1 month in the path to reconciliation

[tojaz]

Most of the time I "shut-up" and just let Tojaz handle this.

<blush>

 

Allie, I like the things Yas is pointing out, especially the double speak. That has been something he has been using since day one and something that is all over your "It's over" post.

 

These are words that are there for one purpose... to protect that status quo. HE pushes you away when you get too close, but he always leaves just enough hope to keep you in the fight. Maybe because he's not sure what he wants and is stalling, maybe because he has found he likes being chased, or maybe just so he has a back up plan. Most likely a combination of all three.

 

I'm not sure where you want to go from here, but despite the direction you choose, my advice is the same, and has been the same for a long time. Stand the hard line! The police did the hard part and put him out, and it sounds like they were able to give him a lot of things to think about as well. He has maintained that he no longer wanted to be an active part of your family, let him live it. Its not about the hard decision to make him leave, its you making a sound decision if, and under what stipulations he will be allowed back.

 

I have a suggestion for a new years resolution for you Allie.

 

Your story has since day one been about you trying to prove your worth, your love, your commitment, and your trustworthiness. In my opinion you have gone above and beyond on all counts and tolerated a lot more then you should have ever had to. Look at yourself and across the room at dd and realize that being part of that is a privilege, and not one that is to be given lightly. It is a privilege that hubby has abused. If he wants to be a part of that then that is something he is going to have to earn and the only way he can do that is to be just as committed as both you and dd were to him even when he was at his worst. You both deserve that kind of commitment and should settle for nothing less.

 

Maybe what has happened here will shock him a little and he can become that person again, but if not.... Its a good thing he likes work, because he should be sleeping there awhile and he will have plenty to think about to pass the time. Stand tough Allie!

 

TOJAZ

[AllieKat]

Thanks Tojaz- i suspect hes only gone for the day but who knows. The police asked him if he wanted to say anything to me before he left or apologize and he said no! I decided to take my ring off too. Why should i continue to stand by him when he has NOT ONCE in 7 mths stood by me.

 

I guess im trying to think with my head more than my heart now. My hearts broke. The words hurt. He told the police that he wishes he hadnt said those true or not. The cop busted him pretty hard on the ring too. Husband tried to make excuses why he doesnt wear it and used work. The cop said ok but today is saturday! Then husband said well he hasnt worn it in months and that yeah its cause hes pissed at me. The cop said if he tells youges not in the angry stage hes lying cause he is. He made it sound to them like he does want to work things out but i dont allow it because i cant give him what he needs... Time!

 

Since he lied to them about not letting me out of door and etc he was probablly lying about that to just to get them off his back

[trippi1432]

Allie, not much more that I can add to what Yas and Tojaz have written here.

 

I will add this, as we have only recently become aware of the under-lying issue around why he can't move past what happened 7 months ago, his issue is not about you, the lie or the miscarriage anymore and his barter for "time" is nothing more than avoidance on his part to get beyond his own fears or help conquering them. Personally, stand your ground. He has to learn to separate that past from what he has had for seven years.

 

It's also called double speak for a reason, because logically nothing makes sense. I give Yas kudos for pointing that out. From where you have started to now, keep in mind that you have grown Allie. Take care of you and DD now, hubby will have to figure things out for himself and if he is the "honorable" person he claims to be, guess its time for him to grow a little as well.

[tojaz]

Thanks Tojaz- i suspect hes only gone for the day but who knows.

 

Thats easy Allie, you know. It is up to you when and if he comes back. Exercise that right, it will most likely do both of you some good. If he wants time, he can find all he wants but that's not whats waiting for him inside your door.

 

The police asked him if he wanted to say anything to me before he left or apologize and he said no! I decided to take my ring off too. Why should i continue to stand by him when he has NOT ONCE in 7 mths stood by me.

 

I guess im trying to think with my head more than my heart now. My hearts broke. The words hurt. He told the police that he wishes he hadnt said those true or not. The cop busted him pretty hard on the ring too. Husband tried to make excuses why he doesnt wear it and used work. The cop said ok but today is saturday! Then husband said well he hasnt worn it in months and that yeah its cause hes pissed at me. The cop said if he tells youges not in the angry stage hes lying cause he is. He made it sound to them like he does want to work things out but i dont allow it because i cant give him what he needs... Time!

