disciplining her daughter

[Mint Sauce]

Hello experienced parents, in particular those in newly composed families.

 

Situation:

 

dating a single mother with a 7yro daughter. She has 60% custody, the father 40%. I don't have kids, and little experience with them (though I like them, and we'd like to have a few more together if life permits).

 

I've only met her daughter on a few occasions, our relationship still being in the early stages. The first contact was good, and so far she accepts me in her life, as someone who is given a fair share of attention by her mother. I think she considers me a good bf for her mother.

 

The question:

 

how should I take up a role as parent, at which pace? Already now, there are instances where I see behavior which should be corrected. It seems a bit awkward to either tell her mother, or to pretend not to notice. Which leaves as an only option that I already step in as an authority figure (not something I'm very good at though...). The little girl seems to have a rather rebellious side, so I feel that if I discipline her, I may have to "stand my ground" a bit.

 

I could view my position as that of a teacher in a classroom, but still, that's different: the teacher "owns" that classroom. I on the other hand am a guest in "her" house...

 

At this point, I've not intervened yet, but that is not sustainable for much longer. Obviously I will discuss this with my gf, but she herself is struggling a bit with keeping the discipline in the household, but still she did not like the very authoritive way her previous bf (i.e. the 1st after her divorce) handled her daughter.

 

Any tips?

[LadyGrey]

You are NOT her parent and it isn't your place to discipline at all. That is strictly up to child's mother and father. If your g/f allows you take that role, I would question her judgement and her own parenting skills.

 

You will never have a good relationship with this child if you take on this role when you are only the b/f and she will rebel and rightly so. You should foster a friendly role model, one she grows to like and respect. It will be much easier for you both if you don't intrude in her life where you aren't supposed to.

[Mint Sauce]

Of course I understand that the actual parenting is done by her mother and father, but many more people in her life will do some disciplining: teachers, grandparents, uncles and aunts, even the baby sitter. I don't think I can avoid taking a similar position...

[Mint Sauce]

when you are only the b/f

 

What did you mean by this? If all goes well, at some point I do hope to be the husband of her mother, she may live in my house,...

[sb129]

What did you mean by this? If all goes well, at some point I do hope to be the husband of her mother, she may live in my house,...

 

 

Its early days though, and until this is a reality, your place is that of a friend.

You haven't been in her life long enough to have the right to discipline her, and the other roles you have described are specific relationships that are very different to what yours is/will be.

 

She already has a teacher, a mother, a father and extended family etc.

Those relationships have specific boundaries- especially in the case of the teacher in the classroom, or in the case of extended family, have been longstanding enough and are permanent relationships.

 

Do you have any children of your own?

 

Its very easy to judge peoples parenting when you're an outsider-

this girl has been through alot with the separation of her parents, her mothers previous relationship and its eventual breakdown- all this can have a huge impact on a child and their behaviour, and their relationship with their parents.

 

Its not your place to discipline her- especially in these early stages. If she does end up living in your home, it would be reasonable to expect certain levels of behaviour, which you should discuss with her mother before the event.

 

In the meantime, as hard as it may be, you need to keep your opinions to yourself unless either asked by the mother or if the behaviour directly affects you in a negative way (ie if she harms you or your property).

[LadyGrey]

What did you mean by this? If all goes well, at some point I do hope to be the husband of her mother, she may live in my house,...

 

Until you are her husband, it's not your place.

[Lois]

Of course I understand that the actual parenting is done by her mother and father, but many more people in her life will do some disciplining: teachers, grandparents, uncles and aunts, even the baby sitter. I don't think I can avoid taking a similar position...

 

Parenting involves so much more than discipline.

 

It would serve you well to get to know this wee girl and gain her respect and trust before ever trying to discipline her. If you go from stranger to disciplinarian, I'll tell you now, it won't be pretty.

 

Good luck.

[mammasita]

Sounds like my situation. I have a son who is with me 70/30. His dad is military so that varies, but he is an active part of his life.

 

Given that the little girls dad is in the picture, it's not your place to step in as a "parent". You should only be a male role model and offer support and back up her mothers methods of discipline. My thought is that you should only offer light corrective advice when the situation calls for it. Of course this can and should be reassessed as your relationship progresses.

