I have learned what Matthew 10:37 means...

[M30USA]

Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me...

-Matthew 10:37 (NIV)

 

This verse has been used by critics to say that the Bible promotes extremism, hate, and anti-family philosophy.

 

But I believe I've come to know what it means. Many people say that their first priority in life is family. "Family is number one" we might hear. While I agree that family is important--and I would even die for my own children--the problem comes when we are willing to disobey God for the sake of our family. For example, a spouse might bear false witness or lie in family court so as to preserve control of their children. Another person might lie/steal or engage in dishonest business practices for the seemingly noble purpose of providing for his family. So while family is certainly very important, I believe Christ used the verse above to show that much evil can come from disobeying him for the sake of "family". Let's just face it. There is a lot of this in our society. It's painful to force ourselves to admit; but do we really love family more than God? The entire history of the Old Testament has examples of how a family inadvertently brings destruction to their family because they try to preserve it at the expense of obeying God--or when they idolize their family over God. It is my belief that our children actually grow up best when we do not place them above God. It's kind of ironic.

Edited August 11, 2012 by M30USA

[TaraMaiden]

No, it doesn't mean that.

[TheFinalWord]

Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me...

-Matthew 10:37 (NIV)

 

This verse has been used by critics to say that the Bible promotes extremism, hate, and anti-family philosophy.

 

But I believe I've come to know what it means. Many people say that their first priority in life is family. "Family is number one" we might hear. While I agree that family is important--and I would even die for my own children--the problem comes when we are willing to disobey God for the sake of our family. For example, a spouse might bear false witness or lie in family court so as to preserve control of their children. Another person might lie/steal or engage in dishonest business practices for the seemingly noble purpose of providing for his family. So while family is certainly very important, I believe Christ used the verse above to show that much evil can come from disobeying him for the sake of "family". Let's just face it. There is a lot of this in our society. It's painful to force ourselves to admit; but do we really love family more than God? The entire history of the Old Testament has examples of how a family inadvertently brings destruction to their family because they try to preserve it at the expense of obeying God--or when they idolize their family over God. It is my belief that our children actually grow up best when we do not place them above God. It's kind of ironic.

 

Interesting perspective. I've always thought of it as thwarting idolatry and Christ showing His divinity.

 

“Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to turn

 

“‘a man against his father,

a daughter against her mother,

a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law —

a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.’

 

Food for thought...Christ quoting from Micah 7

 

Do not trust in a friend;

Do not put your confidence in a companion;

Guard the doors of your mouth

From her who lies in your bosom.

For son dishonors father,

Daughter rises against her mother,

Daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law;

A man’s enemies are the men of his own household.

Therefore I will look to the Lord;

I will wait for the God of my salvation;

My God will hear me.

 

 

I always like this scene as we see Peter "push away" his old life...then this verse is referenced

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bolzvGQ3uD8&feature=related

Edited August 11, 2012 by TheFinalWord

[TaraMaiden]

What more than one person in an ecclesiastical role, has outlined to me, is that ultimately, forming strong emotional attachments to others, is our downfall, because those attachments must end at one point or another - whereas an attachment to god never ends and brings a greater reward.

Humans come and go - and our clinging to the pleasure such attachment brings, is a foolhardy waste of time and emotions. Better to "love one another as I have loved you" - but release such a connection as and when that connection to god, beckons.

[M30USA]

Interesting perspective. I've always thought of it as thwarting idolatry and Christ showing His divinity.

 

“Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to turn

 

“‘a man against his father,

a daughter against her mother,

a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law —

a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.’

 

Food for thought...Christ quoting from Micah 7

 

Do not trust in a friend;

Do not put your confidence in a companion;

Guard the doors of your mouth

From her who lies in your bosom.

For son dishonors father,

Daughter rises against her mother,

Daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law;

A man’s enemies are the men of his own household.

Therefore I will look to the Lord;

I will wait for the God of my salvation;

My God will hear me.

 

 

I always like this scene as we see Peter "push away" his old life...then this verse is referenced

 

Jesus of Nazareth 12 28 Full Movie - YouTube

 

Gosh...is this chapter ever relevant to what I'm going through. I just had to read it.

 

This translation is even more profound:

 

Even with the woman who lies in your embrace

guard the words of your lips.

