Feel like there is no hope left

[ThaWholigan]

None of this matters, any advice we give Somedude will not work because Somedude only cares about getting a GF and the desperation is driving him mental. Until he actually cares about other sh*t, then the same thing will keep happening.

 

SD, repeat after me:

 

Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world. Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world. Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world. Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world. Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world. Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world. Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world. Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world. Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world..........

[Els]

Sure. To an extent I agree with 1). But let's back up a step. How does SD actually go about making friends? As I mentioned before, my experience has been that people tend to like each other in the activity/class first, and then they extend their friendship to beyond the activity or class or what have you. What would you advise to someone who had SD's experience in his salsa class?

 

Unfortunately, I don't think salsa class is the best place to make male friends, even though it may be a good place to make female friends. IIRC a few women tried to be friends with him, but he didn't want to be friends with them because one of them had a husband. Other than that, I need to know what he's doing to try and make male friends before commenting.

 

I actually don't agree with 2). I get these people in SD's class were women and you all for some reason feel that SD should be making guy friends, but I'm not sure how much of a difference there really is in making (well-adjusted) guy versus gal friends. I mean, getting the girls to actually hang out with you is tougher for obvious reasons, but if you can get guys to like you, you can get girls to like you enough to be friendly to you in class. If you're getting slighted a lot there is a need to back up a step.

 

I don't think SD has a problem with getting women to want to be friends with him, he just tries to avoid those friendships once they turn down his attempts at going further, because he doesn't want to get FZ'ed. That's his choice, and I respect it, but he can still have male friends.

 

 

 

And as for 3), that sounds really nice but it isn't true. I don't really have a circle of friends but I still date (gasp!). Once you get into your 30's, most people don't have this circle of friends that everyone on LS seems to speak about as a necessity to get a girl to like you.

 

I never said it was impossible, simply that it is easier to date if you have a social circle. Do you truly have no friends at all? Most single people I know do, regardless of age. The married 30+ year olds do seem to drop off the friend radar a bit, but they have a family. When you don't have a family, friends are all you have.

 

BUT I have the social skills to make friends (see my first paragraph). How does SD go about getting these social skills?

 

Why, by practicing.

[Imported]

You should become a monk. Maybe learn some Kung fu or how to play the accordion.

[ThaWholigan]

You should become a monk. Maybe learn some Kung fu or how to play the accordion.

I actually think SD would benefit from doing a martial art to be honest

[zebracolors]

None of this matters, any advice we give Somedude will not work because Somedude only cares about getting a GF and the desperation is driving him mental. Until he actually cares about other sh*t, then the same thing will keep happening.

 

SD, repeat after me:

 

Getting a GF is NOT the most important thing in the world....

 

^Just quickly chiming in to agree with Wholigan.

 

SomeDude, you're the one who created this topic, seemingly for advice, and yet you've essentially shot down any intelligent and genuine advice people are giving you here. No one is going to say suddenly change their mind and say "oh you were right all along" because everyone's experiences are different. If you don't believe when they say you have to change your outlook, then making topics about your situation isn't going to change anything. You're only making it seem like you are desperate for validation.

[runner]

I actually think SD would benefit from doing a martial art to be honest

 

you're on to something TW. i predict he'll get his ass kicked initially but then learn from his mistakes; with the hope being that he takes his thicker skin into the dating/socialising realm. maybe.

[yessy21]

Push yourself. U can do it. noone stays alone.

[marinelife3]

I have a theory for you. There are two kinds of people in the world, normal people and weirdos. Normal people are interested in conventional things, and they are conventionally good looking, and they find partners through normal established pathways. Weirdos are the opposite. I went to a renaissance fair the other day, and it was filled with very unusual looking, conventionally unattarctive, socially awkward people dressed in fifteenth century clothing. And they were mostly coupled off. They probably found each other through costume-sewing web forums or archery classes or something super nerdy like that.

 

I think maybe your problem is that you are a weirdo, but without the weirdo interests that would put you into contact with potential partners. Instead you are expecting things to work out along conventional lines.