[amaysngrace]

I would go easy on the discipline right now and just concentrate on being a strong male role model. Like Lois suggested, get to know her first and gain her trust and respect because you can discipline her all you want but if she doesn't trust you or respect you all the discipline in the world won't matter anyway.

 

But you should have that conversation with your GF about how you see her parenting style as insufficient from an outsiders perspective if you want and offer constructive criticism.

 

How were you raised? Do you have sisters?

[Mint Sauce]

thanks all for your feedback. I didn't expect such a clear message to refrain from disciplining until much later, if at all.

 

A real-life example to illustrate my problem: the other day, we were in the kitchen, g/f preparing something on the stove, and I was sitting at the table with her daughter cutting vegetables. At that point, the kid starts to throw food on the ground, not in anger, but clearly testing me: "What will he say/do?".

 

So, what should I have done? "Honey, your daughter is throwing food on the ground"? I don't think I'll earn her respect that way...

 

How were you raised? Do you have sisters?

I'm intrigued by your question, as I don't see where it would lead...but yes, I have a sister. We were both extremely well behaved, to the point where we needed a bit of a push to live life more freely. We were raised rather strict, but for some reason never questioned our parents authority, no rebellion, ever. I only remember 1 act of disciplining at a very young age: my favorite crayons being taken away (forever) after drawing on the walls when I was 3. I learned my lesson right there.

[Lois]

thanks all for your feedback. I didn't expect such a clear message to refrain from disciplining until much later, if at all.

 

A real-life example to illustrate my problem: the other day, we were in the kitchen, g/f preparing something on the stove, and I was sitting at the table with her daughter cutting vegetables. At that point, the kid starts to throw food on the ground, not in anger, but clearly testing me: "What will he say/do?".

 

So, what should I have done? "Honey, your daughter is throwing food on the ground"? I don't think I'll earn her respect that way...

 

 

I would have probably said - as light heartedly as I could - something along the lines of, "Gosh, sweetie, that's an awful lot of food you're throwing on the floor, I bet it will take you longer to pick it up than it did for you to drop it".

[todreaminblue]

Hello experienced parents, in particular those in newly composed families.

 

Situation:

 

dating a single mother with a 7yro daughter. She has 60% custody, the father 40%. I don't have kids, and little experience with them (though I like them, and we'd like to have a few more together if life permits).

 

I've only met her daughter on a few occasions, our relationship still being in the early stages. The first contact was good, and so far she accepts me in her life, as someone who is given a fair share of attention by her mother. I think she considers me a good bf for her mother.

 

The question:

 

how should I take up a role as parent, at which pace? Already now, there are instances where I see behavior which should be corrected. It seems a bit awkward to either tell her mother, or to pretend not to notice. Which leaves as an only option that I already step in as an authority figure (not something I'm very good at though...). The little girl seems to have a rather rebellious side, so I feel that if I discipline her, I may have to "stand my ground" a bit.

 

I could view my position as that of a teacher in a classroom, but still, that's different: the teacher "owns" that classroom. I on the other hand am a guest in "her" house...

 

At this point, I've not intervened yet, but that is not sustainable for much longer. Obviously I will discuss this with my gf, but she herself is struggling a bit with keeping the discipline in the household, but still she did not like the very authoritive way her previous bf (i.e. the 1st after her divorce) handled her daughter.

 

Any tips?

 

 

As a mother who has suffered abuse and strong discipline i used to get the strap as a girl and it wasnt one or two hits..looking back on it.i was a quiet child who woudl get in troubel for falling a sleeep on a six hour car ride....or readign a book outside when i should have been active.......i got in trouble for fighting with my sister, for telling white lies like i bought a pet mouse from the pet shop and kept it in my sewing basket......it got found ...i got asked to take it back to the pet shop and i couldnt do it ....his name was ben..after the micheal jackson song pretty pathetic huh..anyway i got disciplined..it was ten plus with a strap i have gone the opposite way....the questionable discipline i got was from a step father interestingly enough...he resented me .was it out of love he4 disciplined m ei dont think so.......thats another story

 

 

my girls are respectful and polite friendly and outgoing and they are out spoken i have a rebellious fifteen year old(suffering ptsd apparently from the break up) a 23 year old mentally impaired difficult son a 21 year old son who is questionable..... and two other girls

 

 

my ex used to discipline the boys not so much the girls....when i heard that strap when he disciplined the boys ,my hearing became acute flashing back..... it took me back to my childhood ......not pleasant parts......

