I don't know what can I do to reconcil my broken marriage

[shalisha42]

Unfortunately, the only way for there to be help is with two people who are receptive to wanting to reconcile, and he is running from that possibility as fast as he can.

 

Him putting the condition of you not "pulling him back into the emotional state" should tell you all that you need to know. While he probably wasn't always, he is now a very cold and selfish man who is only worried about his own well being.

 

He gives no respect to the emotional toll and the burdens he has put you under. Had I been asked I would say to forgo meeting with him at all, the person you will be saying goodbye to will not be anybody you will miss, that person has already checked out I'm afraid, and i don't think it would be as pleasant an experience as you hope.

 

He is all about self preservation right now and I would suggest you take a similar stance to spare yourself any more hurt. Your rejecting his offer and showing your ready to move on might shock him into taking a good hard look at his actions, but sadly that is a long shot based on how you have described him.

 

Sorry MK, wish I could be of more help, but i think your focus needs to be on the healing process now.

 

 

 

I don't see that as a given in any marriage, be it from across the globe or across the street. Marriage/Relationships are about compromise, balance, and yes at times sacrifice. That doesn't have to be one sided and it certainly doesn't mean one person will be doomed to being unhappy. Marriage is what you make of it, MK's husband chose to make it into a prison, there are plenty of ways to avoid that, he chose to walk away when things got tough. That's on him.

 

TOJAZ

 

Hi. I disagree with your statement "MK's husband chose to make it a prison..."

 

She followed him all around and accommodated him. I didn't see anywhere in her post where she said he asked her to do it. She didn't have a full life of her own, nor did she value what was important to her. In fact, she jumped into this relationship not sure or clear of what she wanted. Her post indicates that she only thought of him - and that's not his fault. She devalued herself.

 

To have a man say that having you in his life is going to make him die (spiritually) really means you have to take a look at how you affect people! She was smothering, demanding, needy, controlling and behaving like a shrew. She comes across as a frightened child demanding that her "parents" take care of her and solve her problems. Sorry, this marriage is over.

[shalisha42]

talking to him today about the process and asked him why can't we try again...he said we tried four years and it won't work..he want breath and he felt pressure being with me...he couldn't be himself. we staying together will make him die. He said personality wont change and he has been thinking about it for the past six months and did gave up

 

It's a done deal. Why do you want this man back? Just for the record:

 

You followed him all around the globe and accommodated him. I didn't see anywhere in your post where he asked you to do it. You didn't have a full life of your own to begin with and if you did, you gave it all up on a whim for a man. You didn't value what was important to you. In fact, you jumped into this relationship not sure or clear of what you wanted. Your post indicates that you only thought of him - and that's not his fault. You devalued herself.

 

To have a man say that having you in his life is going to make him die (spiritually) really means you have to take a look at how you affect people! You were smothering, demanding, needy, controlling and behaving like a shrew.

 

You came across as a frightened child demanding that her "parents" take care of her and solve her problems. Sorry, this marriage is over.

 

So why do you want him back anyway?

[mkrainy]

i wanted him back is because all those years of time and things we went through together.i knew we had lots have lots of down moment..but he used to think we were both good to each other and both are good person. In the past couple months..he became having more request...and i start to think i had problems and so i start to change myself. I didn't complete change myself but i told him i would keep trying. He promised that later on in our life, he would follow me to where i wanted to live that why i followed him anywhere at the beginning. i don't have very good temper and i got mad at little things also. i knew my problem and so i was starting to do better and he said he saw it.

[tojaz]

To have a man say that having you in his life is going to make him die (spiritually) really means you have to take a look at how you affect people! She was smothering, demanding, needy, controlling and behaving like a shrew. She comes across as a frightened child demanding that her "parents" take care of her and solve her problems. Sorry, this marriage is over.

 

Where exactly did you read that?

[mkrainy]

To have a man say that having you in his life is going to make him die (spiritually) really means you have to take a look at how you affect people! You were smothering, demanding, needy, controlling and behaving like a shrew.