 

I know you like video games and anime, but you need to push it further. Plenty of people start out just liking anime and end up obsessively recreating ancient Japanese water urns or whatever. I hope you realize that I consider it a compliment to call you a weirdo. I think of myself as a weirdo and almost everyone I like in the world. It's just that you are handicapped by living in such a conformist place and the believing the whole "heck, I'm just a normal guy and I just want a normal chick" thing. You need to discover your inner freak.

[El Brujo]

You need to discover your inner freak.

 

^That.^

 

The best things in life are freaky. Don't be so hung up on what everyone else thinks.

[somedude81]

I am having the same feeling as you, but I want to know why you have not been able to get a girl. Is it looks, height, personality, or is it that you dont socialize much. I cold approach due to no girls in my social circle, do you do the same thing? I ask because I do not want to have no relationship experience by 30

A while ago I made a thread that claimed that the number one reason guys do poorly with women is because they don't know how to talk to and interact properly with them.

 

In addition, if a girl is physically attracted to a guy, she'll make it easier for him and it would be OK if he didn't really have a clue.

 

So my problem is that I don't have a clue how to really talk to girls in a way that makes them be interested in me, and nobody has ever been physically attracted to me. With those two things working against me, it's been very hard to overcome them.

I wasn’t sitting on my high horse or being smug in any way.

That's exactly what it sounded like. How else was I supposed to interpret "I repeat, you haven't tried anything.

 

Start trying to meet people (rather than hoping compatible women will magically appear in front of you), and then you can complain if this doesn't work."

 

Your tone is very condescending.

The reality is that it’s very hard to meet people. I make a lot of effort to be social and to meet new people, and I’m still single.

Is there some bigger meaning to "meet people." About every semester I meet five or so girls that I would like to date and see if a relationship is possible. Over the years I've met tons of girls I was interested in. It's not like I'm not attracted to anybody.

 

So does "meet people" actually mean, meet people that want to date you?

 

 

 

It was even hard when I was young and was a model living in NYC, but I’ve never developed a crappy attitude.

Have you been single your entire life? Lived a life free of affection and intimacy? Never had sex with somebody you liked and who liked you in return?

 

If I’m single forever, I will deal with it. I have other things in my life to sustain me. Being single does not define me and it will not destroy me. You’re ready to let it destroy you, and in many ways it already has.

That's just how I am. I can not be happy by myself. I've been living that way for many years and it's made me depressed, miserable and angry.

 

 

Are you willing to try social activities like Meetup.com? Would you be willing to go to a bar for a drink at happy hour? I've done this by myself before and it's fun; people will talk you.

Yes I have gone to a couple of bars.

 

Yes people will talk to you and initiate conversation if you are female.

Why can't you be happy alone?

 

People find happiness and meaning to life outside of relationships. Why can't you?

I have no idea why. Therapy was no able to help me find the answer either.

 

And please don't try to make it seem that I'm the only person who finds it difficult to be happy by themselves. Hell, I'm sure there are many people like me who hate being single on this very forum.

 

People lose their limbs and find happiness. People lose their vision and find happiness. People lose their children and somehow, someway, manage to find purpose for living.

 

Why can't you?

 

You have a healthy, working body and mind. You have access to safe housing, food, and a good education. You will not be digging ditches for a living for the rest of your life (although even those people manage to find happiness in life).

"At least you have working arms and legs" is not going to make me feel any better at being single.

 

----------

More to come later.

[iris219]

Is there some bigger meaning to "meet people." About every semester I meet five or so girls that I would like to date and see if a relationship is possible. Over the years I've met tons of girls I was interested in. It's not like I'm not attracted to anybody.

 

So does "meet people" actually mean, meet people that want to date you?

 

Have you been single your entire life? Lived a life free of affection and intimacy? Never had sex with somebody you liked and who liked you in return?

 

I meant it's hard to meet people who are single, compatible, and appropriate (how many AGE appropriate women have you met recently?)

