The_Face Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 My ex girlfriend is really against ever getting a parenting plan or having me pay child support. She wants to work it all out between us. Neither of us know what the future will bring. All we have to work with right now is that our relationship didn't work out. Trying to reconcile and live together after finding out she was pregnant didn't work out. So what would now make her think we'll be able to remain civil and cooperative to eachother for the next 18 years? Sure, we are both always working towards a healthy relationship and trying our best to work together through things, but, if something were to change.. who knows how good we'll be able to interact with eachother? I think it's a good idea to get a plan and I have no hang-ups about a dollar amount be determined for me to pay her for the child, I don't see it as a bad thing. I see it as a way to avoid potential problems down the road. Had she not done the recent 180 on me and told me how we never get along and she doesn't want to get a place, I might not be leaning towards a parenting plan. Her words and her actions only make me feel that much more than a parenting plan is, well, a good plan. Why would any mother be against any of this? Unless it's a pride thing, like maybe she just wants to feel like we can do this without any legal interference. She is dead-set on not getting a plan written up legally and child support. She still says she will accept money for the baby of course, but doesn't want it to be through any third party, as she has put it before. I still don't get it? Are then any women out there who would be against this, too? I just don't understand. Usually isn't it the guy who doesn't want to pay child support and have a parenting plan? At least in episodes of Maury, anyway... Someone help me understand this Link to post Share on other sites
TigerCub Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 (edited) My ex girlfriend is really against ever getting a parenting plan or having me pay child support. She wants to work it all out between us. Neither of us know what the future will bring. All we have to work with right now is that our relationship didn't work out. Trying to reconcile and live together after finding out she was pregnant didn't work out. So what would now make her think we'll be able to remain civil and cooperative to eachother for the next 18 years? Sure, we are both always working towards a healthy relationship and trying our best to work together through things, but, if something were to change.. who knows how good we'll be able to interact with eachother? I think it's a good idea to get a plan and I have no hang-ups about a dollar amount be determined for me to pay her for the child, I don't see it as a bad thing. I see it as a way to avoid potential problems down the road. Had she not done the recent 180 on me and told me how we never get along and she doesn't want to get a place, I might not be leaning towards a parenting plan. Her words and her actions only make me feel that much more than a parenting plan is, well, a good plan. Why would any mother be against any of this? Unless it's a pride thing, like maybe she just wants to feel like we can do this without any legal interference. She is dead-set on not getting a plan written up legally and child support. She still says she will accept money for the baby of course, but doesn't want it to be through any third party, as she has put it before. I still don't get it? Are then any women out there who would be against this, too? I just don't understand. Usually isn't it the guy who doesn't want to pay child support and have a parenting plan? At least in episodes of Maury, anyway... Someone help me understand this Please be very careful. She will take your money, but she doesn't want any record of you giving her anything. This seems really fishy to me. Also, since she flip flops on a lot of things it seems, and her attitude changes with the weather - I'd strongly advise you to get everything in writing. What's to stop her one day from complaining that you are a deadbeat dad or telling the kid one day when he/she is older (and she alienated you for some reason) that Yup, she raised him/her all on her own and you never contributed or whatever. Cover your basis, get a contract done legally and get everything in writing. I really don't trust what she says and her intentions much based on her past attitudes. If she's too proud - tell her to swallow her pride and get over it (that both parents have a duty to support their child) - this is what's best for the kid and you want it done legally. Edit - oh sorry, its a boy right, I said he/she cuz I couldn't remember, but I remember now that its a boy and you were excited!! Edited October 29, 2012 by TigerCub 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Balzac Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Why would any mother be against any of this? Lots of info and questions but I'll start here. It's simple, IF, I'm correct. Many young women, ignorant of law and purpose, hold the mistaken belief that no $ equals no power of decision, no visitation. It's not about shame. The concept that your shared child is entitled to financial, emotional and all other means of support from BOTH patents is not one they embrace. Child support is for the child. It's generally paid to a clerk of the court and forwarded into an account, held by the custodial parent. Link to post Share on other sites
