Borderline Personality Disorder?

[HarmonyInDisonance]

I'd love it if you posted about these on here as you go along.

 

Basically I found that DBT is a sort of training to deal with the conflicting messages of the emotional mind and logical mind. People with BPD have extreme difficulty dealing with grey areas, and have problems dealing with a consistent image of themselves or another.

 

Normal people are used to living in these grey areas as we have to balance logic and emotional impulse in order to function productively in any capacity. Persons with BPD are often unable to exist in two states simultaniously. This is partly why they cannot connect to they're thoughts towards a person from a time when they were in another emotional state.

 

A borderline will often base they're opinion of someone on they're last interaction with them. They also tend to base they're self image on they're last accomplishment or lack thereof.

 

Dealing with duality is a simple part of being human, for most. The amydala in BPDers can be as much as half the size on a normal persons. This makes emotional stability difficult do to an actual physical deficiency. Interestingly enough, this deficiency is likely caused by environmental factors not allowing the person to develop emotionally as they should thereby reducing the growth of the amydala due to simple lack of use. This seems to fit and will unless new information comes along indicating some sort of genetic cause to the defect. There are several ways to determine which is responsible, but treatment doesn't change regardless of the cause.

 

So DBT as I understand it is training oneself to deal with the conflicting primal and logical mind during actual Emotional stress.

 

Mindfulness training involves meditation to learn to cope with intense emotion. This technique can also be used to deal with physical pain. I have used my method both ways, it works well, but requires training to develop the concentration to pull it off. During meditation one learns to focus on a subject, or pain, either physical or emotional and be unaffected by it. One can also use mindfulness to dissasociate from pain until it ceases to register. Useful to say the least, but again takes time and opportunity to train.

 

Lastly we have EMDR which stands for Eye Movement, Rapid deprocessing, Reprocessing. It involves moving one's eyes quickly from left to right. When in danger humans begin to scan in this way, whether they notice it or not. Doing this purposely along with memory visualization can trick the mind into a "danger" state. This allows one to learn to deal with the intensity in a safe environment. It also allows people to learn to cope with and thus move past a tramatic memory.

 

By taking bits and pieces I have developed a technique that involves meditation on the fly. This must be possible ultimately while one is fully aware, with eyes open. The techniques basically involves visualizing a logical computation alternating with an abstract visualization. This causes emotional and logical centers to do equal work. It is my theory that this also increases communication between different areas of the brain. It diffuses the conflicting messages and scatters work load appropriately across different centers of the brain. Once you pull this off you find that your logical mind has it's voice back and is able to weigh in on the situation at hand.

 

This can be further pushed to include the scanning and memory regression of EMDR. Thus allowing one not only to go back and learn to cope with a painful past, but allow the individual a means of strengthening the ability to cope through my meditation technique. I forgot but you end the session with clearing your mind completely and seeing only a white void in the mind's eye. If you can't do this you are not equalized and must continue the meditation.

 

I just work an exponentially increasing calculation. Then I switch to visualizing a swirling tornado of color. Each time I switch I increase the complexity of the math problem and the abstract.

 

So that is it in a nutshell. I am actually writing a paper on this subject in order to organize my thoughts. If it is possible I may one day attempt to begin actual studies into this. We'll just have to see what happens. I will say this... I have utilized this in the most extreme emotional state I am capable of. It worked. It has worked several times. In many cases however I failed to make the decision to invoke the process.

 

I have to go. I can provide more information later if anyone is interested. Time for family stuff

[Downtown]

Harmony, thanks so much for sharing that information about your treatment programs. Like Emilia, I find it very helpful to hear from someone who has actually gone through the training.

[J_L_C]

I also have BPD as I have indicated in my previous posts and why I actually started this thread in the first place. I have been thru DBT and while in "theory" it made sense, it didn't work for me. I have started rtms treatment (repetitive transcranial magnetic stimulation). It is used primarily for depression, OCD and eating disorders, but longitudinal studies have indicated benefits for those with BPD in the area of impulse control and emotion regulation. I've just started so not much to report yet other than the fact that it is very painful

[Emilia]

Normal people are used to living in these grey areas as we have to balance logic and emotional impulse in order to function productively in any capacity. Persons with BPD are often unable to exist in two states simultaniously. This is partly why they cannot connect to they're thoughts towards a person from a time when they were in another emotional state.

