At what cost, to be together?

[cerridwen]

yeah. I know it will.

Thanks.

 

 

(i'll just be over there in the corner, sh#ting my pants. )

 

I think it's fantastic that you're both able to have a thoughtful, mature discussion about things.

Even if you are pooping your pants right now.

 

There's a tiny thing that concerns me: your researching opportunities for him.

I worry it's premature and might make it more disappointing if he says "no" to moving.

Through the process of researching and networking, I worry you may be getting your hopes up--Without even realizing it.

 

It's something I've done so maybe it's all projection.

Just a thought.

 

Keep updating!

This is an exciting thread!

[Million.to.1]

There's a tiny thing that concerns me: your researching opportunities for him.

I worry it's premature and might make it more disappointing if he says "no" to moving.

Through the process of researching and networking, I worry you may be getting your hopes up--Without even realizing it.

 

It's something I've done so maybe it's all projection.

Just a thought.

 

Maybe you're right. I just want to relieve a few of his biggest concerns by showing what is available and letting him even have a chat with someone who knows and can share some real insight for him.

I want him to make an informed decision and do what's right for him.

 

It's a pretty big thing to do and I just want him to know I'll be as supportive as i can.

 

My hopes aren't up (..well, not too much) ... I'm being more rational about this than i've ever been about relationships. I know that if he says no, it's not a reflection or rejection of me. And after 2 years of playing with the idea every few months, it will be good to put it to bed once and for all if it's just in the too hard basket.

 

I really appreciate your feedback, Cerridwen & everyone. I'm not talking to my friends and family about it unless it's actually going to happen as that would really start getting my hopes up, so it's good to share my feelings here and talk it through.

Thank-again.

[Ninjainpajamas]

My gut tells me this doesn't have the right natural flow to it to look very promising Million...unfortunately the time it would have happened or the idea would have come up realistically a long time ago.

 

I sympathize with your emotions and effort to turn this into something long-term, however he doesn't really sound like the most practical or emotional prospect.

 

I hope you get the answers you are looking for however, I think you are communicating and handling it the proper way...I don't know the depths of your relationship and conversation but maybe his feelings are stronger than it appears to be.

 

I just want you to make the right decision for yourself, I don't want to see you out of your already struggling situation who was just caught up in a moment with on vacation and never really expected it to materialize into something real or life changing.

 

I've seen it work before and I actually have had an international LDR myself...so I'm definitely not part of the crowd just trying to wrap his mind around it, I know what's it's all about.

 

Good luck, I hope It works out...just lay it all on the table though, say everything you want to say and express how you feel, don't leave anything not said or revealed so you can say you expressed yourself completely.

[justwhoiam]

It's pretty hard to explain unless you are in the industry.

No need to explain, really. See it this way: you value your job more than a potential family with someone you say you're in love with. Either that, or you're probably questioning if you really love him.

 

That said, I'd never put the two things on the same level. That's you. Who you are, your personality, your approach to life and your values.

 

If you had told me: I know I couldn't do what I love doing and I would die inside like that, I would be with you. But acting, if it's done for passion, you can always do it. I have a friend who's in a company and she had a part-time job on the side as a secretary for a while. But before that, there were months she didn't even need another job, acting twice a week. She would get 400€ per show (which meant around NZD5,200 a month).

I also knew a guy who worked as a nurse but still acted and by the time he retired he had his own company with shows all over the place.

 

So it's not about quitting doing what one likes, as you can see.

 

Think about what you really want in life. I guess you have more instinct to emerge and have a name more than passion for what you do.

 

Good luck.

[Els]

So bit of an update...

 

We discussed it in length on skype yesterday. I explained the difficulties i would face at this time going there and why it wouldn't be possible.

 

We looked into how it could work for him coming here and agreed that the practicalities were alot easier that way around. He is eligible for a 1 year working holiday visa untill he is 35. (he's 33 now)

I would largely contribute to his airfare (which would be return) to help with the burden on him of an extended move from home.

 

We clarified alot of things which needed to be talked about and are now on the same page. He understands that i will consider going the other way (to canada) for a time or whatever if things work out between us and we want to look at more permanent arrangements.

 

He is really thinking about it seriously now, and I'm going to leave him to think it through.

In the meantime... I'm doing some research and networking in the music scene here to see what his options are should he decide to come.

 

I'm scared.

 

I think it's great that the two of you are considering this option, and I wish you both the best of luck.

