Women, preserving their independence in a relationship: reality or myth

[CurlyIam]

I have seen a few posts and I started thinking that maybe it's me living in my own fantasy world... So I've had one ong r'ship and ended up all alone, with no friends, no hobby, no nothing except for some great opportunities of a career.

 

I under no circumstance want to make a career out of my family. I want to be able to preserve my hobbies, my friends, the time for myself and my lover.

 

 

I don't want to make the same mistake and put all my time and effort in a relationship. I don't want my bf suffocated by me and by my constant attention. Not now, not later. I just hate it when women do this.

 

 

 

Ok, this is the fanasy world! you,girls, in the real world, how do you make it? [color=darkblue]Do you still see your friends, do you still preserve your male friends, how do you keep your independence? What's your "statement"? [/color]I mean, this is seclusion because of our gender!!!! And you know what? WE, it's us, the WOMEN, instating it! Maybe in the US is different, back in my own coutry it's reality!!!!

[clia]

I don't understand what you are asking -- are you asking how women preserve their independence while in a relationship? What is this "seclusion" you are talking about?

[supermom]

In my first marriage, my exhusband would be upset if I wanted independance, and being young, I allowed that.

 

Now that I'm remarried, with a child, My husband lets me do what I want. We trust each other. I have decided that no man will tell me what to do again. At the same time though, if my husband wants to go out, I don't tell him no, unless I really have something planned for us, then he can decide.

 

Trust is a huge factor in this. My first hus and I didn't trust each other...so it was harder...

 

I am friends with my ex's wife, and he does the same to her...I hate that but I also realize what I gave up! I also gained a life.

 

I'm only 25 too, and still want to hang out. I hardly do go out, as I work 45 hours a week and miss my daughter, but sometimes it's fun to go out with "no curfew"

[CurlyIam]

Yes, I am asking how women keep their indepenence in a relationship!

 

The seclusion part: when I was single, my status changed, so some of my gal "friends" felt I was not safe anymore.

 

On the other hand, when in a relationship, women "are to not preserve male friends" because they aren't safe either! Which lives the women in a relationship with no single friends or male friends.... Guess what happenes when she breaks up with the guy...

 

 

Curly

[Fayebelle]

To me a relationship is the sharing of 2 lives. SEPERATE BUT EQUAL. It was a bad idea for segragation (sorry Curly that's an American thing) -but a good idea in relationships. I keep ALL of my friends,interests, and hobbies when I enter a relationship and share them w/my BF - but they are still mine. It's tricky finding balance but that's part of our life. Nothing should be left behind in a relationship. My job, my friends... they are all part of me and I won't abandon any part of myself for anyone. Not even my BF.

[UCFKevin]

I tend to go for independent women, and when I encounter a clingy one who has to be with me 24/7, I get pretty turned off by that.

 

My friend Scott, I think, has the PERFECT marriage and relationship, which is f*cking HILARIOUS for me to admit, since I was never a fan of him being with who he's with, but I see now that it just works wonderfully. They both spend a lot of time together, but they also have time apart. They go out with their friends, not with each other all the time, they both have outside lives, and that's VERY important to a relationship.

 

My last r/s, it was basically just me and my ex, or we'd go out with MY friends, so she was doing things on my side, not hers, and lost her "self", which is my own mistake, but then again she could've spoken up. I tended to give her a guilt trip whenever she'd go out with her friends, which was REALLY stupid of me to do, not only because she needed time for herself, but because I"d be happy to get time alone and just play video games or whatever. So...man...you learn a lot in relationships, I guess.

[clia]

The seclusion part: when I was single, my status changed, so some of my gal "friends" felt I was not safe anymore.

 

I don't get it -- are they afraid you are going to "steal" their boyfriends/husbands? I've never encountered that with any of my friends. Even while in a relationship I manage to see my girlfriends once or twice a week--they are important to me! They are fun! And sometimes it's nice to be able to talk about tampons and female stuff. I think you need to find some new friends!

 

On the other hand, when in a relationship, women "are to not preserve male friends" because they aren't safe either!

 

Says who? I have tons of male friends. My boyfriend trusts me and I trust him. I haven't entered the current discussions going on about how males and females can't be friends because I think it's ridiculous. Of course they can. People are people. It's only insecure people who believe that their boyfriends/girlfriends can't speak to someone of the opposite sex without wanting to jump in bed with them.

