Reconcile down the line or not?

[Jstub]

Hello everyone,

 

Some of you may know me. I was here on LS about a year ago. I will recap some of the events, to give a sense of history. This will be a long one!

 

Last year, my wife had an EA, which ended after about 2 months. I did the whole begging and pleading etc. she "came back" for about a month. After coming back to me, she started a PA, which went all out. Basically, within 1 meeting, they claimed to be crazy in love. After about 3 months, they wanted to move in together and he was meeting my kids etc. In the beginning of the affair, I was devastated etc. but after about 3 months, I just let it go. Started doing my own thing etc. I made peace with the idea, even though it was painful as hell.

 

The one thing that was parallel with the EA and PA was the addiction to painkillers. Me and my wife used to do some drugs together back in the day and it was an on and off thing "to party" but the painkiller addiction became an every day thing for her. Large amounts of painkillers were being consumed etc.

 

To make a long story short, she dumped her PA partner and started coming after me. I put certain conditions to even consider reconciliation. She went into rehab (1 of my conditions), got clean, and her old self started to come back. Again, to make a long story short, we thought we should give it another shot (stopped divorce procedures).

 

We moved to a new town (big mistake - isolation), i transferred to working from home (big mistake#2 - stuck at each others face). We had some outside interferences in our lives (don't want to get into too much detail) - that affected our security (physical security). My wife was extremely paranoid, and she kept coming to me for support, and I just kept shutting her down, because I still had resentments against her due to her previous PA. So, we started drifting apart. She asked me to move her out of the country, and I did not. I just shut her down, saying I will not just move to a new country and uproot our whole family just because she is thinking something (I did not believe her regarding the security threats back then). She took this as me abandoning her and not caring about her well being (she has a very good point, because now I have proof regarding the threat being very real).

 

At this point, the painkillers returned. Full blown addiction again. All signs of a new PA started forming. Then, some connected person that was supposed to be taking care of business (make the security problem go away) came into the picture. I knew what was coming, so I confronted her and we had a huge argument and she asked for a divorce. I said, SURE. After this, we were pretty much not "together". As I foresaw, this guy, was offering her protection, and she went into survival mode per say. She went on a weekend trip and came back, and the guy was already in love with her. I knew what she was up to. She had him wrapped around her finger like a little puppy.

 

This time around, I had learned from my mistakes and with the help of a very special friend (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE) I started looking at life in a different perspective. Realizing, I am the master of my own faith and my own happiness. I completely backed off, I told I wish her luck with everything and that I completely understand that our marriage was crap and not a way to live. It was really not getting to me much either. Sure, it bothered me, but our "reconciliation" was a nightmare anyway. I right away started making new friends, casual dating (NOTHING SERIOUS, just to have a laugh.. don't bash me, I know according to a lot of people,you are not supposed to do this and that...I am not unloading any baggage on anyone, just being myself and enjoying company), started working out. I was generally happy. Was looking forward to my new life, with the occasional feeling down, which is normal. I never initiated conversations with her, nor gave her any attention, when she talked to me, I was friendly etc.

 

She had a couple of "outbursts" where she started thinking about what she is doing. She started regretting things etc and I kept telling her, just keep doing whatever makes you happy. Didn't think of it that much. Same cycle as before (previous PA), but this time, MUCH FASTER.

 

Now, a few days ago she came clean that she might be pregnant with OM baby! and that she will get an abortion. wuhu! yep! I told her, oh that is interesting, I will not be paying for the service. She was shocked, and she asked me if I will not freak out. I just calmly said, why would I freak out??? It's a natural biological occurrence, when 2 adults have sexual intercourse, without using any protection.

 

A day after this, she came back and said she realizes, what she has done, and that she is a complete idiot, naive and that she is just trying to hide the pain by jumping into something new. She realizes that she is addicted and started to try to shift blame on OM, that he took advantage of her etc. I stopped her and yelled at her (first time i freak out since the affair), saying she should grow the hell up and start taking responsibility for her actions. That it doesn't matter, who said what, if you go spread it for someone, it is YOUR OWN ACTION. Then she said, she was completely high and drunk etc. I again, kept yelling, and repeated myself for her to take responsibility.

