Will he ever want to see his daughter and leave me in the dark?

[Milo12412]

Dear scattered she has claimed child support it's been settled 6 months sho and that's why we have no longer heard from her, she filed for a paternity test as she wanted to prove the child was his but we decided she was proberbly telling the truth and therefore was a waste of £200 to pay for such

[scatterd]

You do need to move forward that is true. I hope your husband is sincere in changing also. You have a right to talk or not talk to other woman. I dint think you would like to hear the other side. Some of us want to know the details that way we can decide if its worth working on the marriage. Sometimes the men leave the wifes and children to fend for their selfs for the OW just as Tara said. So many children get hurt and it really is sad. Their is no guarantee that your husband will never look back and regret not talking to his daughter. She might be better off with out him and the family It sounds like they cant give her unconditional love. Good Luck

[Milo12412]

Thank you scattered that's very nice of you..... It's difficult to say I agree with you weather this will ever come back and bite us on the bum but it's refreshing to hear someone agree that it is possible to move forward and not listen to other sides......

 

Do you also agree that this is the best way if I've decided to stay with my H matterless?

 

I heard recently on the grapevine the OW had said Xmas wasn't too easy and that she had top much pride to come practically begging again for her child to be acknowledged as she didn't need us it was the recognition or lack of it for her child she finds difficult to cope with, I may sound heartless but right now I don't pity her, and the child knows no different so it's her I look to as she understands and I just don't feel sorry for her maybe harsh? However on years to come I may feel for the little girl who knows but we work hard to make sure Xmas is nice for our child and that she has nice holidays really that's her responsibility to look after her child for those things and if the child don't have them

Then yes it will be unfortunate that her sister does but we know we are financially doing our bit money is exchanged and no love maybe but instead of scraping back through the OW was told that from beginning and they've consistently stuck with that for the past 18 months

[Milo12412]

I spoke to another woman the other day she said that she can't understand how it doesn't eat me up, but it doesn't I just switch off, she said well you can't love him like you should as that's what would kill me.... The fact I loved him and he'd betrayed that, that I'd given everything and it had been chewed up and spat out

Does it make me a heartless person because it doesn't affect me like this?

[TaraMaiden]

No. At best it makes you naive, at worst it makes you an impressionable doormat.

 

You've let him call every single shot, and I think you probably were so low, hurt and vulnerable that you would have agreed to anything, and done anything to keep him.

Well you succeeded.

but I wouldn't be particularly proud of myself if I were you.

because i think the parts of you that you sacrificed, are far more precious, valuable and worthy, than he could ever be.

 

You kept him, but I think you lost a part of yourself.

And that should never happen.

 

Dignity and self-worth are worth a million times more than a cheating, lying, manipulative narcissistic scumbag.

 

I think.

[TaraMaiden]

I spoke to another woman the other day she said that she can't understand how it doesn't eat me up, but it doesn't I just switch off, she said well you can't love him like you should as that's what would kill me.... The fact I loved him and he'd betrayed that, that I'd given everything and it had been chewed up and spat out

Does it make me a heartless person because it doesn't affect me like this?

See.. the bolded part is very revealing.

 

You switch off.

it's not that it doesn't affect you.

It's not that you've dealt with it.

it's not that you've accepted it.

It's not that you're comfortable with it.

It's not that you are aware of it, but you have matured beyond it, and your feelings are stronger than ever.

 

You 'switch off'.

 

Which is a self-protective measure prevalent in those in denial.

'If I ignore it, and turn away, it's not happening.'

 

Switch it off by all means.

But the light-bulb is still there...

 

Hopefully, one day, you'll actually have a 'light-bulb' moment, when you'll be switched on to just what a joke this all is.

[Milo12412]

Tara I know you haven't been in my situation and nor would I wish you to....

 

However so you really not believe that people survive affairs and move on and grow old together and live their days in happiness together?

[TaraMaiden]

Oh sure.

but this is more complicated than that, isn't it?

