They're filing!

[herenow]

She may have kicked him out but he was on his way out anyway. He just wanted to do it his way, to make it easy for everyone but when she found out about me that all changed. He would never have stayed with her, though, and no way would he sleep with her. She grosses himout.

 

Famous last words my dear. Guys have a way of being able to have sex with women who "gross them out"?

 

The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

[herenow]

rosie doesn't want to acknowledge that the man she loves has some glaring red flags and she doesn't want to accept that he IS a serial cheating man child. She thinks that she won't ever be in the same position his wife is in and she doesn't understand she needs to protect herself but who knows maybe someday some of the responses she has received will give her some thoughts some day, but she isn't open to them now.

 

Good luck rosie.

 

You are so right LadyGrey

[jwi71]

RiB,

 

Are you going to accept his stbxw's invitation to meet and discuss parenting?

 

Because, if you do (and I believe you should), I wouldn't say "I will have nothing to do with raising your kids". That's likely to be very alarming to her (or any parent).

 

So... Are you going and what is your planned discussion points?

[rosieisblue]

Rosie

 

It sounds like what she told them was the truth. He DID cheat with you and there was more.

 

It really doesn't sound like she is the one blaming you. It sounds like based on the truth of what actually happened at least one of the kids is blaming you.

 

The wife is not under any obligation to lie to the children to make you or MM more comfortable. It sound like the kid's lives are being impacted in a MAJOR way. They are losing their family. They are losing their home. Will they have to change schools too?

 

It is huge Rosie.

 

And their mother told them the truth about why that is happening.

 

 

and Rosie, I know you won't listen, but this situation is not healthy for you. It is not healthy for a man to need the amount of attention this man apparently needs. And even if you are willing to give him that attention now, what happens when you can't anymore?

 

What happens when you have a child of your own?

What happens when you have a sick parent to take care of?

What happens when/if you get sick yourself and can't focus on him?

 

You love him. You see him in the best possible light. I get it. But you really need to take a look at the reality of what this man is and how he copes with his unhappiness. And you need to realize that nobody can make another person happy every minute of every day.

 

I don't agree she needed to tell the kids. They would have been able to deal with things better if she faced up to the fact that their marriage was dead long before he met me. He was MISERABLE when he met me and THAT is what ended the marriage. And from what I hear she wasn't so happy either, was in some sort of depression, so it was over and to tell the kids that it's because of his relationship with me is wrong, because they would have broken up anyway.

 

When I have a child I'll make sure I divide my time so that he knows he's loved and that my child knows that as well. But the marriage comes first, no the child. That's why so many marriages break up: too much focus on the kids and not enough focus on each other.

 

He doesn't need TOO much attention, he just needs attention, full stop. She didn't give it to him. She focused on social stuff, her own depression, one of the kids was bullied and the neighbors were ****. Everything else but him and that had been going on for a long time and there was no room for him.

 

As he said to me once, he felt like when he went home no one cared if he was there or not. So he stayed out with me.

[rosieisblue]

I though you said she was going to get a job. You also said he felt it would be good for her to work. Which is it? I'm am getting confused by your inconsistencies. BTW, didn't she spend time taking care of those kids they have.

 

She is try9ing to get a job but complains that she has too few options after all these years and is trying to get him to agree to suport her for life, which is completely unfair, as it means he will live like a pauper forever.

 

Of course she took care of the kids but they were at school during the day and she sat on her butt doing nothing while they were at school 7 or 8 hours a day. What did she do with her time? Honestly!

[nofool4u]

I'm sure they were happy when they were young and first met

 

But you say it won't happen to you, when you can't ever be sure. Time changes all relationships. Some better than others. Right now you are happy and in love. So where they, thats the point. I'm sure neither of them thought this would ever happen to them.

 

 

but she got miserable and just checked out

 

Ah, so this is all her fault eh? And let me guess, you know this because he told you, right? How do you know it isn't his absence from the home while off serial cheating that didn't send her off the deep end?

 

 

didn't show him any love or affection for a long time.

 

Again, putting this all on her. You don't have a clue. You only know what he tells you. Since he is a serial cheater, its quite possible he was emotionally and physically unavailable to her because he was off boning other women.