Can you elaborate on the bolded a bit more please? How does this manifest itself?

A borderline will often base they're opinion of someone on they're last interaction with them. They also tend to base they're self image on they're last accomplishment or lack thereof.

Yes it has been my experience on both accounts. Realisation of this is what has made it possible for me to communicate with my ex. Not being sucked into a fight with him and his being much happier with his recent accomplishments in general.

So DBT as I understand it is training oneself to deal with the conflicting primal and logical mind during actual Emotional stress.

 

Mindfulness training involves meditation to learn to cope with intense emotion. This technique can also be used to deal with physical pain. I have used my method both ways, it works well, but requires training to develop the concentration to pull it off. During meditation one learns to focus on a subject, or pain, either physical or emotional and be unaffected by it. One can also use mindfulness to dissasociate from pain until it ceases to register. Useful to say the least, but again takes time and opportunity to train.

 

Lastly we have EMDR which stands for Eye Movement, Rapid deprocessing, Reprocessing. It involves moving one's eyes quickly from left to right. When in danger humans begin to scan in this way, whether they notice it or not. Doing this purposely along with memory visualization can trick the mind into a "danger" state. This allows one to learn to deal with the intensity in a safe environment. It also allows people to learn to cope with and thus move past a tramatic memory.

 

By taking bits and pieces I have developed a technique that involves meditation on the fly. This must be possible ultimately while one is fully aware, with eyes open. The techniques basically involves visualizing a logical computation alternating with an abstract visualization. This causes emotional and logical centers to do equal work. It is my theory that this also increases communication between different areas of the brain. It diffuses the conflicting messages and scatters work load appropriately across different centers of the brain. Once you pull this off you find that your logical mind has it's voice back and is able to weigh in on the situation at hand.

 

This can be further pushed to include the scanning and memory regression of EMDR. Thus allowing one not only to go back and learn to cope with a painful past, but allow the individual a means of strengthening the ability to cope through my meditation technique. I forgot but you end the session with clearing your mind completely and seeing only a white void in the mind's eye. If you can't do this you are not equalized and must continue the meditation.

 

I just work an exponentially increasing calculation. Then I switch to visualizing a swirling tornado of color. Each time I switch I increase the complexity of the math problem and the abstract.

 

So that is it in a nutshell. I am actually writing a paper on this subject in order to organize my thoughts. If it is possible I may one day attempt to begin actual studies into this. We'll just have to see what happens. I will say this... I have utilized this in the most extreme emotional state I am capable of. It worked. It has worked several times. In many cases however I failed to make the decision to invoke the process.

 

I have to go. I can provide more information later if anyone is interested. Time for family stuff

Fascinating. I'll read up on this more.

[Emilia]

I also have BPD as I have indicated in my previous posts and why I actually started this thread in the first place. I have been thru DBT and while in "theory" it made sense, it didn't work for me. I have started rtms treatment (repetitive transcranial magnetic stimulation). It is used primarily for depression, OCD and eating disorders, but longitudinal studies have indicated benefits for those with BPD in the area of impulse control and emotion regulation. I've just started so not much to report yet other than the fact that it is very painful

Why is it painful? Do you know why DBT has not worked for you?

[Ashlaria]

I have been reading your posts and would firstly like to thank you for sharing and for being so open and honest, for a while I thought I was the only person struggling so it is with some comfort I see I'm not alone.

 

I think my ex has BPD. We were together two and a half years. In that time there was an awful lot of arguing and general nastiness. He has all the symptoms, childhood abuse and neglect, stealing, chaotic personal life, lying, manipulating. He has anger issues and although he thinks he is a master manipulator, he can never understand other people's behaviour or motivations.

 

The break up has gone badly and I'm struggling to let go. He tells me he loves me and can't be without me, his life is meaningless etc. however I have been the OW all this time and despite 'hating' his gf, he couldn't leave because they have a child. His gf is now pregnant again, despite his vehement denials they were ever having sex.

 

I know I need to let go, but I think I am/have become co dependent during our time together and worry he is not eating properly, taking care of himself, keeping up his visits to one of his other children (there are 3 by 3 different women) and all the things I've tried to help him with such as keeping a job and not fighting and being less angry etc

 

Please can someone help me.

