Girlfriend picks on 'faults' too often.

[jasin005]

Yeah, I did talk to her about that and all what she said was

'That's the way i am and If you're not accepting me like that then there is the door open"

The thing is that she warned me at 1st in the beginning of our relationship

she said that she can get angry and moody and said that she is a strong head and can be hard to please and said ' are you sure you can handle me?" that was like a warning from her at the beginning of our relationship.

 

But once I bring this out and try to talk to her about that, the fact that she gets angry easily and make big issues out of nothing, she says " That's the way I am don't try to change me cause i DON't like it if someone is trying to change me then she starts all over and says that what I said made her sad and how it affected her mood and ruined her day...........almost like the Op's girlfriend reaction.

[Butlerist]

I can tell her about reducing the control. But then, there's the whole insecurity issue of always being the centre of attention and needing to be made a priority. All I know is that throughout the entire relationship, on almost every single trip I made or she made to come over, it would be full of so much love and fun and then tainted by either an argument or nit picking.

 

Have any of you known people that sought help for controlling/bossy behaviour and made a change for the better?

Edited October 3, 2012 by Butlerist

[TMichaels]

butlerist/jasin005,

 

My guess what is going on with both of your girlfriends has to do with them both having abandonment issues which may well be rooted in the fact both of their parents divorced when they were very young.

 

They have a need to be in control because in their minds it "protects" them from getting hurt again. It also gives them a sense of power -- important because they felt so powerless in the past when those they trusted implicitly "abandoned" them.

 

I'm also guessing that even though both may have on occasion been "emotional" with you, for the most part they tend of guard their real feelings and don't let many others get too close. Allowing "others in" makes them uncomfortable and in fact signals danger to them. When they let their guard down and it becomes too uncomfortable, they react by "pulling back" to try to regain control of both themselves and the relationship.

 

There also may be some element of "behaving badly" is a "test" of sorts. IOW, underneath their tough exteriors, your g/fs actually think/feel they are not worthy of being loved and/or they are certain like others they trusted in the past you will abandon them as well.

 

To test your devotion, they act and treat you badly, thinking that on one hand if you stick it out with them *perhaps* you do really love them and they are worthy of your love. However on the other, if you bolt after repeated abuse, they find comfort in the fact that "they were right."

 

It's a destructive, self-fulfilling/-perpetuating prophecy that also enables them to once again make them feel that they're in control.

 

The problem with all this, is it doesn't matter how much you tell them and try to show them that you're in it for the long haul and won't kick them to the curb, it will never be enough.

 

They will continue to treat you badly, and in fact, if you do pull back or express how their behavior is hurting you or your relationship, the last thing they'll do is admit it's their fault or take steps to change their behavior as they don't know how.

 

There's a "void" inside them that *you* cannot fill. There's also a deep-seated anger brought on by the fact they felt abandoned as a child which is also why when they allow someone to get close (like you) they strike out in anger *at you* as you "become the enemy" or represent "danger" since letting down their guard makes them vulnerable and less in control. It's a classic fight or flight response.

 

So what should you do? Sadly, there's not a whole lot you can do. And, it's not your fault.

 

Unfortunately, many people like your g/fs *need* to maintain control so strongly that the last thing they will ever do is consider they need to let go of the past (consciously and sub-consciously) -- it's the "protective mantle" they've wrapped themselves in and it becomes "who they are" -- so like it or leave it.

 

They need to recognize their behavior is self-destructive and sabotaging their ability to have a happy and healthy adult relationship and they need to get to a point where they *want* help as in seeing a qualified professional to help them sort through things.

 

Kudos to both of you for trying to hang in there. I'm sure both of your g/fs do have good qualities and aren't really half the witches they appear to be -- but they can't help acting the way they do -- unless they face up to what's driving their behavior and *get help* to overcome it.

 

You can't fix them, and as hard as it may be to walk away, think of it this way: By sticking in there, not only will you continue to be treated with far less respect and consideration than you deserve, you're also enabling them to continue their self-destructive ways.

 

It's up to you, of course, to decide how you want to proceed, but from what you described regarding their behavior and treatment of you both, I don't see things getting a whole lot better unless either comes to the realization that *they do have issues* and they need to address them.

 

Sorry I can't be more encouraging, but hope the above helps.

 

Best,

TMichaels

[Butlerist]

TMichaels. That input was absolutely incredible. Your insight is incredibly helpful.

