Don't love my wife or find her attractive anymore

[WhatASituation]

@mem : Thank you for your well thought out replies, I will take your advice and start working on myself. After all this, I know I will need it.

 

During our blowout the other night, she said she is willing to go through a mediation process to a divorce. I think it could be amicable. She said she wouldn't want to drag the kids through a long, drawn out divorce process as it's bad enough to go through it. I was actually a bit surprised at this.

[Sauron]

You havea responsibility to your kids, even if your wife is a frigid bitch. If you have been in it for this long at least get the youngest one out of HS and into college if that's in the plan. All this BS about divorce is better than Mommy and Daddy being unhappy is just that, BS. I have seen what divorce does to kids and no one can convince me that it is better.

 

And your a man aren't you? If you don't want to have a GF on the side, go find yourself a regular escort to take care of business and wait it out until your kids are out, then decide what you want to do. Plan your exit, start stashing money and be prepared. Hopefully you are the money manager? It is a huge mistake for men to outsource money management to their wives, especially one like yours. I know cause mine sounds a lot like yours. Good luck.

[WhatASituation]

You havea responsibility to your kids, even if your wife is a frigid bitch. If you have been in it for this long at least get the youngest one out of HS and into college if that's in the plan. All this BS about divorce is better than Mommy and Daddy being unhappy is just that, BS. I have seen what divorce does to kids and no one can convince me that it is better.

 

And your a man aren't you? If you don't want to have a GF on the side, go find yourself a regular escort to take care of business and wait it out until your kids are out, then decide what you want to do. Plan your exit, start stashing money and be prepared. Hopefully you are the money manager? It is a huge mistake for men to outsource money management to their wives, especially one like yours. I know cause mine sounds a lot like yours. Good luck.

 

I hear you Sauron, but speaking from personal experience, my parents divorced when I was around 10. I remember clearly all the horrific fights and me watching them from my room with the door cracked open. Yes it was awful when they divorced, but the peace afterwards was a breath of fresh air. My mom happened to get married to an amazing man afterwards. And yes, I know this is the exception to the rule.

 

See, my wife has NO problems starting a fight in front of the kids. She knows I hate that, but still does it anyway. These fights are none of the kids' business and they don't need to see that. If I have issues, I wait until they are all in bed and bring it up to her. But then she gets so emotional and starts yelling so loud I know the kids hear it. I just can't seem to win here.

[Sauron]

Sorry for your experience. I have spent a lot of time around kids in sports and I can always tell the ones that are from divorced families. Withdrawn, overly willing to please, they hit their teen years and are very influenced by the wrong kinds of things, drugs, teenage fathers and mothers, on and on. But that is just my opinion. Regardless of my lifestyle I am very family oriented and think that we should give our kids as stable of a launching pad as we can.

 

You have a win, you just need to figure out what it is and if it works for you, may not be perfect, may not be the best, but there is one there for you. Or you can just maintain , apparently lots of people just let time slide by day by day and do nothing except complain and then they end up bitter, unhappy and old. I found my win, although its not very popular around here. I bet you can too. Good luck to you.

[Got it]

I hear you Sauron, but speaking from personal experience, my parents divorced when I was around 10. I remember clearly all the horrific fights and me watching them from my room with the door cracked open. Yes it was awful when they divorced, but the peace afterwards was a breath of fresh air. My mom happened to get married to an amazing man afterwards. And yes, I know this is the exception to the rule.

 

See, my wife has NO problems starting a fight in front of the kids. She knows I hate that, but still does it anyway. These fights are none of the kids' business and they don't need to see that. If I have issues, I wait until they are all in bed and bring it up to her. But then she gets so emotional and starts yelling so loud I know the kids hear it. I just can't seem to win here.

 

I had a similar family life as What and my parents stayed married until the youngest was an adult. It was pure hell and we wished they would divorce. My parents had no issues fighting in front of the kids, pitting the kids against each other, etc. I can say they are much better friends now that they are divorced and being with them together is so much nicer. We still do holidays together,etc. so in my case, divorce was better for them because it allowed them to stop focusing on each other and nitpicking the other.

 

My father stands by the fact that he stayed and it was the right decision. Who knows. We agree to disagree. I can't unsee him in handcuffs after a fight one summer and pushing my mom out the back door and the embarrassment that others saw it as well. That is just one of many issues between them though the rest were verbal.

 

Being "the kid" I recommend doing whatever needs to be done to be amicable, whether that is staying together or divorcing. If there is no amicability then divorce and be the safe place for them to fall watching out for parental alienation from your spouse.

