Forgiveness

[tojaz]

Allie, I have no gain or loss in offending or not offend you. But I see a pattern, even in the somewhat defensive, and extra-explanatory responses that followed my post.

 

I persoally don't have the energy or brain cells to do a complete analysis of your threads. But if memory serves me right, a forth ER involves your daughter.

 

Did you not readily admit to me that the "side of the rode" ER event was an attention getter? Come on, Ms. Allie.

 

Now, if memory serves me correct, wasn't your miscarriage visit to ER post hoc? Why don't you go to regular facilities for these matters? Are the life or death matters that require the ER?

 

When you case was most critical, and you were really miscarrying, why didn't you go to ER then? Or did you? If so, you would have had the evidence your husband asked for when he took a day off to care for you in your condition.

 

Your daughter's trip to the ER? What was that about? In context, I have to winder now.

 

Zoloft. Give me a break. ER. LAOAOAOAOAO. I know you don't like that. Why didn't you call your prescribing doctor?

 

Allie. U better stop this shenanigans. U r not fooling me. This is such BS, when I think of people that really need ER and Emergency Roadside Services. I am sorry if u, or others r offended. But this is my opinion. If I am excruciatingly wrong on my data here (may be mistaken on one but not all), then I will formally apologize. Yas

 

Ease up a little Yas. I see what your trying to get at, but you are reading an awful lot into the story.

 

Whether the ER visits were justified or not is easy to question after the fact, but at the time these things are happening to you is a different story. I don't think Allie is trying to fool anyone. Thats why we pay doctors and nurses, so they can tell you what is an actual emergency and what isn't.

 

My mom is an ER nurse and has been for some time. One of her jobs there is constantly assessing patients and assigning priorities to those who have actual threatening emergencies and those that can wait but may just be panicked or scared about what has happened to them. They train these people well to make sure those that truly need immediate care get it and those that can wait do. Call it different degrees of emergency.

 

I see what your getting at Yas, and I know your trying to help, but i think thats an area where Allie should get the benefit of the doubt unless you were there with her when it happened.

 

TOJAZ

[Yasuandio]

You are right, and right, and right. Tojaz, dude man, I hope the Shephardboy is not being attacked by wolves. And, Ms, Allie, please accept my complete apologies if I jumped to conclusions. Yas

[AllieKat]

Yas- your way off and honestly just being rude! Please dont make light of others issues its in bad taste. My daughter didnt go to Er maybe you confused that with H offering to pick her up when I was there. And I did call dr tyvm!

 

Think what you wish ;-)

[AllieKat]

Yas- also to answer you question I believe you had asked me before if I had texted my H to let him know I was in Er because I wanted sympathy? I answered that yes i think i texted him that cause i wanted him to know and be there! I never said I made the story up.

[Yasuandio]

Sometimes I make mistakes, and being rude is one of them. Like I said, I apologize to you. I am very sorry Allie. Yas

[trippi1432]

Allie - something I picked up on here in this exchange, is that you are getting much stronger than you were when you first came to the threads. Your exchange with Yas was more assertive than defensive or aggressive. That's a thumbs up!

 

Another thing, a few posts back, you state that you destroyed your marriage with lies. This is a very profound statement laden with guilt and self-blame. Yes, there were some lies, yes this is what he is upset about (and the divorce request). These are things that you have learned from because even though infidelity was not involved, some deception was.

 

So....where to go from here other than limbo? It's time to actively start to rebuild trust. That can sometimes be a long road, it really depends on the two people living in the situation, the ability to forgive (him you and you for yourself) and the ability to rebuild a better and even stronger relationship by keeping promises and agreements. I came across something yesterday as your comment was on my mind. I can't post a link due to the moderation on this site, but you can do a search on Truth and Deception, there is a website by that name. In the menu, there is a tab for Recovery and Repair and in there a link to Rebuilding Trust. I feel that it had some very good information and some positive talk points. I would post some of it here, but it's very long and don't want to get busted for it, so it will take some effort on your part to go look for this information. I think it could help.

 

We could continue to focus on each day and what he is and isn't doing...what your behavior is or is not, but I think that is just going to keep you in limbo. Your husband hasn't left....he's still been there going on 2 months now. Perhaps it's time to start moving forward within the marriage that you do still have, it's just static right now? When you have read it, perhaps it will open up some more discussion here as well as with your husband.

