Women who use their BODY to compensate for lackluster work!

[beetlebug]

What gives with these women? I work with one who blatently admits to "getting ahead" by using her body... admits that the only way she finished grad school was by flirting and cheating... who purposely visits senior management and comments, "gee, I hope he enjoyed the view on my way out!". And who also felt the need to hit on her direct report on a business trip to the point of making him feel very uncomfortable -- because she told him that she's always used her looks to get somewhere at work..but that she's "not going to do that at THIS job..."

 

It's pretty clear to most of us that this a very insecure person, and since she hasn't been performing in a stellar manner, she's relying on her looks more and more (dressing a little more provocatively, being more obnoxious and open about how "attractive" she is). Oh, did I mention that she is dating someone at the director level - he is the one who got her the job...

 

So - while I am pretty certain my boss (a female) can see through her shenanigans, I am just curious if these women DO get "found out" eventually -- and what happens? And what possesses people to be this obnoxious in the first place?

 

I am not "hot" as she describes herself, but consider myself fairly intelligent -- and those smarts and my drive are what propels me forward. In this day and age, however, I feel that actions like hers just negates everything I (and other women) have worked hard for...

 

Just interested in hearing comments on this topic Thanks!

 

Beetlebug

[LadeeBeedle]

This girl clearly has self esteem issues and it isn't fair that she is getting ahead at work if you are doing a better job. With someone as obvious as she is, however, I doubt she will make it too far... And what happens in a few years when her fabulous body starts to falter with age? What will she rely on to career-climb then? Yes I am in agreement with you that her behaviour is inappropriate and embarresing.

 

HOWEVER.

 

I work in a large law firm dominated by males. I am a very hard worker although perhaps not as smart as some of the other graduates. I have, though, been promoted above my peers. Why? I use my physical attractiveness as a way to get good work and earn the favour of my peers and bosses. I am not an overt flirt, and I do not sleep with anyone at work. But I use subtle things; things as small as blow drying my hair every day, wearing tailored clothes and smiling a lot to up the oompf factor and seperate myself from the pack. I don't think there is anything wrong with capitalising on your looks to help you at work - if you have the ability to back it up. I am good at my job and deserve the position. I probably would not be here if I had not charmed my male bosses but in my opinion I am exploiting their own weaknesses more than anything else.

 

I hope you understand what I'm trying to say. This girl you describe sounds like she is going about this the wrong way. MY point is that looks can help if you make the effort, and the rewards may not be totally unjustified.

[msrealdoll]

This is one of my pet peeves. It's not like I'm being punished for not doing it; I'm just not afforded the same opportunities.

 

It's terribly frustrating when you work harder and are better at your job than a 'hottie', but they get better opportunities. Unfortunately, in most cases there's no objective proof of management favoring the hottie. It's also been my experience that they don't generally get 'found out'-they aren't' in the wrong, management is.

 

I had a coworker that was a hottie. She didn't have any self esteem issues; she was very confident. She knew what she was doing. She didn't have any problem with it. She thought it was no different than someone else sucking up with gifts, or offering to do extra work. She said we all had different talents, and she used hers the best way she knew how.

 

I blame management for it. They are the ones who are supposed to evaluate our performance, and choose who is to be promoted based on that. They have all the control. That they choose her is not her fault.

[HokeyReligions]

I've seen people of both sexes use their sensuality to get ahead. More women then men do it. My MIL flirted her way into a marriage with senior management at IBM.

 

I've seen people get "caught" too when others have complained. Most HR departments have policies in place to deal with this, but it involves documenting the behavior and getting supporting statements from those involved. Once those are obtained, the person can be terminated. A lot of people are afraid of backlash though so they won't do anything about it.

 

I've also seen some beautiful women who worked very hard be viewed as opportunists or worse, just because they are beautiful. Some folks can't see beyond looks, or don't think that some beautiful people also have brains and good work ethics. I'm not saying that is your case---its just something I witnessed.