[Clep]

I hear you Sauron, but speaking from personal experience, my parents divorced when I was around 10. I remember clearly all the horrific fights and me watching them from my room with the door cracked open. Yes it was awful when they divorced, but the peace afterwards was a breath of fresh air. My mom happened to get married to an amazing man afterwards. And yes, I know this is the exception to the rule.

 

See, my wife has NO problems starting a fight in front of the kids. She knows I hate that, but still does it anyway. These fights are none of the kids' business and they don't need to see that. If I have issues, I wait until they are all in bed and bring it up to her. But then she gets so emotional and starts yelling so loud I know the kids hear it. I just can't seem to win here.

 

People scream and fight in front of their children due to a lack of skills. Your parents didn't have to do that in front of you, nor do you in front of your children.

 

My husband used to be like that. He knew I hated screaming in front of our son, so he would do it as a method of control to make me back down in and effort to shield our son from chaos. I know all too well how maddening that is to be dealing with.

 

A person can't fight by themselves and I decided to keep that as a focal point for me. I sat down with my husband after taking my son to a sitter and let him know that should he raise his voice or say inappropriate things in front of our son even in a low voice, I would leave the house and would return when I felt calmed down. He freaked out of course and started screaming so I did exactly as I said I would. When I returned I asked if we could have a calm discussion after our son was in bed. When he started his antics again I left and tried again later on. It took a couple of weeks of consistency for him to realize that I meant what I said and his forceful attitude was not getting him his way. Live is awesome now and so is communication between us.

 

I remembered often too: If my husband was screaming an yelling and the doorbell rang, he would quietly go answer the door and deal with the person, smiling and in a seemingly great mood. The first time I saw that, I knew he was able to control himself with me as well, but chose not to. Things changed after that.

 

As far as the sex goes: There is no excuse for withholding unless it is medically explained and the person is seeking medical attention. Period. I would not tolerate that and would not expect that of my husband.

 

I have a friend that was in marriage counselling and the counselor sent them home with the homework that they had to have sex every day at least once for thirty days. She didn't have much desire to have sex until after the homework assignment. Now they are complete animals. haha. Their relationship has flourished due to the positive feelings that created between the two.

 

I have been to six counselors in my life. The first five did nothing for me. The sixth had a hand in changing my life and my relationship. I was married last month after 12 years of living together on and off.

 

My point being: I would look for another counselor until you find one you both click with. Then repair your broken marriage.

 

My husband and I split up three times before finally getting it together. It is never too late.

 

Our feelings do not create our thoughts....our thoughts create our feelings.

 

Wishing you the best.

[Mr. Lucky]

Do you think there might be a connection between this:

During our blowout the other night, she said she is willing to go through a mediation process to a divorce. I think it could be amicable. She said she wouldn't want to drag the kids through a long, drawn out divorce process as it's bad enough to go through it. I was actually a bit surprised at this.

and this:

Also I've noticed lots of texts from someone to her cell phone and decided to look at the bill. They are all from out of state from where she used to live so I decided to ask her about it last night. She got very defensive and said it was just an old friend from high school. Well these texts go on all day long, and have been occurring for the past 5 days. She tried to turn it around and say that she thinks I am cheating on her.

 

???

 

Mr. Lucky

[WhatASituation]

@clep: Thanks for your response. Honestly at this point I am so burned out, I think I just want out and be by myself for a while. No one can say I didn't try for years and years.

 

@Mr. Lucky: That's a good point. These texts started recently so I don't know how deep this relationship could even be between them to where she would be willing to go along with a divorce. During our "talk" she said she didn't want to do that, and still loves me (in her own way I suppose). I can't say I feel the same back and won't lie to her either.

[Ninja'sHusband]

Also I've noticed lots of texts from someone to her cell phone and decided to look at the bill. They are all from out of state from where she used to live so I decided to ask her about it last night. She got very defensive and said it was just an old friend from high school. Well these texts go on all day long, and have been occurring for the past 5 days. She tried to turn it around and say that she thinks I am cheating on her.The discussion turned into other things, at 3 am mind you. She asked me point blank, what I want to do stating that she loves me and wants to work things out. When she asked, I froze and couldn't give her an answer.

 

Whooaaahhh, did noone notice this? Massssive red flags on top of what you've said already.

[WhatASituation]

Whooaaahhh' date=' did noone notice this? Massssive red flags on top of what you've said already.[/quote']

 

Yes agreed. The texts stopped the next day and she closed her FB account. Unless they are communicating some other way??