[trippi1432]

Sometimes I make mistakes, and being rude is one of them. Like I said, I apologize to you. I am very sorry Allie. Yas

 

Hugs to you Yas....look at how brilliant Allie's responses were to you! I'm proud of her assertiveness and ability to stand by the facts in her situation. That is the exact type of exchange she might get with her husband and a prime example of how her responses should be to him. Facts and not emotionally driven.

[Yasuandio]

Hugs to you Yas....look at how brilliant Allie's responses were to you! I'm proud of her assertiveness and ability to stand by the facts in her situation. That is the exact type of exchange she might get with her husband and a prime example of how her responses should be to him. Facts and not emotionally driven.

 

I agree! A good a practice run! I serve some purpose! Again, I really am so sorry. Yas

[AllieKat]

Yas- apology accepted, thank you! Trip- i think I have come across that website Im going to look at it in more detail. Your right about limbo and its getting old. I have to admit Im afraid to even bring up "our marriage" to H. After the last time i brought up ring it didnt go well and im kinda nervous to bring it up again. However with that being said i definately cant do limbo for the next many monthes.

 

I do focus on everyday actions maybe to much so. Not sure why maybe its just cause im so desperate to have a signal/sign so i obsess over the daily stuff.

[trippi1432]

I do focus on everyday actions maybe to much so. Not sure why maybe its just cause im so desperate to have a signal/sign so i obsess over the daily stuff.

 

 

Allie - sometimes anxiety can happen by focusing so much on those actions, especially when the words don't match. It becomes confusing. Perhaps just focusing on the positive actions and not so much on what he is not doing (expectations) will help curb the anxiety.

 

Granted, with everything going on, your emotions are up and down. If there is a pattern as Yas pointed out, the one I see is that of you not focusing on you. From him asking you to go get tires and spending that time with you as being positive, or eating the dinner you cooked, cleaning the kitchen for you after you cooked....positive actions. But, then he goes off to do his own thing...some of them things you two used to do together, and that brings you down because then you are focusing on the negative.

 

I think a post or two back, you talked about what he loved about you...that your independence got dusty. Did it? See, independence is being assertive, it's knowing you can be as good with someone as without someone. It's about being as happy with yourself as you are with someone else. Before your husband, what did you and your daughter do that made you happy?

[AllieKat]

Oh Tripp to be honest I cant even remember what we did before him. It seems to be so long ago. How sad is that? Ive forgotten/lost that girl. I want to work on getting her back but I gotta admit I loved the family life I HAD too.

I think what is hard for me is H was so family centered too and wanted to spend all his time with us prior. Now he does what he wants and I'm not liking that. Im also concerned about this girl heis friends with on FB. They were friends in Hs and he always had a crush on her. That was before me But now he has friended her and she is newly divorced and has moved closer to us and it scares me. I am insecure and i know he only accepted her friend request because we were fighting. Granted he was very good friends with her in HS and that was it but my worry is now with us being on shakey grounds he will be looking into her.

 

I did confront him through several of our tiffs and he said he hasnt even spoken to her or anything on there. He said she friended him and thats it. I told him I didnt like it and he hasnt done anything about it which makes me think he doesnt care about my feelings. I have a way I can look at his page to see if he posts on her wall or anything and as of yet I havent seen anything but i worry! Its not like hes a huge fbooker he only has 23 friends.

[tojaz]

Oh Tripp to be honest I cant even remember what we did before him. It seems to be so long ago. How sad is that? Ive forgotten/lost that girl. I want to work on getting her back but I gotta admit I loved the family life I HAD too.

I think what is hard for me is H was so family centered too and wanted to spend all his time with us prior. Now he does what he wants and I'm not liking that. Im also concerned about this girl heis friends with on FB. They were friends in Hs and he always had a crush on her. That was before me But now he has friended her and she is newly divorced and has moved closer to us and it scares me. I am insecure and i know he only accepted her friend request because we were fighting. Granted he was very good friends with her in HS and that was it but my worry is now with us being on shakey grounds he will be looking into her.

 

I did confront him through several of our tiffs and he said he hasnt even spoken to her or anything on there. He said she friended him and thats it. I told him I didnt like it and he hasnt done anything about it which makes me think he doesnt care about my feelings. I have a way I can look at his page to see if he posts on her wall or anything and as of yet I havent seen anything but i worry! Its not like hes a huge fbooker he only has 23 friends.

