Complicated affair

[Brian1]

That's all that has happened so far......."just what you want" and look how well you handled that. How many "I"s so you count in this post? How about "me/my"s? It is all about you and the people you possess.

• What will work for you?
  
• Who you could depend on to be faithful?
  
• Who pisses you off or makes you happy?
  
• What you prefer?
  
• What position you are in?
  
• Who is more fun for you?
  
• Who is more committed to you?
  
• Being left alone would be the worst........for you?
  

You have to be one of the most self centered posters that has posted on here. Two women you play with like a cat with twine. You bat them around to suit what you want and need. Make yourself the focus of attention while their lives continue to pass. Worse, you are teaching a daughter to look for a man just like dad or to think all men are master manipulators. You sir need to grow something that will make you stand up and be accountable to someone else other than yourself. Sheesh:sick::sick:

 

OK, OK, I hear you.

[Decorative]

The truth is that I would fall apart and be miserable without either one of them. I love them both but in very different ways. In the areas where I don't love one, I love the other. And vice versa. A perfect woman for me to love would be a combination of my wife and my girlfriend. So, maybe the theory about married men having affairs to fill voids they have in their current relationship is correct. It is certainly true for myself. This being said, I still feel that getting involved in an affair is the worst thing that anyone could ever do. In the long run, there are only major problems and tremendous pain to deal with. I still say to those wannabes, DON'T DO IT!

 

The theory that is better supported is that men who don't give enough to their relationship tend to stray.

 

That's what I see as I read your story from start to now.

 

But aside from that- if neither woman is enough on her own- let them both go. They deserve to be loved and appreciated and honored without restriction.

[Survivor12]

I say DON'T DO IT! because I know the long term results are only pain and suffering. But if someone is already involved in an affair, I say GOOD LUCK! I wish you and all involved the best.

 

But can you not see the hypocrisy in your words? You say here that you wish the best for "all involved", yet you continue to deny your wife--and your mistress--the right to decide for themselves what is best for them.

[Brian1]

He's not indecisive. He wants his wife, but doesn't want to go through the pain of setting things right. He's also reticent to let go of a woman he doesn't want, but who's fun in the sheets and hey, he bought her youth and her uterus so why not enjoy that for longer. She could be fun 15-20 more years.

 

He's classic clearing MM. He wants it all, and he'll play both sides until the very last minute. That's the sick part about it. He's using everyone and only looking out for himself.

 

I agree that my scheme is sick and unfair. But I am not exaggerating in any way when I say that my wife is extremely happy right now and has been for our entire 23 years together. My girlfriend is very happy and living a life way beyond her dreams but she has the most uncertainties of anyone involved in this. I understand that many posters are very bitter and angry because of their own bad experiences with an affair or relationship but I think it would be more constructive to comment objectively instead of subjectively. But anyhow, I appreciate all comments.

[Survivor12]

I agree that my scheme is sick and unfair. But I am not exaggerating in any way when I say that my wife is extremely happy right now and has been for our entire 23 years together. My girlfriend is very happy and living a life way beyond her dreams but she has the most uncertainties of anyone involved in this. I understand that many posters are very bitter and angry because of their own bad experiences with an affair or relationship but I think it would be more constructive to comment objectively instead of subjectively. But anyhow, I appreciate all comments.

 

I have not had an affair nor been a BS--my opinions ARE objective.

[Brian1]

I have not had an affair nor been a BS--my opinions ARE objective.

 

OK, then I'm not referring to you. Thanks for your objectivity.

[Decorative]

OK, then I'm not referring to you. Thanks for your objectivity.

 

You should consider what some of us "bitter" betrayeds are saying.

 

After all- we've been in your wife's shoes. Remember her? The one you claim to love and say you'd prefer?

 

We've done the work. Some of us have reconciled marriages and know the level of heroic work it takes. Some of us have divorced- and know the sheer strength it takes.

 

So be careful about who you dismiss.

[Brian1]

You should consider what some of us "bitter" betrayeds are saying.