 

That being said, I personally think that the two of you need to consider the distasteful possibility of him not being able to find work for a significant period of time and discuss what you would do in such a scenario. Are you able to support him should the need be, or would he need to return home if he can't find work for a month, or more?

 

I ask this because, having been experienced in the WHV myself, it is really, really not easy to find work on such a visa. The majority of employers for good, permanent jobs that lead to a career will absolutely not want him because they will need to sponsor him for a future work visa if they take him, and you have to jump through so many hoops to be able to do that, including proving to INZ that no Kiwi is able to do that job, that most don't even bother. Most WHV people, unless they are very skilled and experienced in a particular field that is in great demand, end up working in farms and factories as seasonal workers, or as minimal-wage labourers such as cleaners, waiters, etc. Granted, if you have contacts in his job field it might be easier for him to get a job than the average WHVer.

 

I don't want to rain on your parade, truly, but this is an eventuality that you need to prepare for. He will not be treated the same as you are in the job market. What will you both do if the choice is between him working on a farm 50 miles away or not getting a job at all? Can you and will you support him in that case?

[justwhoiam]

P.S. Over time, I realized I'm a giver, and I can only be with a giver. I would move, but if I knew beforehand that he wouldn't move for any reason in the world, that couldn't work between us. You are in that situation it seems. Giver+giver is great; giver+taker is unbalanced; taker+taker just cannot work (unless it's an open relationship? or both don't give a ... much about anything)

[almadee]

yes, definitely, of course. if there is a chance and you both honestly feel like you would regret it for the rest of your lives if you didn't give it a go, then yes.

 

just make sure you feel really solid about this guy at the moment and won't resent paying for his flight even if things don't work out.

 

good luck!

[Million.to.1]

Hello again everyone.

 

I thought I'd come give an update on what's been happening.

 

So it's been a while since I suggested the move and we have been going around in circles ever since.

There is alot to consider and we discuss everything. Which is really good. We are both honest about our feelings, fears, hopes and all the bureaucratic stuff that we would have to deal with to make it possible. Many of the concerns you have all bought up in posts have been discussed by us both at length and usually positive conclusions come out at the end.

 

We have looked into Visas and how it would work if he came and then wanted to stay on more permantly... and it's possible to get a partner sponsored visa (as a de-facto couple) once he has been here 1 year on a WHV. (if we live together and can prove it's "seroius" bla bla bla... )

We have options with that and as another commonwealth country, advice has been we shouldn't have too many problems with the process of applications.

 

He has been discussing the move and me with his friends, and his brothers, but not his parents yet. He doesn't want to freak them out. (fair)

I asked him if it was time to discuss it with my mum as I live with my parents at the moment while my new business gets up and running. (they have the space and without going into details, living with them is the only way i can financially get my business off the ground and they are very supportive of that for me which is great) He said that yes, i probably should talk to them before anything is 100% decided. So i have done, and they are very supportive though think we should get our own place - which of course we would be doing anyway once he's here. Duh mum and Dad!

 

 

Anyway... it's looking pretty positive and I am finding all the ways I can to make sure it goes well if it goes ahead. It means some pretty big changes for me, but i'm more than happy to make those. It means alot more changes for him which is why he's weighing up EVERY possibility, and i guess all i can do is be patient, understand what a massive decision this is for him and try to relieve any fears he brings up with tangible solutions.

When you really want something to happen and you have to find a way, it's amazing what options and opportunities become available.

 

So, at this stage it's looking like a YES.... but it will still probably be a couple of weeks off being definite. (feels like a million years already!)

 

I'm quite possibly the most preoccupied distracted woman on the planet at the moment! It's crazy exciting scary!

Edited October 27, 2012 by Million.to.1

[Million.to.1]

No need to explain, really. See it this way: you value your job more than a potential family with someone you say you're in love with. Either that, or you're probably questioning if you really love him.

 

If you had told me: I know I couldn't do what I love doing and I would die inside like that, I would be with you. But acting, if it's done for passion, you can always do it.

Think about what you really want in life. I guess you have more instinct to emerge and have a name more than passion for what you do.

