I think I am the stupidest girl in the world..my story

[Cali408]

You didn't do anything wrong. You were high as a kite from the endorphins of being in love. Now you are withdrawing and it's tough. You'll live, keep your chin off, spoil yourself, occupy your time so you don't think about him and move on. No contact, no nothing.

[Acheron]

Hi Pierre,

 

I was not going to go into my divorce issue that much here but I suppose it did have a lot to do with why I became so attached to my x-MM.

 

I lost a very young child at the end of my marriage and it pretty much destroyed me. My x-H could not cope with it (and he traveled for work 75% of the time so I was alone so often) and he left me at the beg. of 09. I tried to fix things for the first half of 09 but it was too late. I spent so much time alone in the old marital house that I finally started going on the internet a lot- not dating site but a photography site (I do that as a hobby). I met x-MM there.

 

By the time I met x-MM I was very broken, probably borderline suicidal. At that time, x-MM would talk of faith and god's plans and reasons for living. I am not religious (being brought up roman catholic fixed that ) but x-MM just made me feel like maybe there was a reason for it all. Some nights, esp when my old marriage anniversary or the child's birthday came around, he would literally sit up all night with me on the computer. In addition, he was great at photography and I learned a lot of technical skills and Photoshop as well. There was so much at the beginning.

 

It is interesting that the last year, x-MM has no faith or talks of god or plans or anything at all. His religion has some dietary restrictions and a few months ago, I asked him if he thought god cared more about his not eating pork or about his lying /cheating/ hurting me and his wife, etc. I think he ignored me for a week after that question - for punisment

Edited February 7, 2013 by Acheron

[Acheron]

Thanks Cali408. I do need to try to do things for myself, a bit of spoiling. I am tired of being punished- by him and myself.

[Pierre]

Hi Pierre,

 

I was not going to go into my divorce issue that much here but I suppose it did have a lot to do with why I became so attached to my x-MM.

 

I lost a very young child at the end of my marriage and it pretty much destroyed me. My x-H could not cope with it (and he traveled for work 75% of the time so I was alone so often) and he left me at the beg. of 09. I tried to fix things for the first half of 09 but it was too late. I spent so much time alone in the old marital house that I finally started going on the internet a lot- not dating site but a photography site (I do that as a hobby). I met x-MM there.

 

By the time I met x-MM I was very broken, probably borderline suicidal. At that time, x-MM would talk of faith and god's plans and reasons for living. I am not religious (being brought up roman catholic fixed that ) but x-MM just made me feel like maybe there was a reason for it all. Some nights, esp when my old marriage anniversary or the child's birthday came around, he would literally sit up all night with me on the computer. In addition, he was great at photography and I learned a lot of technical skills and Photoshop as well. There was so much at the beginning.

 

It is interesting that the last year, x-MM has no faith or talks of god or plans or anything at all. His religion has some dietary restrictions and a few months ago, I asked him if he thought god cared more about his not eating pork or about his lying /cheating/ hurting me and his wife, etc. I think he ignored me for a week after that question - for punisment

 

A priest was having an affair with a married female parishioner. She said: "father we are living in sin." The priest replied: " But, we are in love and God is love". How could love be a sin?" :D:D:D

 

 

Seriously, MOM got as much as you did from this sessions. Sometimes the one doing the counseling and reassurance gets more validation than the person receiving reassurance.

 

I have noted than men and women that crave validation can fall in love over the Internet whereas others that don't need validation prefer to see someone in the flesh.

 

You were in love because he filled all your needs and that is a drug.

[Tenacity]

I'm so sorry for what you are going through.

 

I see so much in your posts that is just exactly how I felt during the affair I was in. To me, the worst thing this man has done to you is the gaslighting - the bigger lies were part of that, but he has treated you this way on a daily basis for so long that you are now questioning your own reality. You no longer know what in YOUR life is real and what isn't. And this is NOT YOUR FAULT - this is something HE did to you.