 

 

Maybe the first affair she found out about had an impact

 

Bingo

 

 

I can see that, but it was seven years ago that she found that out and she said she wanted to rebuild so he stayed.

 

But he kept on cheating. Sorry, but you are backing the wrong horse in an effort to put the blame solely on his wife. Of course a marriage to a serial cheater isn't going to be a good one.

 

 

And it was downhill from there. He just wasn't happy after that, really, and that's when he did much of his cheating.

 

First, thats not an excuse. Second, you just admitted with your words above that it wasn't going downhill when he cheated the first time. He's just a cheater. He wasn't happy having sex with the same person and the idea of forsaking all others. Thats what it is. You won't see it because out of all his affair partners, you think your special. And maybe you are....for now.

 

 

Look, you defend your serial cheater all you want, he's going to be your problem in a few years when he gets bored and desiring to have those multiple encounters with fresh faces.

 

His wife will end up being the winner. She is getting rid of someone that can't be trusted farther than you can throw him. Hopefully she finds a man that doesn't cheat.

[rosieisblue]

As I and other posters have said, if/when you have this man's children a few years down the road, you will have a lot more empathy for his wife because you will find yourself in much the same shoes. Before you find out he cheated on you, you will have great resentment and disappointment that you gave up so much of yourself to a child disguised as a man. He will say all the same things about you to his new g/f that he now says about his wife to you. You'll be that hateful old shrew who was no fun and who quit loving him. You are going to be one pissed off woman..........at yourself and at him when it happens.

 

I knew a man much like your mm, he was my serial cheating father and heck I'll admit, I used to have a lot of those characteristics myself when I was younger. Trying to get someone else to fill the holes up that one has within themselves is a losing game for everyone. You can't make him happy but for the short term rosie, you will be on the receiving end eventually.

 

No one is trying to hurt you here, in fact we are trying to get you to protect yourself.

 

We have talked this through and through and through and he knows I'll never put up with any of that. I'm my own woman, I don't need a man to define me and I will never fall into the roll of doormat like his wife did. She just didn't love him anymore but wanted to hang on to the lifestyle and the world they created. But neither was happy so it had to end. I'm sorry it ended the way it did but I'm glad it happened.

[nofool4u]

I see all three of us responsible for this: her for not being the wife he needed, him for not leaving when he was first unhappy, and me for getting too involved before he left.

 

This is still putting the blame on her. Saying he didn't leave when he was first unhappy is still putting the blame on her, and you have already excused his cheating.

 

 

And he IS a great dad.

 

I don't know, I disagree. As a father, I'd have NEVER thought so little of them as to have an affair on their mother, someone they love dearly. As a father my thoughts are always on them, and that alone would prevent me from doing anything that would be detrimental to the marriage, especially just so I can get my rocks off with someone other than their mother.

 

Sorry, I wouldn't consider myself a good dad to have thought so little of them so I can gratify myself with other women.

 

 

He has taken so much crap from the kids over this and he still goes back for more, no matter what they say. he loves them so much and is hurt by their anger but is trying to help them find a way to feel happier.

 

He needs to just give them time. If they come around, they come around. If they don't, nobody could blame them.

[nofool4u]

And MM is hugely relieved to be out of the marriage. He says it's like a weight off his shoulders. he didn't even realize how bad it was until he left and she went absolutely nuts. He realized she was a very angry person and said the most horrible things she could think of to him. Taht's one of the reaons he could never go back.

 

Alot to be angry about when your spouse cheats.

[Alice2012]

We have talked this through and through and through and he knows I'll never put up with any of that. I'm my own woman, I don't need a man to define me and I will never fall into the roll of doormat like his wife did. She just didn't love him anymore but wanted to hang on to the lifestyle and the world they created. But neither was happy so it had to end. I'm sorry it ended the way it did but I'm glad it happened.

 

 

Every woman has "the talk" with their man before they get married. Did any of those talks you two had include, "If you ever cheat on me, I'll leave you" or "If you ever feel the need to cheat, you need to leave me first." With him responding, "I would never do that."

 

Everyone has the same talk Rosie. Everyone.

It's so very easy to talk.

Edited June 13, 2012 by Alice2012

[nofool4u]

And yes, there is an age gap of about 15 years but it doesn't bother either of us.

