Girls Harsher Critics Of The Female Body?

[Anela]

These gender wars have admittedly left a bad taste in my mouth this week. I guess it's better than the first derail early on where the girl completely overlooked the thread topic and just blamed pick up artists and misogynists.

 

And you've reminded me of what I was thinking about earlier on: a PUA whose blog I came across a few years ago, who talked about sitting with a friend, in a bar or place where people hang out, and graded the girls/women as they walked by. Those with high scores didn't mind - they smiled, or had some sort of other positive response. The girls who didn't score so well, obviously had a negative response, but this guy didn't care. He just felt the need to tell those girls that they weren't attractive to look at, they weren't acceptable as far as young women went.

 

These guys sometimes work to pit women against each other - at least when they have "harems" - and then bitch about women and the drama they bring. Yeah, okay, whatever. They also work to bring a girls' self-esteem down a notch or three in the form of "negs". There are, unfortunately, PUA's out there trying to turn guys into a bunch of douchey lounge lizards, like a new version of the body snatchers. It's always nice to be reminded of the fact that not all of you are that way, just as not all of us women are out there insulting each other - instead, we're trying to support each other as best we can.

[ThaWholigan]

 

:love: Lucy Pinder, Michele Marsh, Gemma Atkinson, Keeley Hazell :love:

 

I'm just remembering all the white boys I knew going "PHWOOAARR" looking at them. I did like Gemma Atkinson though - Hollyoaks girls

 

They weren't my kinda mags though. If I was going to look at mags with half naked women in them, it was going to be King/Smooth . I still have the issue with Tatiana Ali from Fresh Prince . Even those mags, I only ever bought 4 of them.

[Oxy Moronovich]

I looked up Maxim's circulation on wikipedia. Maxim is sold is dozens of countries around the world. When you combine the population of countries that sell Maxim, the total is almost a billion. Yet Maxim sells less than 3 million copies a month.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxim_(magazine)

 

Yet Cosmopolitan, a woman's magazine that does a lot more than any male magazine in telling women how they she be sexy sells more than 3 million copies a month in the U.S. alone.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmopolitan_(magazine)

[Disenchantedly Yours]

MrCastle

The thread topic--the basis of this thread, the focus of this thread, the main point of this thread; was talking about how critical women are of other women's looks.

 

Are you asking or telling us this? Because I thought you were asking if women were harsher critics of the female body. To which a lot of women disagreed with you. They do not believe women are harsher judges of women's body. This is board is a good place to see why that's the case. With numerous threads that have racked up about talking about women's bodies and ages and how women are this four letter name or that four letter name, mostly threads started by men.

 

My concern is for women who feel the need to lose extreme amounts of weight in order to fit this mold--developing these severe eating disorders to fulfill an image that most men do not even find attractive. Looking sickly is not attractive. Being skinny is one thing, being scary skinny and crash dieting to look a certain way is another.

 

I think it suprise a lot of men how many celebrities that they think are "normal" actually engage in extreme dieting to look the way they do. But other than that, I don't really get why the conversation turned to about what you think the ideal female form is and how women need to conform to it.

 

Men are visual, but as even some women have said in here, women are usually worse when it comes to bringing a woman down about her looks.

 

And some women also said otherwise. However, it seems you want to ignore that in favor of what you utlimately believe.

[Oxy Moronovich]

It's always nice to be reminded of the fact that not all of you are that way, just as not all of us women are out there insulting each other - instead, we're trying to support each other as best we can.

Naw. If you were trying to support each other you'd alot of all-female groups and organizations. Plus, you wouldn't have so many women who only have guy friends.

[MrCastle]

Are you asking or telling us this? Because I thought you were asking if women were harsher critics of the female body. To which a lot of women disagreed with you. They do not believe women are harsher judges of women's body.

 

Don't just say things because they sound nice when you read them. Outside of you, V, and maybe one or two other women; the rest agreed with me. But that's neither here nor there.

[somedude81]

I'm just remembering all the white boys I knew going "PHWOOAARR" looking at them. I did like Gemma Atkinson though - Hollyoaks girls

 

They weren't my kinda mags though. If I was going to look at mags with half naked women in them, it was going to be King/Smooth . I still have the issue with Tatiana Ali from Fresh Prince . Even those mags, I only ever bought 4 of them.

I've never heard of the Hollyoaks girls but I'm glad I Googled them

 

Tatiana Ali, pretty girl but she needs more boobs.

 

GAsp! I just harshly criticized a woman

 

I best run and hide before something should hap

[MrCastle]

Don't just say things because they sound nice when you read them. Outside of you, V, and maybe one or two other women; the rest agreed with me. But that's neither here nor there.

