He's on vacation with his kids

[rosieisblue]

I think the reason he doesn't want rosie to meet the wife is because he is afraid she might share some truths the HE DOESN'T want Rosie to know. Heck the wife already tried to tell her but rosie wouldn't listen.

 

She told me everthing she knew about his cheating and all that. I listened and realize that he had not behaved well but he's behaved well towards me and that's the only thing I can judge him on. I doubt there is anything else she could tell me that would be 'bad'. I know he cheated on her more than once but it seems she's exagerated some of it. She's turned a kiss with her friend into an affair in her mind, some online banter with old work colleagues into affairs, a meeting with an old fling right before she found out about me as another fling when it was just two old colleagues meeting. And teh one affair she knew about before finding out the rest was forgiven a long time ago, yet she won't let it go now.

 

She just hangs on to the anger over his affairs and that isn't helping anyone, especially the kids, as she needs to let it go and move on. She says she wants a divorce but still gives him a hard time about the affairs. And she wants A LOT of money.

[woinlove]

He's a great dad. He loves his kids so much and this whole thing upsets him so much. He never wanted to see them hurt and he hates being put into this position where they want him to choose between his love for me and his love for them. He will never stop having them in his life but doesn't he deserve to be happy as well?

 

I've read that the greatest indicator of whether someone will be happy in an R is whether that person was happy before the R. I don't place high odds on MM staying happy for long, because he does not seem to have learned how to be happy with himself. But that is not the important point in regards to his children.

 

If he really cares about his children then he should want you to meet their mother as any caring parent would want to know who their own children will be spending time with, perhaps even living with part time in the future. He would also have wanted to participate in family counselling to help them adapt to the new reality of their lives. I get the impression that MM cares more about himself than about his children.

[rosieisblue]

I've read that the greatest indicator of whether someone will be happy in an R is whether that person was happy before the R. I don't place high odds on MM staying happy for long, because he does not seem to have learned how to be happy with himself. But that is not the important point in regards to his children.

 

If he really cares about his children then he should want you to meet their mother as any caring parent would want to know who their own children will be spending time with, perhaps even living with part time in the future. He would also have wanted to participate in family counselling to help them adapt to the new reality of their lives. I get the impression that MM cares more about himself than about his children.

 

I think he is happy in himself, he just wasn't happy in the MARRIAGE. I think there's a big difference there.

 

As far as me meeting teh wife, it would be way too uncomfortable. Even though she says she doesn't hate me I think she probably does and I don't want some big argument with her.

 

He is a gentle, emotional man and he is sorry she got hurt and the kids got hurt but he was unable to stay in the marriage any longer after she found out.

 

 

What I want to know is how to ease into this with teh kids. I will wait a bit but it's hard when he wants me to meet them and to make this work. I will stay away and not involve myself but eventually, when we do meet, I am not sure how to handle it. I want it to be fun and relaxed and not all awkward and awful. He thinks the kids will love me once they get to know me because I'm a lot of fun, so we've been thinking going for laser tag games or something like that, kind of like when I met his younger kid at the amusement park. Tehre was no need for lots of talk, ti was just fun and going on rides and eating candy and stuff.

[jwi71]

You aren't hearing anything being said and have gone into a reflexive and defensive stance.

 

You didn't listen in your first thread either. In fact, you are doing the same thing yet again - not listening and getting defensive.

 

Not sure what you are trying to accomplish really since you simply refute everything being said. I guess you're just venting.

 

And as such, nothing will change because venting isn't change.

 

Personally, it's brutally difficult to change from an A to a "normal R" - its going to be impossible here.

 

Good luck though.

[dreamingoftigers]

Oh my god!

 

You are in for a world of hurt.

 

How on Earth is the way you two started (and continue) your relationship anything but extremely damaging and inappropriate?

 

It isn't everyone else that "just doesn't get it."

 

He isn't an innocent party that things "just happened to."

 

He is someone that messes with his wife's friend, has multiple affairs that his exhausted wife tries to forgive until she finally gets the strength to toss him out; effectively making herself a single mother.

 

She still tries to reach out to you, which he blocks.

 

I hope he does cheat on you. Not out of bitternes, but just so you GET IT and can't justify it.

