I'm currently not speaking to my mother

[SpiralOut]

Another problem I don't know how to deal with. My mother put this belief in my head and I can't get it out. She has always treated me as if something is wrong with me - heck, she even said so right in front of me. I've always been a bit shy and socially awkward so that's why she gets to me. I've always wondered, could I have autism? Am I on the spectrum? Do I have some sort of disorder?

 

I have researched it and the symptoms don't speak to me. In fact I'm wondering if they perhaps apply to her, and she's projecting them onto me. She comes across as really weird to people. I've noticed that her social skills are not the greatest. She clearly has problems with boundaries.

 

I cannot help but wonder if my awkwardness may have come from her influence. Am I unsure of myself because I grew up without a normal role model? And on top of that she makes it very clear that she "worries" about me. Bull**** she worries, she probably desperately wants something to be wrong with me so she can feel better in comparison.

 

In spite of knowing all that, I still can't shake the fear, or the belief that I have a disorder. I've been too afraid to ask a doctor about it.

[turnera]

I GUARANTEE your awkwardness is because of your mom.

 

 

There's nothing wrong with you, spiral. You're working your way out of a bunch of dysfunction, and that's slow going.

 

 

Kids grow up learning how to 'be' by watching their parents. If your weren't rooting for you, cheering you on, telling you you could be anything you wanted to be...well, you're going to grow up to be quiet (or the opposite), unsure, non-daring, expecting people to not want to be around you, etc.

 

 

Don't sweat it. Be proud of yourself and the improvements you're making. Enjoy life.

[dreamingoftigers]

Another problem I don't know how to deal with. My mother put this belief in my head and I can't get it out. She has always treated me as if something is wrong with me - heck, she even said so right in front of me. I've always been a bit shy and socially awkward so that's why she gets to me. I've always wondered, could I have autism? Am I on the spectrum? Do I have some sort of disorder?

 

I have researched it and the symptoms don't speak to me. In fact I'm wondering if they perhaps apply to her, and she's projecting them onto me. She comes across as really weird to people. I've noticed that her social skills are not the greatest. She clearly has problems with boundaries.

 

I cannot help but wonder if my awkwardness may have come from her influence. Am I unsure of myself because I grew up without a normal role model? And on top of that she makes it very clear that she "worries" about me. Bull**** she worries, she probably desperately wants something to be wrong with me so she can feel better in comparison.

 

In spite of knowing all that, I still can't shake the fear, or the belief that I have a disorder. I've been too afraid to ask a doctor about it.

 

You know what's weird?

 

I have these issues with my crazy passive-aggressive narcissist parents too.

 

And it made me wonder the EXACT SAME THING.

 

I don't think I am on the spectrum anymore. Thanks.

 

I am just awkward because I had a childhood of dumb parenting where my mother let me know that I was "crazy" everytime I believed what I saw and heard instead of her own fantasy of how my Dad was.

[badpenny]

I could single-handedly write a 19-page thread about the relationship I have with my mother, that would make this one pale by comparison.

 

I hasten to add, that's not intended to be a 'challenge to a pissing-contest' SpiralOut, I'm actually totally empathising with you.

 

My mother and my husband absolutley loathe one another.

Currently, due to very difficult personal circumstances the beginnings of which are out of our control (though we're working on the consequences and trying to better matters) we all live under the same roof.

Naturally, I get the infinitely prestigious and utterly enviable position of 'Piggy-in-the-Middle' and it's extremely wearing.

 

The other day, while both were present, I asked them if there wasn't a single time when they could possibly engage in a normal conversation, without resorting to not-so-subtle one-upmanship and bickering.

They both protested their innocence, as in 'Well it's not my fault, don't blame me, I didn't start it' mode, to which I replied,,

 

"Hang on.... I get on perfectly well with you (mother,) and I get on perfectly well with you (husband), but you two guys do not get on at all... yet, you say it isn't you, and you say it isn't you, so I guess that just leaves me, then. It's all my fault. Is that what you're telling me?"

 

All this said in quiet tone, with a wry smile and a benevolent dose of sarcasm.

 

My dedication to following a Buddhist path, has been of truly immeasurable benefit, comfort and support to me.