[CurlyIam]

Sleeping with the men ina company, will not get her up, but around! There's always gonna be a nicer, younger, easier girl at some point! Plus, the image and the reputation! On the long run this is what having a career is about!

 

The rest of the things about her being proposed for apromotion sooner than you?Wait you turn! It will come, I am sure! You see, I think there is a purpose for the existance of easy women: to make the rest of us feel good! I mean, no offence, opening your legs is the easies, most common way to try ot get somewhere. And that ain't far. It never is, believe me!

 

Capitalising on your looks is always always a good idea. It is a very important and powerfull advantage! Says a lot about a person too!

[meanon]

Whilst I do not condone such behaviour I think it's interesting that no-one ever seems quite as cross about the Boss who abuses their position by returning sexual favours with special treatment. It takes two to Tango and the more senior person has a greater degree of responsibility.

 

It's also worth bearing in mind that there are far more rumours about women sleeping with the boss to get on than are actually true. In my work place if you are a young woman in a senior position it's rare NOT to have such rumours follow you around.

[beetlebug]

Maybe my original post should have been more clear...but let me clarify a few things if I can:

 

Originally posted by msrealdoll

I had a coworker that was a hottie. She didn't have any self esteem issues; she was very confident. She knew what she was doing. She didn't have any problem with it. She thought it was no different than someone else sucking up with gifts, or offering to do extra work. She said we all had different talents, and she used hers the best way she knew how.

 

I blame management for it. They are the ones who are supposed to evaluate our performance, and choose who is to be promoted based on that. They have all the control. That they choose her is not her fault.

 

While your friend may not have had esteem issues, I feel that anyone who starts off not using the looks, but quickly realizes that she is out of her league and isn't as smart as her colleagues, and resorts to this behavior to distract everyone that she doesn't know her job --- THAT is what I have a problem with...

 

 

Originally posted by CurlyIam

Capitalising on your looks is always always a good idea. It is a very important and powerfull advantage! Says a lot about a person too!

 

What do you mean by that? "Says a lot about a person" --

 

 

Originally posted by meanon

Whilst I do not condone such behaviour I think it's interesting that no-one ever seems quite as cross about the Boss who abuses their position by returning sexual favours with special treatment. It takes two to Tango and the more senior person has a greater degree of responsibility.

 

It's also worth bearing in mind that there are far more rumours about women sleeping with the boss to get on than are actually true. In my work place if you are a young woman in a senior position it's rare NOT to have such rumours follow you around.

 

Except that in this case, not only is she coming on to senior management, but she is coming on to her direct report and making very inappropriate comments in one on one meetings with him. He doesn't know what to do -- other than tell her that, "hey, sorry. That picture on my desk is my wife, and that's what I love."

 

I just think that it makes the rest of us normal/average people have to work harder. I guess maybe I have a chip on my shoulder because I am not one of the beautiful people...and they seem to have an easier time in life. The one thing I have is my intelligence, charm and sense of humor -- and that seems to only get me so far unless I look a certain way. And if everyone posting is one of the beautiful people, then that will explain why some feel it is acceptible (JMHO).

[CurlyIam]

guess maybe I have a chip on my shoulder because I am not one of the beautiful people...and they seem to have an easier time in life.

 

That's exactly what I'm talking about. This has very little times to do with looks, but as with how you see yourself and how you show it. Not only attitude, but also care for the detail, for shapes and fragrances and... ultimately style. I remember someone saying that: "you cannot always be the prettiest girl in the room, but you can be the most elegant".

 

I am exagerating, of course, but in the end, it is a bit about the confidence you have in yourself, about how you like your image and about your care to run it. If you do not trust yourself to give a great impression, than how will you be able to go through with tougher tasks? No matter the career choice, if you think management postion, think interacting with people.

