KAS Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 My husband and I have been married for over 20 years. A couple of years ago my husband and I attended his 30 year class reunion in which his first girl friend was there who had been recently divorced from her third husband. She looked fantastic and she is now worth probably millions after her last divorce. Well, I guess I made her mad somehow and she treated me rather badly at the reunion such as she would look me up and down then loving looked at her own body and roll her eyes and then go in the direction of my husband. I felt secure enough in my marriage at that time that this did not bother me in the least. We basically had a good time and made the return trip home and didn't think much about it on the way back home. In conversation I brought it up to my husband the things that she did to me. I was floored when my husband started taking up for her and acting like things were my fault. My husband would also tell people, our two sons included, how gorgeous and successful she was (she was gorgeous but her success was in her last divorce decree!) and seem to talk about her a little too much. I ask that he stop emailing her and he told me "look, she's my friend". I also found out later that during the reunion (after she was mad at me) she invited my husband to go out to her car with her to look at some old memorabilia that she had saved that he had given her. At this same time my husband became dissatisfied with me. I had gained 10 pounds and he wasn't satisfied with my looks but at the same time his sexual appetite increased and he started closing his eyes when we would fool around. He wasn't satisfied with the work I had gotten done in the daytime....nothing satisfied him and he even began acting arrogantly toward me. This went on for several months. I was very hurt and felt very inadequate. I felt that I was no longer the wife that he wanted. My husband has screwed up twice before in our marriage and somehow we worked through things. Before this incident we were happy and had a great sex life. He finally came down from where ever he had been after several months and is now trying to be a great husband, even helping around the house now and I don't think he has any contact with her anymore. But, at this point it's hard for me to even give him a hug and he misses the affection. I feel like I do not want to trust him with my heart again. He said that if I were to discuss this with a friend they would tell me that I should get over it. He doesn't understand my view at all. Well, I just can't talk to a close friend about this without thinking that I'm defaming my husband........so any new friends out there that want to put their two cents in? Link to post Share on other sites
jmargel Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 During that time did he TELL you he was dissatified with you, or was that just your thinking? Closing his eyes while fooling around doesn't mean anything. Don't assume things unless you hear it from him. If he cheated on you twice before I could understand your concern. You have trust issues in this relationship, and it's apparent the two times he cheated on you before are still not dealt with. You two should see a marriage counselor. You shouldn't just 'get over it'. He needs to take a more understanding approach, while you don't assume the worst right away. Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 3, 2004 Author Share Posted August 3, 2004 Thanks Imargel for your point of view. If your boss is unhappy with you but does not come right out and say so, can you tell? I really don't think that I had trust issues until the third time. I do have trust issues now. We have decided not to see a counselor because we have always been able to work through things, but may reconsider if all my husband has to say is to "get over it". Link to post Share on other sites
The_Analyzer Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 The way I see it, is you have 2 choices. You either "get over it", like your H said.(Which I don't think that will happen) The next thing is you go to a counselor. Someone that can help you deal with things. If he doesn't want to go then at least go for yourself. Sometimes people will say they can work things out on their own with no ones elses help, but heres the thing, it may work for the time being, but it will eventually resurface, because it wasn't dealt with properly. Its called a cycle. It will continue until either both or one of you breaks it. Good luck. Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 3, 2004 Author Share Posted August 3, 2004 When I bring up to my husband that he was not satisfied with me for a while he does not deny it. Please give me your opinion....do you think this could all be in my head and everything else just coincidence? If you have been to a counselor please let me know if you thought it was helpful. I have heard some horror stories about counselors. Link to post Share on other sites
Butterfly_Queen Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 I don't think its all in your head, I think you all need to try to work through this if possible. As far as counselors go, you're right, there some that are good and some that are not. Its just like anything else, you want know until you go. If you do go to, one keep in mind that if you feel you aren't being helped then maybe find another one. A counselor can't do but so much, such as, give advice and offer suggestions as what to try or do. The rest of the work has to come from you and your H. Best of luck. Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 4, 2004 Author Share Posted August 4, 2004 If we continue to try to work through this own our own for a while does anyone have any helpful suggestions? Link to post Share on other sites