 

The marriage died because he kept cheating on her every time he felt "unhappy." then he kept associating with some of his affair partners on top of that.

 

Sadly enough all you hear is blah blah blah.

Stick with the prize, see what you've won.

 

If I was those kids, I sure as Hell wouldn't want to be friends with someone that hurt my mother, regardless if she had been hurt multiple times before, it would just make you one of the slow-thinking, selfish crowd that had done so, and the final person that caused their family to split.

 

Some people say ow have no complicity, that's garbage. Being involved in an affair hurts everyone. You might not have made her any vows but it is the same idea that we live by certain societal conduct to avoid unnecessarily hurting others. We don't make vows at the entrance to stores that we won't steal anything when we go in. We don't because it is immoral, unethical and comes with heavy consequences. Same with an affair and having a relationship with a serial cheat.

 

What has he learned from any of this? It sounds like he's still blaming his wife or the marriage for what happened to his children but he "feels really bad."

[MissBee]

Hey Rosie,

 

I have to be honest and say that I see lots of magical and unrealistic thinking going on here with regards to what you expect to happen and the reasons you think certain things are the way they are.

 

I won't dissect every red flag I see with your MM and your relationship with him, as I frankly believe this all will be short-lived. But to address the relationship with the kids. I think your expectations are unrealistic. I refer to it as magical thinking as what you expect or want to happen does not follow with anything logical. At first I thought you were discussing late teens/adult kids when you kept saying you wish they knew the truth about his cheating and how you make him happy in order to accept you. When I realized their ages, I honestly thought, wtf?! Why would an 11 and 13 year old care about that? They have NO interested in their dad's romantic "happiness" and someone telling them about that will make no difference in their like for you. All they care about is mom, dad and the life they knew and could care less about your happiness. Your youth and fun nature may even work against you with regard to them accepting you. I can't imagine as a kid if my parents divorced and my dad's OW/gf was someone a few years older than me who is fun. The kids could care LESS about how fun you are...they are concerned about the stability and life as they know it. Their WORLD has been rocked and you have to accept it will take quite a while, if ever, for them to accept or meet you.

 

I don't believe your MM is as gung ho about you meeting them as you say he is. All his actions show that their feelings come before yours, as they should. You're the one hell bent on meeting them because you feel left out. I understand it, I'm sure it's not a good feeling...but you have to realistically look at the situation and all possible outcomes, one being them never accepting you and your lives always being separate. Can you accept that?

 

Even if he were single or he had divorced before all of this, I still think it would be premature for you all to be hanging out. Parents should be picky about who they bring their kids around. Frankly, until he is super serious about you (and I know you believe he is, but I'm saying, until your relationship has withstood the test of some time as an out in the open R and things have settled down divorce wise and the relationship has matured), I do not think you should expect to be a major part of their lives. This is normal with single parents too, well good ones anyway. Most people don't have their kids hang out with and meet their gfs/bfs until the relationship has some stability. Right now yours does not and I suggest you allow him to be a dad, realize it will be separate lives for a while, figure out if you can deal or not and focus on growing the relationship instead of pushing the kids to accept you right now.

[rosieisblue]

I think I do come here to vent when I'm upset. I don't know if I'm upset or just sad today. I miss him a lot.

 

I get that he cheated before and that it wasn't a good way to behave in a marriage but I also believe he was really unhappy and had a hard time finding a way out because she's so close to his family and there would be a big drama if they divorced. I think it took him really falling in love for him to find a way out. And that was with me.

 

His family is supportive of whatever makes him happy. I think they're very sad to see the marriage end but they want him to have support and to be happy so they don't judge him and that's been a big relief to him. His parents were an affair (father was married with kids) before they got together so they are understanding that these things happen.

 

I just wish I could explain how happy we are together. We make plans for travel in the future, we talk about everything, he shares with me so much, he has cut her out of his life completely and they only communicate through email. She still argues with him but they are moving ahead with the divorce and are working out a settlement.

