Disclosure

[2sunny]

No, you see that I don't think people get to play puppet master or god with other peoples lives and walk away unscathed. As I said none of us do.

 

It's not unscathed- friendships have been broken... All due to the actions of the W cheating.

[Emme]

Her friends husband has a right to know what is real. Since the friend didn't tell - its only right that the H have knowledge of what was going on in his marriage.

 

Has nothing to do with the W asking for help... She CHEATED. There are consequences when a person cheats - she could have told herself - but she didn't.

 

I know she cheated, that's a given. Seren made sure she got the check in the middle of desert. My last point was why not do it anonymously. That's all I'm saying. There are ways to handle situations and if you have a friend that has been by your side for decades through thick and thin... telling is a last resort... not a second.

[2sunny]

I know she cheated, that's a given. Seren made sure she got the check in the middle of desert. My last point was why not do it anonymously. That's all I'm saying. There are ways to handle situations and if you have a friend that has been by your side for decades through thick and thin... telling is a last resort... not a second.

 

Being honest - especially when someone is being harmed - should never be a last resort!

[Furious]

No, you see that I don't think people get to play puppet master or god with other peoples lives and walk away unscathed. As I said none of us do.

 

 

 

In this case, the Betrayed Spouse was also Seren's friend, and if you read the entire thread you'd know he was thankful to Seren for giving him the truth.

 

If anything the marriage is now at a level playing field. You can't fix what you don't know is broken.

[Emme]

Being honest - especially when someone is being harmed - should never be a last resort!

 

Then as soon as she told her all the juicy details that she listened to... she should have notified the husband asap. No ultimatum.

[2sunny]

Then as soon as she told her all the juicy details that she listened to... she should have notified the husband asap. No ultimatum.

 

She gave her friend the chance to tell herself - which the friend CHOSE to continue the lie. That's why seren told.

 

You seem he'll bent on keeping the lid on it - why?

[whichwayisup]

Then as soon as she told her all the juicy details that she listened to... she should have notified the husband asap. No ultimatum.

 

That actually is worse. She is friends with BOTH of them, so she owed the truth to the husband, who is also a friend. Doing it behind the back is a cowardly thing to do.

 

People react and shoot the messenger, but when things calm down and the dust settles MOST recognize what's what and I'm sure the friend will see things differently when she is out of the fog and in a healthier frame of mind.

[Emme]

In this case, the Betrayed Spouse was also Seren's friend, and if you read the entire thread you'd know he was thankful to Seren for giving him the truth.

 

If anything the marriage is now at a level playing field. You can't fix what you don't know is broken.

 

I read that. My point still stands. In friendships there are ways to do things. You take whatever positive route you can to help and assist. The last thing I would choose is create "more" turmoil than there already is. It is my opinion. Make sure that when you get involved in other peoples lives you know the risks and make your motives behind telling are for the right reasons. Seren, made a choice and she should not beat herself up for it. Like I said own it.

[Emme]

That actually is worse. She is friends with BOTH of them, so she owed the truth to the husband, who is also a friend. Doing it behind the back is a cowardly thing to do.

 

People react and shoot the messenger, but when things calm down and the dust settles MOST recognize what's what and I'm sure the friend will see things differently when she is out of the fog and in a healthier frame of mind.

 

That response was to sunny's statement. What she stated, that would have been the outcome.

[2sunny]

I read that. My point still stands. In friendships there are ways to do things. You take whatever positive route you can to help and assist. The last thing I would choose is create "more" turmoil than there already is. It is my opinion. Make sure that when you get involved in other peoples lives you know the risks and make your motives behind telling are for the right reasons. Seren, made a choice and she should not beat herself up for it. Like I said own it.

 

She owned that she told. She wasn't anything but courageous in doing what's right.

 

Seren wasn't creating the turmoil.

 

I see you talking out of both sides - its hard to tell where you stand because you keep moving your stance.