LolaLopez Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 why don't you get a book with activities you can do to bring you closer together? Link to post Share on other sites
Mr Spock Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 Next time you're having sex, tell him you wished he had a bigger penis, or more hair on his head, or call out someone else's name. No seriously, don't-but you see what he was doing to you? You really should check out marriage builders-I finally went and read it after moimeme reccomended it several times. It's full of information that I feel would be useful to you both. You might want to mention that you might have been as rich as she had been if you'd married better. Yes, I'm a little snarky-but I don't know how you put up with that!! Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 4, 2004 Author Share Posted August 4, 2004 Hey Spock, thanks for the chuckle! Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 5, 2004 Author Share Posted August 5, 2004 Oh, by the way, I have read some of the marriage builders but it seemed liked so much of it did not apply or we didn't need help in the area it was taking us. Are there other good books out there? Link to post Share on other sites
LolaLopez Posted August 5, 2004 Share Posted August 5, 2004 this sounds dorky, but we are trying dr. phil's relationship rescue. hello, but it's pretty good, esp. that two week thing he has you do. also my friend is a marriage counseler and she uses this book called 7 secrets to a good marriage or something. go to the bookstore and browse and see what looks good to you. and approach your partner about it in a non threatening and loving way. Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 5, 2004 Author Share Posted August 5, 2004 I'll look for Dr. Phil's book. This might help me because I think he is a straight forward kind of guy. But, I don't know if my husband would take it seriously because he still thinks everyone would just tell me to get over it. I really wish I could. He accuses me of not showing him affection as punishment but I really don't feel like I'm doing that at all. All I really want is to know that he will always be there for me and that he will ALWAYS be satisfied with me, no matter what exterior things may come along. Link to post Share on other sites
LolaLopez Posted August 5, 2004 Share Posted August 5, 2004 well, that is just his way of trying to get away with his behavior. clearly, no one is telling you to get over it. it is quite the opposite. maybe he is feeling like he needs more affection. my friend once told me: if you want to see a change in your marriage, you do it. so don't negate his feelings, be the example by saying: oh, you need more affection? okay, tell me what you need and i will give it to you. then he will feel more secure and able to meet your needs. he was being really insensitive to you with this woman. but it is a mistake to think that we are always going to fill our partners' needs, or they ours. that is impossible. but we can fill the most important ones, by being the central support system. we strive to always be rooting for each other, to give and accept lots of affection, to respect our marriage and each other and make it the most important thing in our lives. I said strive. it is not easy and we both screw up sometimes. you guys are in a bad spot, but you will be surprised how easy it is to turn it around by letting go of pride. trust me i have been there. it was me who had the emotional affair...well sort of. i definitely felt neglected by my hub and met someone i would kind of fantasize about. it was all about connecting with someone. but i told my husband b/c it scaredme. he was hurt but we worked thru it. we both were at fault and had to be honest with each other about it. it takes two to mess things up. however, be sure he is on board b/c i do not want to see you treated like a doormat. there must be respect. Link to post Share on other sites
LolaLopez Posted August 5, 2004 Share Posted August 5, 2004 well, that is just his way of trying to get away with his behavior. clearly, no one is telling you to get over it. it is quite the opposite. maybe he is feeling like he needs more affection. my friend once told me: if you want to see a change in your marriage, you do it. so don't negate his feelings, be the example by saying: oh, you need more affection? okay, tell me what you need and i will give it to you. then he will feel more secure and able to meet your needs. he was being really insensitive to you with this woman. but it is a mistake to think that we are always going to fill our partners' needs, or they ours. that is impossible. but we can fill the most important ones, by being the central support system. we strive to always be rooting for each other, to give and accept lots of affection, to respect our marriage and each other and make it the most important thing in our lives. I said strive. it is not easy and we both screw up sometimes. you guys are in a bad spot, but you will be surprised how easy it is to turn it around by letting go of pride. trust me i have been there. it was me who had the emotional affair...well sort of. i definitely felt neglected by my hub and met someone i would kind of fantasize about. it was all about connecting with someone. but i told my husband b/c it scaredme. he was hurt but we worked thru it. we both were at fault and had to be honest with each other about it. it takes two to mess things up. however, be sure he is on board b/c i do not want to see you treated like a doormat. there must be respect. Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 5, 2004 Author Share Posted August 5, 2004 Lola, I know exactly what you are saying and the first thing that crossed my mind that I was not giving him what he needed or not stroking his ego enough. So, I asked him what he needed and he said that I was doing everything right (????) I know, even though he wouldn't say it, that at that time he wanted me to look better. So I lost the extra weight, although he lost weight for his class reunion but since has put it back on plus a little. I'm glad to hear that you told your husband. Did he sense this before you told him? I think it's much easier for both to deal with when one will admit their mistakes to the other. Link to post Share on other sites
LolaLopez Posted August 5, 2004 Share Posted August 5, 2004 isnt' there always one who is more open than the other? i am more open, but because it is my nature. i cannot lie for sh**. and I have to let stuff out or i burst. i think that's why i like this forum so much... anyway, i'll tell you what happened with us. well, i had a two yr. old and since her birth my hub had very low sex drive. which was so opp. of when we were dating, he was an animal. so we talk about it a lot and he says he does not know why he thinks it is because i am a mom now and he is a dad and he could not make sense of our roles anymore. ok, so anyway, that is running thru our marriage when I decide to go back to work which requires taking some classes at the same time. i have this very hectic schedule and so i tell him, in order for this to work we are going to have to be awesome to each other. he wants me to work cuz of the $. ok, is he awesome? NO!he is not helpful around the home, does not plan any dates, still has low drive. i'm thinking, this guy is cheating on me! but when? he is home all the time. but i'll tell you, the worst of it was he did not put us as a priority. i mean, when you are married you should make time for dates, even if it is when the kids are on bed and you have a late dinner on the porch. and you should be physical, youshould make it a point to be, i think. i mean,it is such an exquisite way to communicate. andone dayyou will be too old to! so, i tell him and tell him how i feel, how i think things are going wrong, etc, till i am blue in the face. but nothing changes. finally, i am out with some friends, at a book club b/c i love to read (he does not) and i meet this professor who has published books is single, is cute. i do not think anything of it, because i am a very loyal and faithful gal. but it was the prof's reaction to ME that was it. Not seeing my ring, he was all ga-ga over me, stuttering and giving me his phone number and talking too much. i was like floored that someone was interested in me and i didn't even wanna believe it. i kept saying "nah! you're crazy!" over the next year and a half i ran into him more and more as we ran around in the same circles. of course i am a mum so i didn't go out to book club events often, but when i did i'd see him and we'd talk. we had a connection, like any you'd have with any friend who seemed like a sort of kindred spirit. but i wouldn't dare think more of it, nor he. eventually, got to where my heart would skip a beat each time he walked into the room. i could not believe this,madly in love with my husband as i was when we first wed. i began to enjoy that feeling, still not even letting myself think it was an attraction. until one day when things were so rock bottom w/ hub i thought divorce was imminent. i'd had too much wine at a book signing. i asked him if he had feelings for me and horrified, he said yes. i went home. i told my hub the next day. he wanted to go beat the bloke up. but didn't and instead cried in myarms. the professor was an upstanding man who did not dare pursue anything at all. hewould not, not that kind of person. things were not immediately fixed for me, and i still complain to my hub that he does not plan dates. so I plan them! it makes me upset that after all this he still does not totally get it. But i've also found you get what you give. I try to check myself as well. We only have total control of ourselves after all. I think what I learned is that there is more than one road you can take. There are choices. So I could have had a hub maybe who had interests more compatible with myown maybe more considerate and attentive. Sure whynot? But I am choosing this road. So if I am CHOOSING then I better make it worthwhile or else I am an idiot just creating my own unhappiness. I have to say that your husband sounds kind of controlling. Is he or am I getting the wrong impression? And is he very bottled up as well? Lola Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 6, 2004 Author Share Posted August 6, 2004 Wow, Lola, you are perceptive! I didn't think I gave enough of my husband away to give anyone that impression. Yes, he has been labeled controlling by more persons than me. And, yes, he would rather watch TV than talk most of the time. I really think that if I could let go of the hurt and all my other emotions right now that things would be much better between between us but this time I think it's going to take more time and I hope we can get back to the place we were before (and stay there). I think I'm in "protective mode" right now. Or maybe I'm being an idiot creating my own unhappiness??????? Just prior to this we did have the distraction of moving and building a new house but we were still affectionate toward each other. I can't see that anything was wrong prior. I do think it feed something in is ego....Maybe I didn't feed his ego enough. Why is it so hard for men to be vested in their marriage????? I feel that I have been the one that has always worked on our relationship. I suppose men feel that as long as they are "good" (at least for a while, in my case) they can leave everything else up to you and that justifies them as being as good husband. I think mine is really trying right now to be a good husband....I just hope it lasts. KAS Link to post Share on other sites