 

I do not believe that he will cheat on me. He's older now and more mature and knows what he wants. He wants a girl who is in shape, into working out, who is fun and all that is me. His wife is bigger, older and into the arts and things like that. And it's not that he cheated on her all the time, constantly. He had an affair six or 7 years ago with someone she worked with. She found out, he ended it, they tried to work on their marriage but she just went back to being her old self: unaffectionate, unloving, bitchy. He had a fling or two, some fun flirtations online and with work colleagues but none of them were serious and he never felt they were anything to leave his marriage for.

 

Then he met me and felt it was something more important than his marriage, that he finally found someone to share his life with so he left and once I left my partner we were together. While I was trying to decide he was patient and didn't push me. I even ended it a couple of times but his wife called my partner and told him that it was still going on and all about pictures and things like that so it ended and I was free to be with MM.

 

I love him. He loves me. I just need advice on how to make it work in the best way possible.

 

I do't think he's keeping me away from his wife to protect himself, I think it's because he is afraid she'll do something nasty to me or say something nasty. He knows I know all about the affairs and is glad because we were able to talk all that through.

 

 

Like he's said to his kids: while they were falling out of love we were falling in love and although it hurt the kids to have their family break up we fell in love and there wasn't much we could do to stop that.

Edited July 5, 2012 by rosieisblue

[MissBee]

Rosie...

 

I don't think anything anyone says about him will make any difference to you. I accept that and won't try to highlight it.

 

I will just say that all my relationships that did NOT end up working out were happy...until they weren't. Looking back I saw red flags but ignored them and those same things that didn't matter as I focused on "happiness, fun and trips" reared their ugly heads later. So just because you are fun and happy and in shape doesn't mean your MM doesn't have issues and that your relationship will last.

 

I don't think it will, if you want my honest opinion. Aside from ALL the red flags by the ton load; even in relationships with no such pressures and strains, it doesn't always last. However, I am not God so you may come back 5 years later and surprise me. But the point right now is, your relationship and the strains on it and difficulties cannot be undone. Wishing this that and the third thing won't change the reality of how things are. All you can do is focus on growing your relationship, accepting that he comes with kids and responsibilities outside of you, accept that the timeline for them accepting you is not gonna be on your watch so his time will be very divided, and focus on day by day and wee by week versus grand future plans of you and the kids or you and him.

[rosieisblue]

Hey Rosie,

 

I have to be honest and say that I see lots of magical and unrealistic thinking going on here with regards to what you expect to happen and the reasons you think certain things are the way they are.

 

I won't dissect every red flag I see with your MM and your relationship with him, as I frankly believe this all will be short-lived. But to address the relationship with the kids. I think your expectations are unrealistic. I refer to it as magical thinking as what you expect or want to happen does not follow with anything logical. At first I thought you were discussing late teens/adult kids when you kept saying you wish they knew the truth about his cheating and how you make him happy in order to accept you. When I realized their ages, I honestly thought, wtf?! Why would an 11 and 13 year old care about that? They have NO interested in their dad's romantic "happiness" and someone telling them about that will make no difference in their like for you. All they care about is mom, dad and the life they knew and could care less about your happiness. Your youth and fun nature may even work against you with regard to them accepting you. I can't imagine as a kid if my parents divorced and my dad's OW/gf was someone a few years older than me who is fun. The kids could care LESS about how fun you are...they are concerned about the stability and life as they know it. Their WORLD has been rocked and you have to accept it will take quite a while, if ever, for them to accept or meet you.

 

I don't believe your MM is as gung ho about you meeting them as you say he is. All his actions show that their feelings come before yours, as they should. You're the one hell bent on meeting them because you feel left out. I understand it, I'm sure it's not a good feeling...but you have to realistically look at the situation and all possible outcomes, one being them never accepting you and your lives always being separate. Can you accept that?

 

Even if he were single or he had divorced before all of this, I still think it would be premature for you all to be hanging out. Parents should be picky about who they bring their kids around. Frankly, until he is super serious about you (and I know you believe he is, but I'm saying, until your relationship has withstood the test of some time as an out in the open R and things have settled down divorce wise and the relationship has matured), I do not think you should expect to be a major part of their lives. This is normal with single parents too, well good ones anyway. Most people don't have their kids hang out with and meet their gfs/bfs until the relationship has some stability. Right now yours does not and I suggest you allow him to be a dad, realize it will be separate lives for a while, figure out if you can deal or not and focus on growing the relationship instead of pushing the kids to accept you right now.

