Drseussgrrl Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 This is just an observation but it seems like that same dudes who post here about wanting to know all about a woman's sexual history are also the same ones who think she should be going halvsies on dates. Kind of two conflicting ideologies about being "old fashioned". Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I swear some of these PUA "rules of engagement"(I had to look it up just now), are written by guys who couldnt get laid in a whorehouse on dollar night... Stoopid... TFY 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Drseussgrrl Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Kind of like the women who don't want to be barefoot and pregnant but do expect to be paid for their time. What? Dude, if I found a guy who wanted to let me stay home and raise him a brood I'd do it in a heartbeat. Unfortch, in this day and age it's becoming more and more difficult for families to survive on one income. Hence, I'm educated, I have a career, and I'm an earner. This has nothing to do with women's lib or any of that garbage it's just the facts. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Lixxy Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 (edited) As much as I sympathize with both genders when it comes to various injustices... Women want I know you would You demanded When declarations like this start being aggressively thrown about, is typically when s**t starts to hit the fan. Yeah.. probably best not to start predicting what evil women do because they are women and you know them inside out, etc, etc. Edited July 8, 2013 by Lixxy Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 (edited) It has everything to do with feminism/women's liberation. Women want to be strong and equal right up until the ship starts sinking, then they want their seat in the lifeboat. I know you would do it in a heartbeat, it puts a twinkle of joy in my eyes every time I see a woman work full time. You demanded to work outside the house, hope you enjoy it as much as we have for millennia. It becoming more and more difficult for families to survive off of one income also has everything to do with women's liberation. What did you think would happen when you doubled the workforce in one fell swoop? Get used to it...or stay home and cry in your beer... Women are generally smarter and make better employees than men do...Not in all cases, but I am seeing it more and more as time goes by..And I am speaking as a business owner and person who has spent my entire adult life managing people..The "new" men are really coming up short in terms of attention span and reliability..Again, not in all cases, but I am seeing it more and more...Of all of my nieces and nephews coming out of college, the girls have all gotten good jobs and the guys are struggling.. They(women) will eventually pass men by...When?? I dont know-it still might take several generations, but the trend is definitely going in that direction. They'll still need us around but it will be less and less as time goes on...The strange thing I have noticed is that the traditional "man's man"..The type that is the protector, earner, do it all type of guy(I consider myself in that category...my stbxw never worked the entire time and we lived pretty comfortable) is disappearing...Many men now are completely content with letting the woman earn and be the breadwinner. Some dont even work or work menial jobs for lousy pay. And they dont feel any loss of self esteem as a result...That would kill me.. Even if she made more $ I would have to at least be competitive.. On the bright side, we can still kick their asses(for the most part), but there are laws against that.. Of course the last comment is a joke!! So get used to it..Getting bitter isnt going to get you anywhere. If you play your cards right you can have all you want.. TFY Edited July 8, 2013 by thefooloftheyear 1 Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Are you kidding me? I absolutely love it. I just don't tolerate any chinese menu style feminism. No problem, bro "Have it your way"...Thats Burger King kind of misogyny??.. TFY Link to post Share on other sites
Imajerk17 Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 (edited) Well, this is my observation. It seems that some of you women who posted here (and on the other thread) claim to love men, yet whenever a guy doesn't want to fall in line with how you feel dating "should" be, you call him "bitter". You expect men to make an effort to understand you better but there doesn't seem to be much of an attempt on your part to understand our concerns. Hmmm. Yes indeed, if each of us guys who griped were "the total package" there would be no issue of a woman waiting a while to have just "vanilla" sex with us while she was a porn-star for some douche on the first night. Nor would anything come up about us buying dinner for some uninterested woman who later that night goes to rock "slimeball Steve"'s world over a 6-pack of Budweiser. Well guess what ladies: If each of you women truly were gorgeous vixens with a heart of gold you wouldn't find the guys you really like telling you that they "aren't ready for a relationship" and you wouldn't find yourselves all worked up and feeling that you are actually justified in being upset because some random dude on LS made a snide comment about women over 30. We aren't all that but then neither are you. My point is that everyone is doing the best they can and doesn't want to be taken