 

I actually really appreciate this... But i feel i should explain further. Acting is a passion. I love it, and i have been a professional since the age of 4. It has been full time and a good earner at different times in my life, but it's not consistent. When you love to do something, only getting to do it every now and then is disheartening. I'm 33 and i have to accept that it's a part-time career. I have no control over that. You can argue all you want, but I know the industry inside out. You are right, i could do it anywhere but only if i do theatre for no money and live on toast for the rest of my life, and have none of thousands of industry connections i have here, and i don't want that. I can not expect you to understand unless you yourself have had a career you are passionate about for nearly 30 years that you only get to a few times a year. The rest of the time you work in **** jobs that you hate that pay FA, just so you can be available to go to auditions that you get rejected from 8 out of 10 times. (which BTW is a pretty good success rate)

It has taken me till now (i'm 33) to combine my acting career, my chaperoning /dialogue coach work (working with child actors on set) a bit a casting here and there, and recently starting up my own business (which i have already invested $15,000 in start up costs) which incorporates my only other passion which is plants and art.

If this works out, (which it will) I will successfully achieve my dreams. I mean really.

 

Now, you are saying that i should give this all up to move to Toronto to work as a waitress for love? That's very romantic, but not practical. If he loves me, then he would see that he is in a much better position to move right now than I am. Our lives would be better here. He can do what he does there, here. I can't. It has nothing to do with me not valuing love.

 

 

So, I would die inside if i gave up my dreams and moved to toronto to be a waitress.

and you know what? If I did that, Pauls love for me would fade after a while, because i would no longer be the strong independent woman with crazy dreams and a succulent obsession that he met and fell in love with.

[Els]

Yay million!

 

Don't want to put the cart before the horse here, but if/when he comes over, make SURE that he is registered officially as living in your house, get formal proof of it, and make sure he gets as much official correspondence as he can get sent to that house. Bank statements, income statements, whatever. And take plenty of photos when you go out together (I know it sounds cheesy, but just do it). You will be glad that you did all that if/when a year passes and he wants to apply for the de-facto partner visa. Too many genuine couples being turned down because they didn't keep proof or didn't know they had to.

 

Luckily I am a lazy slob and didn't throw out my mail for over a year...

[Million.to.1]

Thanks Elswyth! I know! .. i hope it stays a YAY!... and yes.. we have been reading what is required for the partner visa, and jeeeeezzzz, I'm so glad I came across it early as now we know exactly what we would have to gather. I've joined the immigration forum also and started a thread explaining our story and already had lots of good feedback on the best way to proceed.

 

Are you a Kiwi too?

 

Haha.. yes, i am also sentimental as hell and have quite a bit of evidence of our contact over the last 2 years.. and our photos from vietnam & cambodia from when we met. Feels funny to have to gather evidence to prove love! but whatever it takes!!

 

You made a good point about the WHV thing and getting a job being harder. ... Something to keep in mind. I wonder if he could operate as a sole trader?

He does a bit of building so could contract out easily if allowed... hmmmmmm.

Edited October 27, 2012 by Million.to.1

[cerridwen]

Thanks Elswyth! I know! .. i hope it stays a YAY!... and yes.. we have been reading what is required for the partner visa, and jeeeeezzzz, I'm so glad I came across it early as now we know exactly what we would have to gather. I've joined the immigration forum also and started a thread explaining our story and already had lots of good feedback on the best way to proceed.

 

Are you a Kiwi too?

 

Haha.. yes, i am also sentimental as hell and have quite a bit of evidence of our contact over the last 2 years.. and our photos from vietnam & cambodia from when we met. Feels funny to have to gather evidence to prove love! but whatever it takes!!

 

You made a good point about the WHV thing and getting a job being harder. ... Something to keep in mind. I wonder if he could operate as a sole trader?

He does a bit of building so could contract out easily if allowed... hmmmmmm.

 

It's odd, isn't it?

When I learned of what's required, I cursed myself for not saving show stubs, boarding passes, receipts for packages sent.

And pictures together? We have a grand total of two.

Time to get snapping.

 

I am happy about one thing: Taking a page from a LSer's book, I saved the PMs from when we first started connecting on here.

Those could count.

Don't forget the power of LoveShack!

 

So happy for you!

Keep updating!

[Million.to.1]

You don't know how much the feedback and support means. It's so good. Loveshack has been good to me!

 

I just added a few of you to my contact list (cerriden, Elswyth) so you can see a private photo album i just posted on my profile of the two of us... if you are so inclined and like to put faces to usernames!

 

We are skyping again in a couple of hours. I woke up so early this morning out of excitement!

 

I hope this thread (and my life) has a happy ending one day!