 

 

 

I think what you are saying about me is right in some part. I think I am over demanding and needy. He's afraid of me sometimes for telling me how he feel inside his heart. I pressure him too much and he's weak himself too. We tried to work on it start from few months ago, but he thought both he and me can't change. He will have same kind of stress if he still in the relationship with me. He said I am not a bad person and it's very hard to change one person's personality and he's just not the right guy for that.

[shalisha42]

Where exactly did you read that?

 

Go back to one of her initial posts.

[shalisha42]

Where exactly did you read that?

 

Here is her post where he says it:

 

"...talking to him today about the process and asked him why can't we try again...he said we tried four years and it won't work..he want breath and he felt pressure being with me...he couldn't be himself. we staying together will make him die. He said personality wont change and he has been thinking about it for the past six months and did gave up"

[shalisha42]

MK - Have you talked to a lawyer yet about the legal separation and divorce? It sounds like he is cutting off financial support to you which means he probably has and was advised to close accounts so you don't run them up and leave a lot of marital debt.

 

Don't get hung up in what he "used" to say about spousal support, look at what he does now that he wants out. That's very telling. Another bit of advice, don't allow him to continue talking to you the way he has, it's borderline abusive. He doesn't want the marriage, you get that, but he doesn't need to be so disrespectful of what you felt the marriage was. It's more a reflection of his lack of commitment and inability to be married rather anything you have done.

 

 

I have to add to this: Remember, SHE keeps trying to initiate contact with him and SHE keeps wanting to talk to him about the relationship. He told her that if she continued to want to talk about the relationship, i.e, why did it end, give it a few more months, that he was going to start being mean to her because he has already told her so many times that it's a done issue. She is the one that is bringing his cruelty on to herself. She is still pushing and pushing and pushing and wanting to talk about the relationship etc. Since she's not being reasonable, he has resorted to meanness - like he promised.

[shalisha42]

I dont know why he keep challenging my limit. Today I said maybe we could talk about spouse support. I didn't mean I very need it. If he offered, then I might not even accept it. However, after few hours, he paid the current month credit card and asked to close to card. He told me few days ago on the phone that he would take care the card until we legally separated and now he asked to close the card. Just like the spouse support, he used to say he would give me certain amount and now he seem to not willing to pay a penny and said he didn't owe me anything. I just feeling upset not because of the money but the way he became a person that I didn't even know. I didn't understand why even he wanted the divorce, he could change to become a very mean and cruel person.

 

He changed into a cruel person because that's what he warned you he would become if you didn't stop pressing the issue about getting back together, asking him to reconsider, and badgering him about the relationship when he has been more than clear that it's over. But you didn't listen and continued to badger, so now he's being cruel.

[shalisha42]

Even though I cut off all the contact with him, I think I just couldn't get my mind off on having these kind of treatment from my ex after all those years of sacrifice on my job, dream and time and he just walked away without feeling guilty or owing me anything. Being very cruel and rude to me....give up all my friends and family moving to other country, financially support him and give up my dream job for him...How I desire this kind of treatment from him.

 

 

That's exactly what the problem was. You said it all. You gave up YOUR life to accommodate his. Then, when you had no life, you became obsessed with HIS life, smothered him, expected him to be your source of entertainment, friendship, lover and who knows what else. The next time you date someone, do not give up your life. That's not what relationships are for.

[mkrainy]

That's exactly what the problem was. You said it all. You gave up YOUR life to accommodate his. Then, when you had no life, you became obsessed with HIS life, smothered him, expected him to be your source of entertainment, friendship, lover and who knows what else. The next time you date someone, do not give up your life. That's not what relationships are for.

 

 

Yea, I understand that's my problem. I knew it from a long time that's why I insisted on moving back and so I could have my life too. I was hoping he could try to have life here or we figure out which life we could do together and both will be happy. It seem like no solution to him. I made a mistake by pressuring him and at the same time he also said that he has problem about the pressure himself. I knew it's not savable, but it's just very heart broken.

