Consolidated discussion - Online dating

[irc333]

Nobody should ever write a "don't like" list on a dating profile - it gives off such a negative vibe. However, if somebody has a "like" list, isn't that a good thing? If something in the list "clashes", to the point of being a deal breaker, surely it's better that you know about it in advance rather than wasting time communicating, or even dating, someone who turns out to be incompatible weeks or months down the line?

 

Compatibility is everything when it comes to long term relationships.

 

I see more "do not like" lists or "do not email me if..." lists more and more frequently now. Kind of sad. Then they are like "Some may not like what I had to say in my profile, and if it aggravates you so much...move on to the next one!"

[MrTurk]

I see more "do not like" lists or "do not email me if..." lists more and more frequently now. Kind of sad.

 

I see those lists typically with women only. As I said before...women tend to "think they know" what kind of guy fits them. They dismiss 80% of men before they even get out of bed each morning....all based on that list in their head.

 

I've looked over mens profiles on sites as well, and have rarely seen deal breaker lists. I think men are much more willing, and open to meet and see what happens than women are.

[NYC-BigKat]

Female friend of mine I know in real life is also on POF. I actually knew her from POF before having met her at a Meetup event and she was telling me that she attends church in her area 2 times a week, she is rather involved, but not the "preachy" type. She seems nothing like those southern religious zealots that I'm used to meeting. She's far from a bible beater.

 

I said to her, "I noticed you have nothing in reference to being a 'Christian girl seeking a Christian man'". BUt there is that "drop down" where you have to choose which religion you are.

 

And she said she deliberately leaves that part out because she does not want people to judge her as a "religious zealot"

 

Like as soon as someone SEES that, they'll high tail it in the other direction, regardless of hearing her out.

 

She feels talking about it in person to gain an understanding of their views (on a first meet), would be something she'd prefer.

 

That's what made me think that with online dating, people weed out people based on extremes.

 

I'm trying to think of other examples, but I think that's why people lie about their height, age, etc. NOT saying I condone it. BUt in her case she's not LYING, she's just leaving that part of her life out of her profile.

 

That "Maybe if I don't say I'm a Christian, they won't think I'll bible beat them on our first date" LOL

 

So it seems we establish ourselves in our dating profile as MINIMALLY as possible? Do you feel that "less is more"? in an online dating profile?

 

Nope! I think u need to put as much as possible so guys can figure out if they wanna be with u or not u know.

[LittleTiger]

No, it's better IMO to figure this stuff out on the first date. Maybe someone puts on their profile that they like "fishing, hiking, and playing tennis" (among other things), and you write them off because you don't like those things. But if you'd met up, you might discover that you get along really well and that there's enough common ground in other areas to make it work.

 

As I said earlier, it depends on what you're looking for. In my experience, if one person enjoys fishing, hiking and playing tennis (or whatever) and the other doesn't, the relationship is probably a non-starter - but that's based on my own personal values and experience.

 

If you don't care about matching hobbies that's fair enough, but if you have a passion for breeding pet lizards, snakes and rare tarantulas, and you like to spend every weekend jumping out of aeroplanes, these are things that should probably be mentioned in your profile - unless you are prepared to give them up for the right woman.

 

I think part of the problem with daters is that they start looking for a partner before they have any sense of who they are themselves - before they know what their personal deal breakers are. If you don't know what's important to you and, you're not willing to declare that 'you' to prospective partners, how can you expect to find someone who's a good match?

 

'Less is more' only if you're playing a numbers game and, since all replies on this thread (apart from mine) are from men, perhaps that's what most male OLDers are doing.

[LittleTiger]

I see more "do not like" lists or "do not email me if..." lists more and more frequently now. Kind of sad. Then they are like "Some may not like what I had to say in my profile, and if it aggravates you so much...move on to the next one!"