 

Since he lied to them about not letting me out of door and etc he was probablly lying about that to just to get them off his back

 

Sounds like you had a lot of luck with the officers that were called out to your home. Most wouldn't have taken the time to talk about the things these guys did. Happy to hear they did.

 

TOJAZ

[Yasuandio]

Thats easy Allie, you know. It is up to you when and if he comes back. Exercise that right, it will most likely do both of you some good. If he wants time, he can find all he wants but that's not whats waiting for him inside your door.

 

It is your turn now. Keep him outta there. You may need to detach, and get your head screwed on straight. Don't worry - if he loves you, he'll come calling. But I think you will need to start a new marriage - beginning eith courting, dating, etc., for a year or so. Yes, that long. That is how much damage he has done to YOUR PRIDE. Let him value you again, over time. He may, and he may decide it's not worth it to him.

 

 

Sounds like you had a lot of luck with the officers that were called out to your home. Most wouldn't have taken the time to talk about the things these guys did. Happy to hear they did.

 

I find cops are pretty darn nice, and DO take the time, be it a general non-violent domestic disagreement, or a call for fear of stalking. (Tojaz, you probably don't deal with the cops very often.)

 

TOJAZ

 

Cops are trained observers. They always got a follow up question for every question a suspect tries to duck. Your husband got 7 free months of reality therapy in his session with those great cops. That is your tax dollars at work, my dear. YAS

 

PS What crazy hystrionic your poor daughter has to witness. She may grow up to be an "Intensity Junkie" from living amidst this emotional drama (BTW that's not sarcasm, I really mean it).

[trippi1432]

Actually, it's interesting how much police and Sheriff's are more trained in domestic disputes. Unless someone is being violent or totally dramatic, they will take the time to make a better assessment of the situation.

 

Yas, there really isn't a formula for kids based on limited exposure. Exposed to constant drama, perhaps right? But it sounds like Allie has kept dd rather encapsulated from the drama.

[AllieKat]

For the most part dd didnt know what was going on she was asleep with her door shut till i woke her up. Hubby did talk to her and apoligize to her for fighting with me while i was calling cops.

 

As for keeping him out... I cant really the police let me and him know that as long as his name is on lease hes entitled to be here. I even told him to clean out bank account out and get himself a little place. I think time apart is whats best.

 

I think the cops were a blessing in disquise honestly they made a lot of sense and had no real side as they werent his friend or mine which is EXACTLY what we need, a third party to mediate! The circumstances stink but it was two hours of therapy if nothing else I hope it makes him think about what he has. Im not perfect but I love with all my heart and unconditionally. He wont find a woman that would do that the way I have so its his loss.

 

I actually feel sad but kinda free like a burden has been lifted. Im sure when or/if he comes home the tension and anxiety will come back. I honestly hope he doesnt come back for a few days

[aMguilts]

hey AllieKat

 

Sorry it has come to this.

i did try and warn you, but again i got slated, by all those on here than know best!

 

hope your ok

 

aM

[aMguilts]

Cops are trained observers. They always got a follow up question for every question a suspect tries to duck. Your husband got 7 free months of reality therapy in his session with those great cops. That is your tax dollars at work, my dear. YAS

 

PS What crazy hystrionic your poor daughter has to witness. She may grow up to be an "Intensity Junkie" from living amidst this emotional drama (BTW that's not sarcasm, I really mean it).

 

in Bold

alot like most of the posters on here?

 

At least they are `trained` !

 

aM

[tojaz]

hey AllieKat

 

Sorry it has come to this.

i did try and warn you, but again i got slated, by all those on here than know best!

 

hope your ok

 

aM

 

in Bold

alot like most of the posters on here?

 

At least they are `trained` !

 

aM

 

Thank you for blessing us all with your wisdom

 

F

As for keeping him out... I cant really the police let me and him know that as long as his name is on lease hes entitled to be here. I even told him to clean out bank account out and get himself a little place. I think time apart is whats best.