 

The situation is that she has now broken it off with OM. He will be paying for the procedure and he is begging her to come back to him etc.

 

She now tells me that she will get clean for the sake of our family. She keeps repeating that "we are not finished" that whenever she leaves, she always thinks about me (ha! ya right..) from the way she is talking, it really seems like she has hit rock bottom. I do not hate this woman, I am playing nice, because I want my children to have their mom back. This junkie behavior is really not something I will tolerate though.

 

Next steps... We are moving separately in about 4-5 weeks. Moving back close to my job.

 

She wants to become a better person by:

 

1. Go to rehab.

2. Get a job.

3. Go to individual counseling

4. Go to marriage counseling

5. Not be involved with anyone during the separation, just focus on getting better.

6. See if we can fix this marriage or go our separate ways

 

I want to:

 

1. File for divorce, because even IFFFF I reconcile with her, I want to "restart" the marriage to cover my ass in the alimony department. Less years = less alimony. Risky business.

2. Go to individual counseling.

3. Live without her to see what I want. There is a high chance I will not want her back.

4. Try to be open to anything for the future.

 

So if you read this far, CONGRATS and THANK YOU!

 

What do you think? Is it safe to assume, the drugs and threats had a lot to do with her behavior? One thing is for certain, she CHANGED ever since the painkillers were in play. Can a person like this go back to being her "old self" once the drugs and threats are eliminated? I always wanted to have a happy family, but I refuse to stay in a marriage for my kids. I am casually dating and I am actually enjoying it now. She hates this obviously, but I don't want to give into her pressure. Just because she realized something, doesn't mean I should just drop everything. I want to keep the door open... sometimes I feel like she is now my plan B? don't know... what do you think? I got some work to do myself, I have lots of issues I have to deal with. Cheating was her fault, but the marriage / reconciliation failing was 50% my fault. I brought her to the point of disconnect, just like she did.

[aMguilts]

its not safe to assume anything as far as you both are concerned.

 

 

i don`t get what you are asking!!

your fu**ing around and you like it?

 

no one that wants their marriage to work has `casual ` `dates`

 

you either want your marriage or you dont

and you dont

 

so

number 1

get a divorce

 

aM

[TaraMaiden]

I have to say that pretty much nails it.

 

Reconciliation now, is just an old and tried joke.

You're relishing your freedom, and she's too late by a mile.

 

She needs to do all those things entirely for her own benefit, not for any ulterior, reconciliatory motive.

 

You - you're just not into it.

 

Nope.

 

Grab your hat, coat and scarf, and leave.

[Jstub]

its not safe to assume anything as far as you both are concerned.

 

 

i don`t get what you are asking!!

your fu**ing around and you like it?

 

no one that wants their marriage to work has `casual ` `dates`

 

you either want your marriage or you dont

and you dont

 

so

number 1

get a divorce

 

aM

 

No, I am not f*kin around. I am trying to live my life and build my self esteem back. The dates that I am talking about are more like having a drink and having an interesting conversation. Just trying to bring my "old self back".

 

I am asking, if with all that has happened, reconciliation is an even an option. If her actions were somewhat justified or not. If getting over such a thing is even possible. If, I would be an idiot to take her back.

[Jstub]

I have to say that pretty much nails it.

 

Reconciliation now, is just an old and tried joke.

You're relishing your freedom, and she's too late by a mile.

 

She needs to do all those things entirely for her own benefit, not for any ulterior, reconciliatory motive.

 

You - you're just not into it.

 

Nope.

 

Grab your hat, coat and scarf, and leave.

 

Again, you are just focusing on me going on a date. I don't see that as a big deal.

 

So are you saying, If I were to consider reconciliation, I should stop dating?

 

I agree with you that she needs to do those things for herself. The only reason why I think about reconciliation is because I think to myself, if she did all those things, if she got her old self back, and dealt with fundamental issues, we could really have a chance.

 

If, i was completely not into, I would not waste my time writing such a long thread.

 

I am just afraid to get hurt again. Is that wrong?