[pie2]

People scream and fight in front of their children due to a lack of skills. Your parents didn't have to do that in front of you, nor do you in front of your children.

 

My husband used to be like that. He knew I hated screaming in front of our son, so he would do it as a method of control to make me back down in and effort to shield our son from chaos. I know all too well how maddening that is to be dealing with.

 

A person can't fight by themselves and I decided to keep that as a focal point for me. I sat down with my husband after taking my son to a sitter and let him know that should he raise his voice or say inappropriate things in front of our son even in a low voice, I would leave the house and would return when I felt calmed down. He freaked out of course and started screaming so I did exactly as I said I would. When I returned I asked if we could have a calm discussion after our son was in bed. When he started his antics again I left and tried again later on. It took a couple of weeks of consistency for him to realize that I meant what I said and his forceful attitude was not getting him his way. Live is awesome now and so is communication between us.

 

I remembered often too: If my husband was screaming an yelling and the doorbell rang, he would quietly go answer the door and deal with the person, smiling and in a seemingly great mood. The first time I saw that, I knew he was able to control himself with me as well, but chose not to. Things changed after that.

 

As far as the sex goes: There is no excuse for withholding unless it is medically explained and the person is seeking medical attention. Period. I would not tolerate that and would not expect that of my husband.

 

I have a friend that was in marriage counselling and the counselor sent them home with the homework that they had to have sex every day at least once for thirty days. She didn't have much desire to have sex until after the homework assignment. Now they are complete animals. haha. Their relationship has flourished due to the positive feelings that created between the two.

 

I have been to six counselors in my life. The first five did nothing for me. The sixth had a hand in changing my life and my relationship. I was married last month after 12 years of living together on and off.

 

My point being: I would look for another counselor until you find one you both click with. Then repair your broken marriage.

 

My husband and I split up three times before finally getting it together. It is never too late.

 

Our feelings do not create our thoughts....our thoughts create our feelings.

 

Wishing you the best.

 

I want to say how much I LOVE this post. Thank you for sharing this great example of how you've taught your spouse how you want to be treated, and not giving up on the relationship. You have very admirable perserverence!!!

Edited September 25, 2012 by pie2

[veryhappy]

Whatever you do, do not have an affair. Then you'll really feel like you can't win. Figure out your future without getting involved with someone else.

[LadyGrey]

It's sounds like you've got a valid complaint in regards to your wife's lack of interest in sex.

 

I wonder what kind of sexual trauma there might be in her background. Have you asked?

 

I think you made a big mistake a long time ago, because you didn't tell her it was a dealbreaker and if something didn't change you were out. Instead you passively waited for her to change it and on top of that you went and added two more kids into the mix, AFTER you knew there was already a problem. Now your kids are the ones who are going to be hurt the most.

 

Another thing I find odd in reading your posts is not once did you mention anything you've done wrong. According to your posts you've been the perfect husband.:eek: No one is a perfect spouse, so I wonder what you are not fessing up to here. Most people at least mention their own faults or issues, but you didn't, not even one. Why is that?

[TiredFamilyGuy]

WhatASituation, It sounds to me, as though your wife has never truly committed to the marriage. She effectively accuses you of this. But it sounds like her focus and emotional energy have never been on you, and also that she is not acknowledging her desire to have control.

 

That was the case with my wife: should anyone have asked her a year ago she would have said that of course she was committed to marriage, our problems were down to me or in my mind. Now she admits this was not accurate at all, and thanks me for my persistence in getting her to talk. The first block to fall was not sex, it was frank communication in private about emotional matters, and getting her to prioritize the marriage. It was a hard process to initiate: I had to threaten her with divorce to get her to come to the table, and confront her many times. All sorts of strange information emerged.

 

Questions I asked her, which she now says made an impression on her mind and helped change her viewpoint, included: how will it be when the children leave home? - all I could see was dread of each others company. What sort of model for relationships is supplied to children from parents who have no affection and where there is bickering/faultfinding instead? I laid out my thoughts in email where she could not reinterpret them to suit her mood.

 

Good luck

[angie2443]

Yes agreed. The texts stopped the next day and she closed her FB account. Unless they are communicating some other way??

 

I think, if someone really wants to contact someone, they'll find a way. I don't know if your wife did or didn't, but it seems unlikely to me that if she had feelings for this person that she would just up and end it in one day.

[WhatASituation]

I think, if someone really wants to contact someone, they'll find a way. I don't know if your wife did or didn't, but it seems unlikely to me that if she had feelings for this person that she would just up and end it in one day.