 

My girlfriend acknowledges that she does need to seek a therapist in order to learn how to control her anger. She did say that regarding my eating manner, she said she's learned to reduce that and make more of an effort when she says that. So yes, there's occasionally acceptance. However, when I mentioned about all of those arguments, she was like 'what are you talking about? we didn't argue that much'. We may not have argued all of the time. But in a 7 month period, she's shouted 7-8 times in real anger and spoken with such dis-respect and in the middle there have been moments of controlling behaviour and that I should put her first; i.e. 'if you loved me, you would to Germany to be with me'.

 

She told me that her ex used to tell her 'you're treating me like a child'. I said the same thing to her and she responded with 'oh my god...i'm sorry...I need to improve on this'. But then that was the eating with my fork; next time it was the way I said bye or hello or didn't show her passion. Last night when I spoke to her about it all, she said 'i've been so happy in our relationship'.

Edited October 3, 2012 by Butlerist

[HeavenOrHell]

Like I've said a couple of times she needs to put the effort in to get help, or it's just going to get worse.

She needs to see a therapist asap and not just talk about seeing one.

She may have been happy, but you haven't. Sounds like she said she's been happy as a way to make you feel guilty, maybe, so if you walk away you'll be making her unhappy, whereas in actual fact she's not making you happy and her behaviour is causing you to walk away, so she's causing her own unhappiness, but you'll get the blame for it.

It's good you spoke to her about it, what was the outcome?

 

 

TMichaels. That input was absolutely incredible. Your insight is incredibly helpful.

 

My girlfriend acknowledges that she does need to seek a therapist in order to learn how to control her anger. She did say that regarding my eating manner, she said she's learned to reduce that and make more of an effort when she says that. So yes, there's occasionally acceptance. However, when I mentioned about all of those arguments, she was like 'what are you talking about? we didn't argue that much'. We may not have argued all of the time. But in a 7 month period, she's shouted 7-8 times in real anger and spoken with such dis-respect and in the middle there have been moments of controlling behaviour and that I should put her first; i.e. 'if you loved me, you would to Germany to be with me'.

 

She told me that her ex used to tell her 'you're treating me like a child'. I said the same thing to her and she responded with 'oh my god...i'm sorry...I need to improve on this'. But then that was the eating with my fork; next time it was the way I said bye or hello or didn't show her passion. Last night when I spoke to her about it all, she said 'i've been so happy in our relationship'.

[jasin005]

butlerist/jasin005,

 

My guess what is going on with both of your girlfriends has to do with them both having abandonment issues which may well be rooted in the fact both of their parents divorced when they were very young.

 

They have a need to be in control because in their minds it "protects" them from getting hurt again. It also gives them a sense of power -- important because they felt so powerless in the past when those they trusted implicitly "abandoned" them.

 

I'm also guessing that even though both may have on occasion been "emotional" with you, for the most part they tend of guard their real feelings and don't let many others get too close. Allowing "others in" makes them uncomfortable and in fact signals danger to them. When they let their guard down and it becomes too uncomfortable, they react by "pulling back" to try to regain control of both themselves and the relationship.

 

There also may be some element of "behaving badly" is a "test" of sorts. IOW, underneath their tough exteriors, your g/fs actually think/feel they are not worthy of being loved and/or they are certain like others they trusted in the past you will abandon them as well.

 

To test your devotion, they act and treat you badly, thinking that on one hand if you stick it out with them *perhaps* you do really love them and they are worthy of your love. However on the other, if you bolt after repeated abuse, they find comfort in the fact that "they were right."

 

It's a destructive, self-fulfilling/-perpetuating prophecy that also enables them to once again make them feel that they're in control.

 

The problem with all this, is it doesn't matter how much you tell them and try to show them that you're in it for the long haul and won't kick them to the curb, it will never be enough.

 

They will continue to treat you badly, and in fact, if you do pull back or express how their behavior is hurting you or your relationship, the last thing they'll do is admit it's their fault or take steps to change their behavior as they don't know how.

 

There's a "void" inside them that *you* cannot fill. There's also a deep-seated anger brought on by the fact they felt abandoned as a child which is also why when they allow someone to get close (like you) they strike out in anger *at you* as you "become the enemy" or represent "danger" since letting down their guard makes them vulnerable and less in control. It's a classic fight or flight response.

 

So what should you do? Sadly, there's not a whole lot you can do. And, it's not your fault.