This is complicated by the fact that he has demonstrably lied to you, repeatedly, contradicted the testimony of other witnesses, wilfully prevented any form of contact with his ex-mistress, who might well reveal facts and matters about him which would prove he's a manipulative lying jerk, and acted despicably towards his own child, by denying her the opportunity to know her own father, and wilfully insisting she is a non-person and does not exist.

 

Sure, if you can "grow old together and live your days in happiness together" under these false circumstances and this fallacious and underhand existence, be my guest.

I couldn't.

But then, I have a conscience.

[Milo12412]

I also have a conscience..... But I also want my marriage to work..... We don't see the OW or the child nor does anything get mentioned, our friends make more of an effort to Háve nights out and do fun things and it's never acknowledged, therefore as heartless ad it sounds when it's out of sight it's out of mind.....

 

Xmas day I did think I wonder if they think of her but our day was just perfect as always in fact it was a little nicer.... He went for a drink Xmas morning I helped my mother in law with lunch then we had s big get together and well I felt connected with him to our little girl it was lovely

[TaraMaiden]

I also have a conscience..... But I also want my marriage to work..... We don't see the OW or the child nor does anything get mentioned, our friends make more of an effort to Háve nights out and do fun things and it's never acknowledged, therefore as heartless ad it sounds when it's out of sight it's out of mind.....

 

yeah yeah yeah... we get it....

Denial, sweeping it under the rug, pretending it doesn't exist, skirting round the elephant in the room... You wait until that needs a schytt. That will create a whole new stink, by the way...

Only a matter of time....

 

Xmas day I did think I wonder if they think of her but our day was just perfect as always in fact it was a little nicer.... He went for a drink Xmas morning I helped my mother in law with lunch then we had s big get together and well I felt connected with him to our little girl it was lovely

 

Oh how sweet. How idyllic.

How very cosy.

 

I wonder if her little girl was just as lovely?

 

She might even be more lovely.... and just as deserving of a sweet, idyllic and cosy Christmas as your own daughter had.

but of course, your callous, heartless and narcissistic husband made damn sure his daughter would always be denied the right to enjoy a Christmas like you did.

 

What a lovely Santa he is.

 

NOT.

 

You're a mother.

Of a little girl.

His little girl.

 

She is a mother.

Of a little girl.

His little girl.

 

You have that in common. You have that undeniable, irreversible and very real connection with her.

 

Have you absolutely no empathy for her on that score at least - at all??

Are you really so shallow that you can play at 'happy families' and believe everything is really okay?

[TaserTag]

I would worry that one day you are going to stop being able to switch off and ignore everything. And then you might realize that you have a lot of resentment and fear built up.

 

One of my friends has been in a similar situation with her husband. It wasn't until her daughters started getting older that she started to really let herself think about everything. Now she is suddenly worried about being a bad role model for her daughters. She is afraid that they're going to grow up and let a man treat them like a doormat, because they've been watching their father treat her that way their whole lives. She picks fights with her husband over random things and has a lot of anger towards him, but she doesn't want to deal with 'being alone' and getting a divorce. Half of the time she pretends that everything with them is perfect and then the rest of the time it seems like she just hates him. It's heartbreaking to watch.

 

I would worry about the message that this is going to send your daughter one day. Some day she will most likely know that her father cheated on you and then it will come out that he cheated on you for many years and the two of you decided to just shove her sister out of the picture and ignore what had happened.

 

Your marriage should still be able to work out if you demanded honesty from your husband, went to therapy to sort through your issues, and learned how to best deal with his other daughter in regards to your own family. You don't have to blindly accept every lie he tells you to make your marriage work. At least, you shouldn't have to do that. Pretending that nothing happened and you're all perfectly happy and secure is, I guess, a way of moving on. I'm not sure that many people would consider it a healthy way to move on, though.

[Milo12412]

Firstly I'm sorry for your friend, may I ask how long ago this was?

 

And you wouldn't exactly say they've survived?

 

We went to councilling for a year until after the big drama with the child support, Bd the therapist agreed with our decision that it was best to cut all toes Ruth the OW as its the only way to make our marriage work and that sadly for us also meant cut ties with the child and start afresh I believe eventually it'll be best for the child as she has chance to Háve a father in her life full time and just won't know any different if the OW meets someone....