 

I used to email guys who wrote "do not like" lists. I would tell them very politely that their profile made them sound very negative or aggressive or whatever. Some of them would thank me for the feedback and others would tell me to take a long walk off a short pier. No skin off my nose, I was just trying to help and people who have negative profiles will never get anywhere with women online - and probably not anywhere else either.

 

I see those lists typically with women only. As I said before...women tend to "think they know" what kind of guy fits them. They dismiss 80% of men before they even get out of bed each morning....all based on that list in their head.

 

I've looked over mens profiles on sites as well, and have rarely seen deal breaker lists. I think men are much more willing, and open to meet and see what happens than women are.

 

Well then I guess you didn't look hard enough because there are hundreds of men online with deal breaker lists. Usually "don't email if.....

 

- you like to tell lies

- you've ever cheated on someone

- you don't take care of your health

- you multi-date

- you don't have the decency to give men a chance

- you don't like paying your way on first dates

- you like bad boys

- you're not willing to send me a full length photograph

- you're a gold digger

etc

etc

etc"

 

Men are no different from women and lists like this one are a major turn off - on both sides.

 

The main reason that men seem more willing to 'give women is a chance' is because sex is so important to them. Provided a woman isn't physically repulsive, they're obviously going to give her a chance - just in case she's the one who says yes.

[MrTurk]

Well then I guess you didn't look hard enough because there are hundreds of men online with deal breaker lists. Usually "don't email if.....

 

 

I have no faith in your posts. I know what I have seen. To me, you come across as the type of woman that would fabricate information just to validate your side of the argument.

[LittleTiger]

I have no faith in your posts. I know what I have seen. To me, you come across as the type of woman that would fabricate information just to validate your side of the argument.

 

Well if you don't believe me that's up to you. I've been on LS a long time and my word probably holds more credence on here than yours does. You know absolutely nothing about me, let alone anything that would lead you to form an opinion as to what 'type of woman' I am. I certainly don't need to make stuff up to make a point.

 

What I've said is true and I'm pretty sure I've read a lot more male profiles than you have. I don't pretend that women don't do the same thing - I'm absolutely certain that they do. There are negative people everywhere, male and female, who have no idea how to sell themselves to the opposite sex - online or anywhere else.

 

This thread is not supposed to be a 'gender war' so please don't make it into one.

[soccerrprp]

As a guy, I find it rather peculiar if there is too little on a woman's profile. Women often complain that guys don't read the profiles and when they resort to putting one or two lines of "nothing." I don't even bother to try. I am a profile reader. Of course, they want the "perfect" guy to be the one to read the profile and send a clever message, nothing less than that.

 

I would have to say that some of the best profiles were detailed, creative and a lengthy. A lot of thought was put into it. You can put together a nice and not too short profile w/o giving away too much.

 

What i've learned is that the messages need not be too clever or creative. Of course, this depends on how you look, etc. But, I've tried sending creative emails and get the same kind of responses or a little more (it seems).

[MrTurk]

There are negative people everywhere, male and female, who have no idea how to sell themselves to the opposite sex - online or anywhere else.

 

And thats the downfall of dating from a womans perspective....a guy cant just be attractive being himself....because theres too many women out there that expect him to "sell himself" online, or anywhere else.

[LittleTiger]

And thats the downfall of dating from a womans perspective....a guy cant just be attractive being himself....because theres too many women out there that expect him to "sell himself" online, or anywhere else.

 

Of course he can be attractive being himself! Didn't you read my posts? That's my whole point. Once you know who you are, what your own values and beliefs are, what really matters to you in a partner, that's when you are ready to look for someone special.

 

If you then post online exactly who you are, and they do the same - and you both like what you see - hey presto! A good match and everyone's happy.

 

'Selling yourself' is just a turn of phrase. It's about putting your best foot forward, rather than your worst. Post in your profile about your good traits, not your bad ones - that's just common sense. Men and women will always be in competition with each another when vying for sexual attention - that's a fact of life. Just be the best 'you' that you can be, let the world know you're available and eventually the right person will come along.