 

I understand that he did good things and was good to you in some ways, because my ex-MM was like that too. But he was also a narcissistic, insecure, manipulative, controlling man which it took me many, many years to find out, because it was mixed in with so many wonderful experiences.

 

He twists everything - even small things - around so that it becomes "your" fault, to the point where you question even objective things in your life and think they are your fault. I can see this in your posts. He has done this to you for so long that it has beaten you down to the point of doubting yourself and all that you are.

 

Even now, while you are able to realize that this guy has treated you horribly, you are still going back and forth because you are wondering if that is really true, or if it is you, if you are blowing it out of proportion, etc. Am I right? This is exactly how I felt.

 

The good news is, you are NOT "crazy" and this was NOT your fault. Everything that your head is telling you about this guy - and everything people here are telling you - is the reality. You have not lost one bit of your rational, beautiful, intelligent self and you CAN trust yourself and your reactions to this, because THEY are the real thing. In fact, you HAVE to trust in you in order to eject this narcissistic abuser from your life, and more importantly, from your head. Don't let him mess with your head any longer!

 

There is no shame in being lied to and gaslighted. Please stop blaming yourself for this man's abuse to you. There is no more horrible form of abuse, in my opinion, than what you have endured. How dare someone try to take away the most important thing - your sense of reality of YOUR own life!

 

Read about gaslighting (there are several threads here - I started one a few months ago). There are also good books on how users and manipulative men have duped innocent, trusting women who did nothing except offer their heart.

 

And no, I don't believe these men necessarily realize what they are doing. I think it's such an ingrained character flaw that they aren't even capable of seeing how horrible their behavior is. The word 'sociopath' comes to mind.

[Tenacity]

Oh, and I respectfully disagree with Pierre that you should be focusing on, or otherwise analyzing, your "need for external validation" , your huge emotional holes, etc., as if that is the reason you are here.

 

YOU are just fine. NOTHING you did caused this, and no "flaw" in you invited this kind of abusive behavior. Believe in yourself - there is nothing wrong with you. Trust me - I know this. Be good to you.

[Acheron]

Thank you Tenacity.

 

I have read so many subjects trying to understand and recover from all of this that I am surprised that it never occurred to me to read about "gaslighting". This is why I no longer trust anything that I think. It is amazing how he was always able to turn things around on me AND THEN accuse me of twisting things. Even now, when I talk to my parents or siblings, I ask myself if I am twisting things. I am just so used to being accused of it.

 

I still wonder though, and I know it is dangerous and probaly how people rationlize breaking NC, but....if circumstances had been different, ie. him not married, etc - would we have had a good relationship? Or it was always impossible because of character flaws? I don't know - I am sure this is a slippery slope and I should not even think about it. The circumstances are what they are. He did what he did to me. It is completely over now. I do not want any more pain. It is just hard....

[Tenacity]

Believe me, I know exactly what you are saying and exactly how you feel. It does seep into the rest of your life too (as you said, wondering if you are "twisting things" when talking to family members).

 

Gaslighting can be deliberate (like in the old movie, when the husband turned the gas lights down and then told his wife she was imagining things when she mentioned it) or it can be more of a side effect thing, done in order to preserve the gaslighter's vision of himself as always right about everything, without him actually having to do the work that would make him right about things.

 

My ex-MM also used to use the 'silent treatment' on me as punishment - all the time. It just made me sick with panic when he would do that - I would make myself ill wondering what I had done wrong, trying to convince him (and me) that I really didn't do what he said, that I was sorry for it (even though I didn't do it). Then of course, when the "punishment" would be over, which was always his decision, I would be grateful. It was crazy-making, horrible abuse. It makes me sick to think about it.

 

It is okay to wonder if this relationship would have worked if he had not been married. That's just part of your accepting who this man really is. I do not believe there is any possible way that this relationship could have worked, even if he were not married, because it was not just his lie about being married - there was so much more to his treatment of you that was horrible.

