Thinking about having an affair

[Pierre]

I am not saying lafleur should go ahead proceeding affair with the elder MM right away, but she already said in the post she had dates and she was just not interested. And I am sure lafleur is attractive enough based on the backgroud she had described.

 

Unfortunately the attraction between two people can not be measured, when it happens it happens. And also I don't see lafleur is saying that she wants the MM leaves wife, later maybe, but right now lafleur just wants to have a connection and wants to get closer with the MM.

 

If La Fleur was without options, older, divorced , and with grown children I could see your point.

 

But, she is a young woman that is vulnerable to cheating married men for obvious reasons. As we know quite well single men do not impress women like Le Fleur. Single guys show less attention and are not as charming. The old cheating MM is much better at courting women. It is that simple!

[Mount]

I don't understand why you keep belittling those older, divorced, with childeren women here.....Actually I dont understand your point, are you saying they are lower grade women, trashy...to deserve a MM?

 

I think I can understand LaFleur well, as the situtaion and age difference among ourselves and MMs are very similar. Although me and MM are a bit elder than her and her MM (late 30's/late 50s)

 

I think LaFleur is fascinated by the MM already, and her mindset will lead her to next step anyway, meanwhile any successful /charming single guy will be very plain anway in front of her.

 

Just like I will contintue going out the single gentleman that after me, whom is very successful director in IBM over 25 years...etc, his image is better than MM, however in my mind MM occupies most of the place.

 

If La Fleur was without options, older, divorced , and with grown children I could see your point.

 

But, she is a young woman that is vulnerable to cheating married men for obvious reasons. As we know quite well single men do not impress women like Le Fleur. Single guys show less attention and are not as charming. The old cheating MM is much better at courting women. It is that simple!

Edited February 24, 2013 by Mount

[lafleur]

The more I read everyone's replies, the more I think I've lost my mind! (Thank you all so much for taking the time to listen and write). This MM thing is really starting to seem like a bad, bad, bad idea.

 

LadyGrey - I never even considered having to tell any future lovers about an indiscretion like this - that is not something I would ever want to do. Ever. Like Eveeeeeer.

 

Just_A_Poster - You're very funny. I think you missed your calling in breakfast radio But it's not quite as bad as you make it out. Well, the age gap is! But he really has been a perfect gentleman - it's not like he's been pursuing me. He's only ever been a good friend to me and never pushed for anything more - I guess sometimes you can just read between the lines and if I had to call it, I think if I offered it up, he would be happy to oblige (but I could be wrong).

 

With regards to the replies about being picky and valuing myself and now just wanting to give it away - yes, I can see how I'm contradicting myself. It's true - it's not exactly an ideal thing to do. You know how they teach us that if we ever get stranded at sea not to drink the sea water, no matter how thirsty you get? Well, I'm thirsty and thinking about the sea water!!

 

Now that I've passed the big 3-0 and my situation is what it is, a level of panic and desperation has set in. Suddenly those standards that I thought were awesome over the last 10 years and would set the foundation for me making good choices and having good outcomes in life, seem to be the very reason I'm now where I'm at.

 

As Catplates suggested - yes, I really do feel like I missed the boat Where's my damn boat - I want a boat RIGHT NOW! I seem to have lost my ability to be happily single and my faith that Mr Right is on his way, so I guess I just decided that my standards were making me miserable so I should throw them out the window and that MM could be MR Right Now. I can see this is really not an appropriate reaction....

 

But I still feel sh*tty about my situation. I can read through all the replies here and suddenly say, oh my god, what was I thinking?! Everyone's right - I'm out of my freaking mind! And then I worry by next week I'll be right back in the same spot consumed with being alone and looking for an immediate solution.

[Catplates]

Pierre.......I like ya..........agree with most of your advice..........but this insulting stuff you type about older women is sexist and not accurate. I don't care how old a woman is, she deserves better. A mature woman is not a dried up old prune that no man would want. I am not even looking, but they are out there.

 

Right on Lady Grey!

 

I am 65 and dating somebody 10years my junior. There is no way he thinks I am a dried up old prune. Pierre, that older woman stuff is sterotypical and not worthy of your usual thinking,

 

Cat

[wisernow]

Pierre.......I like ya..........agree with most of your advice..........but this insulting stuff you type about older women is sexist and not accurate. I don't care how old a woman is, she deserves better. A mature woman is not a dried up old prune that no man would want. I am not even looking, but they are out there.