Edited July 10, 2013 by Ashlaria
TMI in first post :(

[Downtown]

Ash, like you, I am a sucker for anyone who desperately needs me because my desire to be needed (for what I can do) far exceeds my desire to be loved (for the person I already am). Unfortunately, much of the literature on "codependency" is unreliable because the term is never defined in the APA's Diagnostic Manual. I nonetheless did find the book, Codependent No More, to be very helpful.

 

And the best online article I've seen is therapist Shari Schreiber's article at DO YOU LOVE TO BE NEEDED, OR NEED TO BE LOVED?. Schreiber explains how we got to be excessive caregivers during our childhood. Finally, if you would like to read more about BPD traits, I suggest you take a look at my description at http://www.loveshack.org/forums/breaking-up-reconciliation-coping/separation-divorce/275289-crazy-i-think-but-i-love-her-anyway#post3398735. Take care, Ash.

[HarmonyInDisonance]

I'll try to get back on later tonight and post some things. I have read ALOT of literature and had many real world opportunities to test my methods. Again, they work very well, but it still depends on the person to choose to invoke it. It is terribly tempting sometimes to simply unleash your anger, it is empowering. In the middle of metro Atlanta it's a whole different story that where I usually go. Many violent gang bangers in there among other things. I almost got in a fight with a person known on the streets to be a cold blooded killer. The funny thing is he wasn't even getting at me, he was making what I interpreted to be very racial insults at a scrawny little white guy. Later I tracked him down wanting to clear a few things up before I challenged him again, and found a surprising twist to his motivation. This guy wanted the hell out of the gang life, but was in too deep. He explained that his problem was with people being fake, which in fact the boy was. He also explained that his buddies would have simply gunned him down. He figured teaching him a lesson with a good old fashion butt whippin was a heck of a lot better than a slew of bullets. I got to know the guy and he had a lot of wisdom to offer.

 

Like I said before a very very strange experience. I saw many things that I will never forget. I saw people healing and people destroying themselves and others. I surely doubt I will ever forget the things I saw in there. Gotta go though I type fast, but my kids get into trouble faster, like right now for example. Be back later!

[HarmonyInDisonance]

To answer Emilia's question, BPDs have trouble existing in two states at once. This is a concrete state of the here and now. Most BPDs find dealing with the conflict of logic and emotional impulse nearly impossible at first. Remembering a different emotional state is even more difficult.

 

So it's like this, say your BPD partner has been somehow getting along with you famously for some extended period of time... Then based on the smallest disagreement he decides he hates you and never wants to see you again.

 

Even from a person with a rather sever case himself, I cannot even guess at the reason a person will do this. In my case it is often not the incident of the moment, but rather something from my past that was haunting me lately. The problem is that I often do not realize this in the heat of the moment, but rather as long as a month later.

 

The results are the same however if I do not catch my self. My wife is left with another permanent emotional scar. In addition to this, I am left in shock at what I have just done. This will lead me into an INTENSE desire to simply disappear rather than continue to inflict harm. Another motivation for this is sheer shame. Shame at letting myself succumb to the beast, shame at the foolishness of my behavior. The worst part is the guilt, knowing what is right and wanting it desperately, but unable to perform. This duality only increases the state of conflicting messages and thus leads farther into the dark.

 

I can also add that my chameleon quality makes me feel fake. I don't feel like a real person. It's all good at first, I move in close and assimilate the person's traits unintentionally. This feels good for a time as I at least have a definition of who I am, but then I realize what is going on. I realize that people are freaked out by the fact that I appear to be a different person every time they see me.

 

This is very confusing and shameful.

 

The very very odd thing I have noticed is that while I will go through different cycles of mood and energy, my core presence does not change in my writing. My writing style stays the same, though it does get very analytical in technical documents, and my written word is drastically different from my speech. So I have decided that since this is the only identity that stays consistent, it must be the real me.

 

I know this I love writing and can get absolutely LOST for days on end in my research. While I was gone I wrote about thirty pages by hand.

 

 

And shoot kids are at it again gotta go...

[J_L_C]

Why is it painful? Do you know why DBT has not worked for you?

 

Are you familiar with rtms? Here is a description at the following website- About repetitive Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation (rTMS) therapy?