 

Plus, he LIED to you about being married and made you live his lie for three years! He did it on purpose! Can you imagine being married to such a man, someone who could do that? You should feel very, very sorry for his wife.

 

Below is a thread on Gaslighting. There are many great posts in this thread. I especially like the post on page 1 by Crusoe.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/363527-gaslighting

[Brian1]

Do men like my x-MM realize they are abusive? at least deep down? I really believe that my x-MM thinks he is a good guy and that he was forced to do what he did to "keep me". He was always saying things like he deserves to be happy, that other men are unhappy in marriages and divorce and do these things- so why can't he - that they just do it differently at the beginning than he did. He said that he would not have lied to me for 3 years if I had given him any indication during that time that I would ever date a married man. Too funny- so I basically forced him to lie to me!!!!

 

There is that other thead going where that MM is lying to his wife for 5 years and thinks it does not hurt her because she is clueless. When he says he loves her, it makes me want to throw up. I think that he feels everything is ok because he pays money to all the women in his life. My x-MM did that a lot too. Sent tons of gifts and things. We even had an $8k trip to costa rica last year. But all of that means nothing. I would prefer to not have anything monetary and instead have honesty and love. Another funny sidenote- I had actually thought he was going to propose during that trip hahaha....what delusions I had !!!

 

Look, Acheron, first of all I want to say that I am sorry for the pain that you are going through. Second of all, I will tell you that your MM certainly loved you and had feelings for you. But from what you have said, he sounds like a chronic cheater who does it for his daily thrills. You need to maintain NC forever with him. He is definitely a smooth operator who is just stalking, looking for vulnerable people.

As far as your comments about me not loving my wife, I can certainly understand why you would say that from my posts. But in reality, I would jump in front of a train for my wife. Me saying I love my wife and I love my OW is completely hypocritical on the surface and I understand that. But somehow it's true although very, very wrong.

Like many have said up to this point, you need to stop beating yourself up over this. How could you possibly say that you are stupid and you suck just because some snake took advantage of you. I can guarantee you that once you get over this last guy (after having two bad experiences) you will find your prince in shining armor. Just be patient and careful.

[Acheron]

Sorry LadyGrey. I actually thought I had responded to your post because it was important to me. It means a lot to know that others have gone through what I have gone through. Forgive me for being a bit disorganized. When I used to just read the forum, replies looked so easy, effortless. Now that I am actually trying to respond, I find it difficult to put all my emotions into words. Sometimes I start with a reply and just get overwhelmed with emotion and delete it before posting.

 

The main aspect of your post that spoke to me when I read it again is when you mentioned anger. I was numb yesterday and this morning and now I feel like I have moved into intense anger. It is rather frightening.

[Acheron]

Tenacity

 

Your post made me remember something funny....

 

I had started to get used to the x-MM ignoring me off and on for punishment. Because of that, I was hardly texting him at all anymore, only when he sent text first. I could never even remember if I was in the middle of being ignored or not. So then he sent me an angry text about the fact that I was not texting, saying that in the "old days" I used to care about him and text - that I must not care or love him anymore since not texting much anymore!!!! WTF...honestly, I guess if I had been a better OW, I would have put the ignore schedule in my calendar. Impossible to keep track of it in my tiny OW brain

[Brian1]

Tenacity

 

Your post made me remember something funny....

 

I had started to get used to the x-MM ignoring me off and on for punishment. Because of that, I was hardly texting him at all anymore, only when he sent text first. I could never even remember if I was in the middle of being ignored or not. So then he sent me an angry text about the fact that I was not texting, saying that in the "old days" I used to care about him and text - that I must not care or love him anymore since not texting much anymore!!!! WTF...honestly, I guess if I had been a better OW, I would have put the ignore schedule in my calendar. Impossible to keep track of it in my tiny OW brain

 

Seriously, you need to quit beating up on yourself. Your situation in no way shape or form is your fault. If you're taking pot shots at yourself on this forum, I can imagine how you're treating yourself in private. Take your time to recover, vent and lighten up on yourself. Once I tell my wife of my affair, the last thing I want is for her to feel responsible or guilty for my idiotic actions and I'll tell her that over and over.