[TaraMaiden]

Yes: If you want to even consider reconciliation, you must stop all and any external influence, especially dating!

 

Absolutely!

 

If you're scared of getting hurt again - well, there's a gut-instinct message there, isn't there?

What is it...."Once bitten.....?"

 

Frankly my friend, this unfortunately sounds far too much like the well-worn phrase containing the words, 'horse', 'dead', and 'flogging'.

 

Were I in your shoes, I wouldn't touch this with a barge-pole.

 

Fool me once, more fool you.

Fool me twice, more fool me.

Fool me a third time..... well, fill in the gap.

[Darren Steez]

She had two physical affairs.

 

Got pregnant

 

Had an abortion

 

Why do you want to get back together with her again?

[Gunny376]

This is my spill on it!!

 

One you and she should pull back an re-group!

 

She and both of of you should quit seeing other people and focus on getting each other straightened out an individuals indepentent of one another and of others? Makes sense.

 

You both should go into individual couseling ~ to find out what it is that each other wants and needs from someone ~ from a spouse ~ from a partner ~ out of life ~ want and need in your life.

 

For now? There's no freaking way that either of you are fit to be with each other? Nor until you've got yourself sorted out? With anyone else?

 

My take is that you, yourself are futher along than she is ~ in your re-hab from drugs, substance abuse, dependence and progressing toward self acuatualizaton, self awarness, self dependence etc than she is.

 

Then through IC you should join together in not marriage couseling ~ but mutual couseling. Not so much toward reconciling but toward discovering how much the two of you are feeding emotionally, mentally, pyschologically off one another?

 

Its pretty obvious to me that you and her want, need each other, and are feeding off each other like mental, emotional, and pyschological vampires ~ to coin a phrase ~ if you were.

 

You're further entwined by having childrein together!

 

Stop already, and put the mental, emotional, pyschological well being of your children before your own wants, needs, desires, ~ your OWN!

 

Time to 'Man Up" and be a part of Something Greater Than Yourself, her, the "You" that you and she make!"

[Jstub]

She had two physical affairs.

 

Got pregnant

 

Had an abortion

 

Why do you want to get back together with her again?

 

I consider getting back with her, because I know, if she were to return to her "good old self" she would never do such stupid crap. When she got clean last time, I had a glimpse of her but I was not ready myself, and I screwed it up. I believe my actions got her back to the old ways.

[TaraMaiden]

"The light-bulb's really got to want to change....."

 

But I wouldn't trust her as far as I could fling her.

 

And I'm a woman, saying that.

[Jstub]

This is my spill on it!!

 

One you and she should pull back an re-group!

 

She and both of of you should quit seeing other people and focus on getting each other straightened out an individuals indepentent of one another and of others? Makes sense.

 

You both should go into individual couseling ~ to find out what it is that each other wants and needs from someone ~ from a spouse ~ from a partner ~ out of life ~ want and need in your life.

 

For now? There's no freaking way that either of you are fit to be with each other? Nor until you've got yourself sorted out? With anyone else?

 

My take is that you, yourself are futher along than she is ~ in your re-hab from drugs, substance abuse, dependence and progressing toward self acuatualizaton, self awarness, self dependence etc than she is.

 

Then through IC you should join together in not marriage couseling ~ but mutual couseling. Not so much toward reconciling but toward discovering how much the two of you are feeding emotionally, mentally, pyschologically off one another?

 

Its pretty obvious to me that you and her want, need each other, and are feeding off each other like mental, emotional, and pyschological vampires ~ to coin a phrase ~ if you were.

 

You're further entwined by having childrein together!

 

Stop already, and put the mental, emotional, pyschological well being of your children before your own wants, needs, desires, ~ your OWN!

 

Time to 'Man Up" and be a part of Something Greater Than Yourself, her, the "You" that you and she make!"

 

Thank you for your input. I do agree with you.

 

One thing I want to clarify. Don't get the wrong idea here. When I say we used to party and use drugs, it means we used to do drugs once a month and have some fun. I never had to go into rehab, because I had no problem just quitting drugs (have not touched any for over 8 months and i never had any "withdrawals"). As for having kids. We are great parents, our kids have a great life, they have great input everyday, we never put them in front of the tv and do our own thing. Or ignore them. They have fresh home made meals etc. the reason why I say this, is because when people see "drugs" they right away think, complete junkies. Oh poor kids etc. don't let that be the focus of this discussion.