 

As for Xmas as selfish as it sounds I was just happy he spent it with us, he didn't have to leave to be with her we have a bust enough day to begin with and well as long as me and our child are ok I don't know anything about the other child to genuinely care, Id argue with anyone that it's just not possible to are or love something

/somebody who you don't know...... I'm certain she had a nice Xmas I've heard she has a nice family so I'm certain Xmas was lovely for her too :-)

[TaraMaiden]

Firstly I'm sorry for your friend, may I ask how long ago this was?

 

And you wouldn't exactly say they've survived?

 

We went to councilling for a year until after the big drama with the child support, Bd the therapist agreed with our decision that it was best to cut all toes Ruth the OW as its the only way to make our marriage work and that sadly for us also meant cut ties with the child and start afresh I believe eventually it'll be best for the child as she has chance to Háve a father in her life full time and just won't know any different if the OW meets someone....

 

As for Xmas as selfish as it sounds I was just happy he spent it with us, he didn't have to leave to be with her we have a bust enough day to begin with and well as long as me and our child are ok I don't know anything about the other child to genuinely care, Id argue with anyone that it's just not possible to are or love something

/somebody who you don't know...... I'm certain she had a nice Xmas I've heard she has a nice family so I'm certain Xmas was lovely for her too :-)

 

JeesuzKerrist... you're the kind of person who is stuck in a flood and watching the water rise inexorably all around you - and you think the sunshine is so pretty and sparkly on the water....

 

Cutting ties with the EX did NOT mean he automatically had to shun and discard his daughter too.

There are ways of cultivating a connection with a child without involving contact with the parent.

Trust me, divorced people do it...

I am absolutely 100% certain - more, in fact - that the MC did not mean you had to completely destroy this child's life in the process.

The Counsellor was advising your H that contact with his mistress was inadvisable.

The decision to cruelly and heartlessly bracket this little girl in the same circumstance was entirely your decision, and very, very wrong.

Wrong.

W.R.O.N.G.

 

The Counsellor was saying your husband should keep his dick exclusively at home, not wilfully destroy his own flesh and blood.

 

The child will not have a father if the woman meets someone else.

The child already HAS a father.

Your husband is her father.

That will never change.

And he's mean, irresponsible, callous, cruel and spineless.

Oh, and a liar. Let's not forget his best quality.

 

And your behaviour is utterly despicable too. You're self-deceiving and hiding your head in the sand.

You've openly admitted you would rather take everything your H. says as gospel truth, and pretend everything is hunky-dory, true and straightened out, because the alternative would hurt too much.

So you've ACTIVELY chosen to believe his lies.

 

But here's the thing:

 

You don't Really.

 

You KNOW he's a liar.

You KNOW he's a callous, spineless narcissist with a mean streak.

 

You chose the selfish route because if you hadn't - you'd be where she is now.

Shunned, ignored and alone, with a child to bring up on £90.00 a month. And no father to acknowledge his daughter her as the fruit of his loins.

You accommodate his behaviour because you're too much of a coward to face up to him, and make him come clean.

 

You should be ashamed of yourself.

[TaserTag]

Firstly I'm sorry for your friend, may I ask how long ago this was?

 

And you wouldn't exactly say they've survived?

 

We went to councilling for a year until after the big drama with the child support, Bd the therapist agreed with our decision that it was best to cut all toes Ruth the OW as its the only way to make our marriage work and that sadly for us also meant cut ties with the child and start afresh I believe eventually it'll be best for the child as she has chance to Háve a father in her life full time and just won't know any different if the OW meets someone....

