Time to decide the fate of my marriage -- I hate this question, but what is love?

[brandx]

Ok, hopefully those of you who are reading this have read my other posts in this forum and in the OW forum. If not, it may be hard for you to comment without that background. I am not going to detail it fully, but suffice it to say that I have been talking with my wife and coming to the conclusion that I married her when I was 22 and she was 29 after knowing her 1 month because she was pregnant and that I don't think I would have married her otherwise. I have been trying to figure out if we have the values in common to sustain a marriage, as well as the basis for the love. She is devastated and has put the ball in my court to decide if I want to try to develop love with her or move on; or as spock has put it, pi$$ or get off the pot. Here is how I described how i feel to another friend:

 

Basically, here is where I am at. I don’t know what to do. I know for a fact that over time in a marriage, that exciting feeling of infatuation goes away. Even the feeling of being “in love” can fade during a marriage. But I think and feel that you have to have that basic love in your heart to pull you through those times. I don’t think I have that with my wife. But how does one define “love” and that foundational feeling?

 

OK, let’s forget that for a second. Suppose I know what that is, which I don’t. I have to decide in the next week or so if I think I have the potential of feeling that for my wife. If that potential is not there, I have to end my marriage. If it is there, I feel I need to go for it. Problem is, I don’t think it is there, and I am not sure if I would recognize it even if it were.

 

See, I don’t want to make any immature, rash decisions, so I cannot just make a quick one. But I need to be both expedient and efficient because her and my life are on hold until I take a step.

 

What worries me is that I know if it was not for (my daughter), I would not even bother. I would just move on and look elsewhere. But I don’t know if that is because I know there is not any chance, or because of the last 7.5 years, I don’t have it in me to give her a chance. I won’t stay in this just for Mary any more, but I don’t want to just blow it off because I got into for Mary in the first place and don’t have the desire to even consider my wife an option.

 

I realize the grass always looks greener. I don’t really believe this is my case here. I know myself much better now than I ever did. I always loved the feeling of “falling in love”, which was likely infatuation. I have always craved it deep down, at least I did when I was still dating 8 years ago. I think I have lost that need since I have been married; I have logically decided it is unacceptable when married and given it up by focusing on my marriage and surviving within that. You have to be able to sustain a marriage without that infatuation. But I don’t feel anything right now. Haven’t since this all happened. I am confused as to whether that is because nothing was really ever there but my desire to fulfill my commitments or if it is because I have spent whatever emotional energy I have for her and just have nothing left in the tank. Maybe to someone else there is no difference, but to me there is.

 

The true question is can I love her? If I cannot define that love, then I don’t know. People say you just know; does that mean I don’t love her or that I am out of it or that I don’t know what love is, how to love, whatever. If I follow my heart, then it is over. I have nothing in it for her the way I want to love a partner. I hate to admit it, but that is true. And if push comes to shove before I really feel ready, that is how I will decide. I just feel like I need to look so deep inside and really try to see if I can build love with her. Problem is I don’t know what I am trying to build. I have focused on so many feelings other than that love for so long, I don’t know how to measure it.

 

As we talked last night, I tried to get her to tell me about times when she believed that I loved her. When she told me those times, I tried to picture myself then and get that feeling back into my heart. If I could feel that feeling, then I could determine whether I still had it, or if it was possible for me to build with her. Problem is, I could not recapture that. I am not sure that it was ever there. I don’t understand how I could have gone for this long if that feeling was never there. I never doubted that I loved her; I had that rock in my stomach telling me otherwise, but I ignored that. So how could I go on this long and not love her; have no feelings after the infatuation was over. That makes no sense to me. But I cannot remember loving her in my heart the way I am searching for. Is that the truth or me fooling myself so that I can survive this situation?

 

 

So there it is. I know that only I can answer my questions for my life and marriage. I am trying to get a feel for whether my line of thought here is rational, crazy, am I trying to justify things to myself, etc. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Again, I know the decision rests in my hands, but other perspectives are always helpful.

 

Thank you,

 

Brand X

[rble618740]

Your post concentrates on feelings. I don't look at marriage so much as a feeling, because feelings can be fickle and vary from day to day. You can't base a solid marriage on something as transient as feelings. Marriage is a decision.

[meanon]

I think love means many different things to different people. Within the life time of a long marriage, the type of love changes over the years. Love in a long relationship is often characterised by the sharing of the small things as well as the significant things. There are shared terms of reference, shared private jokes and habits. There may not be the intensity of the early stages of love but the person is still the centre of your emotional world.

 

What is your gut reaction to staying with her for the rest of your life?

[reply to rble]

Originally posted by rble618740

Your post concentrates on feelings. I don't look at marriage so much as a feeling, because feelings can be fickle and vary from day to day. You can't base a solid marriage on something as transient as feelings. Marriage is a decision.