 

It is essentially sending magnetic pulses through the scalp, skull and into the brain to "re-wire" the way the neurons interact with each other. Each person receives a different level depending on how deep and response their pre-frontal cortex is to stimulation. Imagine an electrical shock when you touch something, but at rhythmic pulses in specific intervals. I found it extremely uncomfortable for the first few sessions, but am slowly getting used to it.

 

DBT made sense in theory, but I was able to make practical use of it because my mind was simply overwhelmed with thoughts caused by my OCD and depression. This treatment is aimed at getting the areas of impulsiveness and emotional regulation more under control. At that point, my therapist feels I may be able to use DBT more successfully.

[Emilia]

To answer Emilia's question, BPDs have trouble existing in two states at once. This is a concrete state of the here and now. Most BPDs find dealing with the conflict of logic and emotional impulse nearly impossible at first. Remembering a different emotional state is even more difficult.

 

So it's like this, say your BPD partner has been somehow getting along with you famously for some extended period of time... Then based on the smallest disagreement he decides he hates you and never wants to see you again.

 

Even from a person with a rather sever case himself, I cannot even guess at the reason a person will do this. In my case it is often not the incident of the moment, but rather something from my past that was haunting me lately. The problem is that I often do not realize this in the heat of the moment, but rather as long as a month later.

As a witness to this several times I noticed early on that the conflict stemmed from something small and after a while I learnt it related my ex's feeling of exploitation, especially sexual. He understands this now better and we had a couple of conversations about it and he told me the same thing because clearly it played around on his mind. I would make a joke that I could make with a hundred other men - especially as our relationship was very sexual - but at times he would not be able to deal with the content at all, or rather, it would take him a while to.

The results are the same however if I do not catch my self. My wife is left with another permanent emotional scar.

Has your wife learnt to distance herself emotionally from the arguments or does she bite back all the time still?

In addition to this, I am left in shock at what I have just done. This will lead me into an INTENSE desire to simply disappear rather than continue to inflict harm. Another motivation for this is sheer shame. Shame at letting myself succumb to the beast, shame at the foolishness of my behavior. The worst part is the guilt, knowing what is right and wanting it desperately, but unable to perform. This duality only increases the state of conflicting messages and thus leads farther into the dark.

Yes my ex reported these feelings to me as well.

I can also add that my chameleon quality makes me feel fake. I don't feel like a real person. It's all good at first, I move in close and assimilate the person's traits unintentionally. This feels good for a time as I at least have a definition of who I am, but then I realize what is going on. I realize that people are freaked out by the fact that I appear to be a different person every time they see me.

 

This is very confusing and shameful.

There are people that find it fascinating, I always liked that side of him. I found it interesting how he would change aspects of his persona depending on his job for example. I knew him before he joined the british army and I observed him in different surroundings. It was very interesting.

The very very odd thing I have noticed is that while I will go through different cycles of mood and energy, my core presence does not change in my writing. My writing style stays the same, though it does get very analytical in technical documents, and my written word is drastically different from my speech. So I have decided that since this is the only identity that stays consistent, it must be the real me.

 

I know this I love writing and can get absolutely LOST for days on end in my research. While I was gone I wrote about thirty pages by hand.

 

And shoot kids are at it again gotta go...

Yes my ex's communication style hasn't changed. Everything else is fluid but there is a core that I observed has stayed the same. Probably the reason why I still talk to him because that core is a very good human being.

 

Thanks Harmony, most insightful. Hope the family are well.

[Ashlaria]

Ash, like you, I am a sucker for anyone who desperately needs me because my desire to be needed (for what I can do) far exceeds my desire to be loved (for the person I already am). Unfortunately, much of the literature on "codependency" is unreliable because the term is never defined in the APA's Diagnostic Manual. I nonetheless did find the book, Codependent No More, to be very helpful.

 

And the best online article I've seen is therapist Shari Schreiber's article at DO YOU LOVE TO BE NEEDED, OR NEED TO BE LOVED?. Schreiber explains how we got to be excessive caregivers during our childhood. Finally, if you would like to read more about BPD traits, I suggest you take a look at my description at http://www.loveshack.org/forums/breaking-up-reconciliation-coping/separation-divorce/275289-crazy-i-think-but-i-love-her-anyway#post3398735. Take care, Ash.

 

 

Hey Downtown. Thank you so much for taking the time to reply, I've read through all your posts and they have been enlightening. The thing is, what do I do now? How do I get past the guilt for leaving him when he clearly needs help, the feeling that no one else will ever love me like that again, how do I stop missing all the good things, when I know a single phone call is all it will take to have it all back?

