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[butterflybutterfly]

He's never even fed me that 'she doesn't understand me' line. At first he told me that because they don't see each other much and she has a child from another relationship, he just feels like they only see each other for sex. He told me a while ago that he could see them ending within a few months, then after he knew how strongly I felt about him, that turned into 'It could be a few months, it could be a few years.' He refers to her in a derogatory manner when she springs a nice surprise on him that means he has to cancel on me, he says that she's paranoid and suspicious (turns out she's right to be!) but overall he paints a fairly decent picture of her. He acts like he'd never have cheated on her were it not for meeting me, that I do something special to him that no one else does, that we have a spark (crap, crap, and more crap right? Basically I'm more willing to get down on my knees than anyone else for him, that's all it is). Does that make me an even worse person? That I let 'us' be justified on the basis of this 'special connection' rather than thinking 'They're not happy together anyway, she's a terribly girlfriend' etc?

 

frozensprouts, my morals just really went out the window with him. I never thought I'd ever get involved with someone who has a girlfriend. We just hit it off straight from the start, I liked having someone fun to hang out with as I don't have many close friends. He ramped up the joking to flirting and I followed suit, not thinking he intended for us to act on it. Then, one day, boom, it happened, and my sensibilities left me! I just fell for him straightaway - he's he first person I've been that intimate with, the first person I've been in some (albeit deficient) kind of relationship with, and my emotions just got all tangled up in him. I guess with my lack of romantic experience I'm like a teenager infatuated with the only person who's made me feel a certain way.

[veryhappy]

cutedragon, may I ask why you would advise telling his girlfriend when you wouldn't normally? I'm almost worried that I'm unfairly painting him out as a terrible terrible person, I know that he's pretty much a failure at not being a cheating scumbag but in many ways I think he has got a good heart - or is that just me being a complete idiot?

 

You are not a complete idiot, you are just in love. You don't see what a terrible, terrible person he really is.

 

I would normally advise against the OW telling the BW because the OW signed up to the A fully knowing what it was, and that she was a secret to the BW. Why would she change her opinion on that? (and I'm not talking loyalty to MM at all). I could see some exceptions to that like STDs from an OOW, but I'm just talking in general. People who have affairs are usually in M where there is some distance (doesn't matter who caused it). Everyone has a certain degree of denial in their lives and their own narrative about their life, and people consider themselves happier than they are and function by habit because questioning the image of it could turn out painful. 2/3 of spouses who know about an A decide to stay and work on the M, at least short term. It takes 2 to 5 to lifetime to repair a M after infidelity. Why would the OW set that in motion, including the torment and backlash the process could have on the kids if there are any? I believe it falls on the WS who knows the M and his BS best to decide to confess and work through it, if honesty in the M is important to him.

 

Now, in your case, she's only the girlfriend. There's no mortgage, kids, cars, too many memories, too many family dinners and holidays and all that stuff that finds people entangled. She's what late 20s, early 30s? She likely wants kids, and she needs a partner sooner than later. She's not entangled yet with this guy, but if she dreams of the picket fence she has a chance to run away or at least know who he is. That's why I suggest you tell her. For a marriage with kids, I don't see the damage worth it, but in this case you might potentially save the poor girl from dealing with this ****. She might also decide to believe him, and stay with him. Her choice, but she can walk away and find somebody else.

[butterflybutterfly]

Thanks Lady Grey, I appreciate that. I need to sort myself out. Trying to make something work when it doesn't have a chance, and it shouldn't have a chance, is a waste of time and heartache. I suppose because I've been trying so hard, I've felt like I am being pro-active, but I've been trying with the wrong goal in mind. He's not worth trying for.

 

Thanks for your reply cutedragon. I see where you're coming from. She already has a child who she wants him to spend more time with, even if only for the child's sake she ought to know what he's been up to. I don't know her though, so I don't know how I'd go about telling her (I'd also feel terribly guilty about it, I have a feeling the guilt I should have felt all along would come into play when she found out). Plus, he'd go crazy at me. He has stuff on me that means I really don't want to end on bad terms if you know what I mean? I don't think he's the kind of guy who'd show stuff around but I can't trust him. I have dirt on him but if I tell his girlfriend that's it, he'd not have much left to lose.

[veryhappy]

He has stuff on me that means I really don't want to end on bad terms if you know what I mean?

 

Don't put yourself in that vulnerable spot again with anyone. I can only think it's naked pictures or videos.

 

You are too concerned with what this guy is going to feel. He doesn't give a crap about you.

