Is dating for women 100% easier? Are men expendable to women?

[carhill]

Well, filing for divorce does indicate that one's current spouse is expendable and one wishes to expend them from the partnership. In my neck of the woods, this is generally done to refresh and upgrade. Cleanse, if you will. I say this because, once the expending is complete, the near 100% resolution is a new model, perhaps also expendable, magically appears in short order, sometimes (in my case definitely) even before the complete expending has concluded. If the current timeline holds true, I'll be getting another data point shortly as the current iteration becomes expended. LOL.

[udolipixie]

Well, filing for divorce does indicate that one's current spouse is expendable and one wishes to expend them from the partnership.

 

I agree as to me that shows that person is expandable not that the people in the group the person belongs to is expandable.

Ex: a gal divorcing a guy shows that guy is expendable not guys in general.

 

In my neck of the woods, this is generally done to refresh and upgrade.

[serial muse]

My data points appear to be on a completely different chart than the last few posters. I can of course only speak for my personal network, but everyone - yes, everyone - I know who filed for divorce (mostly women, yes, and also a few men) did so because they were being cheated on. This includes myself. I suppose that letting go of those relationships is a kind of refreshing and upgrading. I know that I quite happily refreshed and upgraded. Guess that makes me a walkaway wife. Blah blah blah etc ad infinitum.

 

And meh. I know that these data points aren't of interest to the general theme and primary participants of this thread, so perhaps I should just stay out of it. Enjoy yourselves.

[carhill]

However, if the woman has a history of similar behavior of expending, it could indicate that she believes and acts upon the belief that men are expendable. Light bulb, illuminated. Thanks

[udolipixie]

However, if the woman has a history of similar behavior of expending, it could indicate that she believes and acts upon the belief that men are expendable. Light bulb, illuminated. Thanks

 

That's a bit of a reach to me as from my experiences most people who have had relationships have a history of breaking up.

 

To me it a history of expanding guys by ending a relationship shows that those guys were expandable not guys in general. As well as indicates she may have poor decision making skills in selecting partners as the likely reason the guys were expandable was that the relationship was a failure or dissatisfying for her.

[Alma Mobley]

This is really getting into semantics. Go on most feminist boards and all you hear about is how men are nothing but a burden and that we are just another child to take care of and how we add nothing positive to a woman's life. It's same exact thing as the MRAs.

 

Exactly. "Feminist" boards are more likely to be extreme. I consider myself a feminist, but I don't visit BOARDS about it. I care about women's issues (sex traffiicing, prostitution, abortion, day care, blah blah) and equal protection under the law. I visit sites about those issues, but I never sit around and talk to my woman friends about how men are a burden and children! I am aware that there is a branch of feminism that is extreme (Dworkin/Mackinnon) but they do not represent all of feminism or the goals of feminism, nor are they even taken seriously today.

 

Also, stop citing the "woman initiate x amount of divorces..." You don't know why they do it, or what has happened to them. My sister decided she wanted a divorce after she found out her husband cheated on her.

when told, he flipped out, beat her up, beat her so hard that she fell over and threw up in front of her two toddlers. He threatened her with guns, if she left him. Hell, he even threatened me when I tried to help her. But, she initiated the divorce (he wasn't going to), and she is another stat in that 70% figure, but I guess women's individual stories don't count?

 

I think women, especially since the changes in the laws, are more likely to quit a bad marriage rather than stick with it. I really don't think the stat says ANYTHING about marriage other than women prefer to do the paperwork, get off the pot, and file. The husbands can always contest, but usually... they don't.

 

Come back when you have hard evidence that women are leaving men in droves (75%) as cake-eaters, cheaters, or walkaways, or whatever you think they are doing. I'm guessing that a huge percentage of that figure are women (along with the men) who are just in bad marriages and realized it was time to just leave.

 

I realize I am not offering any stats, but this is just my opinion, from what I have lived through and observed.

[Oxy Moronovich]

How is gals generally initiating divorces in heterosexual marriages the same as boycotting guys?

 

To me that's failed marriages not abstaining from marrying guys. To you is a guy breaking up with his girlfriend boycotting gals?