TigerCub Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Why would any mother be against any of this? Lots of info and questions but I'll start here. It's simple, IF, I'm correct. Many young women, ignorant of law and purpose, hold the mistaken belief that no $ equals no power of decision, no visitation. It's not about shame. The concept that your shared child is entitled to financial, emotional and all other means of support from BOTH patents is not one they embrace. Child support is for the child. It's generally paid to a clerk of the court and forwarded into an account, held by the custodial parent. That's an interesting view and really sad if that's what they'd be plotting after. However, in this case, she will take his money, she just doesn't want any record of it. Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 A recorded parenting plan/custody/child support document binds both parents to a legal plan of action, and she wishes to avoid that, for reasons unknown. We can speculate. If you really wish to understand the plethora of potentials which attend, consult with an attorney who specializes in this subset of law. You can usually get a good overview during the initial, generally free, consultation. Given current statute, I'd sooner kill myself than allow such an undocumented 'plan' to proceed. YMMV. Good luck. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author The_Face Posted October 29, 2012 Author Share Posted October 29, 2012 Yeah, I never liked that idea of hers one bit. But I cut the conversation short when it got too far into that topic and said we'll deal with this all later. I didn't agree to it, but I stopped pressing my point of view when I realized this would only lead to her getting upset. It's not even necessarily that I believe she's got strange intentions going on. I think it's smart because, her own words, we argue all the time. She just laid that on me recently when she flipped out and pushed me away. With that being said, how does she expect to get through 18 of years of communicating and just "going with the flow" of things? Who knows where the kid will be at tomorrow? Let's just play it by ear! Screw that. I don't want her to be upset, but she's been running things this whole time, and most things I understand. She is the mother, and she is carrying the child. But she can't control this whole situation. What it really comes down to isn't even about what's fair to her or to me, it's what's fair to the child. And that's time spent with his mother and father, in our case, seperately. That's what my son is going to get. ****. How many other things is she going to decide for all of us? She tells me I shouldn't worry, that she's not going to be hard to deal with and she is flexible about time spent with the child. We're getting one. That talk, whenever I decide to have it (the definitive version, that is) will be a fun conversation, I can already tell... I wish I was more laidback. Or better yet, I wish I could just be a deadbeat dad who never sees his kid so I wouldn't have to even stress about anything right now. I'm joking of course, I'm glad I am not like that. But trying to do the right thing isn't always easy. I learned that much this year Link to post Share on other sites
Author The_Face Posted October 29, 2012 Author Share Posted October 29, 2012 Prediction: In the next 6 months, my ex is really going to end up hating me. And I'm going to want nothing to do with her. I hope I'm wrong. But I don't like the way things have gone so far. And if I don't back down about this topic when the time comes, my ex is going to be a miserable person to deal with. shouldn't worry myself so much. Guess I need legal help now. And a cigarette. Thanks for everyone's input, as usual. In some ways I feel a little stronger than I did when I was with my ex, but I'm still on edge alot now. Things will get better. They might get worse first, but then they'll get better. Link to post Share on other sites
Pompom Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Unless you were tricked into parenthood ("Sure, I'm on the pill... not MUAHAHAHA") you should take responsibility for your own flesh and blood. Unless you're being denied this option. In Israel, there is a law: if you're a parent, then nobody cares about how much the other parent hates your gut, you get to see and be involved with your kid. This goes as far as granting rapists rights to ask to meet their kids in prison. She can reject your financial contributions all she wants, she's being selfish; that kid may benefit from them. Her ego does not supercede your child's needs. Link to post Share on other sites
KeepRecieptsForItAll Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Look, you're going to get burned hard sooner or later down the road and if she ends up hating you she can really mess up your life if/when she goes to court for child support and end up having you pay Back pay (i.e. Child support money you haven't paid during the earlier years of your child's life) So buy diapers, clothes and always remember to keep ALL OF THE RECEIPT'S and NEVER give your babies mother cash as that leaves no paper trail proving that you were supporting your child financially. This also includes getting money orders/checks and keeping the receipts of those as well, that way if you ever get brought to court for child support you'll have proof to show the judge you were supporting the child by showing receipts of buying diapers, food and baby clothes. Look, I found this forum/question on accident through google. Because, I got burned hard by my ex with child support because I had no proof to show I was buying anything for my child because I never kept any documentation and only gave her cash. So, you should NEVER give your babies mother cash and always keep all documentation of the money you give her and all of the baby's needs. Link to post Share on other sites