 

Yea, right! And if a woman is a dried up old prune, they make meds, lubes, oils, jellies, for that. Pierre, you crack me up with you psychobabble and sweeping generalities.

[2sunny]

I am not saying lafleur should go ahead proceeding affair with the elder MM right away, but she already said in the post she had dates and she was just not interested. And I am sure lafleur is attractive enough based on the backgroud she had described.

 

Unfortunately the attraction between two people can not be measured, when it happens it happens. And also I don't see lafleur is saying that she wants the MM leaves wife, later maybe, but right now lafleur just wants to have a connection and wants to get closer with the MM.

 

Yes, sure Mount - but why encourage her to have no boundary? Or if any boundary - one that lacks integrity and honor?

 

She may not be asking him to leave his W - but she's about to step into a big pile of poo - and I'm gonna vote "DON'T DO IT!"

[2sunny]

I did have laid out in my post that if she is proceeding to seek connection with the MM, she might have uncomfortable sitution/pain...etc due to the obvious relationship being up and down, break-up or reunite. There is not rocky science, and actually it is common sense that everything is having negative side along with the postive side of it.

 

Initially I made the A happening in my case because I had admiration/love/whatever you call to the MM as well that is why we are where are now.

 

While getting the result that I wanted, to have relationship/connection with MM, the uncomfortable situation is unavoidably as the "bonus" togehter coming along.

 

So basically it would be original poster's call, to get it or not get it.

 

Mount - I thought you ended it with your cheating MM?

[Mount]

I am not voting she should go for it, she needs to be aware and prepare the byproduct coming along anyway.

 

Yes, sure Mount - but why encourage her to have no boundary? Or if any boundary - one that lacks integrity and honor?

 

She may not be asking him to leave his W - but she's about to step into a big pile of poo - and I'm gonna vote "DON'T DO IT!"

[Mount]

From rational thoughts we were ending it...but will see. No one has crystal ball anyway. I will go out with the single gentleman anway as he pushes hard but honestly you know where my mind is. No need to say more.

 

Mount - I thought you ended it with your cheating MM?

[2sunny]

The norm with OW is a ton of pain and heartbreak - I don't recommend that kind of misery on anyone...it's totally settling!

 

And the old guy - of course he's willing to cancel his afternoon of work - he had a young gal needing a shoulder to cry on = potential sex.

[Pierre]

I don't understand why you keep belittling those older, divorced, with childeren women here.....Actually I dont understand your point, are you saying they are lower grade women, trashy...to deserve a MM?

 

You are putting words in my mouth or doing a straw man. It is what it is: La Fleur is 30 single and in the best stage of her life, this is her prime moment. At age 30 she is looking good for men in that age bracket looking to settle and have a family. That she is a virgin is a plus. Any bachelor will appreciate a woman that respects herself to that degree.

 

If she was near 50, divorced, and with kids I can see your point. But, at this time she doers not need to lower her standards, Age 30 is the best age for both men and women. Way better than 40, 50, 60, etc. That is not a put down, it is simply a fact.

 

Just like I will contintue going out the single gentleman that after me, whom is very successful director in IBM over 25 years...etc, his image is better than MM, however in my mind MM occupies most of the place.

 

It does not matter that the single man is superior to your MM. You will always prefer the MM because cheating men fit perfectly with women in need of external validation. It is a marriage made in heaven. Your single guy cannot compete with your cheating MM.

[Mount]

Talking about external validation, your method does not make sense. Single man whom is very interested in that particular woman, would also say any kind of sweet words, attentive, gift, dining wining....etc, however it can not trigger the woman the same connection with the MM somehow. But I don't think there is any difference between external validation between single gentleman and the MM.

 

You are putting words in my mouth or doing a straw man. It is what it is: La Fleur is 30 single and in the best stage of her life, this is her prime moment. At age 30 she is looking good for men in that age bracket looking to settle and have a family. That she is a virgin is a plus. Any bachelor will appreciate a woman that respects herself to that degree.

 

If she was near 