 

Agreed Angie! I only saw one of the texts and it was from him asking her, "How's sweetie". An old high school friend? Who does this?

 

Funny thing is, I really don't even care if she's having an EA with someone. She called just this morning to see of we can go to counseling and honestly I don't even want to. I guess I am just done.

[loveunlimited]

yeah i know, there comes a point where you just don't care any more, you feel numb, exhausted by the whole thing, sick and tired and 'for christ's sake let's just get it over with'. If you've reached that stage, consider the effort required by both sides to get back on track. Is it worth it? do you want to? Are her motives right? Where will it get you? Sod it, I'd just file if I were you and call it quits. no point flogging it if it's ready for burial.

[WhatASituation]

yeah i know, there comes a point where you just don't care any more, you feel numb, exhausted by the whole thing, sick and tired and 'for christ's sake let's just get it over with'. If you've reached that stage, consider the effort required by both sides to get back on track. Is it worth it? do you want to? Are her motives right? Where will it get you? Sod it, I'd just file if I were you and call it quits. no point flogging it if it's ready for burial.

 

Yes and I do not want to get to the point where I resent her. I don't hate her, she's a great mom, and a good person. Maybe we were just a mismatch from day one and I tried to fit a square peg into a round hole all these years.

 

My first responsibility is to the kids, I need to make sure they will be taken care of financially. I will ALWAYS be there for them, that much I can guarantee them. See, their mom is not a good money manager and it scares the heck out of me thinking she's managing her own finances while we take care of the kids.

 

It's just a bad situation.

[angie2443]

Agreed Angie! I only saw one of the texts and it was from him asking her, "How's sweetie". An old high school friend? Who does this?

 

Funny thing is, I really don't even care if she's having an EA with someone. She called just this morning to see of we can go to counseling and honestly I don't even want to. I guess I am just done.

 

 

If you truely are done, then I think that is a much better place to be than bieng confused or trying to make something work that can't. I would also protect myself, though. You might feel done, but if you do find out something was going on, it might bring on a new set of pain (I'm speaking from experience here). Just take care of yourself, and if other stuff comes up, there are many here who have been through simular experiences and who can offer help:)

[WhatASituation]

And you know what else is so funny about this? Society will look at me with disgust and say, "You promised to love her until the day you die. How dare you just leave?" Well, how do you force yourself to love someone? When it's years and years of trying and trying, how can any human love another when that person doesn't seem to be returning that love?

[Got it]

And you know what else is so funny about this? Society will look at me with disgust and say, "You promised to love her until the day you die. How dare you just leave?" Well, how do you force yourself to love someone? When it's years and years of trying and trying, how can any human love another when that person doesn't seem to be returning that love?

 

Who is going to think that!?! And if some busybody does, who cares! You know what you have invested into your marriage, you know the pains you have taken, and you know that any decisions has been well thought out and considered all angles. What matters is what you feel in your gut. If you feel you have done everything you can and the line has now been crossed/ that you are done. Then you are done.

 

That is how it was with my ex. I remember the last year, there were a few events leading up to it and I remember being out walking the dogs and realizing I was done. Done done. And there was no going back. I just didn't have the energy to continue to be pulled under the water again. I couldn't be the only one investing.

 

And I agree, I didn't want to get to a point where I resented him. It doesn't have to be like that. I recommend IC for you to work through the pains of divorcing, mourning the end of the marriage, helping the kids adjust, etc. You guys might end up with an amicable divorce and a good coparenting relationship. Imagine that!?!

[WhatASituation]

You guys might end up with an amicable divorce and a good coparenting relationship. Imagine that!?!

 

That's something I really would love to have happen, and that we might even end up great friends too. But she can be extremely emotional and I really don't know how she is going to react to me saying I am just done. That's the part that really concerns me.

[Got it]

It sounds like from what you have stated she is saying she is fine with ending it as well? Or am I confused there?

 

I was so ready to be done but was scared of saying that statement, I was finally able to blurt it out to my ex and the world didn't come crashing down. He didn't fall apart. And he handled the divorce much better than I feared.

 

The only advice I can give it to just bite the bullet on it and see where the chips fall.

 

I did have MC set up as well to help with the ending of the marriage and how we were handling it. It helped give a softer place to land when we were wrapping things up. I know the MC also continued to work with those who have kids to help them coparent together.

[WhatASituation]

It sounds like from what you have stated she is saying she is fine with ending it as well? Or am I confused there?