[tojaz]

 

To have a man say that having you in his life is going to make him die (spiritually) really means you have to take a look at how you affect people! You were smothering, demanding, needy, controlling and behaving like a shrew.

 

You came across as a frightened child demanding that her "parents" take care of her and solve her problems. Sorry, this marriage is over.

 

Here is her post where he says it:

 

"...talking to him today about the process and asked him why can't we try again...he said we tried four years and it won't work..he want breath and he felt pressure being with me...he couldn't be himself. we staying together will make him die. He said personality wont change and he has been thinking about it for the past six months and did gave up"

 

Yeah I'm aware of what he said. I have yet to find a post where she describes herself as controlling, smothering, or her demanding her parents take care of her.

 

What he said doesn't really matter because he will say whatever he needs to in order to get what he wants. MK on the other hand still loves him and is more then willing to absorb the blame for the break down when it is pointed at her.

 

"Controlling" and "Smothering" are in the first chapter of the WAS handbook, its an easy way to shift blame, and easy for someone who still loves their partner to believe.

 

It seems your reading an awful lot into this situation that hasn't been stated. Thats just going to do more damage.

 

TOJAZ

Edited January 18, 2013 by tojaz

[shalisha42]

Yeah I'm aware of what he said. I have yet to find a post where she describes herself as controlling, smothering, or her demanding her parents take care of her.

 

What he said doesn't really matter because he will say whatever he needs to in order to get what he wants. MK on the other hand still loves him and is more then willing to absorb the blame for the break down when it is pointed at her.

 

"Controlling" and "Smothering" are in the first chapter of the WAS handbook, its an easy way to shift blame, and easy for someone who still loves their partner to believe.

 

It seems your reading an awful lot into this situation that hasn't been stated. Thats just going to do more damage.

 

TOJAZ

 

Gee, it's so obvious. I can understand why you wouldn't see it. Denial is a powerful tool. Most people don't know how to read between the lines (in this case, he was very blunt). Many people are in total denial. Also, most people don't know what "controlling" means. So here is the definition of controlling: When someone tells you over and over again that they are not interested in a reconcilliation, says they need space, asks the person not to call them, and the other person continues to ask them over and over again, text them, call them and insist, plead and beg for the other to reconsider, it's called controlling - it's also called smothering.

 

You may want to save that definition in your dictionary so that you don't behave that way with any of your lovers thinking the behavior is one thing when clearly it's another.

[tojaz]

Gee, it's so obvious. I can understand why you wouldn't see it. Denial is a powerful tool. Most people don't know how to read between the lines (in this case, he was very blunt). Many people are in total denial. Also, most people don't know what "controlling" means. So here is the definition of controlling: When someone tells you over and over again that they are not interested in a reconcilliation, says they need space, asks the person not to call them, and the other person continues to ask them over and over again, text them, call them and insist, plead and beg for the other to reconsider, it's called controlling - it's also called smothering.

 

You may want to save that definition in your dictionary so that you don't behave that way with any of your lovers thinking the behavior is one thing when clearly it's another.

 

So show me what i have so obviously missed..

 

Yeah I'm aware of what he said. I have yet to find a post where she describes herself as controlling, smothering, or her demanding her parents take care of her.

 

 

..because I didn't ask for a definition, but that isn't one anyway.

 

or her demanding her parents take care of her.

Especially this part.

 

I would also look up controlling again.

 

con·trol tr.v. con·trolled, con·trol·ling, con·trols

1. To exercise authoritative or dominating influence over; direct. See Synonyms at conduct.

2. To adjust to a requirement; regulate: controlled trading on the stock market; controls the flow of water.

3. To hold in restraint; check: struggled to control my temper.

 

Controlling as a psychological term is one person using ones weakness in order to dominate them in to some form of submission. Deliberately and maliciously imposing their will. Asking, requesting, bargaining are not forms of control. Control is about force and submission. Throughout MK's tale I have yet to come across a single instance of her imposing her will on her husband. Quite the opposite in fact. She has asked, made her feelings known, but has yet to relate ever imposing her will. The fact that he all of a sudden described marriage as suffocating says little to nothing about MK's actual behavior, just how her husband chose to experience it when he was relating it back to her after the fact and in a deliberately aggressive manner.