 

 

Agreed. Please forgive the brevity, but I have put so much of the other detail up here, I cannot put it all up consolidated here. Suffice it to say that I am aware of that. I realize that maybe I am asking too much in this post. Everyone is going to base marriage on different decision factors as well. I think I have worked out the values, common goals, etc. that need to be there to make that decision, but the feeling of love is escaping me.

[brandx]

Originally posted by rble618740

Your post concentrates on feelings. I don't look at marriage so much as a feeling, because feelings can be fickle and vary from day to day. You can't base a solid marriage on something as transient as feelings. Marriage is a decision.

 

 

Agreed. Please forgive the brevity, but I have put so much of the other detail up here, I cannot put it all up consolidated here. Suffice it to say that I am aware of that. I realize that maybe I am asking too much in this post. Everyone is going to base marriage on different decision factors as well. I think I have worked out the values, common goals, etc. that need to be there to make that decision, but the feeling of love is escaping me.

[quankanne]

what is love? for me, it's that endless well of hope you have in your relationship with another person, and it lays the foundation for a relationship that's solid and firm so that when you are plagued with doubt, it remains constant.

 

you've been married about seven years? I don't know if anyone else can support this, but that's about the time the "newness" of a marriage wears off and you have to seriously take stock in what you want out of that relationship. I believe couples go through that period of assessment every several years because both you and the other person change, you mature as you respond to what you're dealing with in life. So what you felt back then -- what you identified as "love" -- also changes and matures and sometimes isn't recognizeable.

 

I always loved the feeling of “falling in love”, which was likely infatuation … I think I have lost that need since I have been married; I have logically decided it is unacceptable when married and given it up by focusing on my marriage and surviving within that. You have to be able to sustain a marriage without that infatuation.

 

actually, no, you don't. because if you deem your partner unworthy of receiving even your infatuation, you're not giving your relationship a fair shot. Love evolves, but being infatuated with someone isn't limited to the beginning of a relationship; it's what you get when you see a person anew and you respond to whatever it is about them that appeals to you. You have to be willing to have that hope and faith in that person to be able to let yourself experience not just the dreary sameness of your relationship but those little epiphanies about them that make you fall in love all over again with him or her. Marriage isn't static, it just doesn't "end right here" when you say I do -- it's dynamic and you've got to learn be dynamic along with it.

 

not sure if anyone's hawked Marriage Builders or Marriage Encounters as a possible tool to help you in your marriage, but I highly suggest you looking into something like them. The best part of something like M.E. is that you rediscover just what attracted you to your mate in the first place, and you realize that it's something that's ongoing, something you don't have to cut off just because you've hit a lull in your marriage.

[brandx]

Originally posted by meanon

I think love means many different things to different people. Within the life time of a long marriage, the type of love changes over the years. Love in a long relationship is often characterised by the sharing of the small things as well as the significant things. There are shared terms of reference, shared private jokes and habits. There may not be the intensity of the early stages of love but the person is still the centre of your emotional world.

 

What is your gut reaction to staying with her for the rest of your life?

 

Gut feeling -- don't want to spend the rest of my life with her. Honestly, the center of my emotional world is my daughter. That will never change. If not for her, I would move on. I know that tells me something, I just don't want to give up too easily.

[Quilly]

I've also struggled with this same issue and you're right, no one can give you the answer. In the meantime, here's what I've come up with so far (be forewarned, I'm no expert and may be way off base)...

 

First of all, I think that we love people in different ways but for mostly the same reasons. Think about the people in your life that you love and surround yourself with. What characteristics/traits do these family members, friends, close coworkers have that you respect and admire in them? These are likely the same qualities you look for initially in a new relationship. Is it possible that you perceived your wife to have some of these qualities but later, once you really got to know her, realized she did not? Once the feelings of infatuation wear off there has to be something substantial about the person that makes you still love them.

 

Secondly, I think that staying in love with someone requires a strong relationship built on mutual friendship, respect, appreciation, and open communication. If your wife is not the person that you go to for processing your feelings and sharing the ups and downs of your day, or if you cannot talk openly and honestly about problems in your relationship, then how can that love possibly survive let alone grow with you?

 

Unfortunately, falling in love with someone does not mean that you will unconditionally love them forever like you would your child. Falling out of love happens all the time. I personally don't see how it's possible to ever get that feeling back again once it's gone. By that time you know who they are and what they are capable of... you either love them or you don't.

[guest]

I'm glad you asked this because this is something I struggle with. I love my husband but haven't felt in love with him for so long that I don't know if that feeling can ever come back. I love him deeply, like I would an extremely close friend, but I fear that I'll cheat on him because I have no sexual attraction to him at all. I know this sounds sick, but thinking of him sexually almost feels incestuous.

 

I'd like to know whether the difference between "love" and "in love" matters for a marriage. Will the "in love" feeling always go away and we're lucky if we at least have love? Reading a lot of posts in other threads, where it sounds like there's no love at all, I feel very lucky to at least have that.