 

Yes, drugs are impairing her judgement right now, they make her cold and detached, but she does her duties as a mother. And I, I go above and beyond to make sure the kids are taken care of.

 

With that said, you are absolutely right, when you say, we have to get better for ourselves. I have been doing that and it's going pretty well. I shall stop dating and just focus on friendships in order not to create drama. The good thing is, she also realizes that she needs to focus on getting better for herself. That was already discussed. We cannot even consider a future without dealing with our own issues. Getting better as individuals, primarily emotionally. Make ourselves happy first and keep the door open for a future together.

[Jstub]

"The light-bulb's really got to want to change....."

 

But I wouldn't trust her as far as I could fling her.

 

And I'm a woman, saying that.

 

Tara. Thank you for your input. I do not trust her one bit. I listen to her words, but I mostly ignore them in a way. I try to focus on her actions. First action was her handing over the pills. I know she will not just quit, but I see it as a baby step. She realizes that she is destroying herself and everyone around her. Heading towards rock bottom, and I don't want to stop her. I want her to hit rock bottom to wake up. Hopefully.

 

Edit. Another action was complete nc to OM.

Edited February 23, 2013 by Jstub

[aMguilts]

Jstub

ok your right

About going on dates

 

She is going to want to know you BECAUSE you have moved on

(or appeared to of)

 

But then she comes running back to you because of it?

And you are considering taking her back?

 

carry on with your dates

To stop them now just to forgive and forget with your wife would be wrong

like tara said, don`t trust her

For i will bet you anything as SOON as she has you under her wing again, she`ll go back to how she was before

 

its up to you, its your life, if anything she has to proove herself to you that she is willing to make it work?

 

i dunno, maybe i`m talking crap, too fogged out to focus on anything

 

tread carefully

 

aM

[Jstub]

Jstub

ok your right

About going on dates

 

She is going to want to know you BECAUSE you have moved on

(or appeared to of)

 

But then she comes running back to you because of it?

And you are considering taking her back?

 

carry on with your dates

To stop them now just to forgive and forget with your wife would be wrong

like tara said, don`t trust her

For i will bet you anything as SOON as she has you under her wing again, she`ll go back to how she was before

 

its up to you, its your life, if anything she has to proove herself to you that she is willing to make it work?

 

i dunno, maybe i`m talking crap, too fogged out to focus on anything

 

tread carefully

 

aM

 

aM.

 

Yes me dating of course drew her to me. I am well aware of that.

 

It was never about her running back to me and me taking her back. It is about her realizing what the reality will be like for her. She was in a fog and that fog lifted in record time if you ask me. About a month all together. My whole "strategy" was to give her exactly what she wants and focus on myself. I never put up an act. I learned how to be happy and be content with myself in a short period of time. I don't need to tell you, what an affair does to a man's self esteem and ego. I knew however that women want me, There always was interest. It was never about sex for me. Just to have the ability to connect with women, for them to show interest. I never lied to anyone and gave them false hope. Never slept with anyone either. Once I had one, there was more interest. It helped me start realizing that I am wanted.

 

The situation is different now. I definitely need time and see concrete actions to put myself on the line again. That does not mean, I could do that, without fixing myself as well. During this time, dating maybe counter productive, because I want her to be at ease, to really just focus on getting better. I do have friends that I could talk to and have a good time with. So avoiding dating "in her face" may be beneficial, regardless of the outcome of "us".

 

She knows very well that I will not just take her back, not because I am trying to play a game. Just because, we have to be better people first to have a chance for the future.

 

Make sense? I am open to criticism.

[aMguilts]

yes it makes sense

you need time , you said it yourself

 

so give it time

you said your not sleeping with these dates you go on?

good

 

1question thou?

 

Do you want your wife or do you want a divorce??

 

aM

[Jstub]

 

1question thou?

 

Do you want your wife or do you want a divorce??