 

Forgot to add, neither here nor there because some women may have an agenda, like the previously mentioned girl who went on a rant about puas.

[verhrzn]

Don't just say things because they sound nice when you read them. Outside of you, V, and maybe one or two other women; the rest agreed with me. But that's neither here nor there.

 

I don't think either men or women are harsher judges of women's bodies. I think they are equally harsh, in different ways and with different agendas.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Stop assuming you know what I like because you don't. I never said girls had to have super skinny waists in addition to a big ass or big boobs. Stop trying to have an argument that no one is having. You and V are debating against points that were never made by me or any other men in here. I get you and her are mad at the female body expectations in the media, but don't take it out on us, especially guys like me who are fighting for women to ignore said images and start eating. You've got the wrong guy. Stop derailing this thread.

 

I am not assuming anything about what you like. I am pointing out a popular theme in the media that is male centric in it's tastes. Skinny women with disproportionately large breasts and butts. The idea is women that are super skinny with "curves" in the right places. I don't think it's that pro-women when men say they like women with "curves". "Curves" has adopoted such a wide range of meaning but it implies women that have large breasts and butts.

 

I don't really get the impression that you are fighting for women either Mr.Castle. I actually think you seem to be wanting to blame women for everything while not standing up for women on the guy's side. You want to both blame women, criticize women, then talk about how it's okay when men judge women because men are visual. If you want to stand up for women how about talking to other men about the things men do to women that aren't right? Where is that thread?

 

I am also getting sick of hearing you tell other people they are "derailing" the thread for talking about the exact subject you brought up. Your unhappy because I, and V, don't agree that women are harsher on other women. I actually made a really good post pages back that went ignored. Talked about some personal experiences with men and boys growing up that you didn't have a peep to say about.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

For fun, I looked up the top ten on Maxim's list. Here are their BMIs where healthy and normal weight spans BMIs of 18.5 - 24.9:

 

1. 18.5
   
2. 19.6
   
3. 19.7
   
4. 18.2
   
5. 19
   
6. 18.6
   
7. 17.4
   
8. 18.4
   
9. 19.3
   
10. 18.1
    

 

40% of these women are underweight and none of them exceed 19.7 in BMI. So yeah, women judge other women more harshly than men do. Mmhmmm...what's wrong with this picture?

 

 

Apparently it's okay when men judge women because men are "visual". Oh but don't blame the guys. They don't do anything wrong. They are practically perfect in every way. Everything is women's fault.

[ThaWholigan]

I don't think either men or women are harsher judges of women's bodies. I think they are equally harsh, in different ways and with different agendas.

This is basically the point I made earlier. I'm not of the opinion that women are "harsher" in their criticism, but they can be just as venomous as any man in this regard.

[MrCastle]

I don't really get the impression that you are fighting for women either Mr.Castle. I actually think you seem to be wanting to blame women for everything while not standing up for women on the guy's side. You want to both blame women, criticize women, then talk about how it's okay when men judge women because men are visual. If you want to stand up for women how about talking to other men about the things men do to women that aren't right? Where is that thread?[/Quote]

 

Not totally concerned with what you think my feelings are or intentions are. I love women, respect them, and am genuinely disappointed in how they're expected to look. You can choose to believe me or don't, it won't affect me either way. When people; male or female, mess up, I call them on it. What I will not do, is come on here and kiss the feet of women just to get some brownie points. I'm not a chump. When I feel a woman messes up, I call her on it. You're not there with me on PUA forums when I'm bashing men for using women and bragging about it. Again, I understand your anger in regards to the media, in regards to bad experiences you may have had with men, but you've got the wrong guy. I'm not going to be a punching bag for your frustrations. Both you and V have exhausted your very similar talking points and the thread either needs to move on or get closed at this point.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

It is not our lack of acknowledgement that is the problem - I'm sure many men do acknowledge their part that they play. That part is just seen as the all pervading pivotal be-all-and-end-all part. Hence, no matter how much lip service is being paid, all I can see right now is "well it's men who want this and that so it's their fault", no matter how dressed up it looks.

 

How do men acknowledge the part they play and what do they do about it? Do they stop giving money, time and attention to those things?

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Don't just say things because they sound nice when you read them. Outside of you, V, and maybe one or two other women; the rest agreed with me. But that's neither here nor there.

 

Then this wasn't really something you wanted an exchange of different ideas on. You simply wanted to support your theory tha women are worse than men.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

I've never heard of the Hollyoaks girls but I'm glad I Googled them

 

Tatiana Ali, pretty girl but she needs more boobs.