[Acheron]

Hi Brian

 

I thought it was interesting when you said that you would "jump in front of a train" for your wife and that proves your love. I actually think that grand gestures and life/death events are much easier on people. Life and priorities become so clear during those moments. You see it all the time in wartime, etc. People are actually happier sometimes during these events because there is more purpose to life and relationships. They are valued more when faced with death.

 

The true test of love is the day to day grind. In this world of technology where families sit in the same room and ignore each other while texting or on the computer, relationships really suffer. It is sad that couples now think that sitting and watching tv is a viable substitute for talking and "doing" things together. It is no wonder everyone feels alone, even in a crowded room.

 

If I were to ever marry again, I would want the guy to say something like "in boredom and excitement, I will love you and be faithful". In fact, he can go ahead and let the train hit me as long as I know that I had him openly and honestly in the days/weeks/years prior

[Acheron]

Brian

 

It won't matter what you tell your wife over and over, that she is not to blame or feel guilty. She is going to feel all of that no matter what. I lost my child when she was 1 years old. Your wife lost her baby as a miscarriage. That just puts our guilt and misery at a whole different level. And when our marriages fail, we know that played a very big part in it. And I don't mean to hurt you, but when your wife knows about your daughter - God, I am in so much pain right now and don't even want to imagine the pain your wife will have. However, I am sure she will love that little girl eventually, once the pain settles.

 

The point is...women like myself and your wife (once she knows) - we do not listen to your words anymore. I stopped listening to the words of my x-MM months ago. We will only watch your actions. That is the only thing that means anything. The trust is gone from words.

 

but...you actually did make me cry a bit here Brian. I was wondering when the tears would start - so thank you for the extra push that I needed. You are right, I do hate myself and I hate how I feel and I hate the x-MM and I hate my life. AND I do love taking pot shots at myself. I had not even noticed that until you mentioned it

[Acheron]

LadyGrey -

 

I can imagine the evil thoughts that were in your head because I know a few have passed through mine. I still like the pitchfork idea and storming canada.

[Brian1]

Hi Brian

 

I thought it was interesting when you said that you would "jump in front of a train" for your wife and that proves your love. I actually think that grand gestures and life/death events are much easier on people. Life and priorities become so clear during those moments. You see it all the time in wartime, etc. People are actually happier sometimes during these events because there is more purpose to life and relationships. They are valued more when faced with death.

 

The true test of love is the day to day grind. In this world of technology where families sit in the same room and ignore each other while texting or on the computer, relationships really suffer. It is sad that couples now think that sitting and watching tv is a viable substitute for talking and "doing" things together. It is no wonder everyone feels alone, even in a crowded room.

 

If I were to ever marry again, I would want the guy to say something like "in boredom and excitement, I will love you and be faithful". In fact, he can go ahead and let the train hit me as long as I know that I had him openly and honestly in the days/weeks/years prior

 

Well, nothing personal, but you should come and observe my actual life and all those around me, and then you may understand what I mean by being happy. I still feel sorry for your pain you are going through, but not all situations are the same. I am ashamed of what I did and am continuing to do, but I can't go back in time.

[Brian1]

LOL.......I hear ya, do I hear you.

 

 

Have you thought about contacting his wife, she deserves to know what kind of asshat she is married to?

 

That action would serve no beneficial good. Why be so evil and bring unnecessary pain to his wife. She'll find out sooner or later.