 

Stop trying to win the "my life sucks worse than yours" game. As a woman who desperately wants children, but will never have them, I believe my life sucks worse than yours. You don't have to believe it; I'm not trying to convince you of it even though I believe it. Everyone's life has its own special brand of "suckiness."

 

"At least you have working arms and legs" is not going to make me feel any better at being single.

 

It should.

[Nightsky]

You should run away and join the circus.

[tman666]

I just wanted to say that I like the advice that ThaWholigan gave you earlier about being more aggressive with imposing yourself more during social situations versus being the passive "man in the back".

 

It doesn't matter if you look like Brad Pitt; if you don't make your presence known, most girls will pass you up for the more lively interaction. Being present isn't enough: mingle, say goofy things, ask her to dance, compliment her looks or her dress or her perfume. If you can make her laugh, you're in good territory. The bottom line is that you need to keep her positively engaged without laying it on so thickly that her alarm bells start going off. There isn't a guidebook on how to do this, to my knowledge. It comes with experience and honing the ability to feel a situation out...

 

If this kind of thing is beyond you, you might want to consider what Marinelife said as well: maybe the "conventional" social scene isn't where you're meant to thrive. It's a good thing for a lot of people that there isn't only one road to making friends and finding romance.

[somedude81]

I can actually empathize with SD here. I don't think he is so much unhappy about still not having a girlfriend so much as he is by that experience of getting blown off by the women in his salsa class. That blow is a lot more personal and hints at a deeper problem than that which can be fixed by just "putting yourself in front of more women" that some of us, including myself, have advised.

Actually, I am very unhappy that I still don't have a girlfriend. I woke up angry today at the fact that I had to continue with my POS life. I manged to go back to sleep and delay getting up for a couple of hours but I had to eventually get up.

 

The salsa blow also really hurt because that guy and I have known that girl for the same length of time and yet I'm now invisible to her when that wasn't the case a few weeks ago. All around me I'm seeing guys pair off with girls and it just point out how much of a loser I am.

 

There is something about my personality that is just wrong.

 

I'm not sure how easily it can be fixed by "make friends first" advice that everyone on here seems to give SD. That advice doesn't really reflect how things actually happen on the ground. Every time I've made a friend in an activity, there was usually some sort of rapport beforehand that made it natural to become "Facebook friends" and then actually hang out.

Frankly I hate the make friends first advice.

 

People seem to have the idea that I'm actively trying to avoid making friends. That's simply not the case at all.

And as far as the whole "work on yourself" advice that we at LS luuuuvvvv to give, including myself, well, how do you do that. How do you actually learn social skills? (See above paragraph.) Maybe SD could be dressing or carrying himself better, but maybe he is dressing and carrying himself well enough.

I'm defeinitley dressing and carrying for myself well enough.

SD, these are my questions to you:

 

--How good of a dancer are you actually?

On a scale of 1-10, 1 being not knowing how to dance at all (which is the vast majority of guys in my class) to 10, giving women orgasms on the dance floor, I'm about a 4.5

 

I've mastered all the basics and have taken the salsa class on campus a few times. But I have not been able to take it to the next level because no class teaches it and I don't have a partner to practice with.

 

So I'll say I'm a better dancer than almost all of the guys in class but not that good in the salsa club world.

 

--What about that girl you talked about a month and a half ago? I know she is married and so not a prospect, but the fact that she found you appealing enough to interact with you that substantially says something about your basic attractiveness.

In my view, it's just another woman showing me fake interest. Honestly I don't have a clue what she thought of me, but if she wasn't actually available, then it doesn't help me at all. For once in my life I want a girl to show interest and let me date her. I've had way too many cases of girls just wanting to be my friend and I'm sick of that. It's not what I need.

 

@ThaWholigan could you explain what you said a few posts ago "You need to impose yourself on life a bit more instead of letting it happen to you. Start being a little more aggressive in your progression, embrace your manhood."

