When the atheists are all gone

[strongnrelaxed]

What do you think would happen if all the atheists and secular leaders suddenly left. Just picked up and moved to Canada?

 

What would follow very swiftly is a theocracy. There are many who are pushing for this very stridently.

 

Think about that. Repeat that word in your mind a few times. Theocracy.

 

Do you know what happens in countries where there is no one left to fight against the church? If you have never read a history book, I encourage you to do so. Think about what happened to Jesus when HE fought back against the church. And he was Jesus Freaking Christ! The story of Jesus is not in the bible by accident.

 

The symbol of a dead, bloody, tortured corpse of a good man on a spike is not accidental. That symbol is very powerful. Sick and disgusting, but effective.

 

Think about this. No need to respond. I just hope all of you of faith will think about when the darkness descends on you. When the freedoms you take for granted that were paid for with the lives of other people is suddenly gone.

 

They called them the "Dark Ages" for a reason.

 

Please, think about this.

 

Who will you turn to then? God?

[pie2]

Communist regimes (devoid of religion) are paradise, then?

[CarrieT]

The symbol of a dead, bloody, tortured corpse of a good man on a spike is not accidental. That symbol is very powerful. Sick and disgusting, but effective.

Especially when painted on velvet and seen in black light...

 

 

 

Seriously, not everyone thinks Jesus is all that-and-a-bag-of-chips. To some of us, he's just another guy in just another book and nothing else.

[sb129]

Seriously, not everyone thinks Jesus is all that-and-a-bag-of-chips. To some of us, he's just another guy in just another book and nothing else.

 

 

Up there with Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, the Little Mermaid and other fun but fictional characters.

[TaraMaiden]

strong..... you need to get out more.

[TheFinalWord]

What do you think would happen if all the atheists and secular leaders suddenly left. Just picked up and moved to Canada?

 

I hope you don't go

 

I wasn't aware there were any non-secular leaders now? I realize claiming Christianity is beneficial for political campaigns, but actions speak louder than words I won't go there

 

What would follow very swiftly is a theocracy. There are many who are pushing for this very stridently.

 

Interesting you say that b/c the bible does predict someday there will be two theocracies: the reign of the anti-Christ and the reign of Christ.

 

Think about what happened to Jesus when HE fought back against the church. And he was Jesus Freaking Christ! The story of Jesus is not in the bible by accident.

 

Well, from what Christ taught, He actually did not fight back during His crucifixion. He laid down His Life voluntarily for us.

 

 

The symbol of a dead, bloody, tortured corpse of a good man on a spike is not accidental. That symbol is very powerful. Sick and disgusting, but effective.

 

It was even more effective on the 3rd day

 

Think about this. No need to respond. I just hope all of you of faith will think about when the darkness descends on you. When the freedoms you take for granted that were paid for with the lives of other people is suddenly gone.

 

They called them the "Dark Ages" for a reason.

Please, think about this.

Who will you turn to then? God?

 

As for myself, I will

 

"Such as sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, being bound in affliction and iron; Because they rebelled against the words of God, and contemned the counsel of the most High:Therefore he brought down their heart with labor; they fell down, and there was none to help. Then they cried unto the Lord in their trouble, and he saved them out of their distresses. He brought them out of darkness and the shadow of death, and brake their bands in sunder."

 

PS: I like your handle name. Reminds me of Roosevelt's "walk softly and carry a big stick"

[mercy]

It was even more effective on the 3rd day

 

 

 

 

Priceless.

[Taramere]

What do you think would happen if all the atheists and secular leaders suddenly left. Just picked up and moved to Canada?

 

What would follow very swiftly is a theocracy. There are many who are pushing for this very stridently.

 

Think about that. Repeat that word in your mind a few times. Theocracy.

 

Do you know what happens in countries where there is no one left to fight against the church? If you have never read a history book, I encourage you to do so. Think about what happened to Jesus when HE fought back against the church. And he was Jesus Freaking Christ! The story of Jesus is not in the bible by accident.

 

The symbol of a dead, bloody, tortured corpse of a good man on a spike is not accidental. That symbol is very powerful. Sick and disgusting, but effective.

 

Think about this. No need to respond. I just hope all of you of faith will think about when the darkness descends on you. When the freedoms you take for granted that were paid for with the lives of other people is suddenly gone.

 

They called them the "Dark Ages" for a reason.

 

Please, think about this.

 

Who will you turn to then? God?

 

Are you fantasising about a sort of "Rapture for Atheists"?

[madjac74]

What do you think would happen if all the atheists and secular leaders suddenly left. Just picked up and moved to Canada?