 

As for Xmas as selfish as it sounds I was just happy he spent it with us, he didn't have to leave to be with her we have a bust enough day to begin with and well as long as me and our child are ok I don't know anything about the other child to genuinely care, Id argue with anyone that it's just not possible to are or love something

/somebody who you don't know...... I'm certain she had a nice Xmas I've heard she has a nice family so I'm certain Xmas was lovely for her too :-)

 

I'm sure that my friend and her husband will survive. Their problems are ongoing and have been for many years (before they even got married, she found him in bed with someone else a week before he proposed, but she still accepted his proposal and keeps on with him). I don't even think that they will ever split up. They are happy some of the time and enjoy the status that they feel comes with being married and having a family unit. The appearance of that is important to both of them. On the darker side of things, I know that my friend has a lot of anxiety and anger over how her husband treats her and how it might be affecting her daughters. I would not choose to stay in a relationship like that, with the lying & lack of trust, but I know that people are different and have different types of relationships and values at play. Anyhow. My point originally was that this might get harder for you as your daughter gets older and is old enough to understand the dysfunction in your relationship with your husband. I assume that you would not want your daughter to ever be in the position that you are currently in. And I do believe that she is going to wonder about her sister and wonder how her dad was able to just give her up like he's trying to do currently.

 

I agree with everything that TaraMaiden has said in regards to your husband's other daughter.

 

I think that you believing that the other woman is going to meet a better man who will be a wonderful father to her child is more wishful thinking on your part to avoid having to look at the ugly reality of this situation. Hopefully she does find a better man, but what if she doesn't? And even if she does find a wonderful man who loves your husband's daughter like his own.. your husband will still have deliberately put all of his issues on to an innocent child that should have been able to count on him for unconditional love & safety. But really someone should say all of this to your husband. I imagine that it is hard for you to look at the other woman and her child without feeling jealous and upset, and I think that it's normal to wish that they didn't exist in your life and that this hadn't happened to you/your relationship. It is a very cruel position that your husband has put you in, and now a cruel situation that he has dragged his children into...

[Milo12412]

Thank you taser tag..... This is it, it's never spoken about and literally everybody has accepted the situation none Of our friends really care as long as me and our child are ok which we are....

 

They all said they didn't care that he's given up on

The other child and not in a heartless way just as in it don't change things with them none of his friendships have changed we still do a lot of group actIvitoes and well both our families have accepted things and feel the same therefore I guess there's nobody to tell him

Such things....

 

Your right it is sooooo so hard to think about any of them and I think that's why my heads buried just because if I don't think about them it's easier to get on with my life..... I don't think about them and therefore can get on with things, I'm

Not completely dumb.... I do know some things what don't add up but I just wish for the 3 of us to get on and try to live as happily ever after as possible...

[TaraMaiden]

....literally everybody has accepted the situation none Of our friends really care as long as me and our child are ok which we are....

 

They all said they didn't care that he's given up on

The other child

This is a lie. You just said a few posts back how your oldest friends have shunned you for the way you've behaved, and you've mentioned previously how you have lost other friends because of this.

You're "Massaging" facts again to make yourself feel better....

 

 

and not in a heartless way just as in it don't change things with them none of his friendships have changed we still do a lot of group actIvitoes and well both our families have accepted things and feel the same therefore I guess there's nobody to tell him

Such things....

Well, there's you - but oh yes. I forgot.

You're heavily into denial.

 

Your right it is sooooo so hard to think about any of them and I think that's why my heads buried just because if I don't think about them it's easier to get on with my life..... I don't think about them and therefore can get on with things, I'm

Not completely dumb....

No, you're not, and that's the scary part. You're actually deliberately calculating. You have actually made a conscious decision to BE this heartless.

 

You have wilfully turned your back on the whole issue because it's so much more convenient to you. It's so much easier to live under the fragile pretence that everything in the garden is rosy.... when in actual fact, your heels are inches away from a landmine.... Before you know it, this is all going to blow up.... It's an explosion waiting to happen.

 

I do know some things what don't add up but I just wish for the 3 of us to get on and try to live as happily ever after as possible...

 

How can you sleep at night - how can you have sex with the man - knowing that he has a daughter he has treated despicably, knowing that he's a yellow-streaked cheating liar? Knowing that every time he looks at you, holds you, kisses you - he did the same to her for 4 years+? How can you honestly never question the things that don't 'add up'.... are you so determined to lie to yourself, to deceive yourself and to pretend that everything is so 'happy ever after' that you let your self-worth and pride take last place?

