Separated 3 Months - Pending Divorce - My Story

[john4jane]

im actually going through the same thing, i dont think we made it as far as you though in mediation. its been 3 months since we went and we are still negotiating. i hope you get want you want. espescially for the children

[M30USA]

Another update:

 

The 48 hour deadline that my wife was given by the mediator when she melted down and walked out has come and gone. Neither her nor her lawyer has contacted the mediator and it's been almost 2 days past 48 hours. Who the hell knows what is going on. I would've thought it was mandatory for her to respond. I guess she just blew it off. Who the hell knows what that means or what happens next.

[john4jane]

Another update:

 

The 48 hour deadline that my wife was given by the mediator when she melted down and walked out has come and gone. Neither her nor her lawyer has contacted the mediator and it's been almost 2 days past 48 hours. Who the hell knows what is going on. I would've thought it was mandatory for her to respond. I guess she just blew it off. Who the hell knows what that means or what happens next.

let me tell you! when my wife was arrested in court her attorney said because of her crimes b&e,assualt and criminal trespass they are gonna settle out of court.that was 3 months ago and every week since then, my attorney would tell me, "yeah i should here from your wifes attorney by the end of this week regarding a proposal" 3 friggin months!! thats the longest time to wait for somethin so simple. in the meantime im paying the lawyer out the yinyang!oh and i guess because both my lawyer and my wifes lawyer are good buddies wouldnt mean anything? hah

Edited May 31, 2012 by john4jane

[M30USA]

let me tell you! when my wife was arrested in court her attorney said because of her crimes b&e,assualt and criminal trespass they are gonna settle out of court.that was 3 months ago and every week since then, my attorney would tell me, "yeah i should here from your wifes attorney by the end of this week regarding a proposal" 3 friggin months!! thats the longest time to wait for somethin so simple. in the meantime im paying the lawyer out the yinyang!oh and i guess because both my lawyer and my wifes lawyer are good buddies wouldnt mean anything? hah

 

Hmmm...you got me thinking. My wife's family (who is currently supporting her) is pretty loaded. Do you think they might be playing a game of attrition by trying to drain my money? (I have gotten some help, though, so I don't think I would get totally beaten in that area.)

[john4jane]

wow its the same thing here! my wifes family, i wont say is loaded but they have me beat financially, is supporting my wife i was thinking that was the case. that they were trying to drain my income with the lawyer, child support etc.i mean honestly why else? it seems like my lawyer knows more than hes telling me too. but on my end i just felt because there was so much time going by that they were planning to hit me with a whammy, or waiting for me to get arrested on some charge to use against me! fat chance. but right now its just me against her entire family.

[M30USA]

wow its the same thing here! my wifes family, i wont say is loaded but they have me beat financially, is supporting my wife i was thinking that was the case. that they were trying to drain my income with the lawyer, child support etc.i mean honestly why else? it seems like my lawyer knows more than hes telling me too. but on my end i just felt because there was so much time going by that they were planning to hit me with a whammy, or waiting for me to get arrested on some charge to use against me! fat chance. but right now its just me against her entire family.

 

Gosh, dude. Our cases are identical.

[M30USA]

I want everyone's take on something. Last week my STBWX and I briefly discussed marriage counseling. She mentioned that, unless we BOTH made an effort and BOTH took accountibility, there is no point. She said she "doesn't want" a divorce but she sees no other option if I don't take accountibility for what I've done. But the problem here is that SHE is the one who assaulted me and crossed the boundary which ought NEVER be crossed. In her eyes, she views both of us on equal grounds. (And, by the way, I still haven't gotten an apology for the assault even though I've asked her for one.)

 

In my opinion it's just like negotiating with a terrorist. These terrorists don't play by the rules at all. They take it to levels of doing reckless things. Then the next minute they say they want to negotiate--as if the two parties are on equal grounds.

 

Am I wrong in drawing this analogy? Are 2 people in a marriage supposed to BOTH put in effort even when assault is involved? Or should I just start over with my life and assume she won't apologize or change and that therefore it would happen again?

 

NOTE: For full disclosure, my fault in the marriage includes calling her nasty names (also a mutual fault), being addicted to porn, and once visiting an adult online website where I didn't form a connection with ANY woman and I simply posted trashy stuff on the general forum.