 

GAsp! I just harshly criticized a woman

 

I best run and hide before something should hap

 

Funny enough Mr.Castle, in your thread about how women are harsher judges, you and somedude are the only ones that made actually disparging comments about specific women's bodies.

[ThaWholigan]

How do men acknowledge the part they play and what do they do about it? Do they stop giving money, time and attention to those things?

I don't know. What do you personally think is adequate?

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Not totally concerned with what you think my feelings are or intentions are. I love women, respect them, and am genuinely disappointed in how they're expected to look. You can choose to believe me or don't, it won't affect me either way. When people; male or female, mess up, I call them on it. What I will not do, is come on here and kiss the feet of women just to get some brownie points. I'm not a chump. When I feel a woman messes up, I call her on it. You're not there with me on PUA forums when I'm bashing men for using women and bragging about it. Again, I understand your anger in regards to the media, in regards to bad experiences you may have had with men, but you've got the wrong guy. I'm not going to be a punching bag for your frustrations. Both you and V have exhausted your very similar talking points and the thread either needs to move on or get closed at this point.

 

MrCastle, I think you have some control issues. You started a thread posing a question. You got a variation of respones. When people didn't agree with you on the premise of your original question, you told them they weren't on topic. Now that you've had your say, which is apparently men are angels when it comes to women's bodies but women are terrible, now you want the thread closed.

 

I am not taking my anger out on you. I'm no even "angry". You are simply belittling my opinion because you can't think of anything to say to it. Neither do you want to acknowledge the ways men harshly debase women with amazing regularity.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

I don't know. What do you personally think is adequate?

 

I thought you knew since you made the point. I don't know myself. I'm not a man. I know a lot of women that support and enjoy industries and media that give bad messages abou women though. I don't know many men that say, "That's not right, I'm not going to buy into that". That's why I asked you about it.

[Lonely Ronin]

This doesn't even take into account that this list is not the be all and end all of what men find attractive.

 

I mean did you see #85, it's a cartoon character....

[Oxy Moronovich]

This is basically the point I made earlier. I'm not of the opinion that women are "harsher" in their criticism, but they can be just as venomous as any man in this regard.

I was once talking to one of my female neighbors in my apartment building. Another female neighbor walked by in tanktop and miniskirt. When the chick was out of sight, my female neighbor said, "If you saw me dressing like that, you'd think I was a slut." I never prompted her to say that in any way. Every now and then I see them talking, smiling and giggling like the best of friends.

 

Ever seen the music video for Sir-Mix-A-Lot's "Baby Got Back"? Remember the opening dialogue from that white chick? I always laugh whenever I watch that music video because it's so real. That's exactly how women communicate. A woman sees another chick she thinks gets more attention then her then she'll immediately start trash-talking that woman to her girlfriends. Then when that chick comes up to her she'll pretend to be her friend.

[TheBigQuestion]

Hey Castle, did you hear that? You have CONTROL ISSUES now.

 

Seriously, what a clusterf**k of a thread this became.

[ThaWholigan]

I thought you knew since you made the point. I don't know myself. I'm not a man. I know a lot of women that support and enjoy industries and media that give bad messages abou women though. I don't know many men that say, "That's not right, I'm not going to buy into that". That's why I asked you about it.

Well a lot of men who don't agree with it don't buy into it. They also try to educate the women in their lived about the ills of it - to no avail.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

He kind of does. He doesn't like that people came in with a different opinion even though his first post was supposedly a question. When people disagreed with him he claimed htey were derailing his thread. Now he wants the thread closed because it didn't go exactly how he wanted.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

I was once talking to one of my female neighbors in my apartment building. Another female neighbor walked by in tanktop and miniskirt. When the chick was out of sight, my female neighbor said, "If you saw me dressing like that, you'd think I was a slut." I never prompted her to say that in any way. Every now and then I see them talking, smiling and giggling like the best of friends.

 

Ever seen the music video for Sir-Mix-A-Lot's "Baby Got Back"? Remember the opening dialogue from that white chick? I always laugh whenever I watch that music video because it's so real. That's exactly how women communicate. A woman sees another chick she thinks gets more attention then her then she'll immediately start trash-talking that woman to her girlfriends. Then when that chick comes up to her she'll pretend to be her friend.

 

That's because men are kinder, warmer, nicer people that are so gracious and kind toward women. But women are evil people with no good relationships and everything is our fault. But you and other men? You guys are so wonderful and perfect. You just love people and never say anything mean about women even as you currently are debasing women by basically saying their relatoinships are worthless compared to male relationships and bonding. Oh the irony.