 

 

We are serious, we've been serious since my partner and I broke up. We were even serious before that but were faced with this huge thing of letting down our partners gently, which got blown up when she found out.

 

We have been together as a real relationship for seven months and were together before that as an affair for more than five months. That is one year of loving each other and that's a long time for stability. We've had a few blowups due to the kids but that's settling down. They dont' call or text me nasty messages anymore and seem to be much calmer around him, just determined that they don't like me when they haven't even met me.

 

I know that their world has changed but if everyone makes the effort for it to work it's best for them because they'll see their dad in a stable and proper relationship that has REAL love and that will be a good model for their own future relationships.

 

I know it's going to take time for them to accept me, because of how it started, but they have known about me since his wife found out and he has made it clear that he is not coming home. He bought his own apartment and is living freely as a single man. They will be divorced before the new year and the kids know this.

 

I just think that the longer we go without starting those relationships with the kids the harder it's going to be, they're going to have more time to be resentful and in the meantime me and MM will be moving forward with our relationship with a big part missing: his kids.

[skywriter]

I just don't see where I'll be their stepmother. I'm only 12 years older than his oldest kid so I don't see me being anything more than a friend to them. They have a mother and that's good.

 

Rosie,

 

what you are implying is that because you're only 12 yrs older than the eldest child that you don't have the responsibility or maturity to be a stepmother.

 

On the other hand you imply that just because your boyfriend is what? 15 or 16 yrs older than you, that, you are mature enough to handle being his wife without the responsibility of participating in their upbringing.

[dreamingoftigers]

I think the more you two selfishly push those kids to accept you and this relationship, the more they will resent you both.

 

If they have any kind of happy relationship with their father going into their 20s, I will be shocked.

 

Do not have kids with this man unless you want to be consoling them in the future.

[MissBee]

We are serious, we've been serious since my partner and I broke up. We were even serious before that but were faced with this huge thing of letting down our partners gently, which got blown up when she found out.

 

We have been together as a real relationship for seven months and were together before that as an affair for more than five months. That is one year of loving each other and that's a long time for stability. We've had a few blowups due to the kids but that's settling down. They dont' call or text me nasty messages anymore and seem to be much calmer around him, just determined that they don't like me when they haven't even met me.

 

I know that their world has changed but if everyone makes the effort for it to work it's best for them because they'll see their dad in a stable and proper relationship that has REAL love and that will be a good model for their own future relationships.

 

I know it's going to take time for them to accept me, because of how it started, but they have known about me since his wife found out and he has made it clear that he is not coming home. He bought his own apartment and is living freely as a single man. They will be divorced before the new year and the kids know this.

 

I just think that the longer we go without starting those relationships with the kids the harder it's going to be, they're going to have more time to be resentful and in the meantime me and MM will be moving forward with our relationship with a big part missing: his kids.

 

You have been together as a real couple for less than a year....

 

Coupled with the A and that drama, I don't believe you can consider this relationship stable, based on 7 months and 5 months.

 

I'm talking more longterm...it is all well and good that you've lasted for a year, as part affair part real relationship, but the dust has not even begun to settle yet IMO and maybe when you get to the 3 year mark as an out and out couple...then you can start believing there is more stability there. Maybe it will take that long or more for you to become a legitimate part of his life. You seem very young-minded where one year seems like a long time for stability, in high school relationships, that is a while...but IMO it isn't that long, esp not in this kind of setup. I've read studies on it taking up to three years for a couple to really get to know each other and really know if they are serious and can last the longhaul...furthermore a one year A relationship IMO is nothing to build your hopes of a future on. Give it more time. After the 3 year mark, come back and talk to us.

 

What you're saying doesn't make sense. I suggest like others have said, that you read and learn about divorcing parents, kids and the new partner. I am sure there are books and articles about this. Maybe those will give you more insight and tips. I don't think them waiting to meet you for a longer time will be more resentment....that makes NO SENSE! The quicker you are forced on them the more resentment and you will be salt in a FRESH wound Rosie. After things have calmed down and they're used to the divorce, don't you think they will have more time to NOT associate you with what happened. If you show up now you will be pinned forever as the bad person IMO. I don't think you really care about the kids frankly. I think you just are tired of being on the outside so you want to push anything, even things that don't make sense, so that you can stop missing him and being alone and this is your tantrum about it.