 

At any rate, I realized long ago that MY life doesn't end because I get into a relationship. I still do all the things I did before, but I also get to do new things that my boyfriend likes doing. I would flip out if I was with a guy who wanted to spend every second with me -- I like having my girls nights, and I like him having his guys nights.

[meanon]

LOL Curly! Was this prompted by the oxymoron thread? It made me smile, I've had similar arguments here in the past.

 

I still see friends, have male friends and am independent. The thing is, many of the women I know are the same. I think there are wide culural differences in what is considered normal behaviour. There is some merit in the argument that there is more risk of disengagement from a relationship but that's life, better that than not engaging with the world out of fear of what you may discover. As you say, there are also risks if you take the opposite approach, demanding so much from a relationship that you suffocate it.

 

For you inparticular, Curly, the other things in your life are very important. They provide balance. That's not a fantasy.

[moimeme]

People have different needs at different times. Some need and want plenty of space. I always thought I was one of those but, when I was married, spousal unit and I enjoyed most of the same things and got along extremely well - so we ended up doing practically everything together. Our individual friends became friends of us both (and still are!). And it was fun and I quite enjoyed it.

 

My theory is that you should marry the person whose company you enjoy the most since you have to spend a lot of time with that person I get that some people don't want their SO around all the time, but I'm not necessarily sure why - do they get tired of each other? Do they like each other but not a lot? Or do they get tired of everybody, no matter how much they like the people? Or is it a function of compatibility - if you are doing the same thing because you both enjoy it a great deal and you share your opinions and attitudes about whatever you're doing, does that make it easier to spend lots of time together? Is it fundamental differences that cause you to want time apart?

[meanon]

Personally, my need for independence has much more to do with me than how compatible I am with the person I am with. I need a number of close friendships to be happy. To be unable to have them would feel like a loss of freedom and of an essential part of who I am. I've always only dated people who have understood and accepted this.

 

As to your questions Moi, my husband and I are total opposites. My friends (who have more in common with their partners than I do mine) also have the same need for independence. Their primary relationships are the most important ones in their lives but other friendships are important too. It's not so much that they don't want their SO around, it's more that strong relationships are formed in the personal exchange with one other person. These friendships add not just variety, they add richness and quality to life.

[Kat]

I had a small child before entering my current relationship.

 

The previous relationship, I would have either been the woman stuck at home looking after the kids, or the women out working so that my 'husband' could spend all my money.

 

Now I am in a relationship where I have a full time job and so does he. We have spoken about having more kids and he wants to 'take care' of his family. I have told him that I couldn't handle being kept and he knows it.

 

Having a man support you doesn't always mean you lose your independance.

 

Maybe you have a past that shows 'independance' as something that it isn't?

[moimeme]

I guess I wasn't really paying attention to whether I was actually carving out time to maintain my other friendships. I didn't need to, really. We all lived fairly close and it was real easy to just go out and shop or something together so it was no big deal to do it - but we often spent time with my husband, too, because everyone liked him and we all had a good time together.

[meanon]

I never used to pay attention either, now I have to re-arrange four people's lives to get any time to myself

[SnowWhite]

I usually don't like it when my boyfriends become very close to my friends. Although I don't mind if we are all out together at a party or just hanging out for dinner. This isn't a jealousy thing as much as after I have broken up with the person I feel its awkward to have my ex hang out with my close friends.

Case in point I was breaking up with a guy who had become close with one of my friends he constantly called her to ask about me and tell her how miserable he was, then I had to listen to all the bs he had told her about me.

 

I think each person should have a seperate independent life even while the relationship is going on.

[havNfun]

wow. Someone said above that they think there may be some cultural differences etc.. and I suspect this too. But, I also thing there are some age, and maturity differences as well.

 

I just here all this worry from the females posting about their indipendence being taken away.

 

A lot of you seem to have this big defense put up - some of you don't even have a problem or boyfriend currently yet you are all geared up to go into a relationship fighting for this goal you have to remain independent.

 

 

Maybe it is just my culture, or upbringing, or experience or whatever,

but this seems sooooo advisarial and petty to me.

 

If you meet a guy who's awesome for you, shouldn't this issue not be relevant,

and won't you probably want him around you as much as possible?