LolaLopez Posted August 6, 2004 Share Posted August 6, 2004 Yes, I find many of my girlfriends having trouble with the same issues, their husbands being lazy in the marriage. In many ways!!! So weird. I think this new generation of younger men are different. Two of my friends are married to 25 year olds (we are in our thirties) and don't seem to have this problem. But I feel as you do, I am always the one bringing up issues. He almost has never done it. I wanna say never. You keep talking about feeding your husband's ego. Girl, what do you mean? Well, now that I think about it....men do need to be pumped up a little huh? Even if I tell my husband "That is so stupid!" in a discussion, it really upsets him and he'll tell me about it. He can get depressed and then be really unmotivated in the relationship. Well, I guess it goes for both people tho, women need to be told nice things too. Both need to feel appreciated and valued and cherished. You need to remember that even tho it is productive to let go of some neg. emotions, you cannot devalue them and you must know that your issues are very valid ones. AND he has to be 100% on board with this. But I don't think you should go out of your way to stroke his ego. That sounds so old fashioned. And it sounds like babying him. You want a man not a baby! Maybe he needs to let go of some of that ego, that can cause trouble. I'm sure it would be hard for him to do that, though, he sounds like the Manly type? I strive for openness and equality in my relationship. Very important to me since i grew up with a controlling father. But my hub is kinda modern. He is kinda more sensitive than other men. Yet he has still managed to screw things up considerably with the selfishness and lying that was prevalent in our early years of marriage. He has changed a lot though and he wants a good life with me. Just try to keep the momentum going with him. Keep the good feelings flowing. Plan a date. Do you two have kiddos? Good luck to you! And write to me and let me know how things are and if you find any good books that help. I'll do the same! Lola Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 8, 2004 Author Share Posted August 8, 2004 Hey Lola, Once again you have my husband pegged....yes, the manly type. We have three children, two which are grown and one teenage boy at home. I feel my grown daughter is a close friend now and we can spend hours on the phone talking and I think that is really cool. My husband is a real home-body. Our dates are usually a candle lit gourmet dinner and we used to dance the night away in our living room and had a real good time just being together. I just have to be motivated again to feel like dancing the night away. I need to take your advice and "just do it!", huh? I've heard before that if you have to make yourself smile you will feel better so this sounds in the same line. Our teenage son usually has lots to do on the weekends so we do have time alone. It has been really good talking to you. I don't feel nearly like bursting at the seams since I've had someone to talk to. I'll keep you posted on how things are going and please keep in contact and let me know how things are going with you. KAS Link to post Share on other sites
I Survived Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 My husband was contacted by an old girlfriend who lives miles away via an Internet classmates web site. It quickly escalated to them calling each other on the phone or using email every day and there was even an attempt to hook up when he went away on business. He drove hundreds of miles out of the way to be with her. Thankfully, her husband stayed home from work and fouled their plans. It seems she's had an affair before and he does not trust her. I accidently found out about her after he had been "fooling around" for six months. It has not been easy getting the information out of him. We are in couples counseling trying to work through it all. Every once in a while I discover another deception. He bought her minutes for her cell phone and went over the limit every month on his phone. He had his cell phone bill sent to the office, changed his bank account around and even used a credit card that I was unaware of. Most recently I discovered a gift she had sent him. I had asked him in the past if he ever sent her anything. His quick answer was no. Now I find that he sent her something for Valentine's Day. She got the thoughtful gift, I got flowers, a funny card and dinner out only because he felt obliged. I knew he was messing around but I couldn't figure out who it was. Little did I know it was by phone and Internet. While it was going on he was mean to me, did not want to be with me, made excuses to go off without me. He even said he didn't think he loved me. His cheating has caused a lot of pain. I want to move forward but I'm so afraid. How do I trust him again? I never thought he would cheat on me. My whole foundation is shaken. He says it's over and he loves me but he told her he loved her too. I believe him when he says he never met up with her but just the thought that he wanted to makes my head spin. I feel like something precious has been stolen from me. Our lives will never be the same. Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 9, 2004 Author Share Posted August 9, 2004 I know exactly how you are feeling. You know, trust isn't something that you can just give away freely, it is something that has to be earned! And this takes time...sometimes lots of it. I'm betting that he wants you just to forget everything and go back to what you had together before this happened? I think the guilty party always wants this. That way they don't have any work to do. I think that prior to this I had always tried to meet my husbands emotional needs but this did not motivate him to meet mine. I heard a marriage counselor on TV say that it's not the spouse of one who strays that has did anything wrong in the majority of the cases.....it is because the spouse that strayed was not being vested enough in their marriage. It sounds like your husband needs to get more involved in your marriage and become more sensitive to your needs and how you feel instead of only taking care of number one. This would probably help you overcome some of your distrust. I feel your pain of being scared to love your husband freely again....I'm still there....maybe getting a little better each day with time..I think partly because he is trying so hard. Yes, even though they never met up doesn't change the fact that he did demonstrate he had low character and consideration for you, at least for that time period. If your husband seemed like he was trying to work to improve himself and be considerate to you, would this help you begin to heal? KAS Link to post Share on other sites
I Survived Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Dear KAS That's the thing - He is trying! He has been open to me and answered every question I ask. Sometimes I wonder if I ask too much. Today I sent him an email at work and asked him if he would write to her (not to send) and let me read it. I'd like to know what he would say. How would he explain to her how he feels now? How would he explain to her what this has done to our relationship. He said that he would. I have built a wall around my heart for protection. I only hope I don't "force" him to leave me. I want to trust him but........ My inner child needs some TLC. Can't remember what you said...how long has it been since you found out, since he ended it? Link to post Share on other sites
Author KAS Posted August 9, 2004 Author Share Posted August 9, 2004 Is he trying in the ways that are helpful? If not, figure out what would be helpful and tell him. But , like I said it takes time. In my case, I think the other women was never really interested in my husband....I don't think he has enough money for her. I do think that she wanted to prove to herself or me that she could have my husband if she wanted him. It all went to my husbands head and he lived in a fantasy world for some months. The way he treated me during that time was very hurtful....like I wasn't the one he wanted anymore. He finally got a sort of a grasp on reality but didn't want to work on our relationship...just that I should get over it....didn't want to face anything that he could have done wrong. He has only begun to "work" on this is the last few months and I think this is the beginning of healing for us. Your husband needs to be very understanding of you during this time. He needs to understand that he has to earn your trust again. You wouldn't just hand your car keys over to someone that has just wrecked your other car. How long have you been going through this? KAS Link to post Share on other sites
I Survived Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 KAS I found out about her in May but I suspected he was fooling around long before that (last October). It's frightening how obsessed he was with her. Nothing else mattered. They were in constant contact, even when we went on vacation. He had his cell phone on vibrate so when she called I wouldn't hear it ring. He could be sitting right beside me and she would call him. He would go out to the garden shed to call her when he was at home. He called her every work day morning around 6:30. He left for work, her husband was gone. It was easier for him to call her from work. They spent HOURS on the phone. Talking about what??????? He told her he loved her!! Now he's telling me. He didn't think I loved him, didn't think I cared. I did, now I don't think I do. Could that be true or is it just a reaction to the hurt? The thing is, he tried to make me believe it was my fault at the beginning. My mother needed me. He felt abandoned. I was nothing but good to him for months trying to make up for being unattentive to him. I pleaded with him to give me a second chance when all the while he had her..... I have since convinced him that nothing I did deserved his betrayal. How long does it take? I want the pain to end. He says he loves me and wants to make things work. I want to believe him. I have such an urge to contact her or her husband and tell them what I think of them. My counselor says that it would not be a good idea because she will probably not react the way that I need. I want to scream in her face. "How dare you? What were you thinking? Pay attention to your own husband and leave mine alone." Link to post Share on other sites
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