Is There An Age To 'Throw In the Towel' for Women?

[verhrzn]

Hate to break it to you, but MOST people are completely average and not unique in the least. I'd go so far as to say that originality is completely extinct. The fact of the matter is, most people aren't anything more then pencil pushers, clock watchers, and cogs in the great big wheel of life.

 

But rather than cry about it, most would also rather snatch at the little happiness that's available to us before we finally kick it. Welcome to the world. It's got it's highs and lows, but you'll get used to it.

 

And when there IS no little happiness available? What then?

 

Not to get all nihilistic, but if you're (general you) not unique, why are you here? Why bother?

[Pirouette]

You can drop bits of it in random people's mailboxes

 

That'd be funny just to find notes of:

 

Don't get involved romantically at work!

 

Make sure to spend time with your kids!

 

People would be calling the police thinking they had a stalker with those too accurate bits of advice you have up there!

[oaks]

... Yeah, cause no posters are jumping into this thread just to pile on about what an awful person I am, and how they'd love for me to die just so I'd stop whining.

 

Oh. Except Mme Chauncer. And Oaks. And Utterer of Lies. And Janesays. And...

 

Now you're just tempting me to agree with you, but I don't and you know I never said that I want you to die you silly girl.

[McGuffin]

It continues to strike me as bizarre why people want me to become delusional about myself.

 

Do posters really think that lying to myself is gonna help? "Hey, I'm attractive! Hey I'm smart! Hey I'm a good writer!".... When none of those things are true?? Does that not just set up false expectations? Unrealistic standards? I just do not see what good could come of that!

 

I'm not saying you should tell yourself you're a good writer if you're not. But to you, you're a terrible writer who shouldn't waste her time. If you see it as being delusional to think you're an okay writer whose work some people might enjoy and others might not (even if the majority might not), then I want you to be delusional.

 

I don't want you to think you're the prettiest person in the world. But if you think it's delusional to believe that any person could ever be attracted to you, I want you to be that delusional.

 

Doesn't matter what word you put to it. You think your friend who can only seem ok but thinks she seems well is delusional. Most people would just consider that self-esteem. I have no problem calling it delusion.

 

Whatever you want to call it, thinking so negatively about yourself doesn't seem to be making you happy. So maybe being a little of what you consider delusional might be a road to making you happy.

[tman666]

Not to get all nihilistic, but if you're (general you) not unique, why are you here? Why bother?

 

The answer is 42.

 

(Nobody can answer that for you but yourself).

[dreamingoftigers]

I can completely relate to what you are saying.

 

I arrived at that crossroads years ago. (about 10 years ago to be exact)

 

That particular crossroads isn't entirely accurate whatsoever.

 

It is very hard to articulate to someone AT that crossroads however.

 

And it is very hard to articulate to others who have NEVER been to that crossroads.

 

All I can think to say to you about it is that when you are having a truth = misery/acceptance and happiness = self-delusion issue that the view has become too overfocussed.

 

I think I might have lost you with that last one because you might think: I can't be OVERfocussed, in fact I'm in the best position to see my life!

 

Have a teeny bit of faith in me here:

 

Truth in this world is often not an objective thing.

 

A LOT of it is based on circumstance. Many if those circumstances we as human wade through day to day.

 

For example: all of us poster's on here are looking at V's issues like looking at the ocean. She is unhappy, her world is dark and she can't see a way of relating and articulating to others except for her own perspective about the "ocean" being dark and dreary and how she doesn't fit in.

 

Other posters are saying: no way: the ocean is a bright orange and pink. It's warm! There's nice beaches! Yay.

 

Others yet are saying: buck up, it's not black but there are huge waves going to knock you down if you don't prepare yourself.

 

You are ALL CORRECT. however, your view of the ocean is based on where you are situated. V, you are at the bottom of the ocean, depressed, lonely and feeling inadequate because you can't see what everyone else sees.

 

You say that you try to act confident and get shot down hard.

 

It is the same as someone who tries to surface too fast and get the bends.

 

You need to surface slowly, having faith that others are seeing the nice warm beach at sunset, and waiting for you to come along.

 

And that by surfacing there will be cold patches and warm patches and it may take longer than you think.

 

When you get to that beach, you'll be so damn glad to be put from under that cold water, you wont give a damn exactly who on the beach thinks what because you know that you are strong because you made it there to begin with.

[McGuffin]

Doesn't matter what word you put to it. You think your friend who can only seem ok but thinks she seems well is delusional. Most people would just consider that self-esteem. I have no problem calling it delusion.