 

Unfortunately, many people like your g/fs *need* to maintain control so strongly that the last thing they will ever do is consider they need to let go of the past (consciously and sub-consciously) -- it's the "protective mantle" they've wrapped themselves in and it becomes "who they are" -- so like it or leave it.

 

They need to recognize their behavior is self-destructive and sabotaging their ability to have a happy and healthy adult relationship and they need to get to a point where they *want* help as in seeing a qualified professional to help them sort through things.

 

Kudos to both of you for trying to hang in there. I'm sure both of your g/fs do have good qualities and aren't really half the witches they appear to be -- but they can't help acting the way they do -- unless they face up to what's driving their behavior and *get help* to overcome it.

 

You can't fix them, and as hard as it may be to walk away, think of it this way: By sticking in there, not only will you continue to be treated with far less respect and consideration than you deserve, you're also enabling them to continue their self-destructive ways.

 

It's up to you, of course, to decide how you want to proceed, but from what you described regarding their behavior and treatment of you both, I don't see things getting a whole lot better unless either comes to the realization that *they do have issues* and they need to address them.

 

Sorry I can't be more encouraging, but hope the above helps.

 

Best,

TMichaels

 

 

Yeah, Thanks for the Analysis TMichaels, I think that You're definitely right!

Anyways, I have one simple question for you.

 

Although my girlfriend has thins kind of issues, I really love her and I want to spend the rest of my life with her. I can cope with her bad personality side simply cause I love her and I can be passion enough.

BUT the only thing that I want to know IS If I proposed to her, Do you think that she'll probably deny because of her "abandonment issues when was a child" ?

Once I Bring out the Mariage thing......Shhe says, Let's "take it a day at a time" " we have all the time in the world" ...etc

She said "I think that Marriage is very sacred" once we were in bed and she said " Well, At some point I think I CAN have a good life with you( or something like that)"

[MilitantPacifist]

This is a woman you're talking about, right?

 

Women love to pick at your "faults," real or otherwise.

 

She loves to believe that she can "change you" that with just the right "push" i.e. nagging, that you'll transform somehow into the perfect person.

 

It's absolutely delusional and stupid in my opinion.

 

But, bear in mind it doesn't mean she doesn't care or love you. In fact, it's a sign of commitment. Women don't bother trying to change people they aren't latched on to like a barnacle.

[HeavenOrHell]

She doesn't want to change him, that's not the issue, her insecurity is the issue, and trying to control him to a certain extent, also testing him to see how far she can push him.

 

It's not normal behaviour to pick at 'faults', it's not something I do as a woman, generalisations like this are patronising and incorrect.

 

 

This is a woman you're talking about, right?

 

Women love to pick at your "faults," real or otherwise.

 

She loves to believe that she can "change you" that with just the right "push" i.e. nagging, that you'll transform somehow into the perfect person.

 

It's absolutely delusional and stupid in my opinion.

 

But, bear in mind it doesn't mean she doesn't care or love you. In fact, it's a sign of commitment. Women don't bother trying to change people they aren't latched on to like a barnacle.

[MilitantPacifist]

It's not normal behaviour to pick at 'faults', it's not something I do as a woman, generalisations like this are patronising and incorrect.

 

In my experience it's true, but you are correct, I shouldn't make generalizations. Let's just say "most" women like to try to improve their mate, not realizing it isn't possible.

[TMichaels]

BUT the only thing that I want to know IS If I proposed to her, Do you think that she'll probably deny because of her "abandonment issues when was a child" ?

 

Once I Bring out the Mariage thing......Shhe says, Let's "take it a day at a time" " we have all the time in the world" ...etc

She said "I think that Marriage is very sacred" once we were in bed and she said " Well, At some point I think I CAN have a good life with you( or something like that)"

 

I don't remember you saying how old the two of you are now, but if you're both still young (25 yrs-old or less) she may well be right when she says: "Let's take it a day at a time and we have all the time in the world."

 

Seriously. What's the rush?

 

All that aside, I stand by what I told you before which is: " I don't see things getting a whole lot better unless she comes to the realization that *she does have issues* and she needs to address them."

 

If you were in the same location, going to couples counseling would probably help a lot -- as it would help both you understand the impact of each others' behavior and help you learn the tools and behavior to help you deal with your relationship challenges.

 

But, you're in a LDR so that is virtually (no pun intended) impossible. Therefore, the burden is on your g/f's shoulders primarily to get herself sorted out.