 

Allie, like i think i told you before, It is not going to go back to the way it was. If your measure of success is having your marriage return to normal you are going to be disappointed. But you shouldn't be because that marriage wasn't working.

 

Lets look at it from another angle, Your h has spread his wings a little, is out doing the things he wants to do, allowing himself a little independence, and it sounds like he is enjoying it. You have just said that you miss the girl that was a little more independent as well, but your striving to reform a marriage that caused that to fade away. Thats not the answer.

 

Your H is still making a choice to make you and your dd a part of his life. He cares about you and has showed that, but he remains distant because he has been hurt and is cautious to devote himself fully. He is still making that choice though.

 

Go do something! Go and try something you have never done before, or maybe something you haven't done in a long time. Take a little bit of independence of your own rather then just sitting in your house obsessing over his FB page and phonebills hoping to find something that will close the book on this one way or the other. It takes time and it is going to take growth from both of you.

 

Show him the girl you say you lost, the one thats here now waiting for him is stuck in limbo, maybe she will have better luck.

 

TOJAZ

[AllieKat]

Things have gotten worse in last few hours i discovered he had followed someone on twitter ( history on pc)only prob is he never had twitter before so in a effort to look for him i try different sign ins and ofcourse to no avail but when typing in different emails i used his normal email with yahoo and sure enough he has created another email address!! This all looks like someone with something to hide dont ya think? I cant find him on twitter for some reason but when i typed in that email they were sending him a password reset( oops)

 

Looks like i need to talk with him about this! Im sure this is not going to go well

[AllieKat]

Btw i also saw where he had blanked history just not enough that i couldnt see he had followed someone.....grr

[Yasuandio]

Remember, Yas is not a "dash of salt," she is really "peppery" sometimes. But, pepper ain't always a bad thing.

 

Some marriage sites, like "Marriage Builders," would promote transparency so these little FB friendships don't get started in the first place.

 

Let's put the shoe on the other foot. Suppose Allie friends an old HS boyfriend, or her X husband. Is that OK? Hmmmm. These sorts of friendships sometimes become promlematic, because they can offer an emotional outlet to a spouse when he/she should really be discussing matter with their other half. Romances have been known to develop from such FB and/or on-line relationships.

 

If Allie knew what these convo's held, I betcha she'd be out of limbo real fast. I base my assumption on the fact a new email has been created, and history is "now" being disappeared.

 

If husband is fooling around, as is suggest by some past single behavior, and on-line shenanigans, I'd be concerned about STD's. Yes, It's a jump, but I would take a chance if I was in the child bearing years, that's for sure.

 

Keylogging would provide hard evidence as well. But Allie would have to keep it under her hat. I suppose it is an option that she does not want. But, I felt a need to put it out there again, in light of the FB news (which I wouldn't speak anything about, Allie - cause he will just get better at hiding it).

 

I hope my suspicious nature, and gut instinct about this matter proves to be

incorrect. I want the best, for u Allie. But honey, there is nothing more devistating than living years in limbo, only to find the limbo was really denial. I'm trying to protect you - not be mean, or turn you into a suspitious wench. Just, better safe than sorry - is my motto now. I mean, you are already checking stuff out, you might as well go all the way, not half way.

 

Wouldn't it be great if u found nothing with a month of keylogging? That would actuall be good medicine for your anxiety. But these bits and pieces u are seeing are anxiety provoking. Which bring me to my last point. In my opinion, it is INAPPOPRIATE for husband to have this young lady on his friend list, period. That is not the kind of behavior to expect from a married man unless the young lady is a friend of the family, business associate on a business related Facebook page, or family. Anything more is ASKING for Trouble with a capital T. I realize that is not a popular opinion, but, too bad. Married people are not individual socialites anymore, end of story. Yas

[AllieKat]

Well can we all pretend that post above was from a crazy lady! Lol i was so bothered by what I thought I found that I decided to confront H about it! There are some things no matter how much you love you cant turn your head to and I will not be that girl that pretends its ok just to keep a man, that just sets a bad example to my daughter.