I'm not preaching.

I'm merely indicating that I'm convinced without it, I'd be standing in a High Court dock, accused of wilful and intentional murder on 2 counts, and be pleading guilty.

 

As it is, my mother - while being dysfunctional, elderly and very much a product of her Catholic Italian early-to-mid 20th century upbringing - tells me in "good" moments, that she is envious of my patience, good humour and Compassionate and placid attitudes.

My husband's just a high-functioning passive-aggressive narcissist with mild sociopathic tendencies.

 

But I know that, so I can cope with it pretty well.

[Auspecial]

I forgot to mention that this whole experience has forced me to find my own inner mother. Because really, dealing with her is like dealing with a little kid, except that I can't put her into a time out. Whenever she acts out, I am forced to go into this weird "motherly" mode where I have to act nice, but stern, and make sure to correct her without making her feel bad.

 

 

By the time I have kids of my own I'll know what to do! And I won't be like her, either. I will ask the future father/husband to keep an eye on me and tell me if I'm out of line. And if I catch myself repeating her mistakes, I'll put myself into therapy. I can be a good mother.

 

You are exactly right! You can learn how to be a good mother by watching other good mothers who are supportive, WANT their kids to succeed socially and in other ways, and have normal boundaries.

[turnera]

Since you're discussing parenting, my favorite subject,

 

Start reading about authoritative parenting. It's what I did (without knowing it) when I raised my DD24, and she turned out amazing.

 

I can tell you more about it if you want. Here are some brief explanations.

Characteristics of the Authoritative Parenting Style

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/thinking-about-kids/201409/authoritative-vs-authoritarian-parenting-style

 

The authoritative parenting style: A guide for the science-minded parent

[SpiralOut]

I GUARANTEE your awkwardness is because of your mom.

 

 

There's nothing wrong with you, spiral. You're working your way out of a bunch of dysfunction, and that's slow going.

 

 

Kids grow up learning how to 'be' by watching their parents. If your weren't rooting for you, cheering you on, telling you you could be anything you wanted to be...well, you're going to grow up to be quiet (or the opposite), unsure, non-daring, expecting people to not want to be around you, etc.

 

 

Don't sweat it. Be proud of yourself and the improvements you're making. Enjoy life.

 

 

That's true, I have always felt as though people don't really want to be around me. I still somehow managed to have good friends MOST of the time. I was never totally friendless until a few years ago when I began to change and stopped trusting people.

 

 

The weird thing is that in certain ways my mother did root for me. It was confusing because she sent mixed messages.... acting proud of my academic acheivements (I had good grades) and telling me I'm talented (lots of people have told me I'm a talented writer) yet she discouraged me from pursuing a writing career. So I grew up believing that she wanted the best for me, because in certain ways she acted like it. But really, she wanted me to do what she wished she had done. Talk about being mind-f*cked.

 

You know what's weird?

 

I have these issues with my crazy passive-aggressive narcissist parents too.

 

And it made me wonder the EXACT SAME THING.

 

I don't think I am on the spectrum anymore. Thanks.

 

I am just awkward because I had a childhood of dumb parenting where my mother let me know that I was "crazy" everytime I believed what I saw and heard instead of her own fantasy of how my Dad was.

 

 

Thank you so much for sharing this. I feel better knowing that I'm not the only one to have felt that way.

 

Since you're discussing parenting, my favorite subject,

 

Start reading about authoritative parenting. It's what I did (without knowing it) when I raised my DD24, and she turned out amazing.

 

I can tell you more about it if you want. Here are some brief explanations.

Characteristics of the Authoritative Parenting Style

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/thinking-about-kids/201409/authoritative-vs-authoritarian-parenting-style

 

The authoritative parenting style: A guide for the science-minded parent

 

 

Thanks for the links. I remember learning that term in a psychology class years ago. That's how I would try to parent for sure.

[SpiralOut]

I am also wondering if this affects that type of people I attract and the way that they speak to me. I have a very hard time not taking things personally.