 

IMHO, people communicate a lot, more than they know through their clothes and body language. I don't necessarily mean "an outgoing" style, but every style, even the most delicate one, has visibility and is judged, for in the end, it is a choice. The choice of communicating to the world about themselves.

[beetlebug]

Well, while I am not a size 2, I do consider myself very "attractive" and certainly well-dressed, put together and classy. That is not my issue. Yes, I have always felt insecure about my weight (don't we all at times)...I always thought...Thank God I have my face, small waist and large chest affording me a few curves (if you're into that!), but never have I tried to show more cleavage because I couldn't complete a task correctly or on time...

 

...I guess the peeve comes in with the male dominated senior management team. While I may be considered attractive -- she has the "nice a$$" as she tells everyone all the time, and purposely relishes in the idea of VPs checking her out as she walks out their office... And today, knowing that she had a meeting with one of them, wore a short dress that had a slit up the front.. Any woman reading this will understand how hard it is to sit in a dress like that and keep things covered.

 

The intent of my post is not really to whine about not getting a promotion - I'm sure I'll get it. My reason was to try to understand why a person would behave like this. If I looked like that I would not have to *use* what I had to distract people from the lackluster job I was doing -- If I was able to get it done, it's a non-issue.

[CurlyIam]

Well, maybe she simply craves attention! I've seen it before. Likes to think of herself as a "sex bomb" and acts accordingly - clothes, attitude etc. She even reinforces it every time not to by any chance miss it! I have an appartment mate who's like that. Let me tell you what happened: once the novelty has gone, she only is ridiculous, not even interesting!

 

 

That's a style too. I mean, well, hopefully she ain't as slutty as her image is. I find women with lots and lots of sex appeal interesting. I mean you gotta be really strong (or really stupid) to be comfortable with the idea of anyone else seeing you as a "a nice a$$" when not at the swimming pool, but at the office. If she's in the sales dept, that's a strong point as well as an weakness. Strong point for she gets to meet lots of new people who shall probably fall for her act - that's good, it brings lots od contracts to the company, the weak point being totally trashing the company image - if acting upon her urges and sleeping around with suppliers.

 

Back to the main point : no offence, but this is the company's fault all the way! The HR is sleeping on their a$$ and gaining their money For nothing if they tolerate a bahaviour like that (unless you're into advertising, the copywriting department) !!!!! She should have at least been worned about her clothes, regardless of whom she's currently screwing.

 

 

I like sexy women on high hills and chic suits. I find totally laughable women with short skirts and low cleavage! Working anywhere near such a woman would get me on the long run: she makes women look bad and that makes me mad!

 

Don't you have a box of suggestions the HR checks out? You can always type a few words, if her style makes you feel uncomfortable - I know it would make ME feel that way...

[shortbus74]

I have to agree with Curly.... she is suffering from low self esteem....

I work at a bar...(yeah)

 

There is a woman that comes in there and proceeds to hit on EVERY man she sees. My male barstaff runs when they see her coming in the door.... She has picked up on my future hubby (grabbing his no butt and the "package") Picked up on the other manager (he was mortified)

What kills me is she does some of these things in front of her husband (they have been married 6 months) He is a really nice guy and everyone feels so sorry he is married to her.... (I know that I do)

 

I finally had to go to upper management and tell them that they needed to talk to her about her behavior at the bar. (Must have worked because she has not been in the bar for a week).

 

Low selfe esteem.... No doubt about it!!!

[meanon]

if everyone posting is one of the beautiful people

 

LOL, I wish!

The one thing I have is my intelligence, charm and sense of humor -- and that seems to only get me so far unless I look a certain way

You are quite right, that is absolutely unacceptable. Promotion should be based solely on your ability to do the job.

 

I can understand that your colleague's behaviour is irritating given your experience about the way women are treated where you work. If she is getting no-where, however, then she is not disadvantaging anyone else and her reporting manager should deal with it as he would any other inappropriate behaviour. If she is or has been successful in using her looks to her advantage in the past or present then that is reprehensible and a large degree of the blame is to be shared by the people in positions of power.