 

MK clearly stated that she followed him wherever his education took him, that he persued the MBA in order to allow for a move to Asia, and that had remained the plan until he decided to back out...... once she was already in Asia. So who was exercising control here?

 

TOJAZ

Edited January 19, 2013 by tojaz

[shalisha42]

So show me what i have so obviously missed..

 

 

 

..because I didn't ask for a definition, but that isn't one anyway.

 

 

Especially this part.

 

I would also look up controlling again.

 

con·trol tr.v. con·trolled, con·trol·ling, con·trols

1. To exercise authoritative or dominating influence over; direct. See Synonyms at conduct.

2. To adjust to a requirement; regulate: controlled trading on the stock market; controls the flow of water.

3. To hold in restraint; check: struggled to control my temper.

 

Controlling as a psychological term is one person using ones weakness in order to dominate them in to some form of submission. Deliberately and maliciously imposing their will. Asking, requesting, bargaining are not forms of control. Control is about force and submission. Throughout MK's tale I have yet to come across a single instance of her imposing her will on her husband. Quite the opposite in fact. She has asked, made her feelings known, but has yet to relate ever imposing her will. The fact that he all of a sudden described marriage as suffocating says little to nothing about MK's actual behavior, just how her husband chose to experience it when he was relating it back to her after the fact and in a deliberately aggressive manner.

 

MK clearly stated that she followed him wherever his education took him, that he persued the MBA in order to allow for a move to Asia, and that had remained the plan until he decided to back out...... once she was already in Asia. So who was exercising control here?

 

TOJAZ

 

 

After this, I'm not going to answer you, because you're obviously someone who needs to be right, has nothing else to do with your time except argue back and forth with someone, and who clearly is ignorant.

 

So here it goes: "To exercise authoritative or dominating influence over; direct." To direct - when someone says "no" and you insist on having things you're way, you are trying to direct another person to do what you want. Badgering someone with phone calls and texts after they've set a boundary is a form of dominance.

[tojaz]

After this, I'm not going to answer you,

 

Much appreciated.

 

 

 

MK, you've been awfully quiet, are you still here?

 

TOJAZ

[mkrainy]

Much appreciated.

 

 

 

MK, you've been awfully quiet, are you still here?

 

TOJAZ

 

 

Hii Tojaz

 

I am still there. I was thinking alot these days and doing the 180. Was reading some WAS forum and book. I haven't talked to him for almost 6 days now. Time go on very slowly. I miss him so much, but I know I can't call him anymore. He has not updated with me about the divorce process....but I still feel that I haven't walked out from the pain and still feel unbelievable with everything happened in the last couple weeks.

[shalisha42]

Hii Tojaz

 

I am still there. I was thinking alot these days and doing the 180. Was reading some WAS forum and book. I haven't talked to him for almost 6 days now. Time go on very slowly. I miss him so much, but I know I can't call him anymore. He has not updated with me about the divorce process....but I still feel that I haven't walked out from the pain and still feel unbelievable with everything happened in the last couple weeks.

 

Well, at least you stopped the badgering. This will now allow him to at least get some distance from you and possibly miss you. The more you text, call, badger, demand, the more turned off and distant he will be.

 

So good you're not contacting him. When and if he does contact you about the divorce, don't get hysterical. Just be calm. Don't ask him for another chance, don't ask him to discuss the relationship. Just accept what he says, then get off the phone or whatever.

 

Behaving any other way will confirm for him that he has made the right decision. In fact, you said that in one of your posts, that he said something along those lines.

 

So just stay cool and leave him alone. Any contact must be initiated by him. Then you must not bring up anything about reconciliation. You want to be celebrated - not tolerated.

 

Trying to convince him to reconsider is sending him the message that you don't mind being tolerated, so long as he doesn't leave you. Being accepting of his decision (even if you don't feel that way) conveys that you can take him or leave him, which may make him think twice. Remember, people always want what they can't have (i.e., money, love, attention). Keep your dignity - and stop listening to other people on this board who are trying to convince you that your behavior is acceptable when in reality, it is undignified, desperate and controlling - meaning you're demanding something from someone who doesn't want to give it to you.

Edited January 20, 2013 by shalisha42

[tojaz]

Hii Tojaz

 

I am still there. I was thinking alot these days and doing the 180. Was reading some WAS forum and book. I haven't talked to him for almost 6 days now. Time go on very slowly. I miss him so much, but I know I can't call him anymore. He has not updated with me about the divorce process....but I still feel that I haven't walked out from the pain and still feel unbelievable with everything happened in the last couple weeks.

 

Thats good MK, it is often best to take a step back when things get to strained. If you haven't already found it, I would like to suggest "Runaway Husbands" by Vikki Stark. I have exchanged a few emails with Ms. Stark and she has a very good handle on these situations, her website has some good resources as well. Runaway Husbands - The Healing Place

 

I would like to tell you that the pain will pass quickly, but I'm afraid that I have to be honest and say that the healing process is a long one. It does get better with time though, and talking about it can be a great help. LS is a start, but most localities have support groups for these types of things, they are usually free and anonymous. Not sure if they are as common in Asia as they are in the states, but its worth a look.

 

TOJAZ

[trippi1432]

Shalisha - I do agree with you that it should not be drawn out, the people on this board did tell her that in the beginning and that he was not marriage material. She should be allowed ONE time asking why and if he is abusive about it, cut it off. How he responds is on him..and abusive as he did, well, I would give him walking papers because I know my worth.

 

Should she drag her heart on for months, pages and even years....No. It's time to heal, not wallow in pain..MK did that already for many years by following him. It's time for her to learn to live for her and not someone else. You can try to salvage a marriage if someone is still in it, living in the home...but to try and salvage it when someone is treating you horribly, you have to regain your dignity and self-worth.

 

My advice about knixing his abusive behavior was to cut him off....she has her memories of what the marriage meant to her. To put herself through anything else is to not let it go with love in her heart for what was and not for the jerk he is being to her now.

[shalisha42]

Shalisha - I do agree with you that it should not be drawn out, the people on this board did tell her that in the beginning and that he was not marriage material. She should be allowed ONE time asking why and if he is abusive about it, cut it off. How he responds is on him..and abusive as he did, well, I would give him walking papers because I know my worth.

 

Should she drag her heart on for months, pages and even years....No. It's time to heal, not wallow in pain..MK did that already for many years by following him. It's time for her to learn to live for her and not someone else. You can try to salvage a marriage if someone is still in it, living in the home...but to try and salvage it when someone is treating you horribly, you have to regain your dignity and self-worth.

 

My advice about knixing his abusive behavior was to cut him off....she has her memories of what the marriage meant to her. To put herself through anything else is to not let it go with love in her heart for what was and not for the jerk he is being to her now.

 

Hi. You know what I believe? I believe the reason people get divorced is because they never really honestly look at the person they are going to marry. What I mean is, often times, it's easy to get caught up in the fantasy of what marriage will be like with someone instead of looking at who the person actually is - thinking that person will change.

 

The signs are always there when you begin dating someone. Somehow, we ignore those signs hoping those things will go away when we marry the person. But the truth is, the person you see at the altar is the person you will see at the breakfast table.

[mkrainy]

I thought about all things i got from the forum and books. I found that maybe my ex and I both were not looking clearly on what we wanted. He was never the type of person that coucould move for me but he always said so and I always natively belief it. I was always the moody one but when he had to sacrifice now, he then used my personality as one of the reason to convince himself that why he should not scacrify for me.

 

Instead of being upset, i should just learn from the lesson. I should not be emotional in the future relationship but at the same time, i should know that he was always selfish and that's just his personality and i shouldn't be surprised.