 

Can't go back and edit that was supposed to say "sing ok". I have no idea how the word "seem" ended up there instead.

[Janesays]

And when there IS no little happiness available? What then?

 

Not to get all nihilistic, but if you're (general you) not unique, why are you here? Why bother?

 

Because it's beautiful outside. Because I love helping people. Because there are oceans and flowers and sunsets and plenty of things for me to admire. Because of books. Because of music. Because of art. Because of my little brother. My pets. Fresh cut grass. Sleeping in on Sundays. Hot coffee on a cold morning. Because of bananas and sushi and frozen yogurt. Because life can be sad and funny and exhilarating and dreary, but it's never ever stagnate.

 

No one in this world is unique. But the world is beautiful and there is plenty about it to enjoy if you'd just open up your freaking eyes.

[verhrzn]

Now you're just tempting me to agree with you, but I don't and you know I never said that I want you to die you silly girl.

 

Wanting, no. But if you're indifferent, what's the difference really?

 

I'm not saying you should tell yourself you're a good writer if you're not. But to you, you're a terrible writer who shouldn't waste her time. If you see it as being delusional to think you're an okay writer whose work some people might enjoy and others might not (even if the majority might not), then I want you to be delusional.

 

I don't want you to think you're the prettiest person in the world. But if you think it's delusional to believe that any person could ever be attracted to you, I want you to be that delusional.

 

Doesn't matter what word you put to it. You think your friend who can only seem ok but thinks she seems well is delusional. Most people would just consider that self-esteem. I have no problem calling it delusion.

 

Whatever you want to call it, thinking so negatively about yourself doesn't seem to be making you happy. So maybe being a little of what you consider delusional might be a road to making you happy.

 

But is happiness worth it? Is lying to yourself to be happy worth it? I may not be happy now, but at least I can look myself in the eye in the mirror and know I'm being honest. If I was lying to myself JUST to be happy... could I ever claim I'm authentic? Or living a honest life?

[Mme. Chaucer]

... Yeah, cause no posters are jumping into this thread just to pile on about what an awful person I am, and how they'd love for me to die just so I'd stop whining.

 

Oh. Except Mme Chauncer. And Oaks. And Utterer of Lies. And Janesays. And...

 

Oh, really? You read me writing that I'd love for you to die just so you'd stop whining?

 

Are you hallucinating?

 

I certainly would love for you to stop whining and trying to manipulate the people here who are trying to extend all kinds of positive things your way, including me. Yep, I would. I believe you could easily do so without dying! But I don't think you will, since evidently this is one of your top favorite hobbies. So have at it until you don't love to do it anymore, I guess. But LIVE! LIVE! LIVE!

[verhrzn]

Because it's beautiful outside. Because I love helping people. Because there are oceans and flowers and sunsets and plenty of things for me to admire. Because of books. Because of music. Because of art. Because of my little brother. My pets. Fresh cut grass. Sleeping in on Sundays. Hot coffee on a cold morning. Because of bananas and sushi and frozen yogurt. Because life can be sad and funny and exhilarating and dreary, but it's never ever stagnate.

 

No one in this world is unique. But the world is beautiful and there is plenty about it to enjoy if you'd just open up your freaking eyes.

 

That's..... nice, if you value beauty. That's what you care about. Good for you. But it's not something I value. I am one of those weird individuals who looks at a sunset and goes," Yeeeep, it's a sunset, next?"

[McGuffin]

Not to get all nihilistic, but if you're (general you) not unique, why are you here? Why bother?

 

I've asked myself that question a lot in the past. I don't think anyone can really answer that question for anyone else.

 

I wasn't too different from you wanting nothing more than to find love and only getting dumped and rejected instead. I just gave up on wanting a man and found other things to want. Now I have one, and I don't think I would if I were still so focused on having a relationship and depressed by not having one.

[Janesays]

That's..... nice, if you value beauty. That's what you care about. Good for you. But it's not something I value. I am one of those weird individuals who looks at a sunset and goes," Yeeeep, it's a sunset, next?"

 

Let me ask you this, if your life isn't worth living, why are you here? Why HAVEN'T you killed yourself yet? Something keeps you waking up day after day. What is it? I'm not trying to be glib here, I really want to know.

[Taramere]

It continues to strike me as bizarre why people want me to become delusional about myself.

 

Do posters really think that lying to myself is gonna help? "Hey, I'm attractive! Hey I'm smart! Hey I'm a good writer!".... When none of those things are true?? Does that not just set up false expectations? Unrealistic standards? I just do not see what good could come of that!

