More on the Myth of Confidence...

[USMCHokie]

From your answer to 2.50, what he posted is beyond your comprehension.

 

Doubt it.

 

He said nothing about not needing external validation in his dating life, in fact in a previous post he basically said the learning experience was by trial and error.

 

Without external validation, or invalidation, you cannot recognize error, so there could be no trial and error. Without that external feedback, it would be nothing more than a series of trials where you must assume either success or error. Mere belief can only take people so far. Knowledge is what creates true confidence.

 

And yet your reply to him was all about how much he used external validation in his dating life.

 

I stand by it.

 

He is correct you will probably never understand.

 

I could say the same of him. Or you.

 

I have a friend who likes to read in trees. When he wants to read something, and he is an avid reader, he goes down to a park, climbs up into a tree and proceeds to do his reading. Quite often somebody who does not know him will notice and sometimes make rude remarks about him being in a tree. One could say when it comes to external validation, he receives the total opposite. And yet his persists

 

Yes, I call that external invalidation, which falls into the same realm of the overarching external feedback. He still internally processes and "uses" that external feedback; however, it's his choice what he does with it. In the case you provide, he chooses to ignore it.

 

The point is when you say nothing is ever accomplished in a bubble, without external validation, you are totally wrong. There are a great many who do not need being stroked.

 

And this is where the disconnect happens. You associate external validation only with "stroking." My concept of external validation goes far beyond mere stroking and broadly describes any external feedback we receive from others. Sex or being in a relationship are both some of the strongest forms of external validation.

 

So if you limit your view of external validation to only express "stroking," then yes, 2.50 would be correct that he may have never needed it in his life.

Edited August 15, 2012 by USMCHokie

[snug.bunny]

I think **certain** variables are being mixed into one, in this thread:

 

-External Feedback

-Ego

-Self-Confidence (or, Self-Esteem)

-Validation

 

They're not all equal and/or the same...

 

External Feedback is given. It is dependent on how the individual perceives, intreprets and takes in the information.

 

Ego is external.

 

Self-Confidence is internal (how you “quantify” your values, judgments, skills and abilities).

 

Validation is confirmation… But, WHO gets to validate what exactly?

 

It is still your own brain that processes all of the information, funnels it, and applies it accordingly.

 

Women aren't necessarily attracted by "confidence." "Confidence" is merely an internal construct that creates a bias for action, and it's the results from a man's tendency to act that women perceive to be an attraction to "confidence."

 

I agree, to a degree.

 

In any case, try to stop obssessing with these threads... You have a very active mind, which is great, but don't let it become your achilles heel.

[GG2W]

External Invalidation? New term.

 

How can this be? In your previous posts you made an absolute statement that everybody needs external validation. But now you twist it to add external invalidation

 

Then you twist 2.50's posts to say he claims he never needed or used external validation.

 

It seems you have this need to always have to be right? And as such you will never understand, that there are some who could care less.

 

Here is a hint. My friend who climbs trees, has found his special place, a place of peace to do his reading, as he put it one time, it is like being in the arms of mother nature. He could care less what others think

 

You and others like you who have this need of social approval will never understand.

 

Can you say Baaah?

[USMCHokie]

External Invalidation? New term.

 

How can this be? In your previous posts you made an absolute statement that everybody needs external validation. But now you twist it to add external invalidation

 

Then you twist 2.50's posts to say he claims he never needed or used external validation.

 

No, it's not a new term. If you had read the whole thread, or perhaps glanced at previous threads on the topic, I've always maintained external that external validation and invalidation are of the same class.

 

And accusing me of "twisting words"...? I read things at face value. My advice would be to use better words.

 

It seems you have this need to always have to be right? And as such you will never understand, that there are some who could care less.

 

Eh, it's not necessarily a need to be right. I just tend to be right more often than not.

[joystickd]

No, it's not a new term. If you had read the whole thread, or perhaps glanced at previous threads on the topic, I've always maintained external that external validation and invalidation are of the same class.

 

And accusing me of "twisting words"...? I read things at face value. My advice would be to use better words.

 

 

 

Eh, it's not necessarily a need to be right. I just tend to be right more often than not.

You just think you are right. Why even devote the energy to external validation when its not going to give you what you want?

[USMCHokie]

You just think you are right. Why even devote the energy to external validation when its not going to give you what you want?

 

This suggests that you don't quite understand external validation, or at least my explanation of it. External validation requires no effort or energy from you, as it comes from others around you. The effort comes from your internal processing of that feedback you receive from others. Just because you choose not to do anything doesn't mean you don't receive it.

[Fugu]

I think confidence works -- provided that it's real confidence. Beyond that, though, you need to be attractive. Some people are confident but don't really have an identifiable reason to be. And I'm not sniping at anyone here, fwiw; just pointing out what I've seen in my own lifetime.

[USMCHokie]

I think confidence works -- provided that it's real confidence. Beyond that, though, you need to be attractive. Some people are confident but don't really have an identifiable reason to be. And I'm not sniping at anyone here, fwiw; just pointing out what I've seen in my own lifetime.

 

I'd agree with the concept of "real confidence"; that is, confidence that is backed by actual knowledge and not just belief. Actual knowledge cannot be gained without actual experience. How can one be confident that they are desirable? They can either experience being desired and have actual knowledge that they are desirable, or they can imagine being desired and only have a belief that they are desirable. For some, belief is enough.

[joystickd]

This suggests that you don't quite understand external validation, or at least my explanation of it. External validation requires no effort or energy from you, as it comes from others around you. The effort comes from your internal processing of that feedback you receive from others. Just because you choose not to do anything doesn't mean you don't receive it.

I understand. My thing is why even devote time to creating a thread of the myth of confidence just to rationalize reasons to continue to be a loser. We show people how to treat us. When you have self confidence that tells the world that you see yourself as valuable so they will see you that way. I know you see confidence as a myth or a fake it till you make it. The thing is at some point you have to believe in you because it won't mean sh*t no matter what external validation you get.