 

What would follow very swiftly is a theocracy. There are many who are pushing for this very stridently.

 

Think about that. Repeat that word in your mind a few times. Theocracy.

 

Do you know what happens in countries where there is no one left to fight against the church? If you have never read a history book, I encourage you to do so. Think about what happened to Jesus when HE fought back against the church. And he was Jesus Freaking Christ! The story of Jesus is not in the bible by accident.

 

The symbol of a dead, bloody, tortured corpse of a good man on a spike is not accidental. That symbol is very powerful. Sick and disgusting, but effective.

 

Think about this. No need to respond. I just hope all of you of faith will think about when the darkness descends on you. When the freedoms you take for granted that were paid for with the lives of other people is suddenly gone.

 

They called them the "Dark Ages" for a reason.

 

Please, think about this.

 

Who will you turn to then? God?

 

Captain morgan, jim beam and jack daniels

[BetheButterfly]

What do you think would happen if all the atheists and secular leaders suddenly left. Just picked up and moved to Canada?

 

 

I personally like that there are Atheists and Buddhists and Muslims and Wiccans and Hindus and Sikhs and Jewish Orthodox people and Reform Jews and so on in the USA. I wouldn't want them to go! They are fellow Americans too!!!

 

One thing that I think you are not addressing is that many Atheists and secularists have loved ones who believe in God or gods in some way, and love and care for them. Most would not want to go and leave their loved ones who believe in God, at least I wouldn't think so. If all Christians picked up and moved to Canada, I would be sad to leave the people who I know and love who are not Christians.

 

We're all on this earth together and some of us actually love those who are different than us in beliefs, as well as in other ways.

What would follow very swiftly is a theocracy. There are many who are pushing for this very stridently.

 

Think about that. Repeat that word in your mind a few times. Theocracy.

 

Christians are humans who are prone to error too. That is why the Founding Fathers made sure to have separation of church and state. it is very perceptive of them to do, because in Europe, for a long time the Catholics and the Protestants were at each others' throats, killing each other, which is not following Jesus' commands to love at all.

 

So, if there were only Christians in the USA, they would have to make sure not to put either Catholic or Protestant beliefs as the ruling religion, and so there wouldn't be a theocracy, but rather a democratic republic. The Founding Fathers were mainly Christian and Deist. Maybe there were some closet Atheists, but most were Christian (like George Washington) or Deist (like Thomas Jefferson.) They didn't make a theocracy. However, it makes me sad how the Founding Fathers treated the Native Americans and African-Americans. They didn't respect their freedoms at all. I wish that the Founding Fathers who were Christian had made it a point to follow Jesus' commands to love others and do unto others what they would have done to them! (Luke 6:27-38).

 

Do you know what happens in countries where there is no one left to fight against the church? If you have never read a history book, I encourage you to do so.

 

The Pilgrims and other Christian groups escaped from the theocracies in Europe. It is sad that they did not for the most part respect the religious rights of the Native Americans. However, as a Christian in this time period, I personally have no problem with Native Americans believing what their ancestors believed. It is their right and I am ashamed of my ancestors who killed many of them and forced them on reservations. I wish history could be rewritten where Christians who escaped European religious persecution had not persecuted Native Americans or enslaved Africans.

Think about what happened to Jesus when HE fought back against the church.

 

He didn't fight against the church. He rebuked the Jewish leaders, but churches at the time did not exist. Synagogues did though (and still do today.) Some people from all over world have for around 2000 years believed Jesus to be the Messiah prophesied about in 2 Samuel 7, 1 Chronicles 17, Psalm 2, and Psalm 89 to the Jewish people.

The story of Jesus is not in the bible by accident.

 

That's an understatement!

 

The symbol of a dead, bloody, tortured corpse of a good man on a spike is not accidental. That symbol is very powerful. Sick and disgusting, but effective.

 

For me, death of any person or animal is sick and disgusting, especially if I love that person or animal. Why? Because I want people and animals to live, to be happy, to enjoy life!

 

Jesus' death on the cross symbolizes to me John 3:16, and how great Jesus' love is for God the Father, and for us his brothers and sisters - his friends!- through what he did once for all.

 

Jesus said,

 

" Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends." - John 15:13.

 

He wasn't just whistling dixie. He was serious and showed by action his love. Jesus didn't kill anybody. Instead, he died for us and God rose him from the dead! Now, of course you have the right to believe that or not believe that. It is your decision. Freedom of religion is a right.

 

Think about this. No need to respond. I just hope all of you of faith will think about when the darkness descends on you. When the freedoms you take for granted that were paid for with the lives of other people is suddenly gone.