 

 

No Allie, you cannot legally keep him out. The act of strongly discouraging his return and voicing your displeasure in his presence should be enough to make that a desirable option for him though. Those things will often work better then nailing the door shut.

 

TOJAZ

Edited December 30, 2012 by tojaz

[AllieKat]

I just noticed husband left his wedding band for me out the nightstand. Not sure if its been there since police escorted him out or if he came back while i was out and put it there. I guess its his last little message to me our marriage is over.

 

Im having an awful night now. The reality is starting to sink in and i know in the coming days it will get worse as i adjust. Ive been checking our bank account periodical this evening to see if hes withdrawn all our money. As of yet no but i see hes been checking it as well. It has a time stamp on it when you last logged in so i know it wasnt me. I imagine hes checking to make sure i didnt withdrawl all our money too.

 

I was smart enough back in july to open my own secret account and ive stashed money aside including my xmas bonus from work just incase a day like this came and he decides to be greedy. I may be in love and desperately wanting a reconcilation but im no idiot. I know have enough saved in there that i can pay the rent alone at least till the lease is up! I work full time and make decent money so worst case is when lease is up i downsize and thats ok!

[Steen719]

Sorry, Allie. Regardless of who thinks it is whose fault - who even knows (?) - it hurts and I know you are having a hard time. Good for you for making arrangements to safeguard for you and your daughter. Keep your chin up. There will be some relief along with the pain and at least you can start to go forward.

 

Take care of yourself. Hugs.

[BetrayedH]

Wish I had something original to say considering how much you need support right now but nothing I have to say is new. I'm sorry your H is a complete asshat douchebag. Otherwise, I hope you DO keep making decisions with your head instead of with your heart. You're going to need to keep doing that consistently. It took me about 1 year of separation/divorce to detach emotionally from my psycho ex and that was after 6 months of torture previous. Even if you want your H and M back, you need to do a complete 180 from the "nice him back" approach that has been failing you so far. You need to see change and that's only going to come about via you establishing your own boundaries about what is acceptable to YOU. His behavior is unacceptable and it is very damaging for you to continue to accept, which is exactly what he will continue to expect from you until you show him consequences for his actions. Take control of the bus. Put his things on the front lawn. He can earn his way back into the marital home. For now, he's made it clear that he doesn't want to be there. Show him exactly what the consequences are for that choice. Until now he has had no consequences for his juvenile, passive-aggressive temper tantrum. He's had a subservient wife at home willing to accept all of the blame for the state of the M while he pretends he is single. He will not respect you until you respect yourself. Please forgive me if this seems unkind. It's not meant that way; I just know that a complete change in direction is what is needed for you whether you end up staying with this man or not.

[AllieKat]

Thx Betrayed! Im trying to be strong its so hard because im feeling scared, sad, angry all at the same time. I feel like the next thing i will hear from him is divorce papers. I know this time off is good for us both to cool down but i just cant help but feeling like hes gone forever and that brings such sadness. Dd cried herself to sleep last night and that hurts because i made him leave.

[tojaz]

Thx Betrayed! Im trying to be strong its so hard because im feeling scared, sad, angry all at the same time. I feel like the next thing i will hear from him is divorce papers. I know this time off is good for us both to cool down but i just cant help but feeling like hes gone forever and that brings such sadness. Dd cried herself to sleep last night and that hurts because i made him leave.

 

You did not make him leave Allie, he did that all by himself through his actions. You did everything you could to keep your family together and he shied away each and every time it came for him to hold up his end.

 

How this story ends rests squarely on his shoulders Allie. He knows he has options and that the door is open, but he also knows your not going to be the doormat anymore. Thats something he sorely needed to see, and hopefully he makes the right decision.

 

TOJAZ

[AllieKat]

You did not make him leave Allie, he did that all by himself through his actions. You did everything you could to keep your family together and he shied away each and every time it came for him to hold up his end.