Honestly, he has a great point there. One of my coworkers is a 50-something year old dude that's been divorced for a year. He's well-known around the office, both him and his wife. Some co-workers even went to church with him. They say the people at work and the people at church all agree one thing regarding the marriage: it could have been saved. The dude had stopped drinking and saved money so they could go on a long European getaway. Even though everyone who knew him, including some of the wife's close friends, said she was more to blame, he took the entire responsibility for the ills in the marriage. Still, she filed for divorce. She had two divorced sisters and her lawyer, who was divorced were urging her on. There was nothing for her to gain: the kids were fully grown, the house wasn't worth much, they made around the same money, and she didn't have other men after her. It looks like she wanted to get divorced.

 

That might be anectodal evidence but that kinda stuff happens a lot. So yeah, he does have a point of women being hypocrites.

[carhill]

That's a bit of a reach to me as from my experiences most people who have had relationships have a history of breaking up.

 

To me it a history of expanding guys by ending a relationship shows that those guys were expandable not guys in general. As well as indicates she may have poor decision making skills in selecting partners as the likely reason the guys were expandable was that the relationship was a failure or dissatisfying for her.

So when do discrete data points become an individual generality? Who decides that?

 

When do discrete expendable men become men in general?

 

I ask the question because that path is so antithetical to my socialization and was the single biggest hurdle to get over when dealing with 'modern' women; the sense that I was 'today's news' and 'tomorrow's fish wrapper'. When do those discrete data points become a generality? How many are required? Is a lifetime enough? Ten lifetimes? A million lifetimes? Infinity?

 

See where this is going?

[Mme. Chaucer]

Well, filing for divorce does indicate that one's current spouse is expendable and one wishes to expend them from the partnership. .

 

In my case, I filed for divorce not because I deemed my spouse and my marriage "expendable," but in the interests of my own well being.

 

this is generally done to refresh and upgrade.

 

Really? I know it's done, but generally?

 

I certainly don't view my new husband and marriage as an "upgrade" over my first. I love my husband dearly. I don't compare him with my first husband. My marriage is a treasured blessing to me, but if my first husband had been able and / or chosen to uphold the promises we made in our marriage, we would still be married today.

 

I'm not an anomaly.

[carhill]

I did say 'in my neck of the woods', meaning where I've lived for 53 years. Please quote me completely and accurately if quoting. Thanks.

[Alma Mobley]

I did say 'in my neck of the woods', meaning where I've lived for 53 years. Please quote me completely and accurately if quoting. Thanks.

My "neck of the woods" sounds pretty general, though. It can be extrapolated to "the US" (where you live, I am guessing.)

 

I have read your posts and know where you are coming from, so please don't see this as any disrespect to you, personally.

[carhill]

I'll clarify a few things, in case generalities are clouding communication:

 

neck of the woodsn. pl. necks of the woods Informal A region; a neighborhood.

 

[From neck, narrow stretch of forest.]

 

My location lists me as living in 'sunny Cali', meaning California, USA

 

'Antithetical to my socialization' means, specifically, that I was socialized by a woman who was married for life and did not remarry after becoming a widow. This is antithetical to my experiences with 'modern' women, whom, in my experience, where I live, exhibit a very different relationship style, reflective of the title of this thread.

 

I hope I'm clear now.

[Alma Mobley]

I'll clarify a few things, in case generalities are clouding communication:

 

neck of the woodsn. pl. necks of the woods Informal A region; a neighborhood.

 

[From neck, narrow stretch of forest.]

 

My location lists me as living in 'sunny Cali', meaning California, USA

 

'Antithetical to my socialization' means, specifically, that I was socialized by a woman who was married for life and did not remarry after becoming a widow. This is antithetical to my experiences with 'modern' women, whom, in my experience, where I live, exhibit a very different relationship style, reflective of the title of this thread.

 

I hope I'm clear now.

 

Sorry for asking, but I also live in California, so I asked for clarification about that (now, not a native here). And, by socialization for life, do you mean your mother (not your ex?)? My parents, grandparents, etc, were also married for life. My parents celebrated their 50th last year. I take vows very seriously.

[FrustratedStandards]

Who said those things don't apply to women either?

 

For the record, there is a lot more pressure for a woman to look good than a man. Maybe that's why she gets more men in one day, than a man does in a month.

[Mme. Chaucer]

I did say 'in my neck of the woods', meaning where I've lived for 53 years. Please quote me completely and accurately if quoting. Thanks.