Well, that's the thing about compatibility, isn't it - BOTH people have to like each other. If one person doesn't, you're not really compatible.

I know that.

 

It's always one way.

Ah, this is new. How did that turn out, why are you so certain it failed? Did they consistently ignore you or anything?

I can talk to and joke around with guys just fine. But nobody invites me to hang out with them.

 

I don't have a clue how guys actually make friends.

 

With girls, I can meet a girl in a class or some other situation where I can talk to her on a few occasions. Then I invite her to do something with me. We hang out a couple of times and eventually we become friends, because I screwed up and let her friendzone me. Wait what was I talking about again?

 

With a guy, it just feels weird trying to get a guy to hang out with me. And guys never invite me to do anything. Every one seems to have their own friends already.

I have a theory for you. There are two kinds of people in the world, normal people and weirdos. Normal people are interested in conventional things, and they are conventionally good looking, and they find partners through normal established pathways. Weirdos are the opposite. I went to a renaissance fair the other day, and it was filled with very unusual looking, conventionally unattarctive, socially awkward people dressed in fifteenth century clothing. And they were mostly coupled off. They probably found each other through costume-sewing web forums or archery classes or something super nerdy like that.

I would hardly consider myself to be very unusual looking and conventionally unattractive. The only thing I feel about my myself that is unattractive is that I'm 5'6. Is being short really enough to make me ugly?

 

Many people have seen my picture and nobody has suggested that I was ugly.

I think maybe your problem is that you are a weirdo, but without the weirdo interests that would put you into contact with potential partners. Instead you are expecting things to work out along conventional lines.

 

I know you like video games and anime, but you need to push it further. Plenty of people start out just liking anime and end up obsessively recreating ancient Japanese water urns or whatever. I hope you realize that I consider it a compliment to call you a weirdo. I think of myself as a weirdo and almost everyone I like in the world. It's just that you are handicapped by living in such a conformist place and the believing the whole "heck, I'm just a normal guy and I just want a normal chick" thing. You need to discover your inner freak.

I really don't think I'm a weirdo. I've been to some Japanese and Anime clubs on campus, I know how much of a weirdo people can be. That's a level completely beyond me.

 

Also I need to point out that I have nothing against "weirdo girls." I was absolutely, completely obsessed with a girl I met in Japanese class, who also attended the club meetings. She was proud to be a geek. But she had absolutely no interest in dating anybody and was single (and a virgin) for the two years that I knew her. It's been roughly a year since I saw her last

I meant it's hard to meet people who are single, compatible, and appropriate (how many AGE appropriate women have you met recently?)

What would be the youngest age woman that would be okay for a 37 year old guy to date

 

Stop trying to win the "my life sucks worse than yours" game. As a woman who desperately wants children, but will never have them, I believe my life sucks worse than yours. You don't have to believe it; I'm not trying to convince you of it even though I believe it. Everyone's life has its own special brand of "suckiness."

You are the one who started it.

 

"I make a lot of effort to be social and to meet new people, and I’m still single. It was even hard when I was young and was a model living in NYC, but I’ve never developed a crappy attitude. If I’m single forever, I will deal with it. I have other things in my life to sustain me. Being single does not define me and it will not destroy me. You’re ready to let it destroy you, and in many ways it already has."

 

IMO you don't have a crappy attitude because you haven't had it anywhere near as bad as I have.

It should.

Attention everybody who is upset about anything in their life or feeling any sort of emotional pain.

 

You should forget about it, and be happy just because you are alive and healthy! Sunshine and rainbows for everyone!

[Ross MwcFan]

You are the one who started it.

 

"I make a lot of effort to be social and to meet new people, and I’m still single. It was even hard when I was young and was a model living in NYC, but I’ve never developed a crappy attitude. If I’m single forever, I will deal with it. I have other things in my life to sustain me. Being single does not define me and it will not destroy me. You’re ready to let it destroy you, and in many ways it already has."

 

IMO you don't have a crappy attitude because you haven't had it anywhere near as bad as I have.