 

Sure, not now. Because if he is about forty, he is still relatively young looking. When you turn 40 and still look good, he is going to be 55, he will start looking like your grandpa.

 

 

His wife was older than him, actually, so age isn't a bit deal to him, either way.

 

Uh huh, maybe now we know why he was cheating. If she was fairly well older than him, then looks to me like he was wanting to trade in his old model for a much newer one.

 

 

We have a lot in common and we are sharing our interests with each other. I'm really into sports and he is getting in great shape by joining me jogging and stuff. his W isn't into that stuff. She is more into arts and culture and things like that.

 

Well sure, differing interests is always a reason to cheat:rolleyes:

[nofool4u]

I don't think that will happen. After she kicked him out I was still with my boyfriend

 

Geez, and here you were cheating on someone too. This story just keeps getting better and better.

[PhoenixRise]

I don't agree she needed to tell the kids. They would have been able to deal with things better if she faced up to the fact that their marriage was dead long before he met me. He was MISERABLE when he met me and THAT is what ended the marriage. And from what I hear she wasn't so happy either, was in some sort of depression, so it was over and to tell the kids that it's because of his relationship with me is wrong, because they would have broken up anyway.

 

When I have a child I'll make sure I divide my time so that he knows he's loved and that my child knows that as well. But the marriage comes first, no the child. That's why so many marriages break up: too much focus on the kids and not enough focus on each other.

 

He doesn't need TOO much attention, he just needs attention, full stop. She didn't give it to him. She focused on social stuff, her own depression, one of the kids was bullied and the neighbors were ****. Everything else but him and that had been going on for a long time and there was no room for him.

 

As he said to me once, he felt like when he went home no one cared if he was there or not. So he stayed out with me.

 

They probably would have been able to cope even better if their father had displayed some integrity and left the marriage rather than cheat again and again and again. Then they both could have told the children that the marriage ended because they grew apart and it would have been the whole truth. Unfortunately, this MM is a serial cheater and that redoubtably negatively impacted the marriage.

 

And I think you need to know that your assessment of their marriage is not an assessment that the wife would agree with. Your description of an unhappy husband may be completely foreign to her because this man is a serial cheater and serial cheaters lie and compartmentalize to a huge degree. You have no idea of her level of happiness in the marriage. You really don't. You have no idea what their day to day life looked like. She may not believe that they would have broken up anyway. And if she really was unhappy, you don't seem to want to acknowledge that living with a serial cheater (even if you don't know about the cheating) can create a lot of misery for a spouse.

 

I think you are in for a bumpy ride Rosie.

[pteromom]

She may have kicked him out but he was on his way out anyway. He just wanted to do it his way, to make it easy for everyone but when she found out about me that all changed. He would never have stayed with her, though, and no way would he sleep with her. She grosses himout.

 

Uh-huh.

 

My ex said I was fat, boring, and ugly, and guess what? He came back trying to sleep with me (behind the back of his new live-in gf) and I laughed in his face. Hopefully for you, your MM's wife does the same.

 

He had two children with this woman. They had a long-standing regular sex life. There are things she learned to do for him that she does better than anyone else, even if he is telling you that you are the best he ever had. When you have your first major argument, he is gonna think about that special thing she did, and he'll be knocking on her door.

 

Or maybe not. Maybe he will have a new door to knock on.

 

But I think you are deluding yourself that this guy isn't a serial cheater and that it will be different with you because he loves you so much.

 

And good for the wife for going for child support, alimony, and everything she can get. She deserves it!

[PhoenixRise]

We have talked this through and through and through and he knows I'll never put up with any of that. I'm my own woman, I don't need a man to define me and I will never fall into the roll of doormat like his wife did. She just didn't love him anymore but wanted to hang on to the lifestyle and the world they created. But neither was happy so it had to end. I'm sorry it ended the way it did but I'm glad it happened.

 

 

Doesn't sound like she was a doormat to me. When she discovered his affair with you she kicked him out and filed for divorce. Now she is fighting to get what she is entitled to in terms of support while she is allowing her children's home to be sold and is moving into an apartment and looking for a job.

 

 

I think you just feel better when you put her down and blame her for the problems in the marriage. Because heaven forbid the serial cheater get any blame for the marriage ending.