 

Again - this is not a gender war. There is no need to 'put down' or criticise women here. That in itself is not an attractive attitude. Women like men who 'like' women. When I say 'like', I mean respect, appreciate, admire and enjoy them. Just as men 'like' women who respect, appreciate, admire and enjoy them too.

[sdraw108]

I see more "do not like" lists or "do not email me if..." lists more and more frequently now. Kind of sad.

 

It doesn't make me sad. I'm glad they write the lists, because I know straight up that they're not easy to get along with, and I don't need to bother messaging them. Better than finding out later!

[sdraw108]

The main reason that men seem more willing to 'give women is a chance' is because sex is so important to them. Provided a woman isn't physically repulsive, they're obviously going to give her a chance - just in case she's the one who says yes.

 

I agree with you in general, but for the record, I value a quality LTR over sex, so I don't personally think this way, but I'm still more willing to 'give women a chance' nonetheless. I *am* however guilty of the exact thing I described - clicking off a profile because of some little thing which didn't appeal to me. I never do this in real life, because in real life you know whether or not you like someone from your interactions with them, rather than a list of things written down in text.

[sdraw108]

To me, you come across as the type of woman that would fabricate information just to validate your side of the argument.

 

I didn't get that impression of her at all. Not from this thread anyway (and I'm too new here to know who is who from other threads).

 

Your judgement of her differing opinion is unnecessarily harsh IMO.

[dasein]

Men are no different from women and lists like this one are a major turn off - on both sides.

 

Simply not the case. Men are much less picky with the lists that women, we all know this, have experienced it, and perusing 1000s of OLD profiles over the years proves it true. The "men do it too" retort simply doesn't work in terms of dating/mating criteria. Now maybe the top 5% of men that many women flock to and are willing to share with other women are this way, but those very few men are the equivalent of -average- women in pickiness OLD generally. I haven't seen many mile long criteria list threads by male OPs here over time, but have seen many such threads and posts by females.

 

To the topic, less is more in an OLD profile. IMO, the only valid criteria that must be mentioned are whether one is currently separated, has kids, smoking and drinking habits, and age. Everything else may be left out or mentioned in an OLD profile at the member's discretion without qualifying as "lying by omission." Other things should come out in further contacts and meetings. Despite the "HR red pencil" attitude that many attention-laden women display OLD, there is no moral or ethical requirement for one to post all or even some of the intimate details of one's life or personality on an OLD profile.

[sdraw108]

As a guy, I find it rather peculiar if there is too little on a woman's profile. Women often complain that guys don't read the profiles and when they resort to putting one or two lines of "nothing." I don't even bother to try. I am a profile reader. would have to say that some of the best profiles were detailed, creative and a lengthy. A lot of thought was put into it. You can put together a nice and not too short profile w/o giving away too much.

 

I agree fully with this, particularly the bolded part. By "less is more" I didn't mean profile length, I meant the number of "list-type" items which narrow down lots of specific details. I don't believe that it's the sum of the details which make up a person and whether or not you'll connect with them, it's more about who they are as a person. To go back to the earlier example, two people who like "fishing, hiking, and tennis" could have totally opposite personality types, and you might hate one and love the other.

 

The ideal kind of profile you're describing ("detailed, creative, and lengthy") sounds appealing to to me because it probably portrays what the person is like, as opposed to just a mechanical list of statistics and hobbies.