 

None of what you said seems to be in the best interest of the kids...just your own interest, so you stop feeling left out and badly. All of it comes from a place of YOU and what YOU want, regardless of it's practicality. You seem to want to just hurry and meet so that you stop feeling like the OW, you don't have to seem like you're still sharing etc. I think a woman who truly cared for the kids would never try to push this so much, but would be more understanding and would sit back and allow it to play out for a while instead of saying I miss my man so much, those pesky kids, why can't his kids like me so I can hang out with all of them and not be an outsider. I suggest you read some books and articles on what is normal and abnormal in these situations, divorce and kids, divorce, kids and the OW turned gf...google it, go to a book store, buy them and read them if you intend to be in this man's life. That will give you a REALISTIC view of the situation and what to expect and when, as what you're thinking is far from it.

Edited July 5, 2012 by MissBee

[Owl]

Rosie...there is no quick, easy fix to this situation.

 

I honestly don't believe that there's going to be a long, drawn out, painful fix to this situation.

 

Regardless of whatever 'reason' offered for his past infidelities...past behavior is an indicator of likely future behavior.

 

If he can't find a way to be happy in this relationship (with you)...he's going to look for another relationship.

 

I don't see how he's going to be happy anytime soon in this relationship. The situation created by starting this relationship with you as an affair...and how the children feel about that and about you...will maintain a high level of stress for quite some time to come.

 

The stress of dealing with you, and with his kids, and with how the two groups (don't) interact is going to keep him unhappy...and you've already seen where his unhappiness leads.

 

Counseling.

 

For you.

 

For him.

 

For the both of you as a couple.

 

For his kids.

 

Eventually, possibly...for you, him, and his kids as a pseudo-family unit.

 

If that's not feasible...I don't see a "rosie future".

[frozensprouts]

Rosie,

a "fling" or being"flirty" in emails IS cheating for a lot of people, even if you do see it that way ( and i expect you'd change your opinion on that if you were to find out that he had sent "flirty" emails to his ex wife or had a "fling" with her)...what do you mean by "fling" or "flirty" anyway?

 

as for his kids...

 

they are still very young and their parents marriage splitting up will have been devastating to them. They love their dad, so they may very well end up assigning all of the blame for that on you, and , to be honest, if I were i their position I would feel the same way. I don't understand how you thought that being with him was somehow separate than being with them...they are a "package deal" and are probably hurting a huge amount right now...his concern should be with them, not you. You are an adult, they are children who lives have just been turned upside down ( and I will say that the fact that you sometimes wish that the kids knew about their dad's other cheating just so they might like you a bit better is pretty nauseating...let's hurt them even more just so things might be a bit easier for you?)

 

I know you love this guy, but the more you say about him, the more his story stinks. It seems to me that the only reason he isn't at home with his wife pretending everything is okay while keeping you as his latest "fling" is that he got caught and she kicked him out. I think he doesn't want you actually meeting his wife because if you did, you might find out that he is, well, full of you know what.

 

he's got a pattern in relationships where he sees cheating as acceptable ( he must, otherwise he wouldn't have cheated), and no amount of love or working out or being thin and young and attractive on your part will change that...he is what he is. The fact that his parents relationship is the result of an affair is even more troubling...he learned from them that affairs ( to use your words)"just happen"...

 

right now, you provide him with what he needs...what will happen when those needs change? will he turn to you, or will you find yourself in the position that his wife is now in? What if you change? will he still love you? Just remember that once he was telling his wife the same sweet words he's now telling you, and look what happened...the problem lies within him and no one else, and until he changes that part of himself ( if he even can) his behavior will not change

[Quiet Storm]

How do I make this all work well? How do we get the kids to accept that I make him happy? And I do, he tells me this all the time. I make him so happy.

 

Most younger kids are self-focused and do not care if their parents are happy.

 

Telling them how happy you make their Dad will only solidify their assumption that he is putting his own personal happiness over theirs.