 

So i texted H and said Hey i wanna talk would 9am or noon be better( those are his break times) 9:02 am he calls me and asks what up and i told him i was down the road could talk face to face? He said yeah come on over to my work, so i did! I asked him about Twitter and he said he did look at twitter but he doesnt have an account, he said he also was looking at my twitter to see if i tweeted and he said i thought i deleted that! I didnt even have to ask he told me he did cause he didnt want me to see him looking at it. As far as email account he said he doesnt have another so when i got home i double checked by paying to see who the email that i entered into twitter belong too! Oops it wasnt him! Ugh

 

As for the fb friend i told him it really bothers me and i would feel better if he unfriended her. He thinks im being silly but at least he knows how i feel and what is NOT ACCEPTABLE!

 

I decided to text him at lunch to see if he wanted to finish our convo and he called me and we met for a few and chatted but he had to go do something for work so he coukdnt talk long. 15 mins later he called me to talk more! He was talkative and i told him that im having a hard time with trust and ppl we know arent helping. He wasnt happy and he said he was going to go talk to these two ppl that have been talking crap on me and confront them. He said they need to mind their own business! One is his race car buddys wife and shes been telling ppl about what happened with H and I and thats part of the reason i quit my volunteer gig, shes the president!! And a huge gossip!!!

 

H and i talked on phone 40 mins and i ended the call. Im hoping this is a start to open communication and honesty and rebuilding the trust

[AllieKat]

Yas and I agree the girl on fb goes if H wants to stay married to me! Thats one of my rules if we make up. I will not put up with anything less on that either.

[trippi1432]

I'm liking this Allie very much....assertive...not bossy, not sad, not guilty...standing up for yourself and setting healthy boundaries.

 

Now, keep this in mind, Rome was not built in a day. Let him do the things he says he is going to do...don't push him or he could pull back...continue doing things like you normally do. The fact that he is going to speak to the friend and do the MYOB is very good. Before he saw that as your problem, now he realizes it's a problem for the two of you. Again, don't push and let him handle this one HIS way. Other things will come in time.

[tojaz]

Well can we all pretend that post above was from a crazy lady! Lol i was so bothered by what I thought I found that I decided to confront H about it! There are some things no matter how much you love you cant turn your head to and I will not be that girl that pretends its ok just to keep a man, that just sets a bad example to my daughter.

 

So i texted H and said Hey i wanna talk would 9am or noon be better( those are his break times) 9:02 am he calls me and asks what up and i told him i was down the road could talk face to face? He said yeah come on over to my work, so i did! I asked him about Twitter and he said he did look at twitter but he doesnt have an account, he said he also was looking at my twitter to see if i tweeted and he said i thought i deleted that! I didnt even have to ask he told me he did cause he didnt want me to see him looking at it. As far as email account he said he doesnt have another so when i got home i double checked by paying to see who the email that i entered into twitter belong too! Oops it wasnt him! Ugh

 

As for the fb friend i told him it really bothers me and i would feel better if he unfriended her. He thinks im being silly but at least he knows how i feel and what is NOT ACCEPTABLE!

 

I decided to text him at lunch to see if he wanted to finish our convo and he called me and we met for a few and chatted but he had to go do something for work so he coukdnt talk long. 15 mins later he called me to talk more! He was talkative and i told him that im having a hard time with trust and ppl we know arent helping. He wasnt happy and he said he was going to go talk to these two ppl that have been talking crap on me and confront them. He said they need to mind their own business! One is his race car buddys wife and shes been telling ppl about what happened with H and I and thats part of the reason i quit my volunteer gig, shes the president!! And a huge gossip!!!

 

H and i talked on phone 40 mins and i ended the call. Im hoping this is a start to open communication and honesty and rebuilding the trust

 

Attention LS powers that be, we seriously need a "told ya so" button.

 

Couldn't possibly like this anymore Allie. If him stepping up to defend you isn't a positive sign i don't know what is.

 

Trippi gives good advice that this is still a delicate matter and you don't want to push too hard, but you also want to allow that new found communication to grow a little. Allow, not force.

 

Not the right time to ask him, but some time has passed, do you think MC is still on the table?

 

TOJAZ

[AllieKat]

Tojaz MC is another one of my sticking points in order to make this marriage work! And though he never said he was confronting those ppl for me, he made sound like he was doing it for him, i think its a huge positive sign. He even made the comment that if comes to it he wont be helping her Hubby anymore. Thats huge right? Not that i would ever ask or expect him to give that up. He was confronting one of them tonight and another one tomorrow and im deeply afraid they will try to turn things on me and bash me to him. Im afraid hell buy into it but well see!