Edited July 14, 2013 by sdraw108

[MrTurk]

 

'Selling yourself' is just a turn of phrase. It's about putting your best foot forward, rather than your worst. Post in your profile about your good traits, not your bad ones - that's just common sense

 

Yes, I agree with the basics of it. Presenting yourself in a positive manner. But in my experiance...and hearing it directly from the horses mouth....that isnt good enough. I've had plenty of women tell me "Posting a self pic will get you nowhere....you have to post pics showing you having fun, out doing things with other people"

 

Why? Why cant a woman just accept for me for me. Why do I need to "prove" that I do things? Because thats exactly why they want to see those pics. Its just another way that women want to find out everything about a guy before they make the decision to meet him. If I have a nice pic of me leaning against my car, or leaning against the kitchen counter....what is wrong with that? You are dating ME not my social status. So because I dont have picture happy friends, snapping pics every time we do something,....I get blackballed on a dating site.

 

 

Again - this is not a gender war. There is no need to 'put down' or criticize women here. That in itself is not an attractive attitude. Women like men who 'like' women.

 

I can be vocal and opinionated and still respect women. Just because someone points out issues, doesnt mean that person hates the entire gender. There are plenty of women that I know personally that dislike all the female cliches, drama, and bs more than I do. But they still have females as friends....friends that are above all that. Anyone that acts like that stuff doesnt exist with a good majority of women is either totally naive, or lying and trying to cover it up.

Edited July 14, 2013 by MrTurk

[sdraw108]

I can be vocal and opinionated and still respect women.

 

You didn't really demonstrate that in this thread. A female disagreed with you and your immediate response was that she seems like the type of woman who would lie in order to back up her argument.

[LittleTiger]

Simply not the case. Men are much less picky with the lists that women, we all know this, have experienced it, and perusing 1000s of OLD profiles over the years proves it true. The "men do it too" retort simply doesn't work in terms of dating/mating criteria. Now maybe the top 5% of men that many women flock to and are willing to share with other women are this way, but those very few men are the equivalent of -average- women in pickiness OLD generally. I haven't seen many mile long criteria list threads by male OPs here over time, but have seen many such threads and posts by females.

 

I am only telling you about my experience of OLD and 'in my experience', plenty of men post long lists of what they don't want. I have no interest in looking at women's profiles so I've seen very few and therefore I won't pretend to know what other women write. I assume that there are some great female profiles, just as there are some great male ones - ditto with the terrible ones, which includes those who write long lists. I doubt either you or I are 'experts' on how many people, male or female, write long lists of "I don't likes".

 

To the topic, less is more in an OLD profile. IMO, the only valid criteria that must be mentioned are whether one is currently separated, has kids, smoking and drinking habits, and age. Everything else may be left out or mentioned in an OLD profile at the member's discretion without qualifying as "lying by omission." Other things should come out in further contacts and meetings. Despite the "HR red pencil" attitude that many attention-laden women display OLD, there is no moral or ethical requirement for one to post all or even some of the intimate details of one's life or personality on an OLD profile.

 

As I said earlier, it depends on what you're looking for. OLD is a great way to 'weed out' incompatible people, but if you leave out too many details how is the other person going to know if they want to date you?

 

I used to think that men who wrote very little were just lazy and not serious about looking for a partner. Lets face it, if you can't be bothered to tell a prospective partner what your passions are, the chances are they will assume that you don't have any.

[LittleTiger]

I didn't get that impression of her at all. Not from this thread anyway (and I'm too new here to know who is who from other threads).

 

Your judgement of her differing opinion is unnecessarily harsh IMO.

 

Thanks for your support - that's very kind and I appreciate it.

[Rebellious]

Online dating is ok for occasional entertainment, I wouldn’t take it too seriously.

 

I once met girl that had explicit in her profile that she was looking for a religious man, even specified the denomination, non smoker, etc. Mine was all blank.

 

1st date I told her I was not religious at all, but she still did all the things religious girls aren’t supposed to do on the first date. So next date, I bought a pack of cigarettes even though I’m not a smoker, she didn’t mind that either.

 

So lesson learned: never read profiles, just look at the pictures.

[sdraw108]

I once met girl ... So lesson learned: never read profiles, just look at the pictures.

 

Or, you could choose not to base your actions on the results of a single isolated experience.