 

I blocked him on Facebook and cut his phone off, so I have no way to contact him. I think I did this mostly for self preservation. Despite the circumstance, I still want to make things work. I feel so helpless. I was never this person, I am a lot older than him, I have a good job, a home, a wonderful son. I spend my life making decisions and seeing things through and like others I have seen you reply to, I just feel like I failed. He chose the chaos and drama of his real life over the one we had together. I think I am still in shock over the pregnancy to be honest. I feel so stupid and humiliated. Everyone said he was just using me, it wasn't love etc, now I feel like they were right

[Emilia]

Hey Downtown. Thank you so much for taking the time to reply, I've read through all your posts and they have been enlightening. The thing is, what do I do now? How do I get past the guilt for leaving him when he clearly needs help, the feeling that no one else will ever love me like that again, how do I stop missing all the good things, when I know a single phone call is all it will take to have it all back?

 

I blocked him on Facebook and cut his phone off, so I have no way to contact him. I think I did this mostly for self preservation. Despite the circumstance, I still want to make things work. I feel so helpless. I was never this person, I am a lot older than him, I have a good job, a home, a wonderful son. I spend my life making decisions and seeing things through and like others I have seen you reply to, I just feel like I failed. He chose the chaos and drama of his real life over the one we had together. I think I am still in shock over the pregnancy to be honest. I feel so stupid and humiliated. Everyone said he was just using me, it wasn't love etc, now I feel like they were right

 

Hi Ash

 

To rid yourself of this kind of attachment, you need to find the reason within you as to why you choose to form such unhealthy bonds. What was your parents' relationship with each other? Do you come from a family that dealt with a lot of conflicts over the years?

[Ashlaria]

Hey Emilia,

 

I am the third of four children. My dad was an alcoholic and my mum didn't really stand up to him until her mum died. My mum divorced my dad when I was 8, but he continued to be part of our life. I remember he used to get drunk and try to kick down our front door. I would be sent out to the hallway to ask him to go home. Sometimes he did what I asked, sometimes my sister climbed out of the back window and ran to the phone box and the police would come and take him away. I was about 8/9 years old. I have always felt responsible for my mum, I have always felt she is a good person but people take advantage of that so it was my job to help her. I guess it started there.

[Emilia]

Hey Emilia,

 

I am the third of four children. My dad was an alcoholic and my mum didn't really stand up to him until her mum died. My mum divorced my dad when I was 8, but he continued to be part of our life. I remember he used to get drunk and try to kick down our front door. I would be sent out to the hallway to ask him to go home. Sometimes he did what I asked, sometimes my sister climbed out of the back window and ran to the phone box and the police would come and take him away. I was about 8/9 years old. I have always felt responsible for my mum, I have always felt she is a good person but people take advantage of that so it was my job to help her. I guess it started there.

It started with your dad. I didn't want to mention alcohol but I was almost certain you would mention it. Downtown referred to this book Codependent No More - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia and I think you should look into it. It focuses on alcoholism but only as a way to get to the root of codependency. Your mum and dad were in a codependent relationship and this is what you have been copying.

[Ashlaria]

Thank you, I did make a note of the book, I've added it to my wish list. I guess my main focus is to stop feeling like this. What can I do right now to stop the nagging sense I've done something wrong, that I've abandoned him when he needs me, that by cutting off his phone I've kicked him when he's down.

 

I think you mentioned earlier you stopped talking to friends as they didn't understand, I think mine are running out of patience. It's so easy for them - he let me down again, he's hurt me in the worst way, he never loved me etc I should just 'shake it off' almost. It doesn't feel like that to me. It feels like a huge black hole has opened up in my life. All the good things are magnified and no amount of rational thought is helping

[Emilia]

Thank you, I did make a note of the book, I've added it to my wish list. I guess my main focus is to stop feeling like this. What can I do right now to stop the nagging sense I've done something wrong, that I've abandoned him when he needs me, that by cutting off his phone I've kicked him when he's down.