 

The woman who wrote that piece of crap "50 Shades of Grey" is pulling in £1 million a week as a reward for being a poor writer. Credit to her, I suppose. I couldn't read beyond 12 pages of that sh*te she churned out...yet she managed to write hundreds more pages and two more books of it. That's persistence and it certainly paid off.

 

I think you're definitely a better writer than average, but success in something like writing isn't really down to how good you are. I've no clue what it is attributable to, but 50 shades and lots of other almost unreadable pulp out there has proved beyond any reasonable doubt that being good is not a must.

 

You should probably worry less about whether you've the talent to be a writer, and more about whether you've the determination, willpower and resilience to keep picking yourself up when people find fresh new ways of telling you that you're crap. You clearly don't have that willpower and resilience. Not yet, anyway. Every time somebody knocks you, you start up a thread holding the tarnished trophy of a knockback up triumphantly to show us how right you were to think in a defeatist way.

 

You think nobody else on here regularly encounters those putdowns, passive aggressive swipes and all the other little methods people use to try to stop eachother succeeding?

 

And if I recall correctly... the few times I tried to be positive and adjust my thinking, I got shot down, HARD. I already get accused of having too high of standards and being unrealistic about my "league" and that's WHILE considering myself ugly and dumb. If I were to actually raise my expectations, what sort of scathing criticism would I earn then?

 

How long are you going to carry on caring about that scathing criticism? Look, I'm not saying this from some superior position of somebody who has learned not to give a damn. I think it's only human to take criticism to heart a bit....but there's an old saying (can't remember off the top of my head who first said it) that you should always bear in mind when somebody wants to take a swing at you. "To avoid criticism say nothing, do nothing, be nothing."

[oaks]

Wanting, no. But if you're indifferent, what's the difference really?

 

Your glass is so half empty that what you took from that was that I'm indifferent about you dying? Sometimes I just want to shake you, but then you'd only say I was trying to kill you.

 

Ok, I'll spell it out so that you can't get this wrong: I don't want you to die. I am positive about this. Additionally, I do want you to not die. I am sure about that, too. If there's still an angle from which you can see that I wish you dead then please point it out so that I can refute it.

 

I want you to be more positive, too, but my mum told me that "I want never gets" so I'm not going to hold my breath.

[dreamingoftigers]

I think it's because as you get older and mature you realize that you CAN BE most anything in any direction you wish. As soon as you find that: you just BE what you want and it doesn't have to be groundbreaking, original (although that's nice) or even particularly eventful.

 

You don't have to BE anything for anyone you don't want to be, so you can just BE without having your self-image dedicated to being the biggest and best or sexiest or most-accomplished whatever.

 

It's like young men when they realize they can continue to have casual, unattached sex for however long they want, but as soon as they realize the possibility is a reality that can overtake their life if they let it, it becomes pretty empty.

 

BEING SOMETHING for the SAKE OF BEING SOMETHING or to artificially boost your self-worth is empty.

 

That's why as we get older we gravitate to both enjoyment and respinsibility instead of tipping put if balance one way or the other.

[McGuffin]

But is happiness worth it? Is lying to yourself to be happy worth it? I may not be happy now, but at least I can look myself in the eye in the mirror and know I'm being honest. If I was lying to myself JUST to be happy... could I ever claim I'm authentic? Or living a honest life?

 

I would rather be happy if it means thinking I'm just a little better looking or a little better at singing than I really am.

 

I used to look at people who were completely deluded like reality show stars, people making fools of themselves on American Idol, etc. I'd think I want to be nothing like them. I wouldn't believed a guy could like me or if I did I never showed it, because I didn't want to set myself up for him to just be playing some cruel joke on me. I wouldn't let myself think good things about myself that I initially thought couldn't be true, because I didn't want to be a fool.

 

I would not go back to that, and I think I'm actually much more self-actualized now that I'm more willing to accept the good.

[verhrzn]

Let me ask you this, if your life isn't worth living, why are you here? Why HAVEN'T you killed yourself yet? Something keeps you waking up day after day. What is it? I'm not trying to be glib here, I really want to know.

 

Cowardice. And that I'd leave family with debt. I don't like being a burden to anyone, so if I move onward, I'd prefer to do so with a clean financial slate.

 

You think nobody else on here regularly encounters those putdowns, passive aggressive swipes and all the other little methods people use to try to stop eachother succeeding?

"

 

I'm sure they do. The difference, as I see it, is those critiques could or could not be valid. In my case, the criticisms are usually valid.