[TaraMaiden]

Jeesh... and people complain Islam is hostile and aggressive.....!

[dreamingoftigers]

I think that the intial interpretation of the "put your God first" was more in-line with my belief system.

 

I also think that men and women should "guard their words" with their spouses and families, not in a secret-keeping way per se, but because words are very damaging when used the wrong way. Just look at the more extreme religious types in the US.

 

I mean Westboro Baptist!?!?

[mercy]

I think that the intial interpretation of the "put your God first" was more in-line with my belief system.

 

I also think that men and women should "guard their words" with their spouses and families, not in a secret-keeping way per se, but because words are very damaging when used the wrong way. Just look at the more extreme religious types in the US.

 

I mean Westboro Baptist!?!?

 

They graced us (our city) with their presence. h said he wasn't surprised at all that my singing carried louder than their yelling.

 

That was a compliment, right?

[Forever Silent]

Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me...

-Matthew 10:37 (NIV)

 

This verse has been used by critics to say that the Bible promotes extremism, hate, and anti-family philosophy.

 

But I believe I've come to know what it means. Many people say that their first priority in life is family. "Family is number one" we might hear. While I agree that family is important--and I would even die for my own children--the problem comes when we are willing to disobey God for the sake of our family. For example, a spouse might bear false witness or lie in family court so as to preserve control of their children. Another person might lie/steal or engage in dishonest business practices for the seemingly noble purpose of providing for his family. So while family is certainly very important, I believe Christ used the verse above to show that much evil can come from disobeying him for the sake of "family". Let's just face it. There is a lot of this in our society. It's painful to force ourselves to admit; but do we really love family more than God? The entire history of the Old Testament has examples of how a family inadvertently brings destruction to their family because they try to preserve it at the expense of obeying God--or when they idolize their family over God. It is my belief that our children actually grow up best when we do not place them above God. It's kind of ironic.

 

I apologize that I am unable to agree with you. When I have a family, I will put them first and foremost. In all honesty, God will not be the one working to put a shelter over their head and food in my families mouth. God will not be the one reading to my children at night before going to bed. I know that this was probably the most blunt statement I have said about religion, but it I think it shows how I am willing to go the extra mile when I bring a life in to this world (and as well because I fathom god in a different way than most people.) And to say that people who put family first will somehow cheat or condone base actions because they family is untrue.

 

A family should always understand their family member's actions but never accept anything. If your child steals a candy bar at a store, you would obviously tell your child you put it back and explain to him the cost of taking things which are not there on. Now from your understanding I guess if you put family first, you would allow to child to steal the candy bar because it makes the child happy. Or am I not reading this correctly. If my intrepretation is correct however, then we completely disagree on the idea of a family.

[M30USA]

That verse, like most verses, can mean whatever you like it to mean.

 

You're right. I think it means that the moon has monthly cycles.

[M30USA]

It means exactly what it says. Its all about fear and control. If you can make people fear the wrath of god then you can control thier thinking. We see alot of this in these threads.

 

The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge.

-Proverbs

 

Man's wisdom sees this fear as imprisonment. But I have news for you. Everyone is a slave to something or someone. Even the person who frees themselves from all rules is a slave to his own desires. Might as well make yourself a slave to the only one who deserves it.

[M30USA]

I apologize that I am unable to agree with you. When I have a family, I will put them first and foremost. In all honesty, God will not be the one working to put a shelter over their head and food in my families mouth. God will not be the one reading to my children at night before going to bed. I know that this was probably the most blunt statement I have said about religion, but it I think it shows how I am willing to go the extra mile when I bring a life in to this world (and as well because I fathom god in a different way than most people.) And to say that people who put family first will somehow cheat or condone base actions because they family is untrue.

 

A family should always understand their family member's actions but never accept anything. If your child steals a candy bar at a store, you would obviously tell your child you put it back and explain to him the cost of taking things which are not there on. Now from your understanding I guess if you put family first, you would allow to child to steal the candy bar because it makes the child happy. Or am I not reading this correctly. If my intrepretation is correct however, then we completely disagree on the idea of a family.