[butterflybutterfly]

I know. Very stupid. He sprang the video camera on me and in the heat of the moment I agreed, he promised to delete it, which obviously he didn't. Rookie error. It's just he obviously has stuff on me to deter me from telling anyone. Plus, the fact that he's so possessive worries me that he'll turn nasty if it ends badly. Urgh, I can just tell I'm going to end it in a really pathetic 'I love you but I can't be with you, yadda yadda yadda' way that won't fully shut the door instead of just putting my foot down and ending it with some backbone

[butterflybutterfly]

I was psyching myself up to end it...then I saw him, and I melted. Chemistry, why do you have to do this to me?! We talked a lot...he can't tell me enough how much he wants me sexually, he was going on and on about how much he's attracted to me, and I can see it, it's like he's almost animal at the sight of me. It's the only time I feel any control over the situation, it's like the only time he loses himself and of course, it's flattering and intoxicating to see someone buzzing with lust for you. But he says he can't give me what I need from him. That he knows I love him but though he likes and cares for me he doesn't love me, that he doesn't want to hurt me, that he feels guilty about her, that we have to end at some point when he gets more serious with her (what? He doesn't want to stop seeing me yet, but he will stop seeing me at some point...It's like he's saying 'I don't want you - for anything other than sexually - but it's going to end on my terms, when I've had enough, because she's more important to me than you.' He knows I am too in love with him to end it so he is cocky enough to say to my face how it's going to be. He told me he would already be with me if he wanted to be with me, but didn't seem to appreciate that he can't really want to be with her either if he's cheating. I can't bear how he feels so differently about me to how he said he felt at the beginning, when it was like I truly meant something to him. It got to the point the other day when, knowing she was at his house when he was supposed to see me, I nearly went over to knock on the door and expose it (I had a moment when I felt at a tipping point and that I had the nerve to do it once and for all, then lost it). It's like I physically can't make myself do it, and as much as I know he is not the man who deserves to be with me, I can't help that all I want right now is to convince him to finish with his girlfriend and be with me. After all that, how the hell is it even possible that all I want is to be his and for him to be mine? I feel so stupid and like my feelings don't mean anything, trampled upon...I'm having a really weak moment. I know full well I need to end it as soon as I can but I literally cannot force myself to do it. I adore him. I'd be telling anyone else to man up and do it but I honestly can't, physically I can't even utter the words. I don't know how I can be so pathetic.

Edited December 11, 2012 by butterflybutterfly

[veryhappy]

You are not pathetic. You are young and in love. It happens to the not so young and in love too, so at least you can blame age.

 

Intense chemistry can't substitute for commitment and respect. Yes, he's downgrading you to a booty call until further notice. I wouldn't be surprised if he andgf are talking moving in together or engagement.

 

He will always keep you around as long as you allow it. ExMM and I shared intense chemistry, and I'm pretty sure he'd whip it out any day, any time if I'd offer (as long as i don't get too old or fat lol- and even so he might consider it). Sex and lust don't mean anything if they're not in the right context. Casual sex does not work for women. Knowing all this, you realize rationally that it will only cause you pain to continue (proof - he's only said hurtful things this past time) and go NC. It's the only way to save yourself from the pain. Go NC now, don't make his holidays happy by getting to have sex win both of you. Slap him back to reality.

Edited December 11, 2012 by cutedragon

[butterflybutterfly]

He finished with me. I'm utterly broken-hearted...I'm lying here feeling sick and so alone and I don't know how the hell I can be without him...I genuinely can't understand him...I tried so hard to make him want to be with me...all I want is him and it's physically hurting me so much, I feel absolutely terrified at the thought of never being with him again...It just came out of nowhere, we were just having a chat and then he turned the conversation into this full-blown emotional episode...I wish I hadn't even been to see him yesterday so this wouldn't have happened. He said some things that really stabbed me in the heart, he was almost trying to make me hate him, and I still couldn't, I adore him and I hate myself for it. The loneliness I feel right now is agonising, it's suffocating, I've felt so broken before but...this is like an awful pained, panicked, desperate feeling, I literally cannot bear the thought of not being with him, and I don't know what to do.

[Lillyfree]

hi butterfly. i'm so very sorry you're hurting.

you mentioned in your initial post that you would like closure... this sounds like closure. not delivered in the kindest way, but it is how it is.

 

your situation has many similarities to mine - just that i was also married and the one to break it off. as far as the AP goes they could be the same guy.

 

what you're describing, the way you feel atm, is how i felt for the first couple of weeks. then it gets easier.

i still miss him sometimes. i still think of him often. but the pain slowly disappears and relief is starting to replace it.

 

be kind to yourself. you will hurt, but it won't go on forever.