advantage of. Compassion goes both ways. Edited July 8, 2013 by Imajerk17 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Drseussgrrl Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Well, this is my observation. It seems that some of you women who posted here (and on the other thread) claim to love men, yet whenever a guy doesn't want to fall in line with how you feel dating "should" be, you call him "bitter". You expect men to make an effort to understand you better but there doesn't seem to be much of an attempt on your part to understand our concerns. Hmmm. Yes indeed, if each of us guys who griped were "the total package" there would be no issue of a woman waiting a while to have just "vanilla" sex with us while she was a porn-star for some douche on the first night. Nor would anything come up about us buying dinner for some uninterested woman who later that night goes to rock "slimeball Steve"'s world over a 6-pack of Budweiser. Well guess what ladies: If each of you women truly were gorgeous vixens with a heart of gold you wouldn't find the guys you really like telling you that they "aren't ready for a relationship" and you wouldn't find yourselves all worked up and feeling that you are actually justified in being upset because some random dude on LS made a snide comment about women over 30. We aren't all that but then neither are you. My point is that everyone is doing the best they can and doesn't want to be taken advantage of. Compassion goes both ways. Well this is clearly directed at me, as usual. I am really beginning to wonder what all this is about. Following me all over LS! Are you honestly denying that there aren't bitter men here who make vile, blanket statements about women? You're always pointing out the "whiners" and "complainers" yourself, and making threads about "struggling dudes". Link to post Share on other sites
venusishername Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 If you are used to that kind of treatment from men (and if you expect it), then you are not at all independent, which you claim in your original post. Find another guy then. You know, the kind of guy whos mind is stuck in the past that men pay for everything, despite it being 2013 with women working full time and earning good salaries. Find that guy who lets you have your cake (job and income), and eat it too (him paying like a scrub imo) Excuse my being so opinionated on the matter, but I just didnt enjoy how the guys character was questioned by you originally. But it is what it is. Im guessing you are perhaps over 30? Because I notice that women in my age groups (20s) dont get so bent out of shape about actually having to use their disposable income on someone their dating. Dont continue dating this current guy. Because clearly you have a problem with his dating views. Thats a glaring incompatibility. By independent, I mean not depending on a relationship and being confident in myself and in my life choices. I'm not questioning or making judgments about anyone's character here. I'm talking about dating etiquette in the courting stages. Yes, I am used to men insisting on wining and dining in the early stages. I'm used to having doors opened for me and small gestures of romance and chivalry like that. Call it entitlement, but it's simply a preference. Some women don't care about it, but I do, and that will never change. I am in my late twenties and currently date men in their late twenties and early thirties. It doesn't matter how old anyone is, it's just a mindset. I'm not bent out of shape, he just caught me off guard, but it did provoke a good discussion between the two of us. And he didn't seem negatively affected by it; he just asked me out to lunch two days after our last date. So me not jumping to pick up the second check must not have turned him off enough to not ask me out again. To each their own. Link to post Share on other sites
Imajerk17 Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 (edited) By independent, I mean not depending on a relationship and being confident in myself and in my life choices. I'm not questioning or making judgments about anyone's character here. I'm talking about dating etiquette in the courting stages. Yes, I am used to men insisting on wining and dining in the early stages. I'm used to having doors opened for me and small gestures of romance and chivalry like that. Call it entitlement, but it's simply a preference. Some women don't care about it, but I do, and that will never change. I am in my late twenties and currently date men in their late twenties and early thirties. It doesn't matter how old anyone is, it's just a mindset. I'm not bent out of shape, he just caught me off guard, but it did provoke a good discussion between the two of us. And he didn't seem negatively affected by it; he just asked me out to lunch two days after our last date. So me not jumping to pick up the second check must not have turned him off enough to not ask me out again. To each their own. Wow. I could not imagine expecting someone I just met to take me out twice in a row and pay for everything. Or even *preferring* that.... Talk about a Princess Mentality. I mean, what do you do for these guys in return? (No I'm not talking sex...) Edited July 8, 2013 by Imajerk17 Link to post Share on other sites