 

When you have eaten and are satisfied, praise the Lord your God for the good land he has given you. 11 Be careful that you do not forget the Lord your God, failing to observe his commands, his laws and his decrees that I am giving you this day. 12 Otherwise, when you eat and are satisfied, when you build fine houses and settle down, 13 and when your herds and flocks grow large and your silver and gold increase and all you have is multiplied, 14 then your heart will become proud and you will forget the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 15 He led you through the vast and dreadful wilderness, that thirsty and waterless land, with its venomous snakes and scorpions. He brought you water out of hard rock. 16 He gave you manna to eat in the wilderness, something your ancestors had never known, to humble and test you so that in the end it might go well with you. 17 You may say to yourself, “My power and the strength of my hands have produced this wealth for me.” 18But remember the Lord your God, for it is he who gives you the ability to produce wealth, and so confirms his covenant, which he swore to your ancestors, as it is today.

 

-Deuteronomy 8

[M30USA]

Im a slave to nobody. I want things out of life and I will work to get them as I have done so far. I will enjoy my family and live my life. If I have children my main focus will shift providing them with the best life I can. I dont need and dont want to depend on a mass murdering god for anything. And guess what? I will still achieve all those things regardless of my beliefes.

 

True. God is not a respecter of persons, according to the Bible. He causes the sun to shine and the rain to pour on the righteous and the wicked alike, according to the Bible.

 

So don't let your success/failure in life be an indicator to you of your place with God (or without God).

[M30USA]

How can you say that when everything christians have dealing with success they credit to God giving them.

 

They can thank God for what they have, sure. We are supposed to give thanks in all things, though, even hardship and suffering (according to the New Testament writing's by Paul).

 

Christians who use earthly success as an indicator of their walk with God are using their own understanding rather than the Word of God. Period.

[TaraMaiden]

They can thank God for what they have, sure. We are supposed to give thanks in all things, though, even hardship and suffering (according to the New Testament writing's by Paul).

 

I can't say hand on heart that you seem to have been very "grateful to God" for your experiences at the hands of your ex-wife and her parents.

It's hard in such circumstances to find gratitude, certainly....

 

But it serves to remind me of that wonderful saying:

 

"By all means call on God - but at least, row away from the rocks....."

[M30USA]

I can't say hand on heart that you seem to have been very "grateful to God" for your experiences at the hands of your ex-wife and her parents.

It's hard in such circumstances to find gratitude, certainly....

 

But it serves to remind me of that wonderful saying:

 

"By all means call on God - but at least, row away from the rocks....."

 

I frequently pray for humilility. I've never once in my life prayed for money or success. So if this situation with my STBXW is God's answered prayer to my request for humility, then so be it. And, TaraMaiden, you seem to enjoy putting yourself in position as my judge and arbiter. Have I ever once acted as yours?

[TaraMaiden]

You really are unbelievable, you know that?

Jeesh, you smart under scrutiny, and take every comment as a barbed criticism - I advised you already - take a step back, breathe and look at the things I and others have tried to impress upon you.

 

QUIT BEING SUCH A DAMN VICTIM!!!

 

What you see, is what you get with me. If you find anything in my postings that renders me a hypocrite (I don't lie, even a little bit) and anywhere, where I am biased or unfairly critical - then please - PLEASE - feel free to turn it all around on me.

 

But guess what - ?

This is not about me.

 

This is about you, and your patent inability to admit your own responsibility in the dynamics of your relationship with your wife.

 

But if you want to project, and make this about everyone else, and never you, then carry on.

You're on a par with Woggle, in so many ways.

[RickyLovesLucy]

What more than one person in an ecclesiastical role, has outlined to me, is that ultimately, forming strong emotional attachments to others, is our downfall, because those attachments must end at one point or another - whereas an attachment to god never ends and brings a greater reward.

Humans come and go - and our clinging to the pleasure such attachment brings, is a foolhardy waste of time and emotions. Better to "love one another as I have loved you" - but release such a connection as and when that connection to god, beckons.

Yes, I can definitely see why that interpretation would make sense to you. One can extend the point to pretty much everything physical; it may look permanent but it will change. When it does, your attachment to it can lead to suffering.

[TaraMaiden]

yes, that does make sense to me in that way - but interestingly, the interpretation was pointed out to me first of all, by my RC Parish priest.... And yet, it is very Buddhist!

It resonates....

Edited August 12, 2012 by TaraMaiden

[M30USA]

You really are unbelievable, you know that?