Edited June 1, 2012 by M30USA

[Downtown]

Last week my STBWX and I briefly discussed marriage counseling.

If your W has most BPD traits at a strong level -- as you are describing -- MC likely would be a total waste of time. And the odds of her benefitting from IC are very small. Therapist Shari Schreiber says you have a better chance flying to the moon strapped to a banana than ever seeing a BPDer stay in therapy long enough to make a difference. I spent over $200,000 taking my BPDer exW to six different psychologists and 2 MCs, all to no avail. And she was healthy enough NOT to attack me with a board.

I still haven't gotten an apology for the assault even though I've asked her for one.

She is showing absolutely no remorse for her outrageous behavior. Even if she did, it almost certainly would evaporate in a few days if she is a BPDer.

My fault in the marriage includes calling her nasty names..., being addicted to porn, and once visiting an adult online website where I ... posted trashy stuff on the general forum.

Yawn.

These terrorists don't play by the rules at all.

That's the way it works with BPDers. Because they have the emotional development of a four year old, they have two sets of standards: one for themselves and another for everybody else. And both sets of standards will change from week to week. This is the way all very young children behave.

Should I just start over with my life and assume she won't apologize or change and that therefore it would happen again?

Yes. But there is nothing you have to "assume." She has refused to apologize and take responsibility for her atrocious behavior for weeks. What you see is what you will keep getting. And it likely will get much worse.

[M30USA]

Downtown,

 

Thanks for a cold, hard dose of reality. The hardest thing is that I do still love her. But it's sad how love isn't all that matters. It was just so difficult to be in that marriage. (I wonder if she says the same.)

 

My sister told me a story about her best friend's mother. The husband of her mother was an alcoholic. After years she had enough and gave him the boot. She told him she loved him but it was time to choose between alcohol or her. (Notice she didn't refer to it as "our" problem but rather his.) She told him at minimum she was going to take a year. If he was clean for the entire year, she would take him back. Shockingly, he was clean for the entire year and then he asked for another chance. She accepted and they have been married for 15+ years since then. Can you imagine what would have happened if it was referred to as "our" problem? I bet they'd be divorced. And that's the irony. My wife's domestic violence she keeps referring to as something we "both" need to work on. I'm sorry, but why I do need to work on domestic violence when I'm not the one who did it? Of course she says that I provoke her into those actions. Bah. I've noticed when SHE is guilty of something it's "our" problem, but when I'm guilty of something it's entirely my fault. Like with the porn problem...she made me go to counseling. She gave me the riot act. And she didn't think SHE needed to change and maybe start satisfying me more in the bedroom. Nope, it was all MY fault.

Edited June 1, 2012 by M30USA

[Downtown]

It's sad how love isn't all that matters.

Yes, M30USA, it is very sad. Trying to heal a BPDer by loving her is as counterproductive as trying to heal a burn patient by hugging her.

Shockingly, he was clean for the entire year and ... they have been married for 15+ years since then.

Yes, abusive behavior can arise from alcoholism or from a brain injury -- in which case it can vanish overnight when the bottle is put down or a surgeon repairs the brain. Yet, when abuse arises from emotional damage occurring in early childhood -- as is the case with strong BPD traits -- that damage generally is invisible to that injured person. Moreover, the ability to trust is usually gone. Such folks therefore are highly resistant to seeking therapy. Hence, if your W is a BPDer, it is highly unlikely you will get a similar result -- as the woman did with her alcoholic H -- by simply recognizing that the problem is hers to solve.

I'm sorry, but why I do need to work on domestic violence when I'm not the one who did it?

I agree that working on the anger management issues is her cross to bear. Not your problem. This is not to say, however, that the toxicity in your marriage is something SHE is doing to you. It takes TWO willing people to maintain a marriage that's been toxic for five years (as you said, the M "went south after a few months"). Hence, the toxicity is something you BOTH are doing to each other.

 

Of course, her part in the toxicity ( e.g., hitting you with boards) is easy to see. Your contribution, however, is less apparent. As I said earlier, you've been harming her by sheltering and protecting her from suffering the logical consequences of her own bad behavior. For five years, you've allowed her to keep acting like an angry, spoiled four year old -- AND KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH IT (except for the two times you called the police).