 

Please also consider, ladies, that you might actually meet a great guy who would

maybe add a lot to your life, and if you approach a relationship with him

with this personal quest to assert what you think is your independance - because

some unhappy friend or something sold you a bad attitude about men,

the good guy you meet is going to run or become unpleasant because he has

this seemingly reluctant and selfish person on his hands (from his perspective) because

he hadn't provoked.

 

I guess I'm just trying to say that these posts are so negative -= and anti-****ing-man,

Why? it is not attractive

[havNfun]

THIS ONE IS TO KELLY,

WHO SO BODLY WROTE,

would let him tag along with me from time to time with my girlfriends. I told him right from the start he could never tell me what to do and if I felt any jealousy or possessiveness I would dump him."

 

 

WHO THE heck do you think you are Ms Kelly? What an immature conception of relationships you seem to have. Why even date men at all if you regard them so disrespectfully and with such contempt?

 

Believe it or not, there are some men out there that wouldn't give a rat’s ass about tagging along with you and that you would probably be overjoyed if they decided to. And with that attitude, there is bound to be many men that will not give you the opportunity to "dump him."

 

I imagine that once you get your heart broken very badly Kelly, you might grow up and enlarge your sensitivity a bit. Love is not a competition or battle. Your thoughts - at least the sentiment that you posted, seems very heartless to me. And to me, that is ugly.

 

Remember - you may be cute - but everyone has there day of rejection - especially when they have such foundationless arrogance as you seem to. What have you contributed to the world that makes you such a catch that us guys would wish to Tag along with you and your bratty GED girlfriends?

Good lord

[havNfun]

moimeme

 

the lady moimeme seems to have a much more mature understanding - situation

[SnowWhite]

Originally posted by havNfun

WHO THE heck do you think you are Ms Kelly? What an immature conception of relationships you seem to have. Why even date men at all if you regard them so disrespectfully and with such contempt?

What have you contributed to the world that makes you such a catch that us guys would wish to Tag along with you and your bratty GED girlfriends?

 

Eish talk about some hostile comments.

 

HavNfun,

I didn't really think that her post was all that negative towards relationships or guys. I think she was just trying to say that it would be appropriate to 'lay down the rules in the beginining' or tell the person you are dating the sort of things that you are and are not looking for in a relationship.

 

Maybe some people should only be allowed to drink decaf in the morning. <COUGH COUGH>

[dudesomewhere]

the title of this thread would have initially kept the responses to a narrow path...but ah the straying thoughts of people

 

that said...let me nudge this thing in a slightly different way

 

I'm one of those [AND I'LL AVOID DIFFERENTIATING THE SEXES HERE] who is never threatened by the presence of a significant other in my life. Their presence can be all of mine and I would never feel suffocated.

 

Now the things is, independence from each other and independance based on financial settings seem to get confused...both are separate of each other. I would focus on the psychological independance rather than the financial.

 

Maybe it is clearer to use me and my relationship bg as an example. Age, 31...partners 4...relationships 2. Of those 4 partners, 1 was a 1nighter, 1 was to lose my viriginity, 1 was a false love and another is someone I care very much about . So, it is not my goal in life to experience as many people as I can but to fail as few times as possible before I find my one. There can be many "ones", they are just those that fit you just right...although not neccessarily perfectly.

 

For me, my path it is to live my life as best I can...to go forward as best I can...to achieve what I believe I am capable of but also to want that achievement and not obtain it because I feel it a societal obligation. So I go it alone, I craft who it is I craft myself into. I test myself so that I am not a hypocrit, so that I do not contradict myself, my views and my beliefs. One must be happy with themselves in order to be happy for another, they must love themselves truely to be able to love someone truely as well. When you are at that point, when you really love yourself, you can love another...that special unique person, completely...you can love them 24/7 and not just sometimes whenever you have time for them.

 

With that I look at the world, the world in the broad sense and the world within my immediate environment, my country, my state, my city. I look at the thousands upon thousands of faces of strangers in my life that come and go up to this very point. I can live my life and not be with them, not want to know who they are...a sea of strangers. This sea, this ominous thing...I stand on the shore of life and wait. I sit on the sand and wait for that something to wash ashore. A glimmer that catches my eye in the distance of the sand...I move to it. I gaze upon it, whatever it is and it makes me take hold of it. I keep it with me, next to my heart and I do not want to throw it back to the sea.