Jeesh, you smart under scrutiny, and take every comment as a barbed criticism - I advised you already - take a step back, breathe and look at the things I and others have tried to impress upon you.

 

QUIT BEING SUCH A DAMN VICTIM!!!

 

What you see, is what you get with me. If you find anything in my postings that renders me a hypocrite (I don't lie, even a little bit) and anywhere, where I am biased or unfairly critical - then please - PLEASE - feel free to turn it all around on me.

 

But guess what - ?

This is not about me.

 

This is about you, and your patent inability to admit your own responsibility in the dynamics of your relationship with your wife.

 

But if you want to project, and make this about everyone else, and never you, then carry on.

You're on a par with Woggle, in so many ways.

 

That's exactly what my wife said after she took a board over me 5 times, leaving bruises. She said I'm acting like a victim. Hmm. I've reached the end of my discussions with you, TaraMaiden. We clearly see things differently. Good luck.

[TaraMaiden]

One makes one's own luck, and I have plenty.

[TheFinalWord]

Hey M30USA,

 

Not sure what you're going through bro, but I'm praying for you

 

One of my fav songs, I've seen these guys live. Good song and message Hope it blesses you friend.

 

[Betrayed&Stayed]

Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me...

-Matthew 10:37 (NIV)

 

This verse has been used by critics to say that the Bible promotes extremism, hate, and anti-family philosophy.

 

This is why I believe it is dangerous to read the Bible too literally.

 

Back up to Matt 10:34.

 

Jesus is referring to two well-known OT passages (well-known for his audience): Isaiah 9:6 and Micah 7:6.

 

He is talking about Micah which he quotes verbatim (Micah 7:6). Micah was a prophet who spoke of the Messiah coming. Jesus is speaking about that prophecy, not literal families. He is asking, "Do you believe I'm the Messiah or not? Do you believe what Micah (and Isaiah) wrote about Me?" Micah also speaks of forthcoming doom and hope. Jesus is telling his disciples the same thing. He will bring Peace, but not peace from the Romans.

 

That's how I read it anyways.

Edited September 19, 2012 by Betrayed&Stayed

[BetheButterfly]

Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me...

-Matthew 10:37 (NIV)

 

This verse has been used by critics to say that the Bible promotes extremism, hate, and anti-family philosophy.

 

It is sad that critics think that. Actually, it promotes making the decision to follow Christ even when one's loved ones disagree.

 

Two of my friends are ex-Muslims. One is a very sweet, amazing engineer lady from Morocco. She accepted Jesus as her Savior while studying in France. When she returned, she didn't want to tell her family. She was afraid. She ended up inadvertently telling them when one of her sisters was criticizing Christians. Needless to say, her family was furious. Her Mom cursed her out and kicked her out of house. She lives in the USA now.

 

Another friend is a man from Pakistan. He accepted Jesus as his Savior in Pakistan and was disowned by his family. Several times, people tried to kill him. Eventually, he escaped to the UK. However, his life was also in danger there. He now lives in the USA. The USA appears to have a better track record of protecting Christians from persecution from their own families than other countries do.

 

It is really sad when people are persecuted for changing their beliefs. My Muslim friends deny that an ex-Muslim was a true Muslim to begin with, which I understand because when I hear of apostates from Christian beliefs, I doubt if they were ever truly Christian. However, God knows.

 

As for Matthew 10:37, once I personally knew people who were disowned by their families for becoming Christians, I understood this verse better. It is hard for them. Both of these friends love their families, yet they love Jesus so much that they were willing (though it hurt them both) to be disowned by their family. The Pakistani man even endured assassination attempts, whereas the Moroccan lady didn't. They show me what Matthew 10:37 is all about.

 

One of the many things that I love about Jesus' teachings is that Jesus did not teach killing apostates. When disciples of his no longer followed him due to teachings they didn't understand, Jesus indirectly taught to merely focus on one's own belief (John 6:65-69). Jesus never taught his followers to kill people who didn't believe in him or those who stopped following him. Rather, it is true that he warned that people would be persecuted for following him (Matthew 5:12, 44; 10:23; 24:9; Luke 21:12; John 15:20). This persecution can include coming from members of one's own family, which is what I believe Matthew 10:37 infers.

Edited September 19, 2012 by BetheButterfly