 

aM

 

The short answer is, I want my wife back.

 

The more complete answer is, I want my wife back in a marriage that has a good chance to work. With her current condition and my state of mind, it is impossible. It is bound to fail. I have so much resentment towards her but I also have understanding for her. This doesn't mean, I condone what she did. That is just disgusting and ice cold. Would the woman I fell in love with do those things? Not in a million years. That does not mean, I will sit here in denial and justify everything away. The only thing this understanding yields, is some ray of hope. A hope that, she will come back to her senses. If she comes back, I would reconcile. I refuse to entertain her "bad" side. I have had enough of that.

 

I also need to reach a place, where I do forgive and put the whole past behind. Our marriage is dead. We would have to start over completely anew.

[TaraMaiden]

It's been bad for longer than it's been good.

 

 

The risk you're taking is that it will still be to that ratio.

 

When you're on your death-bed, will you wish you hadn't wasted so much time on pursuing a possible, rather than knocking it on the head, and seeking a definite?

[Jstub]

 

Stop already, and put the mental, emotional, pyschological well being of your children before your own wants, needs, desires, ~ your OWN!

 

Time to 'Man Up" and be a part of Something Greater Than Yourself, her, the "You" that you and she make!"

 

I wanted to address this. You don't know me, so it is a very logical thing to say. I can assure you, I am putting my children first every step of the way. I am up at 6:30 every morning taking care of my kids. I work full time and right after work I take over again and then put them to bed. No matter how miserable I have felt at points, I have shown my kids nothing but a big smile and showered them with love. I am actually on a weekend trip with them right now. I am writing while they nap.

 

It doesn't matter if I get my wife back or not, I would still help her become a better person if she is willing, because I want my children to have their mother regardless of "us". I have a huge heart and I am the last person that is self absorbed. I mean what I say, and I consider that "bigger than myself".

[Jstub]

It's been bad for longer than it's been good.

 

 

The risk you're taking is that it will still be to that ratio.

 

When you're on your death-bed, will you wish you hadn't wasted so much time on pursuing a possible, rather than knocking it on the head, and seeking a definite?

 

How can you say it's been bad longer than its good? It's been bad for a year. You don't know my history. (No offense).

 

Look at it from the other angle. What if I throw away something good? My family? What if I regret it? Assuming she shows me by her actions that she is worth it. I will not blindly go back to her.

 

Would I be able to walk away saying, I gave it my all?

[Darren Steez]

I wanted to address this. You don't know me, so it is a very logical thing to say. I can assure you, I am putting my children first every step of the way. I am up at 6:30 every morning taking care of my kids. I work full time and right after work I take over again and then put them to bed. No matter how miserable I have felt at points, I have shown my kids nothing but a big smile and showered them with love. I am actually on a weekend trip with them right now. I am writing while they nap.

 

It doesn't matter if I get my wife back or not, I would still help her become a better person if she is willing, because I want my children to have their mother regardless of "us". I have a huge heart and I am the last person that is self absorbed. I mean what I say, and I consider that "bigger than myself".

 

I think you'll find the part you highlighted is at the end of every message Gunny posts..nothing personal

[TaraMaiden]

How can you say it's been bad longer than its good? It's been bad for a year. You don't know my history. (No offense).

 

Look at it from the other angle. What if I throw away something good? My family? What if I regret it? Assuming she shows me by her actions that she is worth it. I will not blindly go back to her.

 

Would I be able to walk away saying, I gave it my all?

 

Excuse my question, but WTF are you doing here?

You systematically argue the point with virtually everything everyone posts.

 

If someone posts 'black' you say 'white'.

If someone posts 'white', you say 'black'.

 

The bottom line is, that you're not actually resolving anything here.

 

How much further have you moved on in your decision since your first post?

 

You seem to still be in a complete fog and just as uncertain as when you began this thread....

 

What exactly do you want from us?

[Jstub]

Excuse my question, but WTF are you doing here?

You systematically argue the point with virtually everything everyone posts.

 

If someone posts 'black' you say 'white'.

If someone posts 'white', you say 'black'.

 

The bottom line is, that you're not actually resolving anything here.