Attention everybody who is upset about anything in their life or feeling any sort of emotional pain.

 

You should forget about it, and be happy just because you are alive and healthy! Sunshine and rainbows for everyone!

 

I couldn't agree more. I do appreciate that I'm healthy and I have all of my arms and legs, but thinking about this doesn't make all of your problems go away, it doesn't stop you from feeling like crap about something else that is seriously wrong in your life.

 

I think iris must find it hard to grasp, that not everyone, in fact probably most people aren't wired up the same way she is.

[marinelife3]

Aw, I'm not trying to say you're ugly, just that you're not some jock partyboy. Also, the interests you do have are nerdy interests, and you like nerdy girls. So you should immerse yourself deeper in need culture

[xxoo]

Attention everybody who is upset about anything in their life or feeling any sort of emotional pain.

 

You should forget about it, and be happy just because you are alive and healthy! Sunshine and rainbows for everyone!

 

It's called perspective and gratitude.

 

Developing these qualities will make you a more attractive person in general. People of all kinds will be more drawn to you and your positive energy. Some of them will even be attractive women!

[somedude81]

I just wanted to say that I like the advice that ThaWholigan gave you earlier about being more aggressive with imposing yourself more during social situations versus being the passive "man in the back".

That's what he meant? I asked him twice to clarify and he never did.

It doesn't matter if you look like Brad Pitt; if you don't make your presence known, most girls will pass you up for the more lively interaction. Being present isn't enough: mingle, say goofy things, ask her to dance, compliment her looks or her dress or her perfume. If you can make her laugh, you're in good territory. The bottom line is that you need to keep her positively engaged without laying it on so thickly that her alarm bells start going off. There isn't a guidebook on how to do this, to my knowledge. It comes with experience and honing the ability to feel a situation out..

OK that is something I am definitely not doing. I'm not standing out from the crowd. I did recently realize that being there with the group is not good enough because girls would not engage me. There could be a three girls and three guys in group and all three girls could keep talking to and focusing on just one of the guys. The other two guys can try and talk but it's like all the girls just ignore those guys. Frankly it's very rude that girls do it, but I guess that's just how they are.

 

So somehow I need to bring attention to myself so girls will want to interact with me. More often than not there will be other guys around and I would have to make myself seem better than them.

 

My God this sh*t is complicated! I don't want to get five girls at one time interested in me. I just want one fu*king girl! But that's always the case, girls seem to cluster around guys like they are sheep.

Edited November 5, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
removed deleted post

[ThaWholigan]

That's what he meant? I asked him twice to clarify and he never did.

 

That's part of what I meant, but it really applies to anything you do in life. I get the sense that you don't really do this much. That's not to say I think you should be extroverted when you aren't naturally so, but that you could benefit from being able to impose yourself on life more, on the things you want - to impose yourself socially when you want to engage rather than sitting on the fringes hoping.

 

OK that is something I am definitely not doing. I'm not standing out from the crowd. I did recently realize that being there with the group is not good enough because girls would not engage me. There could be a three girls and three guys in group and all three girls could keep talking to and focusing on just one of the guys. The other two guys can try and talk but it's like all the girls just ignore those guys. Frankly it's very rude that girls do it, but I guess that's just how they are.

 

It's about knowing how to navigate these social scenarios to be able to get into the convos. Also, consider that the one guy getting all the attention is subconsciously hogging the limelight and not including you guys in the convo - sometimes that happens. Girls will talk to the guy they feel most engaged by, I don't consider it rude as much as I consider it inadvertently dismissive.

 

So somehow I need to bring attention to myself so girls will want to interact with me. More often than not there will be other guys around and I would have to make myself seem better than them.

 

That's only one way to be able to engage with women in a group. Sometimes your silence can be attractive, but it depends on the energy you project, which is more complicated. It's not necessarily about making yourself better than the other guys, but about "distinguishing yourself" as somebody worth talking to.

 

A lot of this is covered in Carlos Xuma's work, if you got the time get some of that sh*t.