Drseussgrrl Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 By independent, I mean not depending on a relationship and being confident in myself and in my life choices. I'm not questioning or making judgments about anyone's character here. I'm talking about dating etiquette in the courting stages. Yes, I am used to men insisting on wining and dining in the early stages. I'm used to having doors opened for me and small gestures of romance and chivalry like that. Call it entitlement, but it's simply a preference. Some women don't care about it, but I do, and that will never change. I am in my late twenties and currently date men in their late twenties and early thirties. It doesn't matter how old anyone is, it's just a mindset. I'm not bent out of shape, he just caught me off guard, but it did provoke a good discussion between the two of us. And he didn't seem negatively affected by it; he just asked me out to lunch two days after our last date. So me not jumping to pick up the second check must not have turned him off enough to not ask me out again. To each their own. I'd also like to point out that in my case, I've never been "demanding" or "entitled". I've just mostly dated men that INSISTED on paying. A guy I've been out with a few times now went out with me and my GF over the weekend, and he didn't even let HER pay. It was incredibly generous - some guys were just raised that women don't pull their wallets out in social situations. It's how my dad was, too. So fellas, you can blame your other male counterparts for our "unrealistic expectations." They're the ones raising that bar - not us gold-digging leeches. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Ruby Slippers Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Skimming over the last few pages of this thread really makes me appreciate my boyfriend. He pays for pretty much everything, and has told me he doesn't care if I earn any money and would be happy to support me and the potential family we'll have together. I'm always offering to contribute, but unless I grab the bill or insist on paying, he waves it away. We were coming back from a trip last night, and he knew I'd be working at his place without much food in the house today. We stopped for a quick dinner, and in addition to getting our dinner, he told me to pick out whatever I wanted for breakfast and lunch today, placed the order, and paid for that, too. I've been supporting myself for a long time and could do it for the rest of my life. But it sure is nice to be with a man who enjoys providing for me. He works very hard, and it means a lot to me that he offers up the fruits of his labor to me with pleasure and pride 1 Link to post Share on other sites
venusishername Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Wow. I could not imagine expecting someone I just met to take me out twice in a row and pay for everything. Or even *preferring* that.... Talk about a Princess Mentality. I mean, what do you do for these guys in return? (No I'm not talking sex...) Are you a man? I don't care about being called a Princess ... my last boyfriend was a deadbeat entitled loser who asked to borrow money from me regularly. Shame on me for raising the bar a little. I concede that the person doing the asking out should at the very least OFFER to pay. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Phantom888 Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 This is the first relationship in my life where my woman offers to pay almost every meal out. But I generally ask her to put away her money. We go to pricey places around 2X every other weekend.....around $60 - $80 per person per dinner. We are both successful professionals, so although this isn't chump change, it's not gonna hurt the wallet either. She gets to pay whenever we order in...because her credit card is linked to her Ipad app where she orders food from. I really enjoy her effort to pay whenever possible. Link to post Share on other sites
venusishername Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I'll be more than happy to pay for dinner once she's doing my dishes, folding my laundry and cleaning my house. Until then there's absolutely no reason for a man to pay for her dinner. I'll stay away from men with your mindset then That sounds incredibly sexist. Link to post Share on other sites
venusishername Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't you the one who suggested drinks or something yet you still expected him to pay? I guess sort of, because he was the one who asked me out on the date in general. Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 No - but being in favor of it ONLY when it suits you and your wallet, is. I'm seeing a commonality in a lot of posts I read here either by married women or women living with men and these guys think it's just fine for a woman to do 90% of the household chores while ALSO holding down a full time job. Seems a lot of guys are in favor of 'equality' when it comes to saving a few bucks on a date - until they're married or living with someone and it comes time to do the food shopping, laundry, or scrubbing a toilet. Then, they suddenly forget all about that oh so convenient "equality" argument and just assume it's the woman's job to do everything but wipe their asses for them. And no, boys - taking out the garbage, clearing off the dishes from dinner or occasionally folding a load of laundry is NOT doing 50% of the workload. FAR from it. Yes,,,but what would you say to the poor bastard that works his ass off and the wife, who doesnt work at all, couldnt find the time to clean the dishes from breakfast? Or didnt find the time to have anything in the fridge to eat? All this despite a virtual unlimited supply of cash? That swings both ways.... If you went out and earned and I had a lower level job, i would clean the house so well Martha Stewart would be proud. And Id even cook you the best meals and wouldnt put on 100 lb. TFY Link to post Share on other sites
Imajerk17 Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Are you a man? I don't care about being called a Princess ... my last boyfriend was a deadbeat entitled loser who asked to borrow money from me regularly. Shame on me for raising the bar a little. I concede that the person doing the asking out should at the very least OFFER to pay. Fellas, this post is Exhibit A as to why you should not try to date someone with a Princess Mentality. For all of venusishername's talk about how she expects guys to buy her things right from the beginning, the dude she ends up with was a deadbeat loser who took money from her regularly. Reread her last post. The guys who bought her this and that were passed up for a deadbeat. This is why it is important for us to date someone with a healthier more balanced attitude. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
venusishername Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Fellas, this post is Exhibit A as to why you should not try to date someone with a Princess Mentality. For all of venusishername's talk about how she is used to guys buying her things, the dude she ends up with was a deadbeat loser who took money from her regularly. Reread her last post. The guys who bought her this and that were passed up for a deadbeat. This is why it is important for us to date someone with a healthier more balanced attitude. I really should not have to be defending myself here, but even the deadbeat loser sucked me in in the beginning by insisting on paying for everything. It wasn't until years later after we were already living together that he became that way. Geez, don't generalize. Link to post Share on other sites
venusishername Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Maybe he figured it was his turn to be a deadbeat? I'm sure he could find any excuse in the book not my problem anymore... Link to post Share on other sites
stormymonday Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I don't think it's really a big deal who pays. The way that me and my girlfriend do it is take turns, I pay this time, she will get next time etc etc. Sometimes we lose track, but it really doesn't matter to either of us. Link to post Share on other sites
Imajerk17 Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 (edited) OK then single ladies... If there are so many great guys who just want to buy you stuff, then how is dating hard for you and why aren't you yet in the relationship you claim to be seeking? I'm just confused here... In other threads you (the women on LS) say a good guy is hard to find especially because guys don't like women past 30*. But lately, from the last several posts on this thread anyway, you're giving me the impression that being a single girl is a lot like being on The Bachelorette...generous men raising the bar and wining and dining you all on their dime "because that's just how they were raised"... *I want to re-emphasize that it is the 30+ single female population of LS **as a whole** claiming this and not just any one member. Edited July 9, 2013 by Imajerk17 Link to post Share on other sites
Drseussgrrl Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Well, if you must know I've met someone since the last asshat and it's going swimmingly. He's sweet, educated, ambitious, wants to see me every chance he gets, is a dog lover, homeowner, makes me laugh and digs my friends. I'm giving it a real shot. And he wouldn't dream of letting me pay on a date. It's not that I want him to "buy me stuff." He's an old school blue blood gent and a man. And I dig it. He drinks scotch and smokes cigars and reads books. So yeah they're out there. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Imajerk17 Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Well, if you must know I've met someone since the last asshat and it's going swimmingly. He's sweet, educated, ambitious, wants to see me every chance he gets, is a dog lover, homeowner, makes me laugh and digs my friends. I'm giving it a real shot. And he wouldn't dream of letting me pay on a date. It's not that I want him to "buy me stuff." He's an old school blue blood gent and a man. And I dig it. He drinks scotch and smokes cigars and reads books. So yeah they're out there. Well good. Very good. I hope it works out for you! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Star Gazer Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 OK then single ladies... If there are so many great guys who just want to buy you stuff, then how is dating hard for you and why aren't you yet in the relationship you claim to be seeking? I'm just confused here... In other threads you (the women on LS) say a good guy is hard to find especially because guys don't like women past 30*. But lately, from the last several posts on this thread anyway, you're giving me the impression that being a single girl is a lot like being on The Bachelorette...generous men raising the bar and wining and dining you all on their dime "because that's just how they were raised"... You're comparing apples and oranges. Dating is hard because it's hard to find a compatible man. That has nothing to do with who pays for the dang dates. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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