JaneInVegas Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I've been "shopping" for chapels, and I'm surprised how common female ministers are. I was raised Baptist, and female ministers go against my faith. Even though I'm a female and believe women should be anything they want to be, being a minister just isn't one of them IMO. We're doing just a civil service downtown, but was told today that I could not request a male, and whoever was on duty, that's who we get. I don't really want to make a big deal out of this, so no, I would not leave unmarried. So I'd like to know everyone's take on this ... would you feel uncomfortable being married by a female? And if you're like me, would you walk away without getting married? Link to post Share on other sites
sally4sara Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 The marriage license comes from a governmental agency and falls under the jurisdiction of the state in which the ceremony is performed. The state, BTW is separate from any church. Does it matter to you if the person working in that office is female? Because you could have all the male minister headed ceremonies you want, but without that license you are not married. I cared much more about who I was getting married to rather than the gender of the person pretending to be the one marrying us. It was the government that married us for real. Link to post Share on other sites
bentnotbroken Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I too was raised Baptist and I believe just the opposite with scripture to back it up...but we won't go into that here. I don't think a ceremony is sanctioned by the body that is reading the text..but is by the covenant with God and your spouse. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
taiko Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 If it is that important to you keep shopping. In the end it will cost more then just letting the state directly solemnize the union. Perhaps your home church will do it for a nominal fee. Assuming you have not been attending it would be a prodigal son moment for them. Link to post Share on other sites
Author JaneInVegas Posted August 22, 2012 Author Share Posted August 22, 2012 I too was raised Baptist and I believe just the opposite with scripture to back it up...but we won't go into that here. I don't think a ceremony is sanctioned by the body that is reading the text..but is by the covenant with God and your spouse. Bent, I would love it if you would share the verses that you're referring to. I'm certainly open to a new way of thinking Link to post Share on other sites
Author JaneInVegas Posted August 22, 2012 Author Share Posted August 22, 2012 If it is that important to you keep shopping. In the end it will cost more then just letting the state directly solemnize the union. Perhaps your home church will do it for a nominal fee. Assuming you have not been attending it would be a prodigal son moment for them. I wish I did have a church here, I haven't been comfortable with any of them I've been to here in Nevada. Well, 3 out of 3 disagree with me so far. Like I said before, I wouldn't walk away, but it would just "feel funny" to me. I don't know how to explain it. Link to post Share on other sites
bentnotbroken Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Bent, I would love it if you would share the verses that you're referring to. I'm certainly open to a new way of thinking I hope you didn't think I was bashing you:(That was not my intent. I am sorry if you feel that way. Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Some of the nicest and by far most sincere ministers I know here, are women. Honestly, if Christ's mother was female, I don't see any problem with a representative of Christ also being female. I hate to say it, but this is just ingrained and deep-seated prejudicial conditioning... Like some people don't think women should be fire fighters or soldiers, and some men shouldn't be nurses... once upon a time absolutely stereotypically-gendered... now, not so much. I hate to state the obvious, but this is more your problem than the Minister's.... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Radu Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 (edited) Some of the nicest and by far most sincere ministers I know here, are women. Honestly, if Christ's mother was female, I don't see any problem with a representative of Christ also being female. I hate to say it, but this is just ingrained and deep-seated prejudicial conditioning... Like some people don't think women should be fire fighters or soldiers, and some men shouldn't be nurses... once upon a time absolutely stereotypically-gendered... now, not so much. I hate to state the obvious, but this is more your problem than the Minister's.... Unfortunately there are physical differences between men and women, and there are reasons why some women just don't do as good a job as firefighters or paramedics for instance [plain physical strength]. You could include military there as well, if it was frontline fighting where you have to have some physical strength. Other than that, i completely agree with you. I haven't seen any female priests in the eastern catholic church either. Catholics ... well, you already know. Edited August 22, 2012 by Radu Link to post Share on other sites
denise_xo Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I'm the other way around. I deeply dislike communities of faith where women do not have an equal standing with men in terms of the positions they can hold. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Got it Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I would much rather have a woman than a man and actually that has seemed to be the general consensus of those around me. Link to post Share on other sites
taiko Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 However this is Las Vegas where the choices are more varied then a Clark County clerk or a local Baptist church. You can hire Elvis if that is your wish. As a setting Baptist churches tend to be on the plain side which a private chapel can easily replacate or out do anyway.. Link to post Share on other sites
Author JaneInVegas Posted August 23, 2012 Author Share Posted August 23, 2012 I hope you didn't think I was bashing you:(That was not my intent. I am sorry if you feel that way. No Bent, I did not take it in a negative way at all. I really would like you to share that scripture with me though, it would be interesting to see this Biblical debate from a different point of view. Link to post Share on other sites
Author JaneInVegas Posted August 23, 2012 Author Share Posted August 23, 2012 Some of the nicest and by far most sincere ministers I know here, are women. Honestly, if Christ's mother was female, I don't see any problem with a representative of Christ also being female. I hate to say it, but this is just ingrained and deep-seated prejudicial conditioning... Like some people don't think women should be fire fighters or soldiers, and some men shouldn't be nurses... once upon a time absolutely stereotypically-gendered... now, not so much. I hate to state the obvious, but this is more your problem than the Minister's.... Tara, maybe you're not aware of the centuries old debate regarding women in the church. Gender discriminations are typically culture based, such as women serving on the front line in a war, but women in church is a fervant scripture debate. I wouldn't personalize this to say it's "my" problem, I didn't wake up one morning and arbitrarily make up this "rule". This is a religious issue, one that many people feel passionate about, for one side or the other. Link to post Share on other sites