 

Hence, your repeated efforts to calm her -- becoming her "soothing object" instead of a H -- is an enabling behavior that allows her to avoid confronting her own issues. Namely, she avoids having to grow up and learn how to trust and how to do self soothing.

 

For excessive caregivers like you and me, it is extremely difficult to walk away from a sick loved one. Yet, when they are BPDers who are refusing to accept responsibility and fix themselves, that is exactly what we should do. Simply stated, emotionally healthy men do not stay in such abusive relationships for 5 years (as you've done) -- and certainly not for 15 years (as I did). We stayed too long because our desire to be needed (for what we can do) far exceeds our desire to be loved (for the men we already are). Indeed, we tend to mistake being needed for being loved.

[M30USA]

Downtown,

 

Thank you for that excellent post. It made me realize a lot.

 

Here is an update on my situation:

 

It's been just over 4 months now since we separated. As you are aware, our mediation attempt failed. She couldn't agree on the custody. As it stands now, there is no court date set. However, she is scheduled for her domestic violence final court hearing next week. I had declined consent to allow her to take a pre-trial program which would allow her to get it expunged by doing classes and community service. I did this because she still hasn't apologized and because she made it seem like it was self-defense in her description of the events.

 

Well, anyway, I found out that she is planning to plead guilty and go for a reduced sentence since she--accoding to them--is a first time domestic violence case. I contacted her by text today because I wanted to meet her in person somewhere to discuss her trial. I am not a person who likes people to suffer for no reason. If she merely apologized, and if it weren't a legal risk in my custody case, I would love to let her off the hook. That's why I wanted to meet with her. As her STBX and the father of her children, it will be a lifelong charge she carries with her. It will affect her future employment, thus affecting my kids down the line--whether I get primary or she does. But...to no avail...she declined an in person visit with me. She flat out said NO twice. She said I can contact her by email with my concerns.

[Downtown]

M30USA, thanks for the update. I suspect that having a conviction on her record will give you far more leverage with the courts if she becomes unreasonable with child custody. Remember, child custody is a matter that is not settled and done with at only one time. Rather, she can always petition the court at any time to change it if she comes up with some new false allegation against you. I therefore suggest you speak with your attorney about it before throwing this leverage away.

[M30USA]

M30USA, thanks for the update. I suspect that having a conviction on her record will give you far more leverage with the courts if she becomes unreasonable with child custody. Remember, child custody is a matter that is not settled and done with at only one time. Rather, she can always petition the court at any time to change it if she comes up with some new false allegation against you. I therefore suggest you speak with your attorney about it before throwing this leverage away.

 

If you are a woman, and if the violence was only provably against the spouse, and if you are a first timer in the eyes of court...then a woman wont have a big problem getting custody.

[Downtown]

If you are a woman, and if the violence was only provably against the spouse, and if you are a first timer in the eyes of court...then a woman wont have a big problem getting custody.

Sorry, M30USA. You had explained that earlier and I forgot. Yet, even though a conviction would not help you take away HER 50% custody (thus obtaining 100%), it still could be mighty useful if she gets mad enough to try to take away YOUR 50% custody -- e.g., her alleging that you have abused or neglected your child. In that case, the conviction could reduce her credibility. Edited June 16, 2012 by Downtown

[soserious1]

Downtown,

 

Thank you for that excellent post. It made me realize a lot.

 

Here is an update on my situation:

 

It's been just over 4 months now since we separated. As you are aware, our mediation attempt failed. She couldn't agree on the custody. As it stands now, there is no court date set. However, she is scheduled for her domestic violence final court hearing next week. I had declined consent to allow her to take a pre-trial program which would allow her to get it expunged by doing classes and community service. I did this because she still hasn't apologized and because she made it seem like it was self-defense in her description of the events.

 

Well, anyway, I found out that she is planning to plead guilty and go for a reduced sentence since she--accoding to them--is a first time domestic violence case. I contacted her by text today because I wanted to meet her in person somewhere to discuss her trial. I am not a person who likes people to suffer for no reason. If she merely apologized, and if it weren't a legal risk in my custody case, I would love to let her off the hook. That's why I wanted to meet with her. As her STBX and the father of her children, it will be a lifelong charge she carries with her. It will affect her future employment, thus affecting my kids down the line--whether I get primary or she does. But...to no avail...she declined an in person visit with me. She flat out said NO twice. She said I can contact her by email with my concerns.