 

Not that I believe it makes any real difference, but I believe I lived in your (pretty specific) neck of the California woods for some time, myself.

 

Sorry for not quoting you completely.

[somedude81]

Who said those things don't apply to women either?

 

For the record, there is a lot more pressure for a woman to look good than a man. Maybe that's why she gets more men in one day, than a man does in a month.

So you're into guys who don't put any effort into their appearance?

[FrustratedStandards]

So you're into guys who don't put any effort into their appearance?

 

I'm implying that there is a lot of pressure on women to look good. They are stigmatized if they don't look their best. They become "ugly" or "fat".

 

If a man doesn't care about his appearance, no harm to him. He just doesn't get the girls. If a woman doesn't look good, then all of a sudden it's blasphemy and *gasp* she calls herself a lady?!

 

If a man is a slob he is unattractive. If a woman is a slob she becomes a shame. That's why women care so much more about appearance and why it's easier for them to get a guy.

 

If guys cared as much, then I wouldn't be complaining.

[Imajerk17]

This thread is pointless.

 

Lovable Losers: Whining about how women want a guy better than them is dumb. What you're really saying is that women want a guy better than YOU.

[Woggle]

Women are often each other's harshest critics on that front. Most women can get a guy just waking out of bed and walking around the block. Men really are not as shallow as women like to make us out to be.

[d'Arthez]

Men really are not as shallow as women like to make us out to be.

Most women really are not as shallow as some men like to make them out to be either.

[threebyfate]

This thread is pointless.

 

Lovable Losers: Whining about how women want a guy better than them is dumb. What you're really saying is that women want a guy better than YOU.

Profile of an LL. They fear rejection so much, they won't try and then cry because women aren't approaching them. There's also an element of jealousy towards women which is bizarre.

[FrustratedStandards]

Women are often each other's harshest critics on that front. Most women can get a guy just waking out of bed and walking around the block. Men really are not as shallow as women like to make us out to be.

 

I think perhaps that is why women want men that are "too good" for them and feel they are entitled to him.

 

I think since a woman puts so much effort into her appearance, she expects the same from a man. Coincidentally, men who care as much about their appearance have incredible bodies and so, a woman feels that he is her equivalent and that is what she deserves.

 

It makes sense if you think about it. An ugly girl can take care of herself, have an average body, work hard at exercising and eating well, and even though she is still "not good enough" for the sexy brad pitt in the bar, she will feel that she is because she puts just as much effort to looking nice as he does.

 

She isn't going to go for the "average joe" because she feels above him for these reasons.

[Woggle]

I think perhaps that is why women want men that are "too good" for them and feel they are entitled to him.

 

I think since a woman puts so much effort into her appearance, she expects the same from a man. Coincidentally, men who care as much about their appearance have incredible bodies and so, a woman feels that he is her equivalent and that is what she deserves.

 

It makes sense if you think about it. An ugly girl can take care of herself, have an average body, work hard at exercising and eating well, and even though she is still "not good enough" for the sexy brad pitt in the bar, she will feel that she is because she puts just as much effort to looking nice as he does.

 

She isn't going to go for the "average joe" because she feels above him for these reasons.

 

Well if she feels like she is above her equivalent that is her problem. Don't blame men for what many women put upon themselves and each other. It's the female and gay male dominated fashion industry that pushes this idea that women needed to look malnourished in order to be attractive.

[Woggle]

Most women really are not as shallow as some men like to make them out to be either.

 

Maybe but it sure seems like it on this board. I think that is what pisses me off so much.

 

Say what you want about me but I have always condemned men who cheat and use women as toys and I have always spoke against ageism on this board but then I see women talking about those same things and all of a sudden it is you go girl. It's like every time I decide to give myself a chance to be proven wrong I am proven right.

 

It makes me wonder if I should just say the hell with it and side with my sex.

[somedude81]

If a man doesn't care about his appearance, no harm to him. He just doesn't get the girls.

That's enough pressure right there. If men want to get a girl, they have to look good.

Women are often each other's harshest critics on that front. Most women can get a guy just waking out of bed and walking around the block. Men really are not as shallow as women like to make us out to be.

Exactly, men don't judge women on their appearance anywhere as much as women do. And I really don't give a damn that women feel pressure to look good from other women.