Janesays Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Newsflash, it doesn't matter if you keep the receipts. Any money you give her without an official support order will be considered a GIFT and NOT CHILD SUPPORT. Meaning, she could get BACK support. Meaning, you paid her TWICE. My ex had a similar agreement with his ex when they first split up. "Let's just work it out between us" she said and he paid what she wanted. A few months later, she gets mad, takes him to court and gets child support.....plust $4000 in BACK SUPPORT. All the money he gave her before didn't count. All considered 'gifts' to the court. Save yourself the time, hassle and money. Just got get a court order and be done with it. Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Absolutely see a lawyer about this. She probably doesn't want the money so she can make all the decisions about the baby. She may want to marry one day, move away, whatever she wants without your say-so. It doesn't matter how upset she gets you have to do what's right by your baby and protect your rights as his father. I would see an attorney ASAP if I were you. She is definitely thinking something and it isn't in your best interest. Link to post Share on other sites
Balzac Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 (edited) Guidelines for non/custodial visitation exist in many jurisdictions. These guidelines are considered "minimum" visitation. For infants, the guidelines can be quite different than for a toddler. Nursing mother, infant with dad for 3 days, not happening. Provisions exist for her to contact dad prior to using a babysitter. If my memory serves me correctly, this young woman is financially dependent on her family. Dependent as in lives in their home. That indicates to me that her family is not able or unwilling to provide her w separate housing, car, other necessary cash or credit card. This young woman is minimally employed and was/is a student. In and among these challenges, paternity is at question. It's demonstrative of her naïveté regarding finances, her own questions about paternity or her family message, she's not financially independent. Courts are loath to restrict a father's visitation, even in instances of inability or refusal to pay money. Visitation is for the benefit of child and parent. If her family is planning to provide for her and your child, she can deposit the funds into a trust account for your child to own at an appropriate age. Much of what you want to secure is your legal right to visitation and share in child oriented decisions. You may wish for private education, prepared to pay tuition but absent decision making authority, you are held to her decisions. You may cover your child on your medical insurance, choose to have child see a specific pediatrician, she can choose a clinic you'd eschew. Summer camp, music lessons, sports trainer, it's all part of what joint parenting decisions are about. Hang in there. Gather knowledge, you have been through the noncustodial rights with one child, you can use that knowledge as reason to be wary now. All of that aside, this young woman is very likely to be difficult to negotiate with out of her ignorance and family culture. Edited October 30, 2012 by Balzac She may be smart but she is NOT wise. Link to post Share on other sites
amaysngrace Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 She wants 100% control and already thinks of the baby as hers and just hers. Do you want custody? Link to post Share on other sites
SmileFace Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 (edited) Child support can be a drag and can quickly **** up your life if not paid and can just about **** up everything. However not paying it isn't good because if she decides to take you to court the judge can always retro active the order. What I will advise you to do is have a court ordered child support amount that you pay her directly. So that will limit any garnishing, bank liens, or tax inteception - the last two only happens if you don't pay but it can be easily backed up as any other bill. I say get an order and keep all your payments but have this done with a lawyer or in writing or at court. Do not take her word for anything. I am not sure where you are from but in my state child support and custody are two different entities and have nothing to do with each other. Edited October 30, 2012 by SmileFace Link to post Share on other sites
pink_sugar Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I agree with the others....proof proof proof. But I wouldn't too get riled up until you have that paternity test. Link to post Share on other sites
amaysngrace Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I agree with the others....proof proof proof. But I wouldn't too get riled up until you have that paternity test. Exactly. This is why she doesn't want to go before a judge. She hasn't established paternity. Face you have the upper hand here. See a family lawyer soon. Link to post Share on other sites
Author The_Face Posted October 30, 2012 Author Share Posted October 30, 2012 She wants 100% control and already thinks of the baby as hers and just hers. Do you want custody? Actually, in some ways I would prefer that. I know, with that comes more responsibility, but I'd rather deal with that then all of this mess with the ex. I'd rather be a single dad. Link to post Share on other sites
Author The_Face Posted October 30, 2012 Author Share Posted October 30, 2012 She is definitely thinking something and it isn't in your best interest. It's hard not to think she's up to something here. I really will never understand her thinking on this one, UNLESS there is some shady reason behind it. Otherwise, it makes no sense. Part of the reason it seems fishy is her emphasis on how much a parenting plan and child support will hurt ME. Not about how it's negative for her or baby, because it isn't. But she seems to stress how much it will negatively effect me. This will sound harsh maybe but the reason it's fishy is because all of the decisions she's made up until now have been for her, and none of them have been very considerate of me. So why now? And why this? Especially if I'm more than willing to go through with it? Hard not to feel paranoid. But I won't let it get inside my head too much until the time needs to come. In the mean time, I think I'll start speaking to someone in law about this, per many LSer's advice. Thanks again, the people on this forum are all super cool and informative and understanding. I appreciate it alot Link to post Share on other sites