 

How this story ends rests squarely on his shoulders Allie. He knows he has options and that the door is open, but he also knows your not going to be the doormat anymore. Thats something he sorely needed to see, and hopefully he makes the right decision.

 

TOJAZ

 

I hope so because its killing my Dd! She woke up crying and asked if she could go with my sister because she wants out of this house. Everything reminds her of her Daddy, she says. Im going to get her in to talk with a therapist asap because im really worried. She confessed to me via text, she was to afraid to tell me to my face, that when i was in bathroom she heard hubby say im going break the door down and she saw him get a screwdriver and it scared her and she actually went in to kitchen and picked up a knife butput itdown cause it freaked her out. But she thought he was going to hurt meand it scared her.

 

That kills me!!! And shame on him for not acting like a man and letting me alone. I take responsibility to because i should of not even of engaged him in conversation. My poor baby is hurting and is my only concern but she wants her daddy and i cant help her with that

[AllieKat]

I was sitting here alone and i just had to get out and drive i drove all over but needed a few household items and didnt want to go to the local stores cause i just didnt feel like running into anyone and try to put on the happy face, so i went to a walmart 20 miles away. Also i was curious if that was the walmart hubby had been at this am. Now granted theres 5 walmarts within 40 miles and theres no way to tell on the bank statement online which one and it really doesnt matter im not going to drive around looking for him but i was curious and there and sure enough there he was in parking lot sitting. He wouldnt of seen me and i actually was surprised he was there but releaved because he could be out with someone or skipping town but hes still around and most likely sleeping (i hope) in his car.

 

Its almost a good thing he has nowhere to go and how long is he going to sleep in his car? We are in PA and its freaking cold here. So i hope he has a wake up soon and realize what hes got. At the same time i hope he doesnt just come home and pretend so hes got a warm place to sleep

[Yasuandio]

"For the most part" dd didnt know what was going on she was asleep with her door shut till i woke her up. Hubby did talk to her and apoligize to her for fighting with me while i was calling cops.

 

Im sure when or/if he comes home the tension and anxiety will come back. I honestly hope he doesnt come back for a few days

 

 

Quotation Above:

 

(1) Apologies from father to daughter for fighting with wife whilst she phoned police.

 

(2) Wife assumes continued tension/anxiety if husband returns.

 

 

In Most Recent Post:

 

(1) Now you are saying this situation is "killing" your dear daughter.

 

(2) House that reminds her of father.

 

(3) She wants out, to stay with sister.

 

(4) Your daughter "confesses" through text medium a most disturbing revelation:

 

"she was to afraid to tell me to my face, that when i was in bathroom she heard hubby say im going break the door down and she saw him get a screwdriver and it scared her and she actually went in to kitchen and picked up a knife butput itdown cause it freaked her out. But she thought he was going to hurt meand it scared her."

 

(5) NOW you are going to get her into therapy ASAP.

 

Listen, Allie. This is Yas giving you some straight scoop on how to turn your daughter into an Intensity Junkie, as well as unleach upon her the potentiality to develop a myriad of other psychiatric conditions, fears, and phobias, anxietyies, paranoias, abandoment issues, the list goes on and on.

 

I think you know I have never agreed with "YOU" (alone) WORKING ON YOUR MARRIAGE, at the expense of your daughter. Yes, the expense of your daughter's mental health. We have gently, while in denial, tried to refer to it as modeling - but you are now seeing the sign of what it really is - abuse cycle 101.

 

A man, and or men that fit the criterion of this type of melodrama and tap your daughter's learned instincts for a histrionic lifestyle will be her choices. That's what you've been going for here. If you do not draw a line in the sand NOW - and figure this last post out that you wrote of your free will, then it is this type of destiny you are encouraging.

 

I know, save it. Somehow, I don't expect you to take me seriously. No one is going to like this perspective, that is fine, it is only my opinion. I have grown up in an atmosphere like your daughter is living with. My mother and father had a very similar issue/cycle. So, I have been here. And I must speak up now, after reading your last posts.