 

Kids want their stability and wellbeing to be more important than their Dad's romantic fulfillment. It can be a real shock to learn that someone who they likely thought would take a bullet for them, would break up their family unit for "happiness".

 

To them, having their lives totally turned upside is not worth Daddy's happiness.

 

It is not realistic to think that you will be a happy family with his kids. At least not for a very long time.

[carhill]

^^^ Yep.

 

OP, I know it's tough, but ratchet back those expectations. You signed up for some difficult, if rewarding to you personally, duty. With choices come responsibilities and consequences. Accept them and move forward.

[dreamingoftigers]

OP

Anytime I see a person that says "you make me happy" or "I am looking for someone to make me happy" I run for the hills.

 

Those that need external validation to be happy tend to be cheaters. Happiness should be intrinsic and not related to external validation.

 

The wife could not make him happy and he cheated.

 

OP, you will not be able to make MM happy 24/7. At some point you will fail.

 

Then you can hear about how "we just aren't happy anymore."

 

Even by cheating multiple times, he put himself far before his children.

You are a very obvious extension of his selfishness.

I think you are lucky to have the ex-wife that you do have in this situation.

Be prepared to deal with it in the future.

[mercy]

Depending on which state you are in the mother can have it in the divorce that you cannot be with the children.

 

Take a step back and put yourself in their shoes. This is going to take years. If you don't know what patience are now, just wait. Bite your tongue, what you don't want to be doing is arguing with a man about his children. When the dust settles it will be them he chooses.

[mercy]

OP

Anytime I see a person that says "you make me happy" or "I am looking for someone to make me happy" I run for the hills.

 

Those that need external validation to be happy tend to be cheaters. Happiness should be intrinsic and not related to external validation.

 

The wife could not make him happy and he cheated.

 

OP, you will not be able to make MM happy 24/7. At some point you will fail.

 

 

Just had to say, this is a wonderful post. What wisdom in these words.

 

Take heed, OP.

[whichwayisup]

They're 11 and 13. The affair was exposed on the 13 year old's birthday and he resents it still.

 

He will resent that for a very long time..Maybe forever.

 

You can't live on love and if his kids don't ever accept you, and that may happen (they have every right not to accept you into their lives) then your relationship with him in the future will be difficult.

[Spark1111]

RIB, I think you hit the motherlode with this stbxwife.

 

She never says a bad word against you, according to both he and the children?

 

She tried to meet you to discuss parenting and you refused?

 

rosie, you were just the straw that broke her back after tolerating years of his cheating. She is now, seemingly being gracious to you as she is in damage control mode for the sake of her children.

 

Sounds like a great mom, putting the needs of her children first as she dumps him after this last dday. Sounds like she has class in extending an olive branch to you because you will eventually be in her children's lives.

 

Rosie, you are not all that important to her. She is just hoping for the smoothest transition for her children and most likely, wanted to enlist you in this endeavor.

 

Your problem is your MM. He avoids conflict, told you not to return her calls, and has told you his kids want no part of you.

 

Are you sure this is all true?

 

Or is your MM coming up with excuses to avoid having his children meet you?

 

I think you should call her back and ask her what her expectations woud be of you if and when you meet her children. Then, you'll know for sure how much they hate you.

 

...just saying...

[whichwayisup]

Stop trying to control his wife (ex wife) and what she does or thinks.

 

I also wish she had stayed calm when she found out but she went crazy.

 

How do you think a betrayed spouse should react? With care, calm and respect? Come on, you're living in a dream if you really thought things would go smoothly and those kids would accept you.

[MissBee]

RIB, I think you hit the motherlode with this stbxwife.

 

She never says a bad word against you, according to both he and the children?

 

She tried to meet you to discuss parenting and you refused?

 

rosie, you were just the straw that broke her back after tolerating years of his cheating. She is now, seemingly being gracious to you as she is in damage control mode for the sake of her children.

 

Sounds like a great mom, putting the needs of her children first as she dumps him after this last dday. Sounds like she has class in extending an olive branch to you because you will eventually be in her children's lives.

 

Rosie, you are not all that important to her. She is just hoping for the smoothest transition for her children and most likely, wanted to enlist you in this endeavor.