 

I think you mentioned earlier you stopped talking to friends as they didn't understand, I think mine are running out of patience. It's so easy for them - he let me down again, he's hurt me in the worst way, he never loved me etc I should just 'shake it off' almost. It doesn't feel like that to me. It feels like a huge black hole has opened up in my life. All the good things are magnified and no amount of rational thought is helping

You need to get to the root of it and you need to start reading to understand it. Without understanding truly that you are effectively trying to control him because this is how your parents' worked, you will not succeed in conquering it. Codependency is a form of control to make another person do what we think they should do. You see this man as someone helpless while in fact he is an adult and has succeeded in survival without your assistance for many years

[HarmonyInDisonance]

Are you familiar with rtms? Here is a description at the following website- About repetitive Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation (rTMS) therapy?

 

It is essentially sending magnetic pulses through the scalp, skull and into the brain to "re-wire" the way the neurons interact with each other. Each person receives a different level depending on how deep and response their pre-frontal cortex is to stimulation. Imagine an electrical shock when you touch something, but at rhythmic pulses in specific intervals. I found it extremely uncomfortable for the first few sessions, but am slowly getting used to it.

 

DBT made sense in theory, but I was able to make practical use of it because my mind was simply overwhelmed with thoughts caused by my OCD and depression. This treatment is aimed at getting the areas of impulsiveness and emotional regulation more under control. At that point, my therapist feels I may be able to use DBT more successfully.

 

I understand completely. I was unable to put any methods I learned or theorized about to use until they got my Bipolar symptoms under control. This freed up more than enough capacity to utilize the things I have been learning. Keep at it though, there are ways to succeed in this, especially for those with exceptionally stubborn souls.

[HarmonyInDisonance]

Hey Downtown. Thank you so much for taking the time to reply, I've read through all your posts and they have been enlightening. The thing is, what do I do now? How do I get past the guilt for leaving him when he clearly needs help, the feeling that no one else will ever love me like that again, how do I stop missing all the good things, when I know a single phone call is all it will take to have it all back?

 

I blocked him on Facebook and cut his phone off, so I have no way to contact him. I think I did this mostly for self preservation. Despite the circumstance, I still want to make things work. I feel so helpless. I was never this person, I am a lot older than him, I have a good job, a home, a wonderful son. I spend my life making decisions and seeing things through and like others I have seen you reply to, I just feel like I failed. He chose the chaos and drama of his real life over the one we had together. I think I am still in shock over the pregnancy to be honest. I feel so stupid and humiliated. Everyone said he was just using me, it wasn't love etc, now I feel like they were right

 

You can look at this in pretty much two different ways. The funny things is that either way you look at it, he was in fact using you. None on the terrible things we BPDs do should be simply forgiven, not lightly anyway. He was likely using you out of sheer desperation to find stability THROUGH you. As far as the thing with his GF\XGF, is likely just the work of classic lack of impulse control and a strong sex drive.

 

The only thing you can take solace in are his motivations. Intent changes everything. I cannot in anyway condone his actions, but I can say there may have been a horror story going on in his mind. It's a pathetic example of selfish self preservation. Dr.Linehan explains it this way... "BPDers are like burn victims with 3rd degree burns over 90% of there emotional skin. Even the slightest touch can be overwhelmingly painful". So we will basically drown anyone near us if we can crawl over you to saftey.

 

Again intent changes everything.

 

Unfortunately, you may never have these answers as re-engaging is a bad idea at this time. You lack the tools to deal with him right now. In addition to this, he is ultimately responsible for himself. So while he may have some excuse for what he's done, you simply have to protect yourself first. Going in to attack without first arming yourself is suicide in a tactical situation, this is no different.

 

I think it may help to defer to a sort of hyper-rationalism regarding him. Maybe one day you can help, but never, ever ever ever, attempt this until you are positive that it will not destroy you. I know you feel bad, but the fact is that he may never be able to crawl out of his hole in his current environment.

 

This leaves the choice up to him ultimately.

 

Regarding myself, I can only guess that my intelligence and extreme predisposition to logical process is what got me this far. As time went on it became clear that something was wrong, the idea that every person I had problems with was at fault was a statistical impossibility. So by way of simple reasoning I decided to start taking my established diagnosis seriously. Upon doing so I noticed there were odd fluctuations that did not fit bipolar, but were similar. I eventually was diagnosed with BPD in addition to bipolar, but it was kept from me for several years. Curious I asked my therapist directly and she reluctantly explained, although in a deceptive way. I researched it myself, had a breakdown, mourned, and then decided "you know what, I'm me dammit. The same me that could drop into the wilderness butt naked and show up at your door a month later sharply dressed with a grand of walking money!". They got my bipolar under control and I attacked my BPD with renewed vigor.