 

 

I've been trying to meet new people and there have been several times where I am the one singled out. For example, at one meet-up group I was being friendly and the organizer freaked out and shouted something very rude at me. Everyone else liked me well enough. She just took things out, belittling me in front of everyone. It caused this dead silence at the table. What I still wonder to this day is why, out of ALL the women at the table, she chose ONLY ME to act rude to? She continued to act hostile to me throughout the lunch. It shocked me.

 

 

There are several women at work who have taken **** out on me. In that case, I know they are doing it because they are miserable. But still, I can't help but wonder why do they leave certain people alone, yet choose ME to take their **** out on? Two of them are off my back now I have told them to back off.

 

 

A couple summers ago I went to a friends wedding. A so-called "friend" randomly out of nowhere angrily yelled at me to smile more. She did it in the middle of someone's speech. It was really rude of her and everyone turned to stare at us.

 

 

What is it about me that causes other women to explode at me and cause scenes in front of other people? Out of ALL the people available to freak out at, for some reason it's always ME who gets it, and it's unprovoked.

 

 

And I'll mention also that of all the meet-up groups I've gone to, 99% of the people either like me or act neutral enough that I can't tell what they think. Out of a group of 10, there will be that 1 person who takes issue with me. I don't even really care that they don't like me, it mostly pisses me off to be singled out and belittled. I don't recall seeing anyone else spoken to rudely in the ways that I have been. Or maybe it has happened to others, but I wasn't there at the time to see it.

 

 

I can only think of one instance where a man acted that way towards me. He didn't say anything rude exactly, but he spoke to me in a way that was condescending and disdainful. I've noticed that most of the people who act that way with me are insecure in some way. Still, I cannot help but wonder why take their insecurities out on me, while leaving the people beside me alone?

 

 

It's easy for you guys to tell me that it's not about me....but if it's really not about me then why is it always me being targeted? Am I doing something wrong? Or is it just that I grew up taking crap from my mother, and I have a sign on my head that says "please belittle me, I'm used to it anyway" ?

Edited April 26, 2015 by SpiralOut

[Mittens]

I've posted in the past about how your mother is just like mine.

 

Your last post also reminded me of stuff that has happened in my own life. Between the ages of 9 to 15, due to travelling the world with my father's work, I went to 5 different high schools. It was an absolute nightmare, I had to change school on average twice a year. To this day, I hate change with a passion.

 

But like you've experienced, towards the end I realised that there would be at least one girl in my class (I went to private girls schools) who would hate/dislike me. To the point that when I started somewhere new, I would look around the classroom trying to figure out which girl it would be. I also learnt not to take it personally, it was just a numbers game. You are never going to have 100% people like you, 100% of the time.

 

Of course, grown adults have a responsibility to just cope in social situations where there are people they don't like. I've encountered a fair few however who never really got out of the high school mind set and just can't. But their rudeness only reflects on them, not you. Don't waste energy caring about the motivations of rude people. They really aren't worth it.

[turnera]

I am also wondering if this affects that type of people I attract and the way that they speak to me. I have a very hard time not taking things personally.

 

I've been trying to meet new people and there have been several times where I am the one singled out. For example, at one meet-up group I was being friendly and the organizer freaked out and shouted something very rude at me. Everyone else liked me well enough. She just took things out, belittling me in front of everyone. It caused this dead silence at the table. What I still wonder to this day is why, out of ALL the women at the table, she chose ONLY ME to act rude to? She continued to act hostile to me throughout the lunch. It shocked me.

It's hard to imagine, but predator people actually seek out victim people and latch onto them, usually without even realizing they're doing it. It's incredibly subtle stuff, and fascinating. You exude...something...that predators sense. And use. To give THEM superiority.

 

 

Ask your therapist about it.

[SpiralOut]

It's hard to imagine, but predator people actually seek out victim people and latch onto them, usually without even realizing they're doing it. It's incredibly subtle stuff, and fascinating. You exude...something...that predators sense. And use. To give THEM superiority.

 

 

Ask your therapist about it.

 

You know what's weird... now that I think of it, that same woman asked me to do something. I forget what it was exactly but I told her "I'm willing to consider it." She looked flabbergasted . It looked like she was expecting me to say yes. The idea that I might say no did not occur to her. And it was something she should NOT have expected me to say yes to, anyway. That happened a couple of times. I remember feeling like she expected me to be her sidekick.