 

Deceit is the worst crime a person can commit against someone else.

But self-deceit is just despicable, because it just shows how little self-respect you have.

And he continues to have it ALL - HIS - OWN - WAY.

 

Lucky bastard.

Everyone else can go phukk themselves - he has everything precisely as he wants it.

[Milo12412]

Yes your 100% correct I did say that about friends etc sorry I look like I am lying...

 

It should have been phrased as the ppl in our lives now, the ppl we spend time with... The couple we have known the longest as our friends no longer feature in our lives but all the others who we have known just as long and our other friends and both families have accepted things and don't form an opinion and never speak of it and I can't see shy that will ever change as they don't feel Amy compassion to the ow just sorrow for what happened to our relationship and are glad that the dynamics of how our friendships work aren't affected as we have children growing up together and have annual

Holidays together etc

[stillafool]

His mother assists us with child support so it isn't a dent to our finances I meant to add

 

Great! he fathers a child and his mother has to pay for it. That is not a good man. A good man would never turn his back on his own child. A good woman wouldn't let him turn his back on his child. I just feel so so sorry for his little girl who's father has thrown her away.

[stillafool]

Well we live aporox 20 mins away so chances are quite slim, plus I feel too much time would have passed for them to form a real bond would you say?

 

Plus the main reason I dread if that day ever happened is that other little girl may despise our daughter and cause trouble for her out of jealousy that their dad loved her but didn't want to love her....

 

Don't you people even know the child's name? 20 minutes is nothing to drive btw. They are sisters and have a right to know each other. There would be no jealousy if the other daughter had the same rights as your daughter.

Edited January 29, 2013 by stillafool

[TaraMaiden]

.The couple we have known the longest as our friends no longer feature in our lives but all the others who we have known just as long and our other friends and both families have accepted things and don't form an opinion and never speak of it and I can't see shy that will ever change as don't feel Amy compassion to the ow just sorrow for what happened to our relationship and are glad that the dynamics of how our friendships work aren't affected as we have children growing up together and have annual

Holidays together etc

 

Don't for one moment think, ever, that other people don't form an opinion.

That's Bullschytt. It's Human nature to form an opinion, that's how we evaluate things.... If they haven't formed an opinion (that you know of) I strongly suspect it's because they have not been furnished with all the facts, and have been told either only half-truths - or downright lies.

Which, in view of your husband's character, doesn't surprise me in the least.

 

~ ~ ~ ~ ~

 

I don't for one moment think you should have compassion for the other woman.

She was an adult, made her choices and has to accept the consequences.

This isn't about her - it's about your step-daughter.

 

YOUR STEP-DAUGHTER.

 

A child, born to your husband but a different woman.

A Child directly related to your daughter. Her half-sister.

 

FAMILY.

 

SHE deserves consideration, care and compassion.

Qualities which both you and your husband singularly seem to completely lack.

 

~ ~ ~ ~ ~

 

How cosy that you and your friends have children who holiday together and grow up together. You can do this with people entirely unconnected to you - but you have wantonly decided to heartlessly discard a child who by rights, has every entitlement to be a part of your family. A child who is your daughter's relative, a blood-connection; who has far more right to grow up alongside her half-sister than any of these other children will ever have....

 

God, the more you respond, the more it sickens me.

 

It's like you just don't engage your brain to realise what a hypocrite you are being, and how much tactless and insensitive rubbish you are writing.

[Milo12412]

His mother offered to pay to help us financially I guess she done this as spout lives weren't further blown by what happened and therefore it's less effect on our family, is this a bad thing of her to do? I think it's nice!

 

And how can I be a bad woman for allowing him, I've never stopped him seeing the baby and have actually tried to

Encourage him and he's said he just doesn't want to, please tell me how that makes me so bad it's his choice not mine....

[TaraMaiden]

His mother offered to pay to help us financially I guess she done this as spout lives weren't further blown by what happened and therefore it's less effect on our family, is this a bad thing of her to do? I think it's nice!

I think it's utterly dumb.