[UpwardForward]

She is try9ing to get a job but complains that she has too few options after all these years and is trying to get him to agree to suport her for life, which is completely unfair, as it means he will live like a pauper forever.

 

Of course she took care of the kids but they were at school during the day and she sat on her butt doing nothing while they were at school 7 or 8 hours a day. What did she do with her time? Honestly!

 

After a long term marriage, the court probably would allow her lifetime spousal support (at least in this state), unless another agreement is made between the parties.

 

Since she is being chased out of her home, not likely there's anything sizeable for him to bargain with.

 

He shouldn't have to live like a pauper. He to support his family. You to support the two of you.

[nofool4u]

She told them right away that he was having an affair. And his kids were destroyed by that information.

 

No, they were destroyed by HIS ACTIONS. Not the mother's revelation of them.

 

 

He wanted to tell them that the marriage was falling apart but she insisted on telling them the 'truth' because she felt 'lying' tot hem was wrong. And she hurt her kids in the process.

 

Wrong, HE hurt the kids(and you). Don't you dare put this on her.

 

Once again, HE cheats throughout the marriage, she tells the truth about what really happened, and she is the bad guy? Sorry, it doesn't work like that.

[SoleMate]

We went on a business trip for two weeks and she hardly called him.....

 

What is the right number of times to call one's husband, who is on a "business trip" with his mistress? (I would have said, Zero.) Do you feel she had a duty to check in and show him some of the attention he craves, when he could easily be in the middle of a sex act with you? Just focussing in on this one comment of yours, shows how you twist facts remarkably to always put her in the wrong. Only in Fogland would telephonic reticence on the BW's part be seen as a problem.

 

One thing that hasn't been underlined enough, IMO, is that the BW is acting atypically. Many/most BW are quite angry and not at all cordial to the OW or MM. Yet she has cordial chats with you and apparently talks with him without drama too. She's actually told you, you can have him! That sounds like a woman who may just be thoroughly sick of his constant cheating (and that history he admitted to, based on BW filling you in, is a jaw-dropping amount of cheating; keep in mind you've learned ONLY of the A his wife knows about, it's likely there are many more). So you're picking up the defective H she has rejected.

 

Keep in mind that this MM admitted (once cornered) to cheating in the early years of his marriage. So even while she was still fun and lovable and not nagging and overweight, while the honeymoon glow was still on and all the reasons he chose her as a wife were still valid (I'm using his version of reality here), he STILL went and cheated, and in an extended A too. I would be very interested in hearing him explain what motivated that A. Does he blame that one on her as well?

 

Rosie, you seem quite impervious to advice. Yet we all yearn to help you. To 96% of the posters, you are teetering on the edge of a slippery slope that's leading you to a horrible place. It's just the awful dynamic of the OW/MM trap that the edge of that slope is often a truly thrilling, deeply satisfying place to be. This MM is clingy and attention-seeking and can't get enough of you. He sings your praises to the heavens and makes it clear that you're a far better woman than is wife is or ever was. OW and BW often becomes a competition and he's told you, you've won. You are affectionate and playful with each other and I'm sure the sex is very hot, frequent and lots of fun too. He lavishes attention on you and will say anything to make you feel good. Everything is positive between you, there are truly no problems, never a word of disagreement, never discord.

 

Let's be honest everyone, who WOULDN'T love that kind of r/s (if it weren't with a MM that is)? The actual OW/MM courtship has to be more compelling and intoxicating than a regular courtship for various reasons. (If it weren't, few would get involved with a MM given the obvious downsides.) You are in the irresistible, seductive phase where hormones of pleasure and bonding are pumping through you. Your rational mind is being overwhelmed. I believe that's why you are so resolute in deflecting all our counsel. I think we are making a mistake in trying to share data and work with you rationally. I believe another approach is needed.

 

Rosie, when you read the posts here warning you, do you feel the caring and concern that practically everyone has expressed? Do you think that responders, all strangers to you and most with no axe to grind, would nevertheless take the time to advise and caution you for any reason other than that we can't bear to think of the suffering that lies ahead?

 

Seriously, please think hard about the nearly unanimous warnings you have received. I believe that quite a few are from former OW and I think that their words should count most in this matter.

[nofool4u]

Wrong, HE hurt the kids(and you). Don't you dare put this on her.