 

 

So maybe I exude some sort of "I will do anything to be friends with you" vibe.

 

 

I'm not seeing my therapist anymore. I felt that she wasn't a very good match. But I will consider trying someone else. Maybe I should look for someone who specializes in narcissism.

Edited April 27, 2015 by SpiralOut

[SpiralOut]

Question: If a predator has singled me out as his/her target, is there a chance they could change their mind? For example, if I stand up for myself RIGHT AWAY, and don't give them what they are wanting, will they realize their mistake and move onto someone else? Or will they continue to cling onto me?

 

 

Ideally, I would like to NOT be a target in the first place. However, I don't think I can change that overnight, so that leaves me with self-defense. How easy would you say it is to kick someone off me? In my experience so far, it has been very difficult. They seem to be very stubborn SOBs. Is there something I can do to get rid of them more quickly?

Edited April 27, 2015 by SpiralOut

[SpiralOut]

Come to think of it, most of the "predators" I've come across are people I have instantly recognized as being low in self-confidence. Not all people with low self confidence act hostile, however, so it must be something else that I am seeing right away. My first instinct is to be nice to them. Not sure why . . . maybe because living with my mother meant that I had to be as nice as possible to her in order to avoid her moods? Perhaps they remind me of her somehow? Or maybe I perceive that their behaviour is off-putting, so I act nice. I believe (or used to believe) that sometimes all a person needs is kindness.

 

 

Except being nice doesn't work. If anything it gives them a REASON to take things out on me. I think their thought process goes along the lines of "wow this girl likes me. Okay, so I don't need to worry about trying to impress her since she likes me already." Then, they act however they want to me.

 

 

That would be my guess. From now on when I recognize someone with those traits I'll stay away. They are looking for someone nice enough to vent their frustrations onto.

 

 

Perhaps they see kindness as weakness. OR perhaps they think that something must be wrong with me if I like them so easily, so they automatically look down on me. OR perhaps they see my attempts at kindness as condescension. That's not my intention at all, but it's possible I come across badly. But even if I do I'm not sure how that excuses anything. I've dealt with people being extremely condescending to my face and I didn't let them see that it bothered me. But maybe they don't know how to control themselves. Hmmm.

Edited May 2, 2015 by SpiralOut

[turnera]

You know what else helps - being 100% honest. Saying to their face exactly what they are doing. "Really? You're asking me what I had to eat? When we all know - every one of us at this table - that what you really meant was 'wow, you look fat.' I don't appreciate passive aggressive people."

 

But you're right, some people DO see kindness as a weakness and will exploit you.

[SpiralOut]

I get pissed off pretty easily when people make assumptions about me. I think this comes from the way my mother assumed/s that I'm her. It's not nice to grow up with your parent not seeing you for who you really are. I get riled up when I notice someone making assumptions about what I feel, what I think, who I am. I've encountered people who would take my words and twist them around into something I did not say at all. Or they would see the look on my face and assume to know what I'm thinking. It angers me.

 

 

I try to not react. If one person does it continuously to me, then I do eventually react, I just blow up. I become even more angry if I correct them and they ignore me. My mother did that often. If I ever said something she didn't like, she didn't respond to it.

 

 

Ah crap I need to call her tomorrow.

 

 

Also, I've decided that she must be jealous of me. I don't know why else she would try to belittle my relationship. I'm sorry but that was a major social blunder. If I were to go out with a group of people, and I were to say to another woman "why do you call your boyfriend that??" it would make me look like a bitch.

 

 

I think she is still a teenager inside her head.

 

 

I also get pissed off with childish adults.

[turnera]

You're better off trying to feel sorry for them.

[Col1]

Parent drama. Totally can relate. Sure hope when we all are parents we'll avoid instigating this craziness with our own kids!

[Auspecial]

Healthy parents want their children to succeed.

 

Normal parents want their children to be healthy.

[Auspecial]

You know what's weird... now that I think of it, that same woman asked me to do something. I forget what it was exactly but I told her "I'm willing to consider it." She looked flabbergasted . It looked like she was expecting me to say yes. The idea that I might say no did not occur to her. And it was something she should NOT have expected me to say yes to, anyway. That happened a couple of times. I remember feeling like she expected me to be her sidekick.