 

After all- we've been in your wife's shoes. Remember her? The one you claim to love and say you'd prefer?

 

We've done the work. Some of us have reconciled marriages and know the level of heroic work it takes. Some of us have divorced- and know the sheer strength it takes.

 

So be careful about who you dismiss.

 

Good point. I'll take the bad with the good. The more input the better.

[ThatJustHappened]

Hey realist3, in response to your earlier comment, yes I would prefer to live the rest of my life with my wife with visitations with my daughter. But I could also be very happy living the rest of my life with my girlfriend and being with my daughter constantly. The difficult part for me is whoever I stay with, I will really, really miss the other who I don't stay with. And also the 3rd possibility would be that I get left alone and the two women also get left alone. That would be the worst for me, obviously. Up to this minute, I have good and bad moments with each woman. When I am having a bad moment with my girlfriend, I always think I would much rather be with my wife. And of course when I have bad moments with my wife, I always think I would much rather be with my girlfriend. And this goes back and forth several times each day in my mind. My life with my girlfriend and my daughter would be much more alive and fun. But my wife is 100% committed to me and completely loyal and faithful. I don't know how my girlfriend would be over the long term. It's a high risk gamble to go completely with my girlfriend. If all goes well, it would be just what I want. But if it doesn't go well, then I would be in a very,very bad position. So I don't know what the hell to do. Each day is very different from the previous. It's like a vicious roller-coaster.

As far as her family goes, yes I'm fine with them. I've always got along well with her sisters, especially the one who is closest to her.

 

It's not really going to be up to you to choose who 'you stay with'. It will be up to them whether or not they want to stay with you. Frankly I wouldn't be surprised if both of them dumped you in the end..and it would be well deserved.

[seren]

Brian, I came onto the thread expecting to read that you had at the very least, considered the way forward. Instead I read that you are no further along than having blue sky thoughts about moving the OW, your child in with you and your wife, I get that in your Ideal World scenario this might be the way you would like things to work out - who knows, maybe the truth will enable your wife to move in a younger man and you can all be happy. Meanwhile, In the Real World, you are still maintaining a life that relies on creating a false reality for your wife. Surely after all the time, life experience, love, respect, trust and loyalty she has shown you, she deserves better. She at the very least should be given the right to make an informed choice about her life, even if only for all those qualities that you say make you want to stay and love her.

 

I have never heard of such a messed up situation, please take a step back and look at what you are doing and how you are trying to make excuses for it continuing. You are putting off the inevitable. In doing so, you are robbing you wife of the chance to find someone else and make a new life, you are denying the OW the chance to make a new life, I am presuming she doesn't know you still love your wife, most importantly, your daughter is being forced to be a secret and not able to have an open and honest relationship with her Daddy. You can change this, it will be hard however you decide, but no one should have this amount of power over others lives.

 

I really think it will end in a far worse way if the A and your daughter are discovered, rather than you doing the right thing and bringing it all out into the open, taking whatever the fallout is and then trying to plan the rest of your life - leaving the others to plan and have autonomy over theirs. Come on Brian, just do the right thing and not just for you.

 

Just a thought Brian, but if you have given the business to the OW, even if it signed over to your daughter, can she just go ahead and sell it and if so, shouldn't the money be held in trust for your daughter? I also wonder if and when your wife finds out, can she claim half of the business as she has supported you all these years? Just some thoughts I had and wondered if you had thought about this too.

Edited February 4, 2013 by seren

[2sunny]

What is your OW's attitude when you asked for results of a paternity test?

[2sunny]

I hear exactly what you're saying. I'm in the reverse position as most MM's. Often I have thought that she is taking advantage of me just to get the money, but then I talk to her in depth and she convinces me of her dedication. And every time I have had suspicions of one thing or another, after thorough investigation, I always find my suspicions unfounded. Also, many times she has said she can get a full time job and support herself and she will still stay with me exactly as she is now. But I always declined because I want her to take care of and be with our daughter 100%. Although over the last 6 weeks she has been slipping quite a bit, which really upsets me.