[cerridwen]

You don't know how much the feedback and support means. It's so good. Loveshack has been good to me!

 

I just added a few of you to my contact list (cerriden, Elswyth) so you can see a private photo album i just posted on my profile of the two of us... if you are so inclined and like to put faces to usernames!

 

We are skyping again in a couple of hours. I woke up so early this morning out of excitement!

 

I hope this thread (and my life) has a happy ending one day!

 

I hope it's a wonderful journey.

It's entirely possible the ending will be a happy one, so I'll be wishing it for you.

 

Added you as a contact too.

Happy, happy.

[Els]

The two of you look absolutely gorgeous, and beautiful together.

 

Thanks Elswyth! I know! .. i hope it stays a YAY!... and yes.. we have been reading what is required for the partner visa, and jeeeeezzzz, I'm so glad I came across it early as now we know exactly what we would have to gather. I've joined the immigration forum also and started a thread explaining our story and already had lots of good feedback on the best way to proceed.

 

Are you a Kiwi too?

 

Oh, you're on the ENZ forums? I don't need to say anything more, then, cause the people there are way more knowledgable than I am.

 

I'm not a Kiwi, but I want to be one. I'm applying for Residence by Partnership through my Resident bf.

 

Haha.. yes, i am also sentimental as hell and have quite a bit of evidence of our contact over the last 2 years.. and our photos from vietnam & cambodia from when we met. Feels funny to have to gather evidence to prove love! but whatever it takes!!

 

It took me tens of hours to compile and organize all the 'evidence', and I will be putting in my application soon, fingers crossed... Yeah, it felt awkward. I heard the questions they ask in the interviews are Really Weird, too... here's to hoping I don't bungle them up.

 

You made a good point about the WHV thing and getting a job being harder. ... Something to keep in mind. I wonder if he could operate as a sole trader?

He does a bit of building so could contract out easily if allowed... hmmmmmm.

 

He can't start a business on a WHV, if I recall correctly. My guess, based on observation, is that you will most likely need to support him until he can get a proper work visa or the partnership visa, unless he is willing to do farm/factory/seasonal/cleaner work. However, you do not need to wait a year to apply for a partner visa - a few months will suffice, although he will get a shorter-term visa in that case. My advice would be WHV -> come here and start applying for partner visa after a few months -> take the shorter visa to live with you for a year and start working, after which he can apply for Residence if everything is going well.

[Million.to.1]

 

I'm not a Kiwi, but I want to be one. I'm applying for Residence by Partnership through my Resident bf.

 

That's awesome! Let me know how it goes! Are you here in NZ now? if so, where abouts? Are you working? Can i find a thread of yours with a bit a backstory to read?

 

 

I heard the questions they ask in the interviews are Really Weird, too... here's to hoping I don't bungle them up.

 

What do you mean by weird? personal weird?

 

We were just joking on skype about how huge sections of our Facebook or "whats app" chats would have to be blacked out or something as they can get a bit X-rated at times!

Must be awkward with the kind of personal conversations immigration officers may see.

 

As for being a sole trader.. I have a business (not that it off the ground yet) but I could always invoice on his behalf and give him the cash and just keep a bit to cover the tax I would have to pay..... Similar industry too so wouldn't raise any flags. We'll work it out.

I'm pretty sure he won't have to go and work on a farm... Not meaning to blow my own trumpet, but I'm reasonably well connected, and i'm sure i could find him some part time work on hospo or laboring/ landscaping etc just through friends. May not be full time, but thats ok...

[Els]

That's awesome! Let me know how it goes! Are you here in NZ now? if so, where abouts? Are you working? Can i find a thread of yours with a bit a backstory to read?

 

I've been in NZ for the past 2+ years now. And hmm, I haven't posted specifics about my R for a long time, and I usually shy away from identifiable stuff such as location, since NZ is so tiny . I did a search on the LDR forums for my own threads and the latest was April 2011 - here. Our circumstances are slightly different from yours, but I hope it helps.

 

What do you mean by weird? personal weird?

 

I heard that one of the questions a friend got in the interview was, "What color are you and your partner's toothbrushes??" Other than that, yeah, personal-weird. I think they might actually ask about sexual/intimacy habits and such too, not in too great detail obviously, but being in an 'exclusive sexual relationship' was mentioned somewhere IIRC. Really awkward to discuss that with an immigration officer, I'd think!