 

Just as this is a serious problem for women who can not "get ahead" in the workplace, so is the rumour mill that falsely accuses many successful women of such behaviour. I know this is not the subject of your post, I think it was the "these women" phrase that made me think of my own position.

 

I learned to ignore such comments years ago, where I work it is very common to encounter open suspicion about the basis on which you have been promoted. It's always almost always unfounded. Rumour I can ignore but occasionally it gives some ******** the added confidence to try their luck or to discredit you when you turn them down. Sorry, this is turning into a rant

 

I do think it's relevant to point out that there is a risk that justified anger at women who behave this way may spill over into an environment where the integrity of all senior women is questioned and that it is not only those who can not get on who pay the price. I'm not suggesting your comments are aimed at anyone who is "innocent" of such behaviour, merely pointing out another consequence of such working environments.

[beetlebug]

 

I do think it's relevant to point out that there is a risk that justified anger at women who behave this way may spill over into an environment where the integrity of all senior women is questioned and that it is not only those who can not get on who pay the price. I'm not suggesting your comments are aimed at anyone who is "innocent" of such behaviour, merely pointing out another consequence of such working environments.

 

I think your points are completely valid. I should clarify that her boss (and my boss) is a FEMALE... but what my boss doesn't know is that she goes OVER her (to my boss's boss) who is a male senior VP...at any given chance. This happens often when my boss is not around, or on vacation our out... any chance she gets to go into the guy's office, she capitalizes.. Mind you, he is not entirely unapproachable. I see him too, when I have to and if it is a significant matter and my boss is not around and isn't reachable -- but for the most part, our boss IS accessible. There should be no reason to bother a VP, but since he "likes the view" as she puts it, I can see why she makes the effort. However,

 

We have several females in senior management and fortunately they are all intelligent, sharp, tough and well-respected. It is clear why they are at the top - they are devoted to their jobs. While some are very attractive, the sentiment is not that they slept with anyone to get there -- if that's all they had to rely on, they would get eaten up eventually. That may be the first thought in people's minds, but quickly they learn that these women are smart cookies and technically sound.. I work in Finance and some things you just cannot hide from... like having a solid understanding of GAAP principles, Sarbanes-Oxley requirements, forecast/planning skills, etc. (those of us geeks in accounting/finance should probably know what i am talking about).

 

Rumor is that my boss can "see right through" this chicky... I hope so. I think that it is bothering my boss that she keeps hitting on her direct report. The guy has no problem talking about how much it pisses him off and just makes him feel uncomfortable...

 

I'll have to let everyone know 6 months from now how this all shakes out!

[WithinLimits]

I learnt the fine line about using my sexual attractiveness and flirting to get ahead--and get away with lackluster work.

 

I got a promotion from a lower-level clerical job to an Assistant to Supervisors (basically an Administrative Assistant or secretary to several people) by flirting with the male supervisors, wearing push-up bras (I am busty anyways), flirting and even twice bending over on purpose wearing low-cut tops. They flirted back but treated me nicely by never touching me or making (what I would consider) to be really obscene or degrading remarks. The female supervisors and managers were lesbians -- so they were busy with their own stuff. (I am a heterosexual woman.)

 

I wound up fired after telling one man (who worked in a totally different department) that I found his remarks extremely demeaning to women--and on top of this he used to touch female stuff and supervisors WITHOUT permission. Although I got my job back, I don't believe I would have been fired in the first place for just stating my opinion because the company I work for would not have been able to justify my firing because of my lackluster work. Although I still flirt with one of the supervisors that I work for (I am his assistant), I do it because we find each other attractive and it is mutual. I am not blaming women--or men--who use their sexual attractiveness or their body to get ahead, but in our society, it often backfires on women.

[SexKitten]

maybe someone should say "wow, imagine where you would be now if you were drop-dead gorgeous!"

 

just to bring her off her high horse.