 

You might try "nudging" her toward recognizing what impact her insensitive responses or behaviors has on you and your relationship by using what's often referred to as "I Messages." Google it to learn more, but it goes something like this...

 

 

1. I feel... (Insert feeling word)
   
2. when... (tell what caused the feeling).
   
3. I would like... (tell what you want to happen instead)
   

And see whether or not how you respond has any impact.

 

If it doesn't, you really need to ask yourself whether you want to spend any more time (including your entire life if you two were to marry), putting up with her behavior and "issues."

 

As I told you before, *you* CAN'T "fix" her. She needs recognize how self-defeating and -destructive her way of relating to others is, want to change and get the help she needs in order to stop.

 

Best,

TMichaels

[TMichaels]

My girlfriend acknowledges that she does need to seek a therapist in order to learn how to control her anger.

 

That actually is good news. Usually, the biggest obstacle to overcoming self-destructive behavior is coming to the realization that one has a problem. The fact that she acknowledges she does "have issues" is a good thing and a critical first step.

 

She did say that regarding my eating manner, she said she's learned to reduce that and make more of an effort when she says that. So yes, there's occasionally acceptance. However, when I mentioned about all of those arguments, she was like 'what are you talking about? we didn't argue that much'. We may not have argued all of the time. But in a 7 month period, she's shouted 7-8 times in real anger and spoken with such dis-respect and in the middle there have been moments of controlling behaviour and that I should put her first; i.e. 'if you loved me, you would to Germany to be with me'.

 

I don't believe she's lying when she says she wasn't aware what impact her behavior and/or treatment of you was having on your feelings or relationship. She's just oblivious.

 

Think about it. The basis for empathy or sensitivity is the ability to put yourself in another's shoes which in turn frames your response.

 

If you've spent your life keeping your feelings and emotions under control to ensure you won't get hurt, disappointed or cast aside once again, how easy would it be for you to be aware of others' feelings when you aren't even in touch with your own?

 

She told me that her ex used to tell her 'you're treating me like a child'. I said the same thing to her and she responded with 'oh my god...i'm sorry...I need to improve on this'. But then that was the eating with my fork; next time it was the way I said bye or hello or didn't show her passion. Last night when I spoke to her about it all, she said 'i've been so happy in our relationship'.

 

Again, from what you've written I don't think things are as dire as they could be.

 

Reason being, I do think she truly does value you and your relationship AND she *is* aware (at least a little bit) that her treatment of you is having negative impact on your relationship which she isn't totally pleased with herself about.

 

Perhaps that realization will be enough to get her to do something about getting her anger issues under control (with or without professional help).

 

You also might want to try "gently" letting her know when her behavior is out of bounds by using the "I Message" technique I mentioned in my other post to jasin005.

 

It certainly won't hurt as it's a more effective way to deal with interpersonal communication issues than assigning blame, playing the martyr, or avoiding confrontation and getting nowhere. It might just be "the nudge" that helps you both get on a better and more healthy path.

 

Good luck.

 

Best,

TMichaels

[Butlerist]

I broke it off last night with her, as I felt there were too many fundamental faults. I'm devastated and heartbroken.

 

She's calling and telling me that she wants us to work through our issues and to not leave her.

 

I just feel as though throughout my time with her, for a period of 4months I always felt drained. I didn't have energy as I spent my time in thought a lot or when things were not calm I'd be calming it down. Then next day everything was fine. But it felt damaging to my soul.

 

She's right in saying 'how can you go from being ok to not suddenly', but I've just felt so drained and I look out in to the future and wonder about those issues and how they will arise later.

 

 

What you all don't know is that 10years ago, we dated for just 2months. She left me to go back to her ex and during that period of time, a lot of things were unforgiveably dark and harsh. 5 years later, she wrote emails to me apologising for her behaviour. Two years ago, we met once in Germany and she in front of my face said to me how sorry she was. Then this year, we began a relationship. She said she'd changed a lot since back then. Yes, she had. But then I saw almost all of those traits come back and it suddenly shocked me. This time, it's been 7months in the relationship and she feels as though I didn't give her a chance to correct herself. But then, I've been drained and from colleagues to my personal trainers have all said 'you just don't seem yourself anymore...your kick in your step has left you'.

But now she's in pieces and me too, she wants to salvage this and says she'll do anything necessary. I just don't know how much it will change, especially from a distance. It kills me.