 

That is how I would think people would wish to live their lives...in the romantic, intimate sense at least. To look upon something, someone so special to also know that they are looked upon equally as special. That wonderment that shuts out the world when you both look at each other, into each others eyes and into each others hearts and never feel the need to do without them...because, how sad is that?

 

I know those things might sound idealistic but they aren't silly are they? Sure we don't live in a perfect world but it's all about the search and how you get there. I don't think people try hard enough. I wouldn't judge someone negatively if their heart is all over the place but...I take little steps to get where I'm going. I think when you are free of guilt from whatever guilts you, when you are content with what is in your soul, when you are true to the world as to yourself is when you can love someone unbound, with no limitation to time spent together...that there can never be too much of a person. A person lives their life without that someone for however long it takes them...and then one day they find them...why then would they need to be apart from that person?

 

 

BTW, don't forget all the butthead comments I've made. And try to ignore comments I make like these

[havNfun]

Snowwhite,

the important thing to focus on here.. is that caffein increases testicle mass.

hugs

[CurlyIam]

well, havin' fun, I think you have said it this time!

 

 

You see, not everything in my life revolves around sex. I do not seek it around me, I do not want it from my friends and sure won't have it unless with my bf!

 

 

That's all there is to it!

[clia]

If you meet a guy who's awesome for you, shouldn't this issue not be relevant,

and won't you probably want him around you as much as possible?

 

This issue is always relevant, and for both parties in the relationship. I don't care how much in love I am, how head over heels I've fallen -- I need time apart from the relationship to do my own thing. That's just my personality type. I'm an introvert -- being around people all the time drains my energy. I need to be alone to rejuvenate. I also need time with girlfriends -- my friends are important to me. Yes, my boyfriend may be #1, but just because we got together doesn't give me the excuse to ditch everyone who supported me and was there for me before he came along. And frankly, it's annoying when a girl brings her guy everywhere with her. I have a friend like this who is connected to her husband at the hip -- it'll be girls' night + her husband. Kind of takes the wind out of the sails...

 

Please also consider, ladies, that you might actually meet a great guy who would

maybe add a lot to your life, and if you approach a relationship with him

with this personal quest to assert what you think is your independance - because

some unhappy friend or something sold you a bad attitude about men,

the good guy you meet is going to run or become unpleasant because he has

this seemingly reluctant and selfish person on his hands (from his perspective) because

he hadn't provoked.

 

You are reading a lot into these posts. No one here is on a "personal quest to assert independence." Is it so hard for you to believe that some people actually enjoy their independence and don't need to be with their boyfriend/husband 24X7? How is it selfish to be an independent person? What if that is just the way you are and have always been? Should you change into a co-dependent leech just to please your guy?

 

There are all types of people in the world. I don't do well with guys who aren't independent. I do amazingly well with guys who are, because that's how I am. All relationships are also different -- everyone does not fit into one mold of "the happy relationship."

[Suzi]

Independence is something hard to define, like feeling of happiness. But you know when you have it.

It is not about your partner, it is about you; it is about the values inside you. It is what we all are given and none can take it away but us.

For me it is doing what I love to do and having a partner who understands it… it is having chance to do what I love and having a partner who want to help me…

It is knowing what I want and having someone to share my happiness… It is answering him with the same, showing undue favor his desires and feelings.

Hurting each other will never lead to independence. What do you think independence is?

[meanon]

dude you can love someone 24/7 and not be with them 24/7, the need to be in each others presence ALL THE TIME passes. The love remains but changes into something less desperate, more sustaining.

 

havNfun, you are quite right. I am an exceptionally shallow and immature 38 year old. My husband is a saint for tolerating me for 17 years. He is thinking of moving to Stepford where no doubt he will find a woman who will be content to spend her every waking moment really appreciating him.

[moimeme]

The love remains but changes into something less desperate, more sustaining.

 

Oh let me be clear, here. In my case, it was not about 'need' at all. It was sheer enjoyment. It is possible to find folks whose company you enjoy sufficiently that you just don't tire of it. True, they're rare, but they're there.

 

Could be a function of Myers-Briggs E/I, though. Someone who's 'I' might get tired of any human hanging around a lot while an 'E' may find it much easier to be in the company of other humans - and I'm an 'E'.