 

They called them the "Dark Ages" for a reason.

 

Please, think about this.

 

Who will you turn to then? God?

 

The Dark Ages in Europe were a sad time where most of the people were uneducated, could not read, and did not read the Bible for themselves. The Reformation brought education and the ability to read the Bible, as well as other books, for oneself.

 

This led to the understanding that people should be free to choose whether to believe or not, which is why most Christians today thankfully do not kill apostates, but rather understand it is the right of every person to choose what they believe.

[BetheButterfly]

Are you fantasising about a sort of "Rapture for Atheists"?

 

That'd be very interesting, huh?

 

What would be amazing and interesting to is to find a planet with life like human life, to see if they have any people who believe in a Creator or Supreme Being(s).

 

If so, would Atheists decide to go there and leave the earth to believers of God or gods? That is a great idea for a book! However, in reality, many Atheists have family who believe in God or gods and they love each other, which is awesome. I would be so sad if Atheists go... and I personally do believe that if there is life on other planets (which I have no idea... I've never been to any other planet lol) then they would be created by God too...

[mercy]

What do you think would happen if all the atheists and secular leaders suddenly left. Just picked up and moved to Canada?

 

 

 

Please, think about this.

 

 

Ok, I'm thinking....

 

Don't you think a tropical island would be a better choice, what with winter coming and all?

[strongnrelaxed]

Especially when painted on velvet and seen in black light...

 

 

 

Seriously, not everyone thinks Jesus is all that-and-a-bag-of-chips. To some of us, he's just another guy in just another book and nothing else.

 

I was just thinking about this thought the other day. I remember watching The Passion of the Christ as an Atheist. I had seen all the classic Jesus movies, but this one moved me more.

 

I think that when I saw Jesus as just another man trying to change the world. His extraordinary integrity was perhaps his best characteristic. (I will concede that, while the jury is still out as to whether he existed or not, he might have lived and he is worthy of consideration by everyone).

 

Watching him die the way he did as a mere man, made his sacrifice all the more poignant and meaningful to me. He did not have some magic help from God. I know this now. He felt all of that.

 

Because of this amazing sacrifice in the face of such pressure and violence he is a man (symbol) worthy of admiration and respect.

 

I still draw the line at worship though!

[strongnrelaxed]

I hope you don't go

 

I wasn't aware there were any non-secular leaders now? I realize claiming Christianity is beneficial for political campaigns, but actions speak louder than words I won't go there

 

 

 

Interesting you say that b/c the bible does predict someday there will be two theocracies: the reign of the anti-Christ and the reign of Christ.

 

 

 

Well, from what Christ taught, He actually did not fight back during His crucifixion. He laid down His Life voluntarily for us.

 

 

 

 

It was even more effective on the 3rd day

 

 

 

As for myself, I will

 

"Such as sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, being bound in affliction and iron; Because they rebelled against the words of God, and contemned the counsel of the most High:Therefore he brought down their heart with labor; they fell down, and there was none to help. Then they cried unto the Lord in their trouble, and he saved them out of their distresses. He brought them out of darkness and the shadow of death, and brake their bands in sunder."

 

PS: I like your handle name. Reminds me of Roosevelt's "walk softly and carry a big stick"

 

I actually enjoyed reading this.

 

I can't respond to quotations from scripture - or perhaps I am just not qualified. I appreciate some of the sentiments in the bible. I never said it was all bad.

 

I also appreciate your sense of irony and sarcasm. I too liked the "3rd Day" comment.

 

You have to admit though, using an implement of torture as the symbol of a religion is a bit creepy at the very least. Never mind the references to cannibalism (eat my body and drink my blood).

 

Come on, you have to admit at LEAST this one thing.

[strongnrelaxed]

Captain morgan, jim beam and jack daniels

 

I prefer Sam Adams beer, but the Jack I can go for too.

[TheFinalWord]

You have to admit though, using an implement of torture as the symbol of a religion is a bit creepy at the very least. Never mind the references to cannibalism (eat my body and drink my blood).

 

Come on, you have to admit at LEAST this one thing.

 

Sure I can see why you think that. That very sentiment is actually what causes a lot of Jesus followers to abandon Him. They didn't get what He meant. This is a clip from Gospel of John. I like this movie the best b/c it's word for word the ESV version of the gospel of John. Minimal Hollywood license.

 

 

Short on time now, but Christ was referencing the bread from heaven "manna" which Israel ate in the wilderness during their time of testing. They ate the bread God sent from heaven and yet still died. Christ referenced this and then said, but those who eat the real bread from heaven, his body, will never die.