 

It made me look at your history - I see you have been the OW. Maybe that explains your confusion? I don't know... Please clarify what your stance is - for truth or for the cover up.

[Emme]

She gave her friend the chance to tell herself - which the friend CHOSE to continue the lie. That's why seren told.

 

You seem he'll bent on keeping the lid on it - why?

 

 

Sunny you made a statement.

 

Being honest - especially when someone is being harmed - should never be a last resort!

 

If you read your statement the first choice Seren would have made was to tell the husband. Not give her friend an ultimatum.

 

There is no lid. I have posted before that is my opinion to not get involved in telling other peoples business. It is up to the affair partner to confess to the spouse. It is their tale to tell.

 

 

If you had read carefully, you would see that Seren gave her a warning before she told anyone. So it wasn't her 1st reaction.

 

imo to do something like that anonymously is cowardly.

 

I gotta wonder if you are projecting as your responses are over the top.

 

I don't believe being anonymous as cowardly. To me being anonymous is someone choosing to come forward and for what ever reason and made the choice to take themselves out of the equation. They decided to handle the situation tactfully. There is enough drama and issues going on without a third party involved.

[Emme]

She owned that she told. She wasn't anything but courageous in doing what's right.

 

Seren wasn't creating the turmoil.

 

I see you talking out of both sides - its hard to tell where you stand because you keep moving your stance.

 

It made me look at your history - I see you have been the OW. Maybe that explains your confusion? I don't know... Please clarify what your stance is - for truth or for the cover up.

 

Her post also included what's happening in her community. Screw the neighbors and "the dogs." Who cares what they now know. She did what she did and it's done.

 

There is no both sides. Read my post over again. Refrain from adding emotions and/or tonality. It happens here often on LS. Someone's opinion are just that, opinion.

[2sunny]

Her post also included what's happening in her community. Screw the neighbors and "the dogs." Who cares what they now know. She did what she did and it's done.

 

There is no both sides. Read my post over again. Refrain from adding emotions and/or tonality. It happens here often on LS. Someone's opinion are just that, opinion.

 

Ok whatever. You are difficult to follow. It doesn't make sense to me...

[Emme]

I completely disagree about your statement in regards to being anonymous is taking yourself out of the equation. That's just sneaky and being afraid to face the consequences. If I felt compelled to give someone a life altering blow like that, I'd have the guts to let them know it was me. If I didn't feel compelled to tell, I'd keep my mouth shut.

 

You are entitled to your opinion.

 

Some people enjoy having a front row seat. For those people, good for them.

 

There are other's that choose not to put themselves in the middle of a war, good for them.

[Ninja'sHusband]

One more point--

 

Had her H found out on his own, and found out that you knew all along....

 

His pain would have been that much greater. I assume he considers you to be a friend also, so it would have been an extra layer of betrayal.

This is such a good point. I really have a huge problem with one of my WW's friends who I think knew all along... I feel like she was an accomplice.

 

My MIL told me the other day how I had no business telling the OMW from my WW's A.... ugh....it was such a hard decision...but I know she deserved to know like everyone here says. I think you did the right thing. So many people just put up blinders to this kind of offense. Affairs are so dangerous...what if she had gotten knocked up? What if she picked up an STD? What if she eventually decided her husband wasn't worth staying with? What if her husband noticed the disconnection and left himself anyway? Adulterous people are so blind to the horrible repercussions of their actions and it sickens me how normal it is for people to just go along and hide it...and how people who bring out the truth can be chastised almost as if we were the ones who committed the offense in the 1st place. Just because we said "affair" doesn't mean we are stained with that horrible offense ourselves. It means we are trying to raise awareness and to stamp it out.

[2sunny]

If I know my friend robbed a bank and I don't tell - are you saying that makes it all ok?

 

No- the bank was robbed and disclosure of truth needs to be made.