 

my girls have suffered through the break up of my ex and i

 

 

they are mostly fine now even understand and want me to be with someone.....

 

 

i would say for you

 

 

talk to the mother tell her how you feel suggest therapy for the problem child or to do family therapy ...or maybe if you have a church you go to ....speak to the pastor or the bishop together about your issues...and how you feel......it would be better for you to concentrate on building a relationship that doesnt have stressors or expectations of reprisals.....

 

 

 

with a broken family.....concentrate on getting to know them all mother and child or children watch interactions dont integrate yourself into a discipline scenario...it will only build resentment...get to know the family be honest with what you feel and work on everything together with th emother....

 

never ill repeat never

 

pull her up in front of her kids ...

 

 

 

you have to truly love someone to discipline properly......if you dont love its not discipline its abuse...you need to love the child before you can tell her what to do it has to be from the right place in your heart..to be effective and true discipline

 

.not what your mind perceives a bad behavior to be but what is in the best interest of the child because you love that child you want her to be the best she can be....and then you can correct bad behavior.....deb

Edited December 18, 2012 by todreaminblue

[amaysngrace]

I asked because I wanted to find out what your style of discipline may be.

 

I wouldn't have objected if you told my daughter that it was wrong to throw food on the floor because its not nice and she is suppose to be helping but that's not helping.

 

If she hung out anyway and did a good job after that, I'd be sure to tell her that and thank her for helping.

 

I don't see her mom being upset by that at all.

[turnera]

Agreed. Not your place to say 'you don't throw stuff on the floor' at this point. Mom will immediately back up her child. No matter what. Because you pushed her into it.

 

Better to find ways to 'teach' without bringing out the punishment. If she continued, however, after you gently 'taught' that people don't throw things on the floor, I would take the mother aside and tell her that you're uncomfortable with this and you're hoping she will take action to use it as a teaching moment.

 

IF there are a bunch of such instances, and a clear pattern of mom NOT stepping in and correcting her daughter, you two need to have a heavy discussion about what life in a joint household would look like. You may end up incompatible. Best to discuss it now, rather than later.

[TG1]

I would suggest staying out of the way altogether and letting her parent her daughter because you are not the daughter's father at all, she has a father, so no need to get involved but yes you should be there only to support your girlfriend when she is parenting her daughter but not getting full on involved only unless you are married to her mother, in which case you are not

[2sure]

If the daughter is rude or disrespectful to You specifically, call her on it.

Tell her you enjoy her more when she is polite. Or that she isn't being very nice to you.

 

Other than that, discipline And behavior corrections are way way way beyond the scope of an occasional guest to her home. Its not your place.

 

If the child's behavior is so disruptive that it is unpleasant to spend time with them together, tell the mom the truth. It's OK. She needs to know. She will step up or she won't. But don't let her tell you to handle it.

[turnera]

The only other thing I would add is that, if this is happening in YOUR home, not your girlfriend's, you have the right to explain to her and her child what you wish to be the rules in your own home. If she can't understand that, run.

[TG1]

The only other thing I would add is that, if this is happening in YOUR home, not your girlfriend's, you have the right to explain to her and her child what you wish to be the rules in your own home. If she can't understand that, run.

 

I agree with that

[sb129]

If it was my daughter, I would have disciplined her immediately had she pulled a stunt like that.

 

If I was at a friends house and it was their kid- I would have ignored it.

 

Kids aren't dumb.

She probably feels a little threatened by you, and/or protective of her mother.

She's also probably a little insecure with the fact that her mother has met someone else and is worried about what that means for their relationship.

She saw what happened with her mothers ex- if he was heavy handed with discipline, that could have been a bone of contention between the ex and her mother, and the kid probably worked out pretty quickly that acting up would cause friction between her mother and her mothers BF- and ultimately it ended their relationship.

 

Kids act out their frustrations, fears and insecurities by behaving badly because they lack the maturity and communication skills to verbalise them- be aware of that with this girl.

 

She's pushing you because she wants a reaction....throwing vegetables on the floor was either a way of getting attention from her mother when you're around, or a way of creating conflict between you and her mother.