 

Take care friend.

[TheFinalWord]

Another clip, in this one Christ refers to His Body as the temple...no one understood it. Even when he was on the cross the pharisees (main religious sect at the time) mocked him saying "You who are going to destroy the temple and build it in three days, save yourself! Come down from the cross, if you are the Son of God!""

 

The Gospel of John: Jesus Kicks Out The Money Changers From The Temple - YouTube

 

His message fell on deaf ears. Even His disciples did not understand it until He expounded the prophecies after His resurrection.

[Feelin Frisky]

One just has to look at what's happening in the middle east over the last few days to see how things go when religion and law/government are not separate. There can't be any free speech because the wrong words and images could set off instant chaos. America is a secular nation and thank God for that. But it is part of a "global" civilization which now has technology which lets practice of free speech register in other countries where religion IS the law. The answer surely is not to make America a theocracy, just for us to investigate the truth about this "film" and how it just seems to coincidentally have produced such an outrage in so many countries at the same time. Stupid ass Mitt Romney's condemnation of "apology" before the facts were known that the embassy itself tried to pre-empt its own attack with a statement of truth that the US does not condone or take part in the production of material that mocks Islam was read by some factions as indeed America condoning such material. Romney is not even POTUS--just a disaster every time he opens his mouth in international affairs. He must be defeated. Get out and vote against this jerk by re-electing sane and sound President Obama.

[strongnrelaxed]

One just has to look at what's happening in the middle east over the last few days to see how things go when religion and law/government are not separate. There can't be any free speech because the wrong words and images could set off instant chaos. America is a secular nation and thank God for that. But it is part of a "global" civilization which now has technology which lets practice of free speech register in other countries where religion IS the law. The answer surely is not to make America a theocracy, just for us to investigate the truth about this "film" and how it just seems to coincidentally have produced such an outrage in so many countries at the same time. Stupid ass Mitt Romney's condemnation of "apology" before the facts were known that the embassy itself tried to pre-empt its own attack with a statement of truth that the US does not condone or take part in the production of material that mocks Islam was read by some factions as indeed America condoning such material. Romney is not even POTUS--just a disaster every time he opens his mouth in international affairs. He must be defeated. Get out and vote against this jerk by re-electing sane and sound President Obama.

 

There should be votes that count for 1,000 thumbs up. I would give this post that vote.

 

Well said brother.

[strongnrelaxed]

Sure I can see why you think that. That very sentiment is actually what causes a lot of Jesus followers to abandon Him. They didn't get what He meant. This is a clip from Gospel of John. I like this movie the best b/c it's word for word the ESV version of the gospel of John. Minimal Hollywood license.

 

 

Short on time now, but Christ was referencing the bread from heaven "manna" which Israel ate in the wilderness during their time of testing. They ate the bread God sent from heaven and yet still died. Christ referenced this and then said, but those who eat the real bread from heaven, his body, will never die.

 

Take care friend.

 

I am with you on this. Unfortunately, many of your faithful colleagues take such things less symbolically. I have heard this with my own ears and read it with my own eyes.

 

It is like there is this one big religion, with a whole bunch of sects, and derivatives thereof. And they all use the same book. And they all interpret it differently. And if someone else points out the oddities or inconsistencies in their book, there is all this defensiveness.

 

Man, I am more confused than I was before. But I must say this Final Word. You are living your beliefs in a way that is lacking in many of your brethren.

 

I would argue that if you put aside your theism, you would still be a good and decent human being.

[TheFinalWord]

I am with you on this. Unfortunately, many of your faithful colleagues take such things less symbolically. I have heard this with my own ears and read it with my own eyes.

 

It is like there is this one big religion, with a whole bunch of sects, and derivatives thereof. And they all use the same book. And they all interpret it differently. And if someone else points out the oddities or inconsistencies in their book, there is all this defensiveness.

 

Man, I am more confused than I was before. But I must say this Final Word. You are living your beliefs in a way that is lacking in many of your brethren.

 

Hi there,

 

Yes, there are multiple denominations. The core doctrines are the essentials. Outside of that there is all manner of interpretations. The interpretations are often based on scant information, i.e. immersion vs. sprinkling, etc. Some are based on tradition. Some differences are really just personal preferences that make Christianity look more divisive than it is. For example, the style of worship. Some churches have acapella only, no instruments. Others have full on orchestra. So, a lot of times these differences come down to personal preferences.