 

All other issues aside, she's going to plead guilty & face sentencing for DV, the LAST thing she should be doing is meeting with you alone anywhere. I'd suggest only having contact between your lawyers at this point.

[M30USA]

All other issues aside, she's going to plead guilty & face sentencing for DV, the LAST thing she should be doing is meeting with you alone anywhere. I'd suggest only having contact between your lawyers at this point.

 

I would meet not her alone. It would be in a public area. And my purpose would be to communicate one last time (without recordable emails or phone calls) before the trial to see if she is truly not apologetic OR just afraid to apologize because she fears I might record it and use it against her. Bottom line is I know it will permanantly damage her ability to get jobs and housing. It never goes away. And as much as she has screwed me over, a part of me feels sorry for her.

[M30USA]

All other issues aside, she's going to plead guilty & face sentencing for DV, the LAST thing she should be doing is meeting with you alone anywhere. I'd suggest only having contact between your lawyers at this point.

 

She got the DV "dismissed" apparently. They didn't ask me to be a witness--not sure why. Even though there was police photographs and witnesses, the prosecutor said because it was her "first offense" she would get a reduced sentence. Just community service and a few classes. In 2 years there will be an opportunity for it to be removed--not sure if that means expunged or what.

 

So here's the latest...

 

(Now 6 months after separation. Please read OP for background.)

 

I get a call from the kids' babysitter saying she had a knock on the door and got subpoenad. Don't ask me what the hell they want her for. What the hell do they want the babysitter for? She's background checked, CPR/first aid, referneced, and qualified. I'm actually more upset that they are wasting the babysitter's time. Here I am trying to keep a good babysitter and she has to deal with this crap. If this makes her more likely to quit, then I will have a few words with their lawyer.

Edited August 15, 2012 by M30USA

[Downtown]

M30, thanks for giving us an update. I was wondering how you've been doing for the past two months. Sounds like you are holding up well, considering the circumstances. She is being vindictive, it seems, as usual.

[M30USA]

M30, thanks for giving us an update. I was wondering how you've been doing for the past two months. Sounds like you are holding up well, considering the circumstances. She is being vindictive, it seems, as usual.

 

Thanks, Downtown, you've been one of the most helpful on this forum, especially w/ your knowledge of BPD.

 

Vindictinveness is her modus operandi. Her father told me that she and her mother have never lost an argument in their lives. Sounds like the behavior of fearful, weak people to me.

Edited August 15, 2012 by M30USA

[the ill-made knight]

Something I've been curious about with your story, is your wife a violent person at all? Have you ever seen her strike anyone besides you?

[M30USA]

Something I've been curious about with your story, is your wife a violent person at all? Have you ever seen her strike anyone besides you?

 

She frequently would talk about how she would beat the s#it out of any girl who tried to take me. Her mom had violent tendencies, as well. I saw her slam her fist down on a truck which drove a bit close to her in parking lot.

[M30USA]

Update:

 

We had a court hearing for her motion to modify temporary custody orders. Just ruled no changed, and the final divorce court date has been set for 2 weeks.

 

Well, this is it folks. I will soon be a divorced man in 2 weeks.

[TaraMaiden]

I don't know whether to congratulate - or commiserate....

[M30USA]

I don't know whether to congratulate - or commiserate....

 

I don't know either. I still love her. That's not the issue. The issue is that I couldn't handle her. She is like a firecracker and to say that it's stressful to live with her is an understatement. I tried my best. But I started to develop a constant type of PTSD with her.

[TaraMaiden]

When people are damaged - they do more harm to others, because they're like a loose cannon - and woe betide the poor victim in the firing line.

You tried and tried waving the white flag - but against all rules of the Geneva Convention (!) she shot you down anyway.

I'm sorry, in a way, that you still have deep feelings for her.

It must make everything doubly hard.

 

I hope you can continue stepping on, and doing well... walk, don't run.

It's when you run, that the tumbles hurt more.