 

I also can't imagine why anyone would bother trying to stop me succeeding when there is no chance of me doing so. It's like how people tell you that bullies are mean to you because they're secretly jealous.... Yes, I'm oh-so-sure the popular, rich girls in school were mean to me because they were jealous of my awful skin, lank hair, ill-fitting clothes and awkward social demeanor. Know what I mean?

[verhrzn]

I would rather be happy if it means thinking I'm just a little better looking or a little better at singing than I really am.

 

I used to look at people who were completely deluded like reality show stars, people making fools of themselves on American Idol, etc. I'd think I want to be nothing like them. I wouldn't believed a guy could like me or if I did I never showed it, because I didn't want to set myself up for him to just be playing some cruel joke on me. I wouldn't let myself think good things about myself that I initially thought couldn't be true, because I didn't want to be a fool.

 

I would not go back to that, and I think I'm actually much more self-actualized now that I'm more willing to accept the good.

 

Hmm, this sounds somewhat similar to my belief. I refuse to be played the fool. Happened waaaaay too many times before. Like when I stood up in front of a class and read out my story, thinking it was awesome, and was met with mockery.

 

But I still wouldn't go so far as to say I don't accept the good. I am just much less trusting of it. It must prove itself. I will believe good things about myself when they can be proven and supported. Isn't that a pragmatic way to make sure you strike the right balance of reality?

[Janesays]

Cowardice. And that I'd leave family with debt. I don't like being a burden to anyone, so if I move onward, I'd prefer to do so with a clean financial slate.

 

Ok, so if you're too much a coward to do it, why not just suck it up and find something to enjoy? Heck, even if all you enjoy is sitting outside in the sun, do it.

 

The world is not going to change for you. So just accept it and find some inner peace. In the grand scheme of things, you only have about 100 years on this planet if you're lucky. How many of them do you want to waste being miserable?

[McGuffin]

I also can't imagine why anyone would bother trying to stop me succeeding when there is no chance of me doing so. It's like how people tell you that bullies are mean to you because they're secretly jealous.... Yes, I'm oh-so-sure the popular, rich girls in school were mean to me because they were jealous of my awful skin, lank hair, ill-fitting clothes and awkward social demeanor. Know what I mean?

 

Bullies aren't mean because they're jealous. I never understood that claim either. They're mean because they have low self-worth and they want to make other people feel worse about themselves than how they feel. The worse they can make you feel, the better the feel by comparison.

[verhrzn]

Ok, so if you're too much a coward to do it, why not just suck it up and find something to enjoy? Heck, even if all you enjoy is sitting outside in the sun, do it.

 

The world is not going to change for you. So just accept it and find some inner peace. In the grand scheme of things, you only have about 100 years on this planet if you're lucky. How many of them do you want to waste being miserable?

 

I really don't know how else to explain it. I'd rather be miserable than honest, then happy and lying. I just don't enjoy this life, in this current body. I just don't. So if you can't enjoy anything, what then?

 

The hope is I stop being a coward soon, I suppose.

[Woggle]

I have said this before and I will say it again. Please get some counseling.

[Taramere]

Cowardice. And that I'd leave family with debt. I don't like being a burden to anyone, so if I move onward, I'd prefer to do so with a clean financial slate.

 

 

 

I'm sure they do. The difference, as I see it, is those critiques could or could not be valid. In my case, the criticisms are usually valid.

 

I also can't imagine why anyone would bother trying to stop me succeeding when there is no chance of me doing so. It's like how people tell you that bullies are mean to you because they're secretly jealous.... Yes, I'm oh-so-sure the popular, rich girls in school were mean to me because they were jealous of my awful skin, lank hair, ill-fitting clothes and awkward social demeanor. Know what I mean?

 

I agree that trying to convince people "they're jealous of you" often achieves nothing in terms of trying to analyse the dynamics of a bullying situation. People bully for all sorts of reasons. One of the main ones being that as long as somebody else is being picked on, they're not the target. Or, if they're pretty far removed from that position of being likely to be a target, they might bully for no reason other than that they want to draw attention to themselves.

 

Bullying is traumatising. I think you're living the pain of schoolyard bullying over and over again, and in a strange way there's probably a comforting familiarity for you in doing that. A part of all of us craves some certainty and familiarity in life....even if objectively those certainties and familiar scenarios are very negative things.

 

Do you have any action plan to break your pattern of doing this? Have you discussed possible methods of breaking the patterns with a counsellor...or would you rather just keep things the way they are, even if retaining the status quo carries the price tag of your potential for happiness and personal growth?

[dreamingoftigers]

Check, check.....test.

 

Is this thing on?