 

But she's not with your D 100% of the time.

 

And 15 years from now your D will be off to college and have her own life - so thinking that you need to be EVERYTHING or her Mom needs to be her EVERYTHING is terribly unrealistic.

 

When they are babies, yes. When the get older, no.

 

You will eventually be left on your own with the OW - IF you end up marrying her.

[veryhappy]

I agree that my scheme is sick and unfair. But I am not exaggerating in any way when I say that my wife is extremely happy right now and has been for our entire 23 years together. My girlfriend is very happy and living a life way beyond her dreams but she has the most uncertainties of anyone involved in this. I understand that many posters are very bitter and angry because of their own bad experiences with an affair or relationship but I think it would be more constructive to comment objectively instead of subjectively. But anyhow, I appreciate all comments.

 

I am bitter and angry because I am projecting my life experiences into this. You don't respect your daughter, you don't respect your wife and you don't respect your OW. You are all facade.

 

If I could, I'd give you a shake. Nobody is happy besides you. And maybe your daughter( for now), with the innocence of her age and not understanding what is going on.

 

Fact: your W has suspected your OW child might be yours. That is not a happy woman, except the moments of deep denial that she needs to pretend she's not worried.

 

Fact: you have made your OW promises of a life and future together. She didn't hope the two of you would marry in a vaccum. I can guarantee you as a bitter and angry discarded OW that she is not happy.

 

You are living in la la land and the only reason I am writing on this topic is that the last thing the world needs is another woman with daddy issues. And that will be your daughter.

[2sunny]

Which man was on the birth certificate as the child's father? Do you have any rights through your court system, or have you all made your daughter the secret?

[Brian1]

Brian, I came onto the thread expecting to read that you had at the very least, considered the way forward. Instead I read that you are no further along than having blue sky thoughts about moving the OW, your child in with you and your wife, I get that in your Ideal World scenario this might be the way you would like things to work out - who knows, maybe the truth will enable your wife to move in a younger man and you can all be happy. Meanwhile, In the Real World, you are still maintaining a life that relies on creating a false reality for your wife. Surely after all the time, life experience, love, respect, trust and loyalty she has shown you, she deserves better. She at the very least should be given the right to make an informed choice about her life, even if only for all those qualities that you say make you want to stay and love her.

 

I have never heard of such a messed up situation, please take a step back and look at what you are doing and how you are trying to make excuses for it continuing. You are putting off the inevitable. In doing so, you are robbing you wife of the chance to find someone else and make a new life, you are denying the OW the chance to make a new life, I am presuming she doesn't know you still love your wife, most importantly, your daughter is being forced to be a secret and not able to have an open and honest relationship with her Daddy. You can change this, it will be hard however you decide, but no one should have this amount of power over others lives.

 

I really think it will end in a far worse way if the A and your daughter are discovered, rather than you doing the right thing and bringing it all out into the open, taking whatever the fallout is and then trying to plan the rest of your life - leaving the others to plan and have autonomy over theirs. Come on Brian, just do the right thing and not just for you.

 

Just a thought Brian, but if you have given the business to the OW, even if it signed over to your daughter, can she just go ahead and sell it and if so, shouldn't the money be held in trust for your daughter? I also wonder if and when your wife finds out, can she claim half of the business as she has supported you all these years? Just some thoughts I had and wondered if you had thought about this too.

 

First of all, my girlfriend knows that I love my wife very much. I even asked my girlfriend if I were to divorce my wife, would she marry me and be happy. She said she would absolutely marry me and be happy and that would be a dream come true. But she also said she definitely does not want to break up my marriage.

As far as the business goes, it is 100% that of my girlfriend. The house where they live is in the name of my daughter and can not be sold until my daughter is at least 18 years old.

[Brian1]

What is your OW's attitude when you asked for results of a paternity test?

 

She has wanted to do it for years, because sometimes I say "I'm not even 100% sure that she is my child." And of course, my girlfriend blows up at that comment.