 

Correction, meant it to read HE(and you) hurt the kids.

[Lostinlife4now]

Oh Rosie, Rosie, Rosie.....

 

How old are you? did you say 25 and he is what in his 40's? Been there done that.....and I am divorced from him. YOU ARE TOO YOUNG TO BE GOING THROUGH THIS!! You are what we call an "exit affair"! Yeah he says he loves you now...but wait...he will get tired of you too!

 

You, my little girl need to experience life alot more...You are going to find yourself divorced or without him in a couple of years time....And does he want more kids? You should NOT be around his kids at all right now...At least one year!!!!!!! Those kids will be in therapy someday because of all of this!!!!!

 

I have a 24 year old daughter and if she was doing this...I WOULD BREAK HER EFFIN LEGS! I would not want her to be saddled with his kids and yes you will be.....it just happens. And what about the x-wife....she will be there FOREVER! You really want to deal with that?

 

I know you are excited, but honey listen to me...RUN RUN RUN...you are young and HAVE NO idea what you are getting yourself into. I have been where you are and IF I COULD TURN BACK TIME....Geez...................

[Lostinlife4now]

What is the right number of times to call one's husband, who is on a "business trip" with his mistress? (I would have said, Zero.) Do you feel she had a duty to check in and show him some of the attention he craves, when he could easily be in the middle of a sex act with you? Just focussing in on this one comment of yours, shows how you twist facts remarkably to always put her in the wrong. Only in Fogland would telephonic reticence on the BW's part be seen as a problem.

 

One thing that hasn't been underlined enough, IMO, is that the BW is acting atypically. Many/most BW are quite angry and not at all cordial to the OW or MM. Yet she has cordial chats with you and apparently talks with him without drama too. She's actually told you, you can have him! That sounds like a woman who may just be thoroughly sick of his constant cheating (and that history he admitted to, based on BW filling you in, is a jaw-dropping amount of cheating; keep in mind you've learned ONLY of the A his wife knows about, it's likely there are many more). So you're picking up the defective H she has rejected.

 

Keep in mind that this MM admitted (once cornered) to cheating in the early years of his marriage. So even while she was still fun and lovable and not nagging and overweight, while the honeymoon glow was still on and all the reasons he chose her as a wife were still valid (I'm using his version of reality here), he STILL went and cheated, and in an extended A too. I would be very interested in hearing him explain what motivated that A. Does he blame that one on her as well?

 

Rosie, you seem quite impervious to advice. Yet we all yearn to help you. To 96% of the posters, you are teetering on the edge of a slippery slope that's leading you to a horrible place. It's just the awful dynamic of the OW/MM trap that the edge of that slope is often a truly thrilling, deeply satisfying place to be. This MM is clingy and attention-seeking and can't get enough of you. He sings your praises to the heavens and makes it clear that you're a far better woman than is wife is or ever was. OW and BW often becomes a competition and he's told you, you've won. You are affectionate and playful with each other and I'm sure the sex is very hot, frequent and lots of fun too. He lavishes attention on you and will say anything to make you feel good. Everything is positive between you, there are truly no problems, never a word of disagreement, never discord.

 

Let's be honest everyone, who WOULDN'T love that kind of r/s (if it weren't with a MM that is)? The actual OW/MM courtship has to be more compelling and intoxicating than a regular courtship for various reasons. (If it weren't, few would get involved with a MM given the obvious downsides.) You are in the irresistible, seductive phase where hormones of pleasure and bonding are pumping through you. Your rational mind is being overwhelmed. I believe that's why you are so resolute in deflecting all our counsel. I think we are making a mistake in trying to share data and work with you rationally. I believe another approach is needed.

 

Rosie, when you read the posts here warning you, do you feel the caring and concern that practically everyone has expressed? Do you think that responders, all strangers to you and most with no axe to grind, would nevertheless take the time to advise and caution you for any reason other than that we can't bear to think of the suffering that lies ahead?

 

Seriously, please think hard about the nearly unanimous warnings you have received. I believe that quite a few are from former OW and I think that their words should count most in this matter.

 

 

Solemate.....Perfectly stated!!!!!!!! Rosie...read these words.....They are empowering.....

 

You are doing his x-wife a favor...and you don't even see it....

Edited June 13, 2012 by Lostinlife4now
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