 

No you are not confused. She has indicated in the past that if I wanted to divorce her she would agree to an amicable, mediated approach to a divorce rather than dragging this all through the court system. BUT, she also said this in a very emotional state. I know women are typically more "passionate" about things, but I wish I could show you how crazy she gets. I can't take that anymore and do almost anything to avoid it. She doesn't get physical, but it's like dealing with someone coming off drugs (only way I can describe it).

 

Here's how I know I am done. As I mentioned earlier, she received a series of texts from someone she knew back in high school. There wasn't one ounce of jealousy, not one! I was almost "relieved"!

 

I only want happiness for her. She says she wants to go see a counselor and wants to work on the marriage. I just don't. I feel like asking her, "Where the h*ll have you been?!". I've been trying to work on this for years but there is so much damage here, it's beyond repair.

 

When you can say, with no emotion, no fear, no remorse that you are done. I think you just are.

[mem11363]

What,

If you wish to improve yourself, so that your next relationship is not a train wreck like this one, the best way to do that is to give your current marriage a well defined time period for recovery.

 

This is a suggestion from a well meaning stranger, take it for what it is worth.

 

If your wife wishes to go to MC, you absolutely should. Without ANY further discussion I would tell her: I agree we should attend MC together and to see if we can fix our marriage. If possible, please schedule the appointment for x or y or z times. If not, I will find a way to make it work.

 

Thats it. Not another word about it. If she doesn't make the appointment during the next two weeks you should find a MC, get some possible dates/times from them and then ask your wife which is best for her. If she does not attend, do a 180 at home to deliver the message that you are not going to tolerate a marriage where you pretend everything is ok.

 

If she does attend MC, then you need to go into the first session prepared to listen mostly and not talk too much. Except for one thing, I think you need to give each other some homework. You each need to write down the main things you think that YOU have done to get the marriage to almost dead. And then you will read the list to each other and ask what you left out, add it and APOLOGIZE to each other. The basis for that is simple. If you lack the respect for each other to apologize for harming each other, MC is a waste of breath.

 

Apologies: I am not going to call this “conflict” management. Because there are folks who excel at “jumping over” their own bad behavior. Literally they pretend like nothing happened, and they often get away with it. This is a big aspect of a relationship, maybe even be THE biggest one. We all make mistakes, treat each other unfairly, etc. The list below goes from your basic perfect world, slowly down the steps to Hell. For the purpose of this discussion, let’s pick a case where a few things are true. (1) Your partner has very clearly treated you badly. (2) There is no way they would tolerate you doing to them, what they just did to you. (3) You are no longer “in the moment”, and in fact have some quality time in which the event can/should be addressed.

 

I call this section “apologies” only because that is actually the standard way in which 21st century people think about redress. The irony is that a “spoken” apology might mean a lot, and it might mean almost nothing. You cannot tell the first time around. You can however tell if someone keeps doing the same “unkind” thing to you and then sincerely apologizing. Those apologies are hollow.

 

1. GOLD STANDARD: THEY bring it up shortly after it happens. They don’t wait to see if you will let it go. THEY believe you deserve better than that. They apologize, commit to behaving better next time, and do something nice for you to show their contrition is sincere.

2. When you bring it up they apologize, commit to fixing it and perform some acts of contrition.

3. They don’t apologize but they DO commit to not repeating the behavior. If sincere, this is actually WAY more important than an apology.

4. They sincerely apologize but avoid committing to change. Beware the “empty” apology that means nothing. This step is however a positive step. By the second or third empty apology you simply begin insisting on a commitment to improve.

5. They flat out refuse to commit to handling that type situation differently/better in the future

6. They give you the non-apology. Some variation of “I am sorry if that hurt your feelings”. The implication is that you are too sensitive.

7. They go into “lawyer” mode and explain that while normally this behavior is frowned on, in this specific case it was justified by “insert long, self serving rationalization”.

8. They directly blame you. If only you hadn’t forgotten to take about the trash on Memorial day 3 years ago, they wouldn’t still be angry and would never have done this.

9. They deny the whole thing. Look you in the eye and deny that it ever happened.

10. They deny the whole thing and attack you for even SUGGESTING they might do something like that.

11. They deny, attack you for suggesting it and then blow it up into “I am not even talking to you until you apologize” for even saying such a thing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Agreed Angie! I only saw one of the texts and it was from him asking her, "How's sweetie". An old high school friend? Who does this?

 

Funny thing is, I really don't even care if she's having an EA with someone. She called just this morning to see of we can go to counseling and honestly I don't even want to. I guess I am just done.