 

I'm non-denominational (while I don't claim a specific denomination, many would say non-denominationism is a denomination, then it gets into the same type of semantics as is atheism a belief lol). Basically, I adhere to the core doctrines of Christianity, but I am open to various interpretations of the non-essentials. I would probably most closely align with Baptist denomination though; mainly b/c I think they have the morality part right (the most important side-beliefs to me outside of the essential doctrines).

Basically, I try not to major on the minors.

 

But I must say this Final Word. You are living your beliefs in a way that is lacking in many of your brethren.

 

Could be. But I see a lot of young people wanting authentic spirituality. I have a lot of hope in this generation. You probably saw this, but it is the attitude of a lot of young people. Not saying everything he says is correct in this video, but the young folks want spiritual authenticity. They're tired of "religion" and are thirsty for a relationship with God.

 

 

I would argue that if you put aside your theism, you would still be a good and decent human being.

 

Thanks for the kind words Well, I tried that. I wasn't very good You'll just have to take it on faith when I say that

 

Take care.

[TripLine]

A country full of "churches" does not make a country any safer. There will still be hooligans, ghetto, punks, rap music, MTV, justin beiber... the works.

PS Canadian women > American women.

[strongnrelaxed]

I hope you don't go

 

I wasn't aware there were any non-secular leaders now? I realize claiming Christianity is beneficial for political campaigns, but actions speak louder than words I won't go there

 

Interesting you say that b/c the bible does predict someday there will be two theocracies: the reign of the anti-Christ and the reign of Christ.

 

TFW, you may be one of the most gracious and "atheist-like" decent believer with whom I have had the pleasure of interacting in a long time.

 

What you say above, though, I must admit scares the crap out of me and reminds me one of the reasons I became an atheist.

 

I wish I could remember where I first heard this, but it went something like this "Think about this; most believers of Abrahamic religions truly believe that the world is on a crash course to destruction. Many of them are working tirelessly to bring about that ultimate event."

 

That scared the crap out of me too. And I am not really even that afraid to die.

 

This "anti-christ" is sounding more and more like what one would consider the atheist movement.

 

I am an atheist. And I can tell you that I have never met an atheist who is thinking about all the ways we can bring about the end of the world as we know it.

 

Can any atheists/non believers here help me on this one? Are there any references to "end the world" or "Armageddon" or "Revelation" in our literature - aside from the debunking perspective? I just want to fact check before I get myself into too much trouble.

[TheFinalWord]

TFW, you may be one of the most gracious and "atheist-like" decent believer with whom I have had the pleasure of interacting in a long time.

 

What you say above, though, I must admit scares the crap out of me and reminds me one of the reasons I became an atheist.

 

I wish I could remember where I first heard this, but it went something like this "Think about this; most believers of Abrahamic religions truly believe that the world is on a crash course to destruction. Many of them are working tirelessly to bring about that ultimate event."

 

That scared the crap out of me too. And I am not really even that afraid to die.

 

This "anti-christ" is sounding more and more like what one would consider the atheist movement.

 

I am an atheist. And I can tell you that I have never met an atheist who is thinking about all the ways we can bring about the end of the world as we know it.

 

Can any atheists/non believers here help me on this one? Are there any references to "end the world" or "Armageddon" or "Revelation" in our literature - aside from the debunking perspective? I just want to fact check before I get myself into too much trouble.

 

Hi,

 

Thanks for the kind words.

 

The anti-Christ is not an atheist. He will actually exalt himself as God. Many dictators already have assumed that position, but the bible foretells that this person, the anti-Christ, will be given great power.

 

Here are some references from the bible:

 

"Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God."

 

"And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name"

 

The Anti-Christ will lead a great army to destroy Israel.

 

“In those days and at that time,

when I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem,

I will gather all nations

and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat.

There I will put them on trial

for what they did to my inheritance, my people Israel,

because they scattered my people among the nations

and divided up my land."

 

It will appear that Israel is about to be destroyed, when Christ will return to save His people. If you think those battles in the Old Testament were bad, you should see the one in Revelation 19

 

But no, Christians are not working to bring about the end of the age of grace. It's our job to promote the atoning work of Christ during the dispensation of Grace. No one knows when God will bring these things to pass.

 

“But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."

Edited September 17, 2012 by TheFinalWord

[strongnrelaxed]

A country full of "churches" does not make a country any safer. There will still be hooligans, ghetto, punks, rap music, MTV, justin beiber... the works.

PS Canadian women > American women.

 

 

Woah! Hold on a minute! HOW DARE you put beautiful art forms like rap and MTV in the same category as the evil that is Justin Beiber. Shame on you!

 

I would be willing to concede to you that Canadian women are better, but I would like some proof of that. From what I am hearing about what is happening in Vancouver these days, it does not look very good for Canada.