 

 

So maybe I exude some sort of "I will do anything to be friends with you" vibe.

 

 

I'm not seeing my therapist anymore. I felt that she wasn't a very good match. But I will consider trying someone else. Maybe I should look for someone who specializes in narcissism.

 

 

Good for you, SpiralOut. You do not have to agree to other people terms if they don't match your terms.

[Auspecial]

Question: If a predator has singled me out as his/her target, is there a chance they could change their mind? For example, if I stand up for myself RIGHT AWAY, and don't give them what they are wanting, will they realize their mistake and move onto someone else? Or will they continue to cling onto me?

 

 

Ideally, I would like to NOT be a target in the first place. However, I don't think I can change that overnight, so that leaves me with self-defense. How easy would you say it is to kick someone off me? In my experience so far, it has been very difficult. They seem to be very stubborn SOBs. Is there something I can do to get rid of them more quickly?

 

IMO, this is a time where being justifiably angry works. People who cross lines and push themselves and their own wants onto others really make me annoyed and angry.

 

Did they not get the memo that the world does not revolve around them??

 

No, they didn't and most likely, never will "get it."

 

This is an area that all women have to deal with, not just those who have scars from an abusive family.

 

My answer here is that if you are annoyed and angry enough, you will be easily able to get rid of these types. If they still stick, you have every right to contact 911. If their boundaries are that poor, you have the green light to do everything in your power to stop them.

[turnera]

The best way to deal with a predator is to make them uncomfortable. If they can be humiliated, do so - call them out in front of other people. If they care about money, sue them. And so on. Be smarter than them.

[SpiralOut]

Yeah you're both right. I have always tried hard to not humiliate people, even if they are being rude to me I don't want to be kicking people below the belt. But I'm getting better at doing it in a way that "matches" the situation.

 

 

A few weeks ago I went to a meet-up. It was going well until the end of it when this one woman put me on the spot. I had been talking to a few people there, but not many, and she noticed it and demanded that I talk more. I asked her well what do you want me to say? Lol. She then started grilling me with all these questions while everyone stared at me. She even made some rude comments about how I was "giving one word answers." Well of course I am, I'm nervous because you put me on the spot!! I then got pissed off and said "wow I feel like I'm being interviewed or something!!"She then got embarrassed and stopped. She apologized to me afterwards.

 

 

Also, I met someone who I think MIGHT exude the same vibe as me. I get along with her, and she's very nice. Unlike me, she's not shy about talking. However, when she talks, she doesn't sound confident. Anyway, a few of us went out to dinner last night. This other woman was there, someone we hadn't met yet. It didn't take that woman long to ask her "so where at the babies? I heard you've been married for 8 years. So where are the babies?"

 

 

 

 

I couldn't tell if the woman was rattled or not by the question. She just sort of rambled about how she doesn't want to look after a baby because she can hardly look after her cat. I'm assuming she felt uncomfortable - I sure as hell would be!! And that question came out of nowhere, and they hardly knew each other. WTF!!

 

 

Anyway I guess I'll just have to stop feeling bad about embarrassing people. I would rather be respected by other people for saying "F off" than look like a doormat. Other people's feelings don't always come before mine. That's something that is hard for me to change. I've always put other people before myself.

[turnera]

You've always put people before you.

 

So who's going to put YOU ahead?

[SpiralOut]

Exactly. I have always put others first. I still feel guilty sometimes if I do what is best for me. Even when I protect myself I feel like a bad person. There have been times when I stand up for myself against someone and afterwards I question myself. "Being nice" and doing the "right thing" has always been the most important thing to me. I have trouble understanding or admitting that being rude doesn't make me a bad person. My idea of "rude" is probably skewed also from living with an oversensitive person. Even the most harmless comment could be interpreted as an insult and she would get pissed off about nothing. Sometimes I wonder if that's why I became so quiet.

[turnera]

There's a great little book that therapists recommend a lot to women about that. It's called The Dance Of Anger. It's all about women's inability to put ourselves first, and how to start doing so without ticking everyone off. Good stuff.