 

How much further have you moved on in your decision since your first post?

 

You seem to still be in a complete fog and just as uncertain as when you began this thread....

 

What exactly do you want from us?

 

You are right Tara. This is a waste of time. You know it all. That's why you safely and arrogantly assumed that it was more bad than good.

 

Don't waste your time on my thread.

 

The purpose of this thread is to let my thoughts out and get opinions.

 

On a side note. Wife just called that she got her period and is not pregnant. Doesn't make a difference to me though. Just thought I share.

[aMguilts]

You are right Tara. This is a waste of time. You know it all. That's why you safely and arrogantly assumed that it was more bad than good.

 

Don't waste your time on my thread.

 

The purpose of this thread is to let my thoughts out and get opinions.

 

On a side note. Wife just called that she got her period and is not pregnant. Doesn't make a difference to me though. Just thought I share.

 

hey jstub

 

in bold...

i dont believe you

i believe its makes a lot of difference

Say it doesn`t back to me if you like, but even if i don`t know you personally, i KNOW you are relieved

you wouldn`t be human if you wasn`t!!

 

now back to the subject of reconcillng with her

 

ok so you want this marriage to work?

 

(my last post to you i asked you that question(if you wanted your marriage to work or if you wanted a divorce ))

 

so ok , you want your marriage to work

now i`m going to ask you WHY??

 

 

aM

[Yasuandio]

It is good news to hear a pregnancy from another man does not have to be dealt with to fruition. But nonetheless, the closet door opened, and the skelton will always be there. Perhaps some things happen for a reason - that is one way to look at this. To teach us a lesson in life, a huge crisis, to wake us up - to guide us in the right direction.

 

In my opinion, your wife's sudden confession and interest in repairing relationship is due to the fact that she NOW values you. She values you only because she knows others value you now (i.e., you dating). Her self esteem is so low, she doesn't trust her own judgment - but when others want to take her Mercedes out of the garage, she's running down the street, waving her arms. Everyone wants what they fear they are losing, or what they cannot have. But the shine will wear off this penny real fast. You have to watch out - the minuite you stop dating and enjoying others, she will start devaluing you again. She must really truely believe she is on the verge of losing you.

 

That is why you must continue to progress on yourself, and I commend you for being there and helping your wife with her substanse abuse problem. However, I am not convinced that adiction to drugs is an at home do-it-yourself project. Withdrawal from drugs can cause sezures. And you acting as the physcian, providing smaller and smaller doses is not necessarily the method used in hospitals. Plus, it puts you in a strange control position as at least an "enable," and at worst "keeper of the pills." I really think if she is serious - rehab is the answer. She should not have to ask you for a pill - it's demeaning.

 

Now this may be more than on time she has been in rehab. I want you to think about that fact for a moment. Gunny pointed out that you seemed to have progressed and are more advanced in you viewpoints about the relationship problems. But my question is, how long have you been in this "happy state"? What is to keep you there? As well, you did not seem to have the addiction personality that your wife has when it came to experimentation with drugs. And I do not think you could argue that your wife does not have an addictive personality.

 

I think this all comes down to a basic question of whether or not your wife will return to drugs which seem to influence an unacceptable lifestyle and irresponsible conduct not conducive to the marital agreement.

 

And this is an impossible question to answer. But one thing we do know for sure. It doesn't matter how much time goes by for a drug addict, a sex addict, an attention junkie, alcholic, ciggarette smoker, whatever - their their propensity towards this addiction will always be there. The longer you remain with this young lady hoping her "good side" will remain in tact, there will always be the change that her "bad side" will emerge. It may not occur until 10 years from now - when she can soak you for alimony (as you expressed concern about that). It may now occur at all? This is where Ms. Tara Maiden's statements about ratios and the deathbed become particularly relevant.

 

I would advise you re-review every single post that you have challenged, (or not) and try to find the wisdom hidden in each and every one. And if it is not there, create it. This is your reason for being here. Yas

 

 

 

 

The risk you're taking is that it will still be to that ratio.

Edited February 24, 2013 by Yasuandio

[aMguilts]

homer yas?

 

aM