[Brian1]

When they are babies, yes. When the get older, no.

 

You will eventually be left on your own with the OW - IF you end up marrying her.

 

My daughter is still a baby and she needs at least her mother with her 100% of the time. Living alone with my girlfriend in 15-20 years after my daughter goes on her own is the big question in my mind. I am sure I would rather be with my wife in my twilight years.

[Brian1]

Which man was on the birth certificate as the child's father? Do you have any rights through your court system, or have you all made your daughter the secret?

 

The father is listed as unknown. Changing it is no problem but obviously after the paternity test. Those are the first two things on my agenda right now. And after those are done, then I have to figure out how to inform my wife about my daughter. The only unconditional love I will receive from the three is from my daughter. But if I cut off my girlfriend, then who knows how she will respond. I'm sure she will try to brainwash my daughter against me. My girlfriend has been a very, very loving, caring and good mother to my daughter, until recently. My wife, obviously, would be a much better mother to my daughter, long term.

[woinlove]

I agree that my scheme is sick and unfair. But I am not exaggerating in any way when I say that my wife is extremely happy right now and has been for our entire 23 years together. My girlfriend is very happy and living a life way beyond her dreams but she has the most uncertainties of anyone involved in this. I understand that many posters are very bitter and angry because of their own bad experiences with an affair or relationship but I think it would be more constructive to comment objectively instead of subjectively. But anyhow, I appreciate all comments.

 

I don't see many bitter or angry comments here. Probably many feel as I do, that we pity you, your BW, your OW and your daughter. I don't know if there is a single poster here who would want to trade places with any of you, but in some ways, particularly you, from what you have told us.

 

It is so much easier to tear things down than to rebuild them, and that goes for people and integrity too. However difficult you found it to cross the line to cheating and to maintaining that disrespect and deceit for 5 years, including keeping your own daughter a secret, you can be sure the path to an authentic life with integrity, if you are interested, will be longer and more difficult.

 

I see you think honesty will have to wait until you get more information, fix some documents, as you are not willing to risk losing control yet. Perhaps you think you have been doing a better job at controlling things than you have.

[ThatJustHappened]

You are teaching your daughter that she's a source of shame..something that needs to be hidden. She may not understand that yet but kids are pretty perceptive. If you don't do something about this quickly she will start picking up on it and the damage will be intense and irreparable. You're already punishing your innocent wife for your bad behavior..don't punish your little girl too. You must come clean and bring this all out into the open.

 

I'm going to repost this in hopes that you read it again and stop saying me, I, and my all the time and start thinking about your daughter.

[Brian1]

LFH, woinlove, thatjusthappened and frozensprouts, I thank you all and you are all right on target. LFH, your post really hit home and I could relate to everything you said. I'm trying to fix this problem as fast and as best as I possibly can. There are quite a few variables involved and all must be considered fully. I have a plan that will take maximum until the end of this year but most likely much sooner.

[seren]

Brian, good to hear you are working out a plan, trouble might be that while you are working out variables in your head, your wife, OW and daughter are investing their hearts, I hope you take that into account. Each day it continues they invest a little more.

[Brian1]

Brian, good to hear you are working out a plan, trouble might be that while you are working out variables in your head, your wife, OW and daughter are investing their hearts, I hope you take that into account. Each day it continues they invest a little more.

 

I hear you. The sooner I get it done the better. But the paternity test and birth certificate change can take some time. Logistics mainly. Explaining why I'm doing this or that to my girlfriend, mainly.

[2sunny]

Seems that paternity test could easily be done now. I would think most of your decisions rest on the test results. No need to wait.

[Brian1]

Seems that paternity test could easily be done now. I would think most of your decisions rest on the test results. No need to wait.

 

That's correct, the test can be done quickly. I just need to coordinate it with my girlfriend, which sometimes isn't an easy task. The test results I'm sure of. Changing the birth certificate could take time. Then after that, comes the so called dday. (Doomsday, decisionday, ...)