M30USA Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 Ahh That makes sense regarding what is actually going on. I'm thinking out loud, but in Satan's mind (how he would view things), isn't he trying to say that God isn't god-like at all, if Satan himself can overpower him? Anyway, I don't even know what I mean...so nevermind! Read the first chapter of Job. Satan clearly understands his relationship to God. He even presents himself before God as a servant would present himself to a Lord, and he asks God for permission to bring affliction upon Job. Satan knows who God is. Again, the battle is not between them, directly; but rather over the angels and humans as if we are their "property". In other words, who will get the worship, praise, and following? Link to post Share on other sites
Author pinkie Posted February 9, 2013 Author Share Posted February 9, 2013 (edited) Why God allows this is the million dollar question that we'll never know. Could it be because we have a choice? (to sin or not to sin, go against god and be evil in the flesh) Edited February 9, 2013 by pinkie 1 Link to post Share on other sites
TheFinalWord Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 Why God allows this is the million dollar question that we'll never know. Could it be because we have a choice? (to sin or not to sin, go against god and be evil in the flesh) It's pretty interesting because there is a lot of theology of satan wrapped up in Revelation 20 The Defeat of Satan And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heaven and consumed them, and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. Link to post Share on other sites
M30USA Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 It's pretty interesting because there is a lot of theology of satan wrapped up in Revelation 20 The Defeat of Satan And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heaven and consumed them, and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. Exactly. He was imprisoned and will be released by whom? 2 Link to post Share on other sites
pie2 Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 Exactly. He was imprisoned and will be released by whom? No question God is in charge! The battle instead is over the angels, initially, and now us. We are the target of the battle. Satan believes he can get angels and mankind to follow him and his ideas. God obviously allows it. How did that original battle start though? I imagine that a thought entered Satan's head that he could be more powerful than God (in other words, Satan thought that God's power wasn't really omnipotent)....but that's not accurate, then? _______ Basically, my question is: Is the definition of an atheist someone who can't believe in God because there is no scientific evidence? Or, do some atheists believe in things "unseen" (ie spiritual), but just don't believe that any being fits the definition of "God" (omnipotent, omniscient, etc)? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
M30USA Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 (edited) Actually I need to make a correction to my last post. I said Satan WAS imprisoned. I forgot this is a likely reference to the 1000 year reign of Christ, which hasn't started yet. Therefore he has not even been imprisoned yet. Imagine a world without Satan. Think about a world where you don't have to be on constant guard or fear being deceived and led astray. Another important thing about these verses is they clearly refute the idea that Satan is an "idea" or a "spirit". How can an idea/spirit possibly be imprisoned? In order to be imprisoned, you must have the characteristic of locality--being in only one place at any time. Edited February 10, 2013 by M30USA 1 Link to post Share on other sites
TheFinalWord Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 (edited) Actually I need to make a correction to my last post. I said Satan WAS imprisoned. I forgot this is a likely reference to the 1000 year reign of Christ, which hasn't started yet. Therefore he has not even been imprisoned yet. Imagine a world without Satan. Think about a world where you don't have to be on constant guard or fear being deceived and led astray. Another important thing about these verses is they clearly refute the idea that Satan is an "idea" or a "spirit". How can an idea/spirit possibly be imprisoned? In order to be imprisoned, you must have the characteristic of locality--being in only one place at any time. Yes, this is the millennial reign. However, we get a picture of satan from a theological perspective. First, he is released on purpose. Second, his mission is to deceive. What I find interesting is that these people are capable of being deceived by Satan in the midst of Christ's physical reign on earth and having knowledge of the prophecy predicting their doom! A shoot will come up from the stump of Jesse (*Jesse was father of David, the ancestor of Jesus); from his roots a Branch will bear fruit. The Spirit of the Lord will rest on him—the Spirit of wisdom and of understanding, the Spirit of counsel and of might, the Spirit of the knowledge and fear of the Lord— and he will delight in the fear of the Lord.They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, for the earth will be filled with the knowledge of the Lord as the waters cover the sea... In that day the Root of Jesse will stand as a banner for the peoples; the nations will rally to him, and his resting place will be glorious. How does deceit work? It plays on our carnal nature and speaks to what we want to hear. These illustrations show us the great power of deception which satan possesses...here it is in action. This is the answer to the million dollar question, why does God allow satan to work: to deceive (that is one reason, there are others). Micaiah continued, “Therefore hear the word of the Lord: I saw the Lord sitting on his throne with all the multitudes of heaven standing on his right and on his left. And the Lord said, ‘Who will entice Ahab king of Israel into attacking Ramoth Gilead and going to his death there?’ “One suggested this, and another that. Finally, a spirit came forward, stood before the Lord and said, ‘I will entice him.’ “‘By what means?’ the Lord asked.“‘I will go and be a deceiving spirit in the mouths of all his prophets,’ he said. “‘You will succeed in enticing him,’ said the Lord. ‘Go and do it.’ “So now the Lord has put a deceiving spirit in the mouths of these prophets of yours. The Lord has decreed disaster for you.” ...... The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Meant to add too, consider these things in the context of the parable of the weeds. The Parable of the Weeds Explained Then he left the crowd and went into the house. His disciples came to him and said, “Explain to us the parable of the weeds in the field.” He answered, “The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the people of the kingdom. The weeds are the people of the evil one,and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels. “As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil.They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Whoever has ears, let them hear. Edited February 10, 2013 by TheFinalWord 2 Link to post Share on other sites
M30USA Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 (edited) Yea, TFW. Deception is Satan's prime goal. It all goes back to the first time he opened his mouth in all Scripture: "Did God really say...?" You are so right about him using deception which appeals to our natural, carnal, normal instincts and desires. Usually if we ENJOY hearing something and it sits really well with us, 9 out of 10 times it's a lie. Our souls are so at odds with God that simply hearing the truth usually makes us uncomfortable. Edited February 10, 2013 by M30USA 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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