[alexandria35]

I know she cheated, that's a given. Seren made sure she got the check in the middle of desert. My last point was why not do it anonymously. That's all I'm saying. There are ways to handle situations and if you have a friend that has been by your side for decades through thick and thin... telling is a last resort... not a second.

 

Why do you think Seren doing this anonymously is better? That doesn't make any sense. So she tells the husband anonymously, which imo is a worse way for him to find out then from a caring friend, and then the cheating wife would come crying all her woes to Seren, and then what? Is Seren then supposed to deceive her friend in pretending to have no idea who told her husband? Is she supposed to let her friend cry on her shoulder all the while knowing that she is the one who told but pretend she had nothing to do with it. THAT would be a horrible and disgusting way for friend to act. Do you normally support these kind of lies and deceit in friendships and marriages. If I was engaged is some sort of deceitful behaviour and a friend blew the whistle on me but told me beforehand that she was going to (and gave me a chance to stop that behaviour or come clean myself) and told me why, I might be hurt and angry, but I would have to respect her for being upfront and forthright with everyone, even me. No sneaking, manipulating, lying or going behind anyones back. Seren said what she meant and meant what she said. She was open and honest with her friend and with the husband, she stood by her convictions and she took responsibility for her actions even though she likely knew their would be some backlash for her too. This is what integrity looks like. A friend who would anonymously tell my spouse something like that and then not have the guts to tell me she did it would be a two faced untrustworthy friend in my opinion.

 

I think some people in this situation might decide not to tell the husband and they might have some good reasons for that too. It's a personal decision that one has to make based on their own morals and convictions. However to say that one friend should anonymously tell on another friend, then sit back and watch the fireworks while pretending to have no involvement whatsoever really blows my mind. What a horrible nasty friend that would be.

[frozensprouts]

if you look at the situation from the point of view of the husband, who is also seren's good friend, what she did was a very great favor.

 

by giving him the information, she allowed him a chance to make informed decisions about his life and what goes on in it. She allowed him to protect himself from STDs, and perhaps even from an other man who becomes a little too attached and decides to act on that. he also knows that he has a least one friend in his corner, and now that the affair is out in the open, he and his wife might actually be able to either work on their marriage from a place of honesty, or end it if that is what they both feel is for the best.

 

As for her friends anger, while i can understand her being angry ( easy to be angry at seren that at herself for her own cr@ppy behavior) she had no business trying to force her moral views on someone she knew felt very strongly about affairs being wrong. If she felt the need to share tales of her glorious exploits with someone, she should have found someone who was agreeable with the idea of cheating ( it would be different if she felt bad and wanted help in stopping...it sounds more like she just wanted to brag and get help in covering up her behavior). to try and use seren, who had been very hurt by an affair i this way is just more of treating people in a cr@ppy way. trying to make someone who is very much against affairs become compliciant in one by looing the other way 9 or even aiding in it by providing an alibi) seems pretty mean to me.

 

if this wayward wife doesn't like the fallout, then she shouldn't cheat...as the saying goes if you're going to dance, the piper must be paid

 

seren has nothing to feel bad about...in my opinion, she did the right thing and has done a good deed for a friend (the husband). Her friend should never have put her in the middle the way she did.

[Ninja'sHusband]

Oops didn't notice the war going on... =\

 

All my comments in my earlier post apply:

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/marriage-life-partnerships/infidelity/332368-disclosure-5.html#post4075084

 

Seren isn't responsible for the destruction of a marriage...*if* the marriage dies, it's the cheating spouses who destroyed it. Seren just told the H his house is on fire....he can fight the flames or run.

 

At least now if there's a pregnancy he knows he should be suspicious. At least now he knows should get checked for STDs (maybe hasn't occurred to him..but it might now)

[2sunny]

Oops didn't notice the war going on... =\

 

All my comments in my earlier post apply:

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/marriage-life-partnerships/infidelity/332368-disclosure-5.html#post4075084

 

Seren isn't responsible for the destruction of a marriage...*if* the marriage dies, it's the cheating spouses who destroyed it. Seren just told the H his house is on fire....he can fight the flames or run.