Author JaneInVegas Posted August 23, 2012 Author Share Posted August 23, 2012 I would much rather have a woman than a man and actually that has seemed to be the general consensus of those around me. Interestingly, I polled my office .... 4 out of 21 said they would never be married by a woman, and several said they would have to think about it. Link to post Share on other sites
Author JaneInVegas Posted August 23, 2012 Author Share Posted August 23, 2012 However this is Las Vegas where the choices are more varied then a Clark County clerk or a local Baptist church. You can hire Elvis if that is your wish. As a setting Baptist churches tend to be on the plain side which a private chapel can easily replacate or out do anyway.. You would think, Taiko. But every chapel I have talked to has said, "This is what we have, no special requests, take it or leave it." Link to post Share on other sites
RickyLovesLucy Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 I've been "shopping" for chapels, and I'm surprised how common female ministers are. I was raised Baptist, and female ministers go against my faith. Even though I'm a female and believe women should be anything they want to be, being a minister just isn't one of them IMO. We're doing just a civil service downtown, but was told today that I could not request a male, and whoever was on duty, that's who we get. I don't really want to make a big deal out of this, so no, I would not leave unmarried. So I'd like to know everyone's take on this ... would you feel uncomfortable being married by a female? And if you're like me, would you walk away without getting married? I'm confused. You're shopping for chapels, but you're just doing a civil service downtown. Why are you shopping for chapels if you're going the CS route? Also, a CS isn't a religious ceremony so I'm not quite sure why any religious injunctions would apply. In terms of your question, it wouldn't bother me a bit. Some of my churches have had women pastors, some have not. I just want the church to get the best available player, regardless of sex. Link to post Share on other sites
Author JaneInVegas Posted August 23, 2012 Author Share Posted August 23, 2012 I'm confused. You're shopping for chapels, but you're just doing a civil service downtown. Why are you shopping for chapels if you're going the CS route? Also, a CS isn't a religious ceremony so I'm not quite sure why any religious injunctions would apply. In terms of your question, it wouldn't bother me a bit. Some of my churches have had women pastors, some have not. I just want the church to get the best available player, regardless of sex. Thanks for your input. I had been calling a number of chapels and got frustrated when they wouldn't accept a gender request, but were willing to have someone dress up like Elvis, or Frankeinstein, or Pee Wee Herman. So I decided to go the civil service route because it's a lot cheaper, and I got burned out on the commercialism of the chapels. Link to post Share on other sites
RickyLovesLucy Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 I got burned out on the commercialism of the chapels. Yeah, I can imagine. I hope you find someone that works for you. Link to post Share on other sites
bentnotbroken Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 No Bent, I did not take it in a negative way at all. I really would like you to share that scripture with me though, it would be interesting to see this Biblical debate from a different point of view. I tried to PM you but I can't. Read Acts 2:17-18 and Matthew Henry's commentary helped. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
taiko Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 I've been "shopping" for chapels, and I'm surprised how common female ministers are. I was raised Baptist, and female ministers go against my faith. I started looking and found this 1994 report It seems that while Southern Baptist, not the other Baptist, are generally against women in leadership because of the congregational leadership model there are Southern Baptist convention churches headed by women. I would guess most chapels are nondenominational so there would be no bishop enforcing rules from the larger organization. For what it is worth as a child I attended a United Methodist Church, and while our home church had a man the UMC does/did ordain women. For the past 10 years i have attended a Foursquare Church which was founded and lead by a women Link to post Share on other sites
rainfall Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 I see no problem with female ministers and I would have no problem getting married by one. I think I would have more of a problem with a religion or church saying that only a male is allowed to be a minister. It would make me feel like they were under the impression that a woman should still not speak her mind and should stand behind her husband and let him do the talking. Link to post Share on other sites
episkopos Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 Bent, I would love it if you would share the verses that you're referring to. I'm certainly open to a new way of thinking 1Cor 14:34-35 'Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.' These are some of the verses most people use to back their rejection of women ministers but the Bible also shows in Titus 2:3-4 'The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things; That they may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children,' Here we see that women are encouraged to even become marriage counsellors. The point is to be a mature minister. Maturity in terms of scriptural knowledge and application of the word to your life's issues. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
M30USA Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 God is the one who purposed men and women to be unique and distinct. Why does the Bible say women must not be in a position of instruction or leadership within the church? I will never know all the reasons. But I accept it because, from what I've seen, when women become involved in church authority, the integrity of Scripture soon becomes liberalized and replaced by an "experiential" Gospel where emotions and personal experience become tantamount to God's Word. I've seen it way too many times for it to be coincidence. So...just as God designed women to bring children into the world (and not men), why can he not purpose for men to be the instructors and leaders in church (and not women)? It's a thought which has serious weight and, at the very least, must be taken seriously and not blown off. Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts