Consolidated discussion - "Leagues"

[Treasa]

Disagree. If you showed pictures of different women to 100 men and asked them if she is beautiful or not, number of "yes" answers would be different for each woman. Thus, a clear, objective ranking would emerge.

 

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree. I don't care if 1,000 people feel the same way about something - it still makes it subjective.

 

Let's say a large percentage of the country thinks black people are inferior. It certainly doesn't make it either true or objective.

 

ob·jec·tive

/əbˈjektiv/

Adjective

(of a person or their judgment) Not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts.

[normal person]

Asking other people what "league" you're in is absurd. Let me put this as plainly as possible:

 

HOW YOU FEEL ABOUT YOURSELF IS ALL THAT MATTERS.

 

When people stop getting their validation from others, they will be much happier and have a lot more success.

 

I agree that self-awareness is nice, but this guy isn't talking about his happiness, he's trying to figure out where he stands amongst other people over a variety of metrics. In that sense, I don't think you could be more wrong -- other peoples' perception of you is the only thing that determines where he stands since there is no real "answer." If OP thinks he's the best looking guy in the world, does that make him so? No. If everyone else thinks he is, does it make it so? Perhaps, it's much more likely for something as completely subjective as this.

Edited February 13, 2013 by normal person

[Treasa]

this guy isn't talking about his happiness, he's trying to figure out where he stands amongst other people

 

You perfectly captured why I think the whole "league" thing is silliness. Who cares about being happy with yourself? It's much more important to find out what other people think about you.

 

I honestly think a lot of people would benefit from reading Gandhi's autobiography.

[normal person]

You perfectly captured why I think the whole "league" thing is silliness. Who cares about being happy with yourself? It's much more important to find out what other people think about you.

 

I honestly think a lot of people would benefit from reading Gandhi's autobiography.

 

While I agree with you and think there's a lot of insight to your post, it's irrelevant. One thing I've learned on this forum is that it's usually fruitless telling someone to focus on a bigger issue when they've got a trivial one to worry about.

[somedude81]

You perfectly captured why I think the whole "league" thing is silliness. Who cares about being happy with yourself? It's much more important to find out what other people think about you.

 

I honestly think a lot of people would benefit from reading Gandhi's autobiography.

How do you be happy with yourself when nobody likes you?

 

That just seems to require an extreme level of delusion.

[Lonely Ronin]

lol, it's not delusion, It's called not caring what others think. It's a very powerful personality trait to have as long as it's within limits. Some people fear it, because it makes you very hard to manipulate, others are highly attracted to it.

[ltjg45]

lol, it's not delusion, It's called not caring what others think. It's a very powerful personality trait to have as long as it's within limits. Some people fear it, because it makes you very hard to manipulate, others are highly attracted to it.

 

That means nothing if no one is attracted to you to begin with.

 

Ugly and playing hard to get? Forever alone.

 

All you did was finish digging your own grave.

[Mme. Chaucer]

It must be time for a consolidated thread about "leagues."

 

I'm feeling beleaguered by all these league threads.

[Treasa]

How do you be happy with yourself when nobody likes you?

 

That just seems to require an extreme level of delusion.

 

The irony here is that I'm extremely happy with myself, and I have a boyfriend (even though I wasn't looking for one), and I would still be happy even without one, but I'm the delusional one?

 

I know an awful lot of people who are just totally liked by everyone, but they still hate themselves and are unhappy.

 

Did you ever think that maybe people like me because I'm happy with myself and not the other way around?

[Emilia]

How do you be happy with yourself when nobody likes you?

 

That just seems to require an extreme level of delusion.

 

You need to be very selective about whose opinions and affection you value. I listen to my close friends and my sister but not to some idiots in a bar or in the office or in the gym. You need to realise that people will try to flatter you for their own end or just upset you to destabilise your world. Our senior manager is a great example: he talks to people he likes, he turns his back very publicly on those he doesn't like. Most people are scared of him as a result, if I was bothered by his opinion that much I'd probably change jobs because wouldn't want to subject myself to his manipulation

[Mme. Chaucer]

I'm pretty sure that people whom "nobody likes" are full of self loathing to begin with.

[TheGuard13]

I'm feeling beleaguered by all these league threads.

 

I see what you did there.

 

And yeah. It's getting kind of silly.

[Lonely Ronin]

That means nothing if no one is attracted to you to begin with.

 

Ugly and playing hard to get? Forever alone.

 

All you did was finish digging your own grave.

 

Most people, aren't ugly/unattractive. IMO most people lack a sense of style, or even if they do have one, they don't have one that works well for them. Add in social/personality issues, and that's why a lot of guys do so poorly with the opposite sex.

 

I have no idea who is to blame for it, but as fashion became more prominent over the lase decade and a half, a lot of men seem to have fallen behind in this area. Society as a whole doesn't really help guys in this regard. I mean some guys will shame a guy and call him metro in a derogatory way, and then turn around and complain because women they like are highly attracted to him.

 

 

The entire thing leagues thing is not nearly as simple as how it's debated on LS. Looks, style, personality all play a part, and the lines between them are blurred.

[TouchedByViolet]

I'm pretty sure that people whom "nobody likes" are full of self loathing to begin with.

 

Yeah, the kid who everyone picked on in high school really hated himself to begin with. He definitely didn't deserve any friends and love because he hated himself. I always thought compassion and understanding were the answer but maybe the kid just hates himself so we should make fun of him. When we humiliate him and isolate him it's really his fault anyways for being such a unhappy loser.

[Treasa]

Yeah, the kid who everyone picked on in high school really hated himself to begin with. He definitely didn't deserve any friends and love because he hated himself. I always thought compassion and understanding were the answer but maybe the kid just hates himself so we should make fun of him. When we humiliate him and isolate him it's really his fault anyways for being such a unhappy loser.

 

I don't think anyone is saying that. I think what people are saying is that regardless of what you went through in your past, you can still decide to be happy now.

 

I WAS that kid who was picked on, only it was more in grade school. I was nerdy, had glasses, braces, really frizzy hair, and wasn't stick-skinny.

 

I remember two boys thinking they could take it to a physical level. I beat the crap out of them one day when they tried it. They never bothered me again.

 

Deep down I have a strength and a pride in myself that no one can take away from me. For a long time it was diminished by loathing I learned to have for myself because I put too much stock in what others thought.

 

I remember a time when I was extremely overweight. I would get moo'd at by morons driving in their cars if I was out for a walk. I have been verbally and emotionally abused.

 

And you know what? No matter what happens in life, you freaking get up and keep moving. **** happens to everyone. But you can decide if you want to carry that baggage around and be miserable, or let go of it and be happy.

 

Is it easy to do that? HELL NO. I have to work at it every day, sometimes with very little effort and sometimes with a lot of effort. But good things don't happen to people who just wait for it to come along. No one just goes up to someone sitting on a street corner and says, "Here's an Olympic gold medal in pole vaulting (or whatever)."

 

If you want to be or have something in life, you have to work at it. Including being happy. For some people it comes very naturally, regardless of their lives and how hard they've been. For a lot of us, it takes dedication, will, inner strength and courage.

 

So I guess you can either whine about life's circumstances, or you can buck up and decide how you are going to feel about yourself.

 

I love myself, no matter what anyone else thinks. I wish more people could honestly say that about themselves.

[Mme. Chaucer]

Yeah, the kid who everyone picked on in high school really hated himself to begin with. He definitely didn't deserve any friends and love because he hated himself. I always thought compassion and understanding were the answer but maybe the kid just hates himself so we should make fun of him. When we humiliate him and isolate him it's really his fault anyways for being such a unhappy loser.

 

That is not what I said, or meant, at ALL.

 

If I believe that a person who "nobody likes" is probably filled with self loathing, this in no way impedes my ability to have compassion, understanding and empathy for them. And I don't want to make fun.

 

The bullied kid in school is a victim. But, like anyone, there comes a time when that person needs to take ownership of his or her own life, or remain in the role of victim forever. It's terrible and unfair that some people have such great difficulties when others seem to have it much easier, but I'm sure you know that many have risen from very sad circumstances to create fulfilling lives for themselves.

 

This would be the result of caring enough for oneself to get help, make changes, take risks, etc. to recreate ones own life.

 

So, even though it's a hackneyed cliche, my deep belief is that the first step is to BE OPEN enough to find a shred of self-love to work with. And then to be open and brave enough to take a lot of DIFFICULT steps to leave the role of unloved, bullied, self destructive person behind.

 

I am not saying this glibly, even though I realize I post around here like I think I'm the queen of the world. I know from very serious personal experience.

[Mme. Chaucer]

I WAS that kid who was picked on, only it was more in grade school. I was nerdy, had glasses, braces, really frizzy hair, and wasn't stick-skinny.

 

Me, too, except I was as skinny as an praying mantis, with a gigantic mass of frizzy hair. I have a very bad memory of standing in the middle of a circle of "popular" kids when I was in the 6th grade who were all pointing at me and chanting in unison, FRIZZ-Y! FRIZZ-Y!