 

At least now if there's a pregnancy he knows he should be suspicious. At least now he knows should get checked for STDs (maybe hasn't occurred to him..but it might now)

 

And at least he knows his wife has broken the marriage - now he can decide to work on it or have her leave.

[Emme]

Why do you think Seren doing this anonymously is better?

 

I think every individual who chooses to tell the tale of someone else's business should choose to do it anonymously (maybe except parent/child). I don't believe in involving oneself in an already difficult situation. There are already other issues that are now on the surface that have to acknowledged. What that person has now done is added more issues to the situation. Why would you add yourself to an equation that is already difficult. I have to question the motives behind it. It's like people who give money away, some do it anonymously. They do it because they want to and there's no need for praise. None. Can the deed be told without getting involved, if the answer is yes then tell the tale. There are many people who love to watch drama unfold. They feed off it.

 

 

That doesn't make any sense. So she tells the husband anonymously, which imo is a worse way for him to find out then from a caring friend, and then the cheating wife would come crying all her woes to Seren, and then what? Is Seren then supposed to deceive her friend in pretending to have no idea who told her husband? Is she supposed to let her friend cry on her shoulder all the while knowing that she is the one who told but pretend she had nothing to do with it. THAT would be a horrible and disgusting way for friend to act. Do you normally support these kind of lies and deceit in friendships and marriages. If I was engaged is some sort of deceitful behaviour and a friend blew the whistle on me but told me beforehand that she was going to (and gave me a chance to stop that behaviour or come clean myself) and told me why, I might be hurt and angry, but I would have to respect her for being upfront and forthright with everyone, even me. No sneaking, manipulating, lying or going behind anyones back. Seren said what she meant and meant what she said. She was open and honest with her friend and with the husband, she stood by her convictions and she took responsibility for her actions even though she likely knew their would be some backlash for her too. This is what integrity looks like. A friend who would anonymously tell my spouse something like that and then not have the guts to tell me she did it would be a two faced untrustworthy friend in my opinion.

 

 

Seren has been through her issues. She states her friend knows this. As soon as that woman opened up her mouth and said she was cheating. *Seren's hand should have went through the phone and put her hand right in her face.* Stop. The B word should have came out her mouth and cursed her out. You know what I've been through and here you are f*cking on your husband. I am going to doubt that was the initial response because Seren has details. She listened. She should have ended that relationship with her then and there. There will be no crying on my shoulders. Loose my number and don't ever call me again. If you have a moral code you stick to it. Then when you tell the husband anonymously, she would have known it was her (that's if she hasn't told others.)

 

There is no friendship. She is not the person that Seren thought she was.

 

 

I think some people in this situation might decide not to tell the husband and they might have some good reasons for that too. It's a personal decision that one has to make based on their own morals and convictions. However to say that one friend should anonymously tell on another friend, then sit back and watch the fireworks while pretending to have no involvement whatsoever really blows my mind. What a horrible nasty friend that would be.

 

Seren has front row seat. She is now a witness.

[Ninja'sHusband]

She was trying to give her friend a chance.

 

I gave the OM a chance before telling his wife as well.

[woinlove]

You are entitled to your opinion.

 

Some people enjoy having a front row seat. For those people, good for them.

 

There are other's that choose not to put themselves in the middle of a war, good for them.

 

I don't think when one is talking about how one deals with a situation involving close friends it is a matter of front row seats.

 

I was in a similar situation to Seren, but where I was closest to the betrayed spouse and discovered her H was cheating (who was also a friend, but not as nearly as close to me). I told my friend and having the truth out in the open did end the A and they successfully rebuilt their M. But it also caused some problems in our friendship as the H originally blamed me. We remained friends but not as close, as the energy all went into the M and that took priority over our friendship. At the time, I felt bad, but later I saw it in perspective.