[Brian1]

Brian

 

It won't matter what you tell your wife over and over, that she is not to blame or feel guilty. She is going to feel all of that no matter what. I lost my child when she was 1 years old. Your wife lost her baby as a miscarriage. That just puts our guilt and misery at a whole different level. And when our marriages fail, we know that played a very big part in it. And I don't mean to hurt you, but when your wife knows about your daughter - God, I am in so much pain right now and don't even want to imagine the pain your wife will have. However, I am sure she will love that little girl eventually, once the pain settles.

 

The point is...women like myself and your wife (once she knows) - we do not listen to your words anymore. I stopped listening to the words of my x-MM months ago. We will only watch your actions. That is the only thing that means anything. The trust is gone from words.

 

but...you actually did make me cry a bit here Brian. I was wondering when the tears would start - so thank you for the extra push that I needed. You are right, I do hate myself and I hate how I feel and I hate the x-MM and I hate my life. AND I do love taking pot shots at myself. I had not even noticed that until you mentioned it

 

My wife didn't have a miscarriage. But that's a minor detail. I just hope you can recover and not put any of the blame on yourself for what someone else did to you. You are obviously a very open and emotional person and it's good that you opened up about your story here on this forum. I hope you get some tid bits that make you feel better. I certainly have with my story.

[Brian1]

OOOO plzzzz..........give me a break, if you call stealing someone's time and affection under false pretenses love, then I've got a beachfront property in Arizona I want to sell you. He LIED to her, about being married, he took her choices away, he made a false reality. He manipulated, he used and abused.........wtf, do you call that love????

 

He did all that and more to her. His actions were evil. But he still had affection and a certain kind of love for her.

[Acheron]

Soni Sagra

 

I actually did say something like that at one point during my insanity after finding out he was married. He said that if I really loved him, then I would wait forever, be willing to even be homeless for him, be ok with having nothing....

 

He was all about the tests.!!

[Acheron]

LadyGrey

 

I think the wife knows. She seems so beat down and accepting of all the abuse now. I mentioned in a post before that once the x-MM made a recording of him talking to wife and asking her if he asked for divorce. (he wanted to prove to me that he was for real with me). I heard the most pathetic sound, a very sad woman answer yes. It broke my heart and I was scared or what kind of man the x-MM was. I feel really really bad for her.

 

Honestly, I am not sure I could handle talking to her because it would break my heart. I think I would want to kidnap her (and their 10 year old daughter that I had no clue about!!!) and bring them back to the US for safety from x-MM. (he is not physically abusive- but I think the emotional abuse is just as bad and I am convinced she gets a lot)

 

Honestly, he was available all the time to me. On the computer all the time with me. He treated wife and daughter horribly. After I found out about the daughter, I once asked when he ever does anything with her. He said that sometimes when he is on computer with me, she will come sit at his feet and draw. wtf!!! a 10 yr old doing that? so sad. and not like he got off computer with me. He continued on and thought being in same room with daughter was enough. When I think of the computer and work time for him- that he spent with me - there was no time at all for his daughter. sick.

[Tenacity]

He did all that and more to her. His actions were evil. But he still had affection and a certain kind of love for her.

 

Who really cares if he had feelings of affection or love? Given the way he treated her, what possible difference does that make?

 

Like I said to you in my post in your thread - love is an action, not a feeling.

[Acheron]

Brian

 

I thought I was happy also when I thought I had a real monogamous relationship for 3 years. Discovering that was all a lie is the worst thing ever and makes you feel really stupid. I am in pain now but I would never want to go back to that fake happiness. I value truth.

 

you are fooling yourself if you think everyone is happy.

and fyi- money is not happiness. you throw that around so much and I think you believe that.

[Acheron]

hahahaha

protecting another MM? giving him time to come up with his own cold and calculated plan for the year?

 

anyway, I am pretty sure she knows.

[Acheron]

honestly brian, you are killing me!!!

imagine the relationship we could have - your cold and calculating ways and my over emotional nature......