 

Marriage is both party that need to work on it. If only me want to keep going, its very meaningless. Even i am willing to move this time...whenever in the future that he need to sacrifice , he will want to divorce again and pick on my mistake. Hes just not worth my effort to keep giving up. I should find someone who appreciate it.

[shalisha42]

I thought about all things i got from the forum and books. I found that maybe my ex and I both were not looking clearly on what we wanted. He was never the type of person that coucould move for me but he always said so and I always natively belief it. I was always the moody one but when he had to sacrifice now, he then used my personality as one of the reason to convince himself that why he should not scacrify for me.

 

Instead of being upset, i should just learn from the lesson. I should not be emotional in the future relationship but at the same time, i should know that he was always selfish and that's just his personality and i shouldn't be surprised.

 

Marriage is both party that need to work on it. If only me want to keep going, its very meaningless. Even i am willing to move this time...whenever in the future that he need to sacrifice , he will want to divorce again and pick on my mistake. Hes just not worth my effort to keep giving up. I should find someone who appreciate it.

 

Hi. You never want to sacrifice anything in a marriage. Marriage is not about sacrifice at all. It's about compromise. But you have to be clear on what it is you're willing to compromise before you get into your relationship. You have to be clear on what is negotiable and what is non negotiable. One of the definitions of sacrifice is:

 

" Forfeiture of something highly valued for the sake of one considered to have a greater value or claim."

 

When you "sacrifice" you become resentful and rightfully so. But you can't blame the other person for your choice. You made some poor choices because you didn't know better. You didn't know yourself.

 

Ask yourself what you value in life. What's important to you? What do you hate? What do you love? What are you passionate about and feel strongly about? What are deal breakers for you? These are your personal values. If they mesh with the other person, great. If not, you need to make a serious decision as to whether or not you want to be with that person. For instance, if you value honesty, and your lover is a liar, you will have constant conflicts.

 

So you need to know what the other person values. I don't think your husband was necessarily selfish. I think his values were different than yours. Just because he didn't want to move to Asia, doesn't mean he was selfish. Calling him selfish is a way to not take responsibility for your own inability to identify what your own values are/were. He knew what his values were.

 

He valued being able to be around his family rather than move to a strange city. You valued moving to a strange city not knowing anyone for the sake of a relationship. That's fine. But if you have a partner that doesn't value that, the result is what you now find yourself in - a messy divorce.

 

Your values are not negotiable. His values shouldn't be negotiable either. These are the things you need to look at before you jump into your next relationship - that includes your friendships with women.

[tojaz]

I thought about all things i got from the forum and books. I found that maybe my ex and I both were not looking clearly on what we wanted. He was never the type of person that coucould move for me but he always said so and I always natively belief it. I was always the moody one but when he had to sacrifice now, he then used my personality as one of the reason to convince himself that why he should not scacrify for me.

 

Instead of being upset, i should just learn from the lesson. I should not be emotional in the future relationship but at the same time, i should know that he was always selfish and that's just his personality and i shouldn't be surprised.

 

Marriage is both party that need to work on it. If only me want to keep going, its very meaningless. Even i am willing to move this time...whenever in the future that he need to sacrifice , he will want to divorce again and pick on my mistake. Hes just not worth my effort to keep giving up. I should find someone who appreciate it.

 

I like it MK, it's time to see him for what he is and stop asking what you could have done differently, because your exactly right, whenever it did come time to compromise, he would have wanted to check out again and you would have been in the same situation you are now.

 

He gave you a compromise along time ago, and you held up your part and he backed out when it came time to hold up his. Even though it hurts right now, and this is never easy, it's best you know the type of man he is now before things had become even more complicated or children entered the picture.

 

TOJAZ

[mkrainy]

Thats good MK, it is often best to take a step back when things get to strained. If you haven't already found it, I would like to suggest "Runaway Husbands" by Vikki Stark. I have exchanged a few emails with Ms. Stark and she has a very good handle on these situations, her website has some good resources as well. Runaway Husbands - The Healing Place

 

Hey Tojaz,

 

I bought the book before you even mentioned it It's on my way. Maybe I will update you what I think after I finish reading the book.