 

By the way, I've found that girls on OLD really hate it when you don't read their profile. They even mention this very thing on their profiles, frequently. And it's usually obvious, because the guys who *have* read the profiles will use it to tailor their response by referring to it, or starting conversations based on it.

[MrTurk]

You didn't really demonstrate that in this thread. A female disagreed with you and your immediate response was that she seems like the type of woman who would lie in order to back up her argument.

 

Thats specific to her and my opinion on the impression I get from reading her other posts. It's no cause for alarm...just my opinion. I still showed no disrespect. I simply stated how I see it, no name calling, or anything of the sort. Too many people think that someone is mad at you when they disagree with you. And thats not always the case. I can have a totally civil, friendly conversation with LittleTiger in person, and still disagree.

[MrTurk]

By the way, I've found that girls on OLD really hate it when you don't read their profile. They even mention this very thing on their profiles, frequently.

 

Funny though....when you make a fake profile, and use a hot guy as your profile pic....ALL those rules that women have, suddenly dont apply

[Rebellious]

Or, you could choose not to base your actions on the results of a single isolated experience.

 

By the way, I've found that girls on OLD really hate it when you don't read their profile. They even mention this very thing on their profiles, frequently. And it's usually obvious, because the guys who *have* read the profiles will use it to tailor their response by referring to it, or starting conversations based on it.

 

If you’re 6’3” and handsome you don’t have to read anything.

[LittleTiger]

Yes, I agree with the basics of it. Presenting yourself in a positive manner. But in my experiance...and hearing it directly from the horses mouth....that isnt good enough. I've had plenty of women tell me "Posting a self pic will get you nowhere....you have to post pics showing you having fun, out doing things with other people"

 

Why? Why cant a woman just accept for me for me. Why do I need to "prove" that I do things? Because thats exactly why they want to see those pics. Its just another way that women want to find out everything about a guy before they make the decision to meet him. If I have a nice pic of me leaning against my car, or leaning against the kitchen counter....what is wrong with that? You are dating ME not my social status. So because I dont have picture happy friends, snapping pics every time we do something,....I get blackballed on a dating site.

 

There is nothing wrong with posting pics of you just standing there, but you're right that women want to see more than just 'how you look'. Women are not like men. 'How you look' is not our number one priority. Of course we do care what you look like but what we care about even more is 'who you are'. It has nothing to do with your social status, it's about what you enjoy and what you value - and a picture is worth a thousand words. A photo of you doing stuff that you love is 'you', that's the whole point - and why wouldn't a woman want to know as much about you as possible before deciding to meet you? That's the beauty of online dating, no need to dress up for a night out or fork out money at a restaurant until you think there is at least a chance of compatibility.

 

Would you date a woman who refused to post a photo of her face or body? Would you take her word for it if her profile stated she was slim and attractive?

 

Writing in a profile "I love my family, have great friends and enjoy skydiving every weekend" is just not the same as a photo of you actually skydiving or out having fun with your friends and family". They 'see' the photo and they 'see' you - for real - not just an imaginary picture they've created from words on a profile. It's no big deal to take photos with a phone these days and upload them. If what you say about yourself in your profile is true, what is your objection to showing it in a photograph?

 

I can be vocal and opinionated and still respect women. Just because someone points out issues, doesnt mean that person hates the entire gender. There are plenty of women that I know personally that dislike all the female cliches, drama, and bs more than I do. But they still have females as friends....friends that are above all that. Anyone that acts like that stuff doesnt exist with a good majority of women is either totally naive, or lying and trying to cover it up.

 

There you go again! Even if you believe that 95% of the female population is full of drama, clichés and bs, it does you absolutely no favours to say so. I haven't read your dating profile, obviously, but if you come across in the same way there as you do in this thread, women will not find you attractive. You sound like a guy who actually dislikes women. 'Respect' means 'thinks highly of'. Your words suggest that that you do not 'respect' women.