 

As for being a sole trader.. I have a business (not that it off the ground yet) but I could always invoice on his behalf and give him the cash and just keep a bit to cover the tax I would have to pay..... Similar industry too so wouldn't raise any flags. We'll work it out.

I'm pretty sure he won't have to go and work on a farm... Not meaning to blow my own trumpet, but I'm reasonably well connected, and i'm sure i could find him some part time work on hospo or laboring/ landscaping etc just through friends. May not be full time, but thats ok...

 

Hey, that's great. Wishing you both the best of luck, and keeping my fingers crossed for ya!

[CherryT]

 

I don't think I'd ask someone to do something this gigantic unless I'd do it myself. I know you have a business, but if you didn't, would you leave and move to New Zealand if he asked you? And really, be honest?

 

I agree with this. I'm in a LD relationship with a wonderful man... we're only a 3 hour only plane ride away, but we are from different Countries (US/Canada). Even though the flights are short, they can be expensive. So we do our best to see each other at least once a month. I have, in my head, acknowledged that he is something special and I don't know if I would find anyone who connects with me on that intellectual, emotional, and spiritual level again. With that being said, I would in a heart beat move to be with him. I love his city and I've met his close friends and family and could see myself being happy there. I haven't had the conversation with him just yet, because we're not that far into our relationship and we do have plans for the next 6 months. Each month that goes by, we plan for another month. Always making sure that we will see each other.

 

Although I know I would LOVE to drop everything I have here to be with him, I need some commitment from him too. I would never ask him to drop his family, friends, career, everything without me giving him something in return. I can see that there's a huge leap of faith you are asking your guy to give up for you and if it doesn't work out for the both of you, you are still in your hometown whereas he'll have to start back at square one. That's huge to ask of someone. Could you be in a LD relationship where he comes to visit and you visit (maybe not for long, but at least you get some face time?) and then when you are more sure to bring up the moving thing?

 

 

I just read your update! And I'm glad it's going in the right direction. Take your time And wish you both the best.

Edited October 29, 2012 by CherryT

[Million.to.1]

I agree with this.

Although I know I would LOVE to drop everything I have here to be with him, I need some commitment from him too. I would never ask him to drop his family, friends, career, everything without me giving him something in return. I can see that there's a huge leap of faith you are asking your guy to give up for you and if it doesn't work out for the both of you, you are still in your hometown whereas he'll have to start back at square one. That's huge to ask of someone. Could you be in a LD relationship where he comes to visit and you visit (maybe not for long, but at least you get some face time?) and then when you are more sure to bring up the moving thing?

 

 

Hi Cherry, and thanks, Yes i understand. I really would go to Canada. The answer me going there to live is a definite "yes i would consider it" I've never been there, so i really don't know, but Of course i would make sacrifices to be with him if it came down to it.

I don't know if you read the whole thread but I have explained my situation, and I can't work in Canada because i am too old to get a working holiday visa. I also have a business here.

I am open to the possibility of moving there one day if we both want that, but the practicalities of me going there right now are not in our favour, where as him coming here makes practical sense. Life in NZ is good.

[Million.to.1]

....

 

 

He said YES!

 

[VeveCakes]

Congrats on the start of your journey. I dated someone from the UK ( I'm in Ontario) and we could never sort ourselves out enough to make a move. I'm still sad about it to this day.

 

Just also wanted to let you know you can get a special visa to work in Canada in the entertainment industry. I worked in the industry for 5 years and it is VERY easy to meet people and get work here. The industry is booming.

 

Good luck with the upcoming changes!

[ana0pera]

congrats!!! I am so excited for you both and I hope it all goes well

[cerridwen]

....

 

 

He said YES!

 

 

Big congratulations, Million!!

From one wahine to another.

 

PS: you're an awesomely handsome couple.

I don't think I mentioned that before but after seeing your pics...y'all look fantastic together.

[Million.to.1]

Thanks Everyone!

 

I am very happy and very excited!

 

Vevecakes... I will PM you as I am very keen to understand more about this visa you mentioned.

The future might lead us back there.. who knows!

 

[allenpo123]

I think you both should sit down and really talk about the possibilities. Maybe try visiting each other a couple weeks first, just to try it out.

 

You mentioned he can't afford to pay to visit, there must be some way to save up right? If he can't make the effort to save up to pay the tickets, he would never leave his country to be with you.

 

Good luck!!