 

There was nothing 'front row seat' about my motivation or feelings, and I'm sure the same holds for Seren. It is more about compassion, integrity, respect and treating others the way we would want to be treated. For those of us who have not cheated on our spouses, I think it is common to feel that we would want the A outed, no matter what our role, betrayed or betrayer, because we think to betray our spouse in that way would mean we were really off the rails and in need of help.

[seren]

A front row seat? hmm, if I wanted a front row seat to watch a drama unfold it would be because I wanted to see it. Which is so far from how things are, I was plonked in the front row seat by being used as an excuse for my friend (she is still my friend) to see the OM. I found out because she asked that I say she was with me, when in fact she was with the OM. We had always talked about if either of us knew the other's spouse had an A whether would we tell. Both of us agreed we would and that not to would damage our friendship, she also knows that I own my actions and if I had done something wrong, own up and take whatever is coming my way. This isn't me being the big moralist, but how I was raised, owning your actions is a big, big thing in my life. Of course I understand that by telling it has opened a can of worms, of course I question my motives, but creating drama for the sake of it so far from the intention. TBH, my friend understands this, having spoken to her, she holds no grudges against me and owns her own actions too. Will it damage our friendship? I hope not, but it probably will.

 

When she asked if I would lie for her I told her no, I asked if she was having an A and she said yes. Much conversation later, I asked if she loved the OM and the answer was no it was becasue it was exciting and that she had no intention of leaving her H and loved him, again more conversation and I said either leave your H, leave the OM or tell H, and yes, I said that if she didn't then I would tell him.

 

Does that make me play God? maybe, Was it my call to say those things? maybe not, but the alternative was to knowingly be used for excuses and knowingly enable the A. I asked on more than one occasion if it had ended and it was a case of I shall do it when we meet next and so on. I am then asked a few days later to lie and say she was coming to me for the weekend and I could not do it, her H asked if I knew if there was anything wrong, he asked if she was ill and was hiding from him and also if she had anyone else as she had been weird the past few days and I told him.

No, I am not proud, I use LS to speak about it as it is anonymous and no one else will know. But maybe you're right and I am looking for validation, TBH the strongest validation has been from my friend as she said if it had been her H who was having the A she would be pissed off I had given him time.

 

It is early days but I hope they can reconcile, they are back in the same house and have asked if me and H will go around next weekend to talk about what worked for us. I don't want to do this, but we probably will. I don't want, need or invited the drama, in fact I just wish I didn't know about it all, more to the point, I wish it hadn't happened at all.

 

The dilemma was that both are very good friends, to keep the secret of one would have meant lying to the other, to walk away after 55 years of intertwined lives and friendship is not easy and we would have missed each other. If I have a soulmate, she is it and I for her. No her actions were not that of a good friend, possibly mine weren't either and we will speak about that, later. For now the focus is on them both, as it should be. Do I still feel like crap? yes of course. The one thing that has jumped out of all this is her saying that if it had been he having the A, then she wouldn't forgive me if I hadn't told her and so can forgive what I have done.

 

My friend is owning her actions as I own mine. So, no front row seat, no drama seeking, I have never been a Drama Queen and if I choose to go to watch a play unfold, it will always be one I have chosen to buy tickets for. This sad, sorry situation is not one I would have chosen for any of us.

[freestyle]

I get the feeling that your friendship will survive in the long run, Seren.

It might take a few years, but you have over half a century of history together, hopefully that will outweigh any resentments on either side of the fence.

 

When the fog clears from your friend's heart/mind, I predict she's gonna realize, "WTH was I thinking?"

 

Personally--I would hope a true friend would whack me upside the head if I acting foolish--(gently, but firmly). I'm more inclined to trust someone who gives it to me straight, rather than someone who acts like a "yes man".