His mother can't be all that young. She may well be using money she herself may need down the line in case she needs medical care, procedures, and attention.

 

Besides, he should be taking responsibility for his own stupid idiotic behaviour.

In essence - think about this - in essence - HIS MOTHER IS PAYING SUPPORT FOR HIS DAUGHTER.

 

He pays support - his mother pays him.

He's not doing what's right - he's just a middle-man for the money.

You MiL might just as well put HER contribution, directly into OW's bank account and miss your H. out altogether.

Because your MiL is making up the shortfall for the money he is obliged to pay his ex-mistress in support of his daughter.

 

And how can I be a bad woman for allowing him, I've never stopped him seeing the baby and have actually tried to

Encourage him and he's said he just doesn't want to, please tell me how that makes me so bad it's his choice not mine....

 

Because you are complicit in the behaviour. Because you back his decision, even though you know - DAMN IT, you MUST know! - his behaviour is low, despicable and cruel.

You hide behind comments like it's his decision, I never stopped him, I tried to encourage him.... but if you really wanted to expose him for the low-down cheating lying scum he is, you would do the right thing.

 

 

 

I have an idea.

Why don't you write to this woman and tell her, that you would like your daughter and her half-sister to get to know one another, grow up together and have a relationship?

 

Wouldn't that be a compassionate and generous thing to do?

 

It would make him mad, right?

 

So what?

 

His anger is nothing to the huge fall-out that will occur when these two girls find out about each other further down the line.....

 

But of course, you won't.

you value your fragile, artificial carefully-constructed façade of a happy home life... you him and your little girl, just the three of you, living happily ever after in your ivory tower, which actually should be condemned because the foundations are rotten to the core.....

Like the walls of Jericho, one loud bang and it will all come tumbling down.

 

The loud bang being the trumpet sound of eventual exposure of your husband as the worm he really is.

[anna121]

I don't for one moment think you should have compassion for the other woman.

She was an adult, made her choices and has to accept the consequences.

This isn't about her - it's about your step-daughter.

 

YOUR STEP-DAUGHTER.

 

A child, born to your husband but a different woman.

A Child directly related to your daughter. Her half-sister.

 

FAMILY.

 

 

I agree with much of what you've written in this thread. OP is acting pitiably.

 

I don't agree, though, that the child of your spouse's adultery partner is your stepdaughter...or your family.

 

OP does not owe any moral or ethical obligations to the child. It is, though, on her what she tolerates in terms of unethical behaviour from her spouse.

 

If my spouse wrongs someone, it is not my responsibility to remedy that. It is my responsibility how I deal with my spouse about his ethical lapse.

[stillafool]

I don't agree, though, that the child of your spouse's adultery partner is your stepdaughter...or your family.

 

The child is in fact family to Milo's daughter. They are bonded by blood. That little girl has every right to know her father and sister. She should have the same rights as Milo's daughter.

[stillafool]

 

And how can I be a bad woman for allowing him, I've never stopped him seeing

the baby and have actually tried to Encourage him and he's said he just doesn't want to, please tell me how that

makes me so bad it's his choice not mine

 

 

Milo12412;4539979

 

I know she still wants my husband and I know by his reaction how he treat her

when she came round to discuss child support and had the baby with her that he

hates her which makes me feel more secure than ever.

 

It is comments like the above that makes me think you are not a good woman and only care about keeping your husband away from OW you don't care about your husband being a father to his child.

 

 

 

My friends have said there's no chance he will as she's now 9 months old and if

he didn't bother her when was born and didn't bother to contact her at Xmas then

he's not going to all of a sudden care now is he! I know it's our little girls

sister but I just don't think it's fair she ever knows about her as we don't

want her to know her father was Habing an affair since before she was born till

she was 2 and we know she'll ask questions.

^^^^^^^

Here again is proof you don't want your H involved with his child. You are more concerned about your daughter finding out what a whore her dad is.

 

Your friends may not say to your face that your H is wrong to ignore his child but I'll bet they talk about you two behind your back regarding this issue. There's no way anyone really supports a father who is ashamed of his child.