 

Your problem is your MM. He avoids conflict, told you not to return her calls, and has told you his kids want no part of you.

 

Are you sure this is all true?

 

Or is your MM coming up with excuses to avoid having his children meet you?

 

I think you should call her back and ask her what her expectations woud be of you if and when you meet her children. Then, you'll know for sure how much they hate you.

 

...just saying...

 

I agree.

 

It seems as though this woman is being as gracious and nice as possible, given the circumstances. It is completely unrealistic to expect and DEMAND that your MM's wife and kids just all love and embrace you and not be upset. A reasonable person should expect that this will not be a bed of roses. I know I would and would be treading lightly. If the stbxw was gracious enough to want to meet up and discuss her kids, I'd be surprised, maybe a bit suspicious BUT nonetheless I'd give it a shot and see for myself. I'd try to smooth over any bumps from now, showing that I am sorry for the circumstances and showing I am genuine and care about the kids, instead of being defensive and doing MORE things to make myself seem like a standoffish person who has no interest in her kids and just want the man. I would do everything to not make it seem like I'm making him choose me or the kids and that I'm antagonistic towards her, when I'm the one whose at fault here.

 

Rosie, what has his wife done to you? All you have to go on is what MM says she will supposedly do. You're a big girl, not his kid, you can handle yourself and you should talk to her. If you're big enough to have an A and big enough to think all will eventually go well, then you're big enough to have a chat with the stbxw. Don't you think so? If she's nasty to you, so what? You're big enough to handle it. I'm sure she won't physically assault you.Tell him you'd love to talk to her, you don't think she will be nasty, and if she is, you'll handle it graciously. Say that and see what he says. I have a feeling he is not concerned about you why he doesn't want the conversation, but rather his concern is for himself. You say it's not true...then prove it! Tell him, you want to talk to her woman to woman and watch his response. Watch if he will clamor and do everything possible to dissuade you. If he uses her being "mean" to you as the reason why not, tell him you're not worried about it, you realize she may be a bit snarky, you are mature and expect this and will handle the situation well. Then watch his reaction after that. What is the WORST that can happen by you speaking to his wife? Do it for YOURSELF and see and don't let him tell you what to do or not do in that regard. If you plan to be in his life, so will his kids, and so will their mom. Meet up with her for YOURSELF and come to your own conclusions versus allowing him to tell you what she'll do or not.

Edited July 5, 2012 by MissBee

[CarrieT]

Here is a little history for you: My 51-year old BF was your BF's 13-year old boy when his father left the marital home for the mistress.

 

My BF HATED this woman for years - at least a decade, if not longer. He has spoken with me about it. His father and the mistress have now been married for 40-some years and he has only recently been able to apologize to the now-wife for his behavior all those years ago.

 

Don't hold your breath it is going to happen quickly.

[Got it]

Rosie,

 

I am in a similar situation. I have had limited involvement with the kids for a multitude of reasons. And yes this is the road I have chosen to walk down. We too had a dday and the oldest especially is most unhappy with me. We are three years from everything and there is little improvement.

 

For me, I think it terms of decades and know that I have a very long haul with the kids. But I remember being their ages and I know that they didn't choose this. There are many things they don't know about the whole situation, their parents, etc. and being kids just wanted to live their lives focused on them like it is kind of suppose to be.

 

You picked a very tough situation that will be a hard road for you and your sMM. This is a choice you guys are making and it will take a great deal of time.

 

In my eyes I see the best, the luckiest, I am going to get with them is maybe one day be seen as a friend. But I also know that I have contributed to hurting them and feel responsibility for that as well. We have never tried to force the kids to do anything they don't want to do and know they will do things at their pace. The best thing we can do is allow them the power to control their involvement with me.

 

One thing I can recommend is looking into family counseling. This will help his relationship with the kids and eventually your relationship with them. I would not think or advise integrating until after the divorce is final.

 

Please take the time to think about the situation on the whole, there is a lot you are getting into here and a lot of work everyone is going to need to do. The best advise I can offer is really look at the foundation between you and sMM, work on it, and think of mending the bridges with the kids in terms of years and decades.

 

We made the choice to have an affair and so these can be the consequences for them.

 

(((((rosie))))))