 

I really hate to say this, but I honestly believe I have been steered into this current point by God almighty himself. I can adapt to almost any circumstance and cultural lines mean nothing to me. I have been so messed up and indulged in every last "flavor" of sin there is to the point that I cannot judge another. I don't see disability, deformations, color, culture, past wrongs, or any other traits we tend to avoid.

 

Long story short, it probably takes a miracle to cure any BPDer. I do believe however, that God is particularly found of each and every one of us and that he has the time to help us all.

 

So you can still do one very powerful thing to help him... Pray

 

Don't forget to ask for God's help for yourself either Okay.

 

Hope this helps...

[J_L_C]

I understand completely. I was unable to put any methods I learned or theorized about to use until they got my Bipolar symptoms under control. This freed up more than enough capacity to utilize the things I have been learning. Keep at it though, there are ways to succeed in this, especially for those with exceptionally stubborn souls.

 

Have you had rtms???

[Downtown]

I researched it myself, had a breakdown, mourned, and then decided "you know what, I'm me dammit. The same me that could drop into the wilderness butt naked and show up at your door a month later sharply dressed with a grand of walking money!".

Delightful attitude. Simply delightful.

It probably takes a miracle to cure any BPDer.

There is no cure because there is no disease to cure. BPD is not considered to be a disease but, rather, a way of thinking. It therefore can be managed and controlled by undergoing therapy to retrain the mind to think differently.

 

As to what it takes to be successful in that endeavor, it does not "take a miracle." Rather, it takes a high level of self awareness and sufficient ego strength to persist with therapy. Significantly, you have both of those attributes in spades, Harmony.

[Ashlaria]

 

Again intent changes everything.

 

I think it may help to defer to a sort of hyper-rationalism regarding him.

 

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply. I think you have completely summed up my anguish in statement about intent. That is exactly my issue, if his intent was honest and he genuinely wanted to be with me, then I can deal with that. If he was just taking me for what he could get, that is way harder for me to deal with. My friend thinks it doesn't matter, but it is fundamental to me. If I didn't see what he was doing, how will I see it next time? How will I trust another man?

 

Can you explain what you mean by 'hyper-rationalism' I haven't heard that term before.

[Emilia]

My friend thinks it doesn't matter, but it is fundamental to me. If I didn't see what he was doing, how will I see it next time? How will I trust another man?

By getting rid of your codependent tendencies thus making yourself less vulnerable to dysfunctional relationships.

Can you explain what you mean by 'hyper-rationalism' I haven't heard that term before.

It will be interesting what Harmony says and I think he was referring to what I learned: how to distance yourself from the emotional effect his behaviour has on you. To be able to 'see through' the projecting and realising that the anger is in fact anxiety and not take it personally. Learning that it's not about you but him. As soon as I worked out my ex's pattern - ie that the lashing out was always related to what he believed my views were on him and not to what his views were on me - his outbursts stopped affecting me emotionally.

[Emilia]

None on the terrible things we BPDs do should be simply forgiven, not lightly anyway.

You also must remember Harmony that we are human beings with options. This is not to dismiss the effect of being smashed into the doorframe emotionally as dreamoftigers so well put it but we are all adults with choices. The way you are affected by emotions is not the same as I am.

[Ashlaria]

Thank you again Emilia. I already see through his acts and I don't take them personally anymore. I did at first, after the honeymoon period, which lasted 5 months, the rows started. I was devastated at the things he said. When he had calmed down he explained over and over that when he is angry he says terrible things but he never means them and I should only believe them if he is calm when he says then.

 

It took about a year for me to stop reacting to the harsh things he said. I guess I was worn down with the emotion of it all. I've never been in a relationship like it, none if my previous bfs behaved like that and in fact no one in my whole life had spoken to me the way he did, so it was all a shock.

 

I have taken on board what you have all said and ordered the book Downtown recommended. I read the article he suggested but as I remember hardly anything from my early childhood, I couldn't relate to the abandonment or lack of maternal love. Lets see if the book makes more sense.

 

Thank you again for your time, it's nice to know that I'm not crazy, at least