 

Is it possible to have romance after 20 years of marriage? I don't need to have that tingly feeling, I'd just like to know if it's at all possible to have any sexual attraction or romantic feelings.

[emobat]

I'm ten years into my relationship with my wife, and feeling the same thing right now...

 

I didn't marry her because of a pregnancy, but I know I rushed into moving in with her... and then I prolonged engagement for the longest time. I finally gave in, because I didn't really know what else to do. I didn't want to leave her at the time, so breaking up didn't seem like the right choice.

 

Now we have a daughter, and I really don't know if I want to live the next X number of years unsatisfied, and I honestly feel that if the daughter wasn't around I would probably be gone right now.

 

I totally understand what you are feeling though.

[cherrie]

Have you ever heard of the saying, "The best thing that a father can do for a child is love their mother", well it is true. Try marriagebuilders.com. You have a serious seven year itch. Don't do something you and your child may regret later.

The newness and excitement wear off of all relationships eventually. The trick is in knowing what to do about it!

[brandx]

Cherrie,

 

Thanks for the comments, but if you have read any of my other posts, you would realize that this is not a seven year itch. I wish it were that simple. I have read the marriage builders site and have found some helful tips, but this is not a easy as a "stage" of life or marriage.

 

Take Care

Brand X

[MuzicLuver]

I just wanted to say I really feel for you because I think we all know what we should or shouldn't do as far as divorce is concerned, but when the days stretch out endlessly before us and we're going to be spending them with someone we think we married by mistake is gut wrenching. I think it's difficult to tell someone else what they should or shouldn't do because I don't know the whole story. I don't know you except for reading a few lines of typed script. For all I know you could be my neighbor or around the world from me. This one thing I know, I was married to a man and just after our 12th anniversary, found out he was really gay and that our marriage could not go on because we would both be living a lie. Finally, all the problems we had made sense and we had to realize that we had both made a mistake and that we needed to move on. I don't think it a wise idea to end a divorce over feelings of being in love or not because feelings are fickle. It seems as though many people put too much emphasis on their feelings and we all get carried away with our jobs, familiy stresses, etc. and we forget why we wanted to be with our partner in the first place. We forget quite easily and perhaps it wouldn't hurt to take some time to remember the things that drew you together in the first place and re-visit that with each other. Can life be adjusted to include those things (such as shared interests, shared activities, etc) and clear out the clutter in our lives (such as things we feel obligated to do but really don't have to).

 

As a clarifier....I am not judging anyone nor do I think I have the answers....just some points I have pondered that I wanted to share.

[KissMyTiara]

Can you live without her? Would your insides feel like they had been torn out if she left you, if she died, if she cheated on you?

 

Answer that, then you'll know if it's love.

[brandx]

Originally posted by KissMyTiara

Can you live without her?

 

Yes. Without hesitation.

 

Would your insides feel like they had been torn out if she left you, if she died, if she cheated on you?

No, I would help her pack. No, I would be sad for the loss of my daughter's mother though. And no, I would help her pack.

 

Unfortunately, the only person I feel that way for in this situation is my daughter. Not my wife.

[emra]

Hmm, My thoughts on this are 1st you did have a wonderful child come from this. Which is awesome to have a child.

I do not believe a person should stay in a relationship for children. I know that sounds terrible, but think about it, What are you teaching your child? Children learn what they live. Do you want your daughter to grow up thinking that is life and to go thru it with never really having a connection. To not see love between you and your wife? You can give her all the love she needs. However, if she sees this type of a relationship, it teaches her a lot.

I am sure a lot of people will not agree to this reply and that's fine.

I have 2 children. I am a single mother. Their father and I spilt because there was no love, I was an object. And for a whole lot of things, that I will not go into.

DO you what is right for you. Be happy. LOVE YOUR CHILD!!!

[twista]

All right. Here's my two cents.

 

You've basically said that you don't love her and that you don't think you will grow to love her, etc. Correct?

 

 

Okay then. Is she holding you back from accomplishing your goals? Does it feel like she gets in the way (so to speak)? Do you feel like she brings you down? Do you feel like you could do so much more or be so much more in life if she wasn't a factor?

 

 

By the way, I haven't read any of your other posts, so these questions may already be answered.

 

 

I decided to divorce my husband because I felt he was holding me back. He procrastinates, he's lazy, etc.

 

 

Do you miss the freedom of being a single man? Do you ever feel like cheating (or get tempted)?

 

It doesn't seem like the loss of her in your life would make a great impact on you, so why not go for it? I mean...are you happy? Or is she added weight?

[gettingoutofdodge]

Hey been married 10yrs, just got worse of the years. There are no feelings of love at all. I am getting out, dont want to waste another 10 just for my daughters sake!