[tojaz]

Tojaz MC is another one of my sticking points in order to make this marriage work! And though he never said he was confronting those ppl for me, he made sound like he was doing it for him, i think its a huge positive sign. He even made the comment that if comes to it he wont be helping her Hubby anymore. Thats huge right? Not that i would ever ask or expect him to give that up. He was confronting one of them tonight and another one tomorrow and im deeply afraid they will try to turn things on me and bash me to him. Im afraid hell buy into it but well see!

 

Well Allie, even though he never said it, most people looking to get out of a marriage put a lot of time into FINDING allies rather then setting them straight about what is and isn't their business. I will agree that it was huge just to have him willing to meet you when you needed to talk and not flying off the handle at your snooping, let alone confronting these people.

 

Hopefully all goes well. Looking forward to hearing about it tomorrow.

TOJAZ

[trippi1432]

Tojaz MC is another one of my sticking points in order to make this marriage work! And though he never said he was confronting those ppl for me, he made sound like he was doing it for him, i think its a huge positive sign. He even made the comment that if comes to it he wont be helping her Hubby anymore. Thats huge right? Not that i would ever ask or expect him to give that up. He was confronting one of them tonight and another one tomorrow and im deeply afraid they will try to turn things on me and bash me to him. Im afraid hell buy into it but well see!

 

He is, but he's doing it to stand for something else...so let him do it his own way. Will he maintain the friendship with his friend, he will do what he needs to save it, he never needed or probably cared what his friend's wife thought. Understand that..it's not a power play...it's about unity. Reverse drama and accept that you husband is standing for your marriage.

[AllieKat]

I went to bed early last night so didnt get a chance to hear what happened so I texted H this Am to ask. I'm not sure how to take it and I dont want to assume but it sounds like he was looking out just for him. Heres what was said:

 

Me- Hey how did things go last night w/Mary*?

 

H-It seemed to go okay. I explained to her that I don't know for a fact where the gossip is coming from but since the only people involved besides Betty* are on the board, it has to be originating from someone on the board-and I explained that whoever it is needs to stop and that there is absolutely no reason that I, being on one end of this situation, should need to be in the middle of it too. I asked her to stop repeating anything if she was hearing things and to tell me what, if anything, is being said, and who is saying it.

 

me-Ok well hopefully it does stop. Are you going to speak to Jen* too?

 

H-She told me she is just as frustrated as I am because somehow, her name keeps being brought up in all of this; I told her I can't control that without it having a negative effect on me helping Bill* with his race car-meaning that I stop going out to their house to work on it with him and stop going to races-which is totally unnecessary if everyone else does the right thing.

 

H-As long as Jen* shows up tonight, I will be speaking to her about it.

 

Me- ok great thanks

 

 

 

So I dunno! He answered my text in length which is good I guess. Thoughts?

[Yasuandio]

Yas and I agree the girl on fb goes if H wants to stay married to me! Thats one of my rules if we make up. I will not put up with anything less on that either.[/

 

So you agree with the essense of my post, just do not agree with the collection of evidence, or the potential dangers I pointed out? And you call me crazy lady? I didn't say he did it, I said, "better safe than sorry."

 

Perhaps looking for a "I told you so button" may be premature, Mr. Tojaz. Husband was trying to fix the bad gossip so he erased the history. That doesn't exactly sound like the kind of thing a man would do, does it? Now, Allie showed her badge. She also is in the "Snoop" catagory, to add to everything else. Just because he didn't say it to her, doesn't mean it's not on his mind.

 

If he is going to use the computer for any relations, she will never see it again (whether it's going on or not). Perhaps that was the goal to begin with. I sure hope it all works out peachy keen. I really do Ms Allie. I regret I have responded on the farthest side of the continuum in addressing your concerns. In light of husband refusing to return your wedding ring, living a single-like life for a period, and now unusual on-line activity - I just call it like I see it.

 

I know you didn't mean to hurt my feeling. But I particularly sensitive to

being call "crazy" lady, since being diagnosed with this psychiatric disorder. I'll back off, and let the pros handle this. I wish you the very best luck is resurrecting an even better, more open and honest marital relationship with your husband. Trippi and Tojaz are the perfect Angels to guide you! Yas

[AllieKat]

Yas- you misunderstood! I was speaking of my post and myself with all my conclusion jumping. Not you dear! Sorry you took it that way I should of stated that clearer!