 

I hated myself for years, and not just because of things like that. I had some personality / mood / whatever problems and a super dysfunctional and pretty violent home life. I was kind of a "born to die" nihilist and hell-bent on self destruction in my teens and early adult years.

 

It was up to me to forgive myself, and even people who'd hurt me, and make a conscious effort to find the good in things (which was anathema to me). Because I had an epiphany and chose life.

 

Sometimes I think maybe I was fortunate to have become a suicidal junkie. If things had not become so intensely dire, maybe I would just be an ungrateful, self indulgent, destructive and pitiful middle aged lady by now. Or dead.

[Treasa]

That is not what I said, or meant, at ALL.

 

If I believe that a person who "nobody likes" is probably filled with self loathing, this in no way impedes my ability to have compassion, understanding and empathy for them. And I don't want to make fun.

 

The bullied kid in school is a victim. But, like anyone, there comes a time when that person needs to take ownership of his or her own life, or remain in the role of victim forever. It's terrible and unfair that some people have such great difficulties when others seem to have it much easier, but I'm sure you know that many have risen from very sad circumstances to create fulfilling lives for themselves.

 

This would be the result of caring enough for oneself to get help, make changes, take risks, etc. to recreate ones own life.

 

So, even though it's a hackneyed cliche, my deep belief is that the first step is to BE OPEN enough to find a shred of self-love to work with. And then to be open and brave enough to take a lot of DIFFICULT steps to leave the role of unloved, bullied, self destructive person behind.

 

I am not saying this glibly, even though I realize I post around here like I think I'm the queen of the world. I know from very serious personal experience.

 

I love everything in this, plus your two-center taters, or whatever we were joking about when you mentioned the peasant thing a few weeks ago.

[Treasa]

Me, too, except I was as skinny as an praying mantis, with a gigantic mass of frizzy hair. I have a very bad memory of standing in the middle of a circle of "popular" kids when I was in the 6th grade who were all pointing at me and chanting in unison, FRIZZ-Y! FRIZZ-Y!

 

I hated myself for years, and not just because of things like that. I had some personality / mood / whatever problems and a super dysfunctional and pretty violent home life. I was kind of a "born to die" nihilist and hell-bent on self destruction in my teens and early adult years.

 

It was up to me to forgive myself, and even people who'd hurt me, and make a conscious effort to find the good in things (which was anathema to me). Because I had an epiphany and chose life.

 

Sometimes I think maybe I was fortunate to have become a suicidal junkie. If things had not become so intensely dire, maybe I would just be an ungrateful, self indulgent, destructive and pitiful middle aged lady by now. Or dead.

 

I wish I could "like" this 5,000 times over.

[ltjg45]

I'll be happy being in a relationship where I can just aim to make her happy and nothing more.

 

I'm better off being a "slave" at times than actually being equal to her.

[Alma Mobley]

I'll be happy being in a relationship where I can just aim to make her happy and nothing more.

 

I'm better off being a "slave" at times than actually being equal to her.

 

Come again? This makes no sense. Unless being a slave is your kink?

[ltjg45]

Come again? This makes no sense. Unless being a slave is your kink?

 

I'm always down. I don't like my mother and I barely want anything to do with my family.

 

I have no desire to associate myself with others with my same skin color since that is disgraceful enough.

 

In a relationship, I'll be fine doing whatever is necessary to keep the female happy. I don't need the same in return since it won't change anything with me in the long run.

 

As long as she is happy, I feel my purpose has been served. That's good enough for me.

 

At least I can say that I was of some value to someone, even if it was minimal in the long run.

[Alma Mobley]

I'm always down. I don't like my mother and I barely want anything to do with my family.

 

I have no desire to associate myself with others with my same skin color since that is disgraceful enough.

 

In a relationship, I'll be fine doing whatever is necessary to keep the female happy. I don't need the same in return since it won't change anything with me in the long run.

 

As long as she is happy, I feel my purpose has been served. That's good enough for me.

 

At least I can say that I was of some value to someone, even if it was minimal in the long run.

 

What you just said is the epitome of low self esteem. Make YOU happy , not some theoretical partner! And never, ever put the sex you are attracted to on such a pedestal.

 

And I have mommy issues too.

[Jane2011]

Generally, I just consider myself in a not very high league but not in a very low league, either.

 

To the OP, your height and weight are a proportion I'd like. Too tall for me, but the proportion is ideal, anyway.

[e40]

I'm pretty sure that people whom "nobody likes" are full of self loathing to begin with.

Which is the cause and which is the effect?