[butterflybutterfly]

I just tracked down his girlfriend on Facebook (I didn't even know her surname but I still managed to find her and God I wish I hadn't let curiosity get the better of me). I feel utterly sick. I'm on the verge of messaging her and telling her the truth or even going to where she works and telling her to her face. I'm shaking. I don't know what to do, I know I'm being spiteful. Seeing what she looks like (I know it's bitchy, but good heavens is she an ugly sight), her statuses thinking she's all happy and loved up with him, I just feel this overwhelming hatred and urge to split them up.

[Sunshine87]

I just tracked down his girlfriend on Facebook (I didn't even know her surname but I still managed to find her and God I wish I hadn't let curiosity get the better of me). I feel utterly sick. I'm on the verge of messaging her and telling her the truth or even going to where she works and telling her to her face. I'm shaking. I don't know what to do, I know I'm being spiteful. Seeing what she looks like (I know it's bitchy, but good heavens is she an ugly sight), her statuses thinking she's all happy and loved up with him, I just feel this overwhelming hatred and urge to split them up.

 

Hey there,

 

I'm sorry you are hurting. But pls don't do this. What good can possibly come out of it?

[loredo21]

No! Please don't do this. Especially when angry. It will only make things worse for you and your healing. Part of me thinks she needs to know about her man, BUT give it a little while. Breathe. There is really no good that come out of telling her. I just always advise against making rash decisions when angry. Just really think about it sweetie! You seem like a very smart girl, you can do WAY better. This situation is not for you anymore. Move on and find someone who appreciates you inside and out.

[butterflybutterfly]

But why should he get to be happy with her? He's cheated on her, he's lied to her. He's screwed me up so entirely and he's broken my heart. And yet he gets to swan off and live happily ever happy with her. I've lost everything and he's lost nothing, he's had his cake and eaten it and will go on as if we never even happened. Yes, I want him to pay, and I don't want her to get to be with the man I love when she's the reason I can't be with him.Of course I'm not doing it for any 'good' reasons, although if I wasn't involved in the situation and didn't irrationally despise her, I would think she needed to be told for 'good' reasons (first and foremost being she has a child, who he has no interest in having a good relationship with, and seems to be resentful of. I think she's irresponsible and selfish as a parent for being with a man who she knows couldn't care less about her child and who she knows has anger management problems, but perhaps her motherly instinct would at last kick in if she realised what he's really like. I'm not going to lie and say I feel so sympathetic and sorry for her not knowing what a cheating scumbag she wants to spend her life with, but one thing I do feel strongly about is a little child in the midst of it.).

 

I know that they're unlikely to stay together for long - they only see each other once or twice a week, he himself thinks that when she makes him start to spend more time with her child he'll lose his temper with the child and she'll end it with him. But knowing they're together now makes me feel utterly sick. It's hard enough being without him, let alone knowing that I'm without him because he's with her. Particularly when I can't understand why he's picked her. I know I don't sound like the nicest person in the world from what I've written, but I've been a veritable angel towards him, I couldn't have treated him better if I'd tried. Comparatively, not just looks but personality and the situation, she's simply not the better option, and he clearly can't truly love her if he's cheated on her, so I can't understand why he's choosing her.

[butterflybutterfly]

I am angry at myself, I know I've been an idiot and this should never have happened but that's life, we get involved in stupid situations. The way I see it right now: being without him + him being with her = insufferable agony. Being without him + him being without her = agony slightly less insufferable. I know I will feel better and be more able to move on knowing he's not with her. I literally cannot take knowing they're together. I know I don't have honourable intentions but I really don't see how telling her will make me feel worse (apart from the backlash from him, which is really the only thing stopping me now). If anything it's the only thing I can think of that will make me feel any better.

[whichwayisup]

I am angry at myself, I know I've been an idiot and this should never have happened but that's life, we get involved in stupid situations. The way I see it right now: being without him + him being with her = insufferable agony. Being without him + him being without her = agony slightly less insufferable. I know I will feel better and be more able to move on knowing he's not with her. I literally cannot take knowing they're together. I know I don't have honourable intentions but I really don't see how telling her will make me feel worse (apart from the backlash from him, which is really the only thing stopping me now). If anything it's the only thing I can think of that will make me feel any better.

 

You're not God and you don't get to decide someone else's punishment or karma.

 

The best revenge is to grieve and heal, live your life happily and not let this ruin you as a woman, as a person.

 

Vent away, think bad stuff about him, but don't pour your venom on his girlfriend, and go lurk her, follow her and tell her off.

 

If you tell, own YOUR part in all this and don't put all the blame on him. Own it and apologize to her since you knew had a gf from the start. Also, be prepared for the fallout and drama that follows after telling. Don't run from it, face it and deal with it.