 

Let the mother do the disciplining for now.

AS hard as it may be, ignore bad behaviour- I doubt very much its pure "bad behaviour" that requires simple discipline... there are lots of emotions and previous experiences colouring it.

Edited December 19, 2012 by sb129

[Mint Sauce]

thanks again all for your replies.

 

I fully understand that it must be an emotional time for the kid, but she appears very appreciative of me, and happy for her mom. She's asking whether she can get a brother or sister now, whether I'll be over when she's at her father's so mom isn't lonely. I try to give them plenty of time for the two of them, not take too much space too soon. It's not going so bad really, but I want to avoid getting on the slippery slope where she feels that when she's alone with me, she can do whatever she wants.

 

I think I have to differentiate between 2 cases:

 

1) the mother is absent or not a witness of the kid testing my boundaries, and ignoring is impossible (let's say she's drawing on the freshly painted walls of their house, while eyeing me).

 

2) the mother is present, tries to discipline but is overruled by the kid, until some kind of attention diversion works (either by the mom or by me).

 

For the first case, my type of disciplining would be something along the lines of "your drawing is really pretty, but it's a pity that now we'll have to repaint the wall next weekend instead of going to the zoo". An alternative would be "I don't think your mommy is going to be happy about that, come here, we'll play a game together. " i guess the 2nd one is better at this stage of the relationship?

 

For the 2nd case, I'm really at a loss. As the father I'd firmly say "sweetheart, listen to your mom, we don't like you doing this." But now, idk.

[turnera]

In the second case, I would first read up a lot on parenting (in anticipation, you know) and then tell her what you've learned about not letting kids rule the family, how it's actually harmful to let them get their way.

 

It's pretty common for divorced women to overcompensate to their kids to make up for the broken marriage, by indulging in the kids and not wanting to 'hurt their feelings' by being a harsher parent.

Edited December 19, 2012 by turnera

[sb129]

Have you actually asked the mother what she wants you to do?

 

If I started a new relationship, I would like to think its something we could discuss, and being aware of eachothers expectations is always a good thing.

 

You could start by asking her what she expects of you when her daughter misbehaves- use the vegetable throwing as an example.

 

Maybe say something like- "Hey, the other day ___ happened, and I wasn't quite sure to approach it, what do you think?"

 

I would really respect that in a new partner- much more than if they just jumped on in feet first without consulting me.

 

I also think perhaps I might lay down some groundrules with a new partner regarding disciplining my child pretty early on- I'm married to my daughters father, but I have had to tell her grandparents/ babysitters/ friends etc what sort of behaviour we won't tolerate and what is expected of her when we aren't around.

I found by communicating that clearly from the start meant less tension- and esp with the grandparents I think they appreciated having some ground rules.

 

I know for a fact they bend a few of them (mostly dietary!!) but.. no harm done.

[Lois]

And THIS is exactly why so many kids are out of control today.

 

Mint, I don't envy your position at all. I don't do other people's bratty kids well.

 

You'll eventually be in a position where you're expected to live with this kid all the time, support her (if she's living in your house and eating your food and using your heat, water, electric, cable and everything else, then to an extent you're also supporting her right along with her mother and father) and will probably STILL have to deal with the bullcrap of hearing, "you can't discipline her - you're not her father!"

 

Good luck with that.

 

 

You clearly missed the point of my post, it had nothing to do with discipline.

My suggestion to mention the incident in that manner was more of a "dob her in to her mother" ploy. By phrasing it lightly, Mint protects himself from being deemed the bad guy, he gets a glimpse of the mother's reaction -which provides him with information on how to proceed in the future - and it sends a message to the child that he's not going to stand-by whilst she plays her games.

[sb129]

You'll eventually be in a position where you're expected to live with this kid all the time, support her (if she's living in your house and eating your food and using your heat, water, electric, cable and everything else, then to an extent you're also supporting her right along with her mother and father) and will probably STILL have to deal with the bullcrap of hearing, "you can't discipline her - you're not her father!"

.

 

At the moment, he doesn't live with them. So he is right to approach disciplining her with caution.

 

Overdoing it this early on could cost him his relationship.

 

If they decide to live together- totally different ball game with different rules IMO.