My God this sh*t is complicated! I don't want to get five girls at one time interested in me. I just want one fu*king girl! But that's always the case, girls seem to cluster around guys like they are sheep.

 

This is just depressing.

 

It's not that complicated once you understand it. You just need the right information presented the right way to help you.

 

Nope I don't have aspergers, autism or any other sort of disorder and I was tested a few years ago.

 

I'm just an introverted guy with very poor self-esteem and long term depression.

 

I thought not. It's been suggested to you more than once on this forum, but I've never thought you were autistic or anything like that.

[Pirouette]

I did recently realize that being there with the group is not good enough because girls would not engage me. There could be a three girls and three guys in group and all three girls could keep talking to and focusing on just one of the guys. The other two guys can try and talk but it's like all the girls just ignore those guys.

 

So what do these other guys have that you don't?

[Els]

OK that is something I am definitely not doing. I'm not standing out from the crowd. I did recently realize that being there with the group is not good enough because girls would not engage me. There could be a three girls and three guys in group and all three girls could keep talking to and focusing on just one of the guys. The other two guys can try and talk but it's like all the girls just ignore those guys. Frankly it's very rude that girls do it, but I guess that's just how they are.

 

So somehow I need to bring attention to myself so girls will want to interact with me. More often than not there will be other guys around and I would have to make myself seem better than them.

 

My God this sh*t is complicated! I don't want to get five girls at one time interested in me. I just want one fu*king girl! But that's always the case, girls seem to cluster around guys like they are sheep.

 

This is where social aptitude and observational skills come in. Younger girls do tend to 'cluster together' - contrary to popular belief, not always because of the top 5% crap - because for some obscure reason, they are conditioned to do so in high school and college. The lone girl or the girl who dares to be different is seen as a 'loser' in that context. So most girls who want to fit in, tag along with their friends in a group and don't spread out much.

 

However, if you observe the social dynamic closely, you will notice that the one man cannot possibly talk to all of the girls. There will always be the one or two hanging around at the edge of the group, not really being talked to much. That is where your window comes in. Of course, before you respond, I must add the disclaimer that there is no guarantee anyone will talk to you, guy or girl, but I have a feeling you're assessing the situation rather wrongly.

 

That being said, college girls in group situations is really only one of the multitude of possible opportunities out there. And were I a guy, it would be the opportunity that I would be least likely to explore.

[xxoo]

So somehow I need to bring attention to myself so girls will want to interact with me. More often than not there will be other guys around and I would have to make myself seem better than them.

 

My God this sh*t is complicated! I don't want to get five girls at one time interested in me. I just want one fu*king girl! But that's always the case, girls seem to cluster around guys like they are sheep.

 

You might have better luck breaking into the conversation by initially addressing the guy, not the girls. The girls may lower their guard toward you if you are viewed as a buddy of this guy, rather than a guy trying to pick them up.

[tman666]

You might have better luck breaking into the conversation by initially addressing the guy, not the girls. The girls may lower their guard toward you if you are viewed as a buddy of this guy, rather than a guy trying to pick them up.

 

Hell yeah. Groups of girls are almost impossible to break into as a lone guy. You can be good looking and smooth as any guy out there, but you'll be viewed as a predator/imposter if you walk up to a group of young women alone and try to "break in".

 

Somedude needs a couple of good wingmen...

[somedude81]

Just want to stop and say that I'm reading everything.

 

Right now I'm trying to get myself noticed by the girls. It is going to definitely require me to become more outgoing.

 

Also there are four girls I want to get to know better and two of them are close friends with each other. Not sure how I can work that out.

Edited October 30, 2012 by somedude81

[ThaWholigan]

Just want to stop and say that I'm reading everything.

 

Right now I'm trying to get myself noticed by the girls. It is going to definitely require me to become more outgoing.

 

Also there are four girls I want to get to know better and two of them are close friends with each other. Not sure how I can work that out.

Do you play the game "Fallout"?