 

Yeah, "shame on him." Your poor daughter wants her daddy. I am like too worried she is not the only one. And I am praying that you are not preying on that desire. Be very careful - her psyche is her psyche. Do not use your daughter's seeming needs to fulfill your needs. Arrange a meeting place, or schedule time for her to have alone with him. That's it. This web has to come down.

[tojaz]

But obviously - this is hitting a tender nerve for me. Please take over Tojaz and Trippi.

 

>>gently picking up baton<<

 

Yas, I know it is a tender subject for anybody and you are speaking nothing but the truth, but the human psyche isn't quite so fragile that just experiencing trauma like this is a one way ticket to psychosis or a life of intense therapy. Not the least of which is past history or simply a persons own predisposition. If it was that simple 90% of the population would be in the looney bin.

 

It is important that Allie keep DD's best interests in mind, but shes made it clear that she's doing just that. Its important to be mindful of the possibilities, but caution needs to be taken not to turn it into another boogie man waiting under the bed.

 

Allie, speaking from my own experience. Snooping, checking up, and knowing where he is doesn't quiet the doubts and doesn't help in the long run, even though your instincts tell you otherwise. TRUST ME ON THIS ONE!

 

Not to mention, what do you think would have happened had he spotted you... strangely at the same store 20 miles away that he had happened to select? Not good for you all the way around.

 

TOJAZ

[AllieKat]

 

Allie, speaking from my own experience. Snooping, checking up, and knowing where he is doesn't quiet the doubts and doesn't help in the long run, even though your instincts tell you otherwise. TRUST ME ON THIS ONE!

 

Not to mention, what do you think would have happened had he spotted you... strangely at the same store 20 miles away that he had happened to select? Not good for you all the way around.

 

TOJAZ

 

Yeah i realize that! Its funny that is alway the walmart we would go to to not run into ppl plus its newer and clean and not so many scary ppl there.

 

The thing good that came from it was i could tell dd hes ok. She was worried he was hurt or something. Shes a worrier like me she always thinks of others first. Im hoping she can see my counselor this week so she can start to express her feelings and fears. I do worry a lot about her especially since she told me she went to get a knife thats the scariest thing ive ever heard. And i feel so bad because i had to wake her up to get her phone so i could call police or she never would of been involved.

 

I do hope he stays away still but it doesnt stop me from feeling upset or worried. At this rate i have no idea when he could walk in as opposed to before when i knew. That worries more than anything i mean he could walk in at 2am that would scare the crap out of us!

[trippi1432]

>> hand off baton? <<

 

Yas, I can understand your concerns and yes, it's a touchy subject when a child witnesses an altercation. The difference in a child overcoming a trauma is how much they are exposed over an extended period of time or how much drama one creates by concentrating on one specific episode or incident....both can be damaging.

 

Certainly the event scared your daughter Allie, and I'm not going to say that she needs to go through any intense therapy over the situation because I don't recall you saying that there have been many situations like the one the other night. Nor have you really painted the hubby as an abusive individual. I do think that you need to speak with your daughter and give her a sense of the same stability that was there before all these issues presented themselves. There has been some intense stress over the past several months and it seems that both of you have tried to protect her from it.

 

Now, I am going to take the same stand on the following him and seeing where he is. That needs to stop. It's not going to help you or the dd at all. It's only going to peak your anxiety and hers in relation to it. Now I am going to put it lightly what Yas is trying to say....perhaps not in totality. It's more about keeping a check on your own anxiety/drama, it does affect people around you and what they learn. I know it's hard to act "normal" when you are going through so much, but it's not just about how hubby's actions/reactions are affecting her, your actions/reactions can affect her too. There are two people who influence her and those two people are responsible for, as Tojaz said, keeping dd's best interests in mind. With him out of the picture right now, it's going to come down to you keeping her feeling safe even though you are hurting too.

[Oberfeldwebel]

Allie, I have been observing from the sidelines, but think this may be a point to make a comment or two. First I think that you need to take a deep breath. You are so over come with emotion that you may not be helping your cause. From my view point both of you could have handled the exchange leading up to the police call better. These things tend to start out calm enough but gradually escalate until they are out of control. Still violence or intimidation of violence should never be tolerated.