Balzac Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Out of curiosity, is she partially through school? Not taking credits now? Her family must be an interesting lot. You seem to be navigating through this solidly working out in your head what you need and want to accomplish. It cannot be easy. Hang in there. There will be a moment when you realize that her becoming upset is a choice she makes. Now is not the moment as you rightly have decided. Link to post Share on other sites
Author The_Face Posted October 30, 2012 Author Share Posted October 30, 2012 Out of curiosity, is she partially through school? Not taking credits now? Her family must be an interesting lot. She dropped her classes last week or the week before, I think. She had just started taking her pre-reqs to get into a Phlebotomy program. I think she had only been in school for a month before she had to drop out. So I guess I'd have to answer your second question with a "no", I don't think she's taking any credits now. She mentioned having to enroll for a different quarter, after the baby is born. And I don't think she plans on going back to school for a few months after the baby is born, last I heard was she wanted at least 6 months with the baby before going to work or school.. I don't know about her family. I wonder what her mom is teaching her, sometimes.. And if not that, just where in the hell she learns some of this stuff she does and thinks. She's a good person in alot of ways.. but, ****. I don't know. Link to post Share on other sites
Balzac Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 None of what you say surprises me. In fact it confirms my comment about outside influences. Stop trying to figure it out. You've got a handle on things, you'll find a way through this. It just hurts to still be feeling attraction and romantic feelings for a woman pregnant with your child. We can all understand that hook. No point in me coughing up pejorative comments about her. Link to post Share on other sites
norajane Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Are you certain this is your baby, like, paternity test certain? Start there. And get a real family law lawyer immediately. Family law is no joke and it varies so much in different states. Make sure you understand your rights and resonsibilities - there's a LOT you don't know right now. Make sure your arrangements are legal and documented. She sounds 100% flaky, and that will only hurt you. Protect yourself and your child. Link to post Share on other sites
Author The_Face Posted October 30, 2012 Author Share Posted October 30, 2012 Not paternity test certain, no. I assume you read some of my other posts? Gotta get it down after baby is born. Yeah. Can't wait to bring that topic up again...Yay. I make decent money and am luckily in a position to save some of it up for the next couple months, until the baby is born, but still.. I know a lawyer is worth it, I am a little spooked on what that will cost me, money-wise. I guess I'll find out here soon enough. I haven't heard ONE person tell me I shouldn't get a test done, or that I shouldn't worry about getting a parenting plan set out and all that. It's funny. She told me once, after I had been on the computer for a bit, that I shouldn't waste my time reading what other people tell me in these forums, that none of them know the story, etc. etc. What matters is me and her, you know? Maybe she didn't want me reading other people's opinions because somewhere in that head of hers, she knows not many people are going to side with her. Except for her family and who knows about her friends. Getting a lawyer, and I'm going to defend myself the best I can. All I ****ing want is to be a good father and to see my child whenever I can. It shouldn't have to get ugly, I just feel more and more each day that it's going to get UGLY. Good thing I got my pals on LS here to talk some sense into me! 3 Link to post Share on other sites
norajane Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Actually, I haven't read your other posts or threads. This just sounds fishy to me. And if this child support thing is fishy, what else might be fishy? You already suspect that this has the potential to get really ugly. Protect yourself. Follow the boy scout motto and Be Prepared. A good lawyer now could be well-worth the price if this does get ugly later. Link to post Share on other sites
SlevinKalebra Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 "I haven't heard ONE person tell me I shouldn't get a test done," And here it comes. I don't know what the laws are where you are at but in Co. if you agree to a paternity test and you are not the father the mother can eliminate all contact between you and the child. If this is what you want if the child is not yours than agree to the test. If this is not what you want you have the right to decline the test. As far as support goes if she does not want support have that written very plainly in the parenting plan. Then as another person had mentioned, you could feel to give gifts of diapers, formula, or even money. You most likely are right about your predictions of the future re: the relationship between you and the mother. This is what you need to plan for. Definitely talk to a reputable family lawyer, but know this WILL open a can of worms, and you go into it with an insurmountable disadvantage the legal term of which is non-uteri in corpus best of luck Link to post Share on other sites
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