 

I think that you should seriously consider a physical separation with goals and objectives set in place and interactions controlled. First there needs to be a place for one of you to go for approximately 90 days. In that period, visitation needs to be set up for your daughter, she is the true victim her and needs BOTH of you. She also needs a known routine and for the anger to eliminated from her environment. I would recommend no contact except for finances or daughter, for the first 30 days.

 

After that time there has to be a plan for you two to move forward as a couple. This can be family time doing things with daughter, but needs to also be just time with you two. It can be dinner, movie, something and needs to include touching (holding hands, hugs, a kiss). This should be a couple times a week and be for at least 30 days.

 

The last 30 days you need to be escalating contact to include some form of sexual contact. If at the end of this time you two should be looking at how to cohabitate again. Personally I would give this to him as a plan. He is not going to be happy about it, but probably won't be happy with anything you have to say right now. If at the end of the 30 or 60 day marks, he does not want to continue, then you will have your answer. Best wishes to you and your family.

[tojaz]

Yeah i realize that! Its funny that is alway the walmart we would go to to not run into ppl plus its newer and clean and not so many scary ppl there.

 

The thing good that came from it was i could tell dd hes ok. She was worried he was hurt or something. Shes a worrier like me she always thinks of others first. Im hoping she can see my counselor this week so she can start to express her feelings and fears. I do worry a lot about her especially since she told me she went to get a knife thats the scariest thing ive ever heard. And i feel so bad because i had to wake her up to get her phone so i could call police or she never would of been involved.

 

I do hope he stays away still but it doesnt stop me from feeling upset or worried. At this rate i have no idea when he could walk in as opposed to before when i knew. That worries more than anything i mean he could walk in at 2am that would scare the crap out of us!

 

Don't feel bad Allie, you did what you had to do. You can't shield DD from everything... and let him carry the responsibility, he's the one that but her in that position, not you.

 

It's good you can tell her that he's fine, but checking up starts to be like keeping a wound open just to remember it hurts, but everyone does it, an you will too. Just keep it in mind.

 

Keep the door locked and keep a phone close. A reasonable person would announce themselves before returning and if he doesn't you would have every right to call the police for your own concerns.

[AllieKat]

Thanks! Last night i had dd sleep in my room as a "slumber party" with snacks and junk food galore. Truth be told i just wanted her close and within my reach, but i didnt want her to know that.

 

She keeps texting asking me what is going to happen? Its hard cause shes 12 but i still want to shelter her. I told her i dont know but hopefully dad and mom can cool down to learn to talk like adults again. What else can i say?

[AllieKat]

Allie, I have been observing from the sidelines, but think this may be a point to make a comment or two. First I think that you need to take a deep breath. You are so over come with emotion that you may not be helping your cause. From my view point both of you could have handled the exchange leading up to the police call better. These things tend to start out calm enough but gradually escalate until they are out of control. Still violence or intimidation of violence should never be tolerated.

 

I think that you should seriously consider a physical separation with goals and objectives set in place and interactions controlled. First there needs to be a place for one of you to go for approximately 90 days. In that period, visitation needs to be set up for your daughter, she is the true victim her and needs BOTH of you. She also needs a known routine and for the anger to eliminated from her environment. I would recommend no contact except for finances or daughter, for the first 30 days.

 

After that time there has to be a plan for you two to move forward as a couple. This can be family time doing things with daughter, but needs to also be just time with you two. It can be dinner, movie, something and needs to include touching (holding hands, hugs, a kiss). This should be a couple times a week and be for at least 30 days.

 

The last 30 days you need to be escalating contact to include some form of sexual contact. If at the end of this time you two should be looking at how to cohabitate again. Personally I would give this to him as a plan. He is not going to be happy about it, but probably won't be happy with anything you have to say right now. If at the end of the 30 or 60 day marks, he does not want to continue, then you will have your answer. Best wishes to you and your family.

 

Hey ober thanks for posting. I like your ideas about 90 days but im sure like you said he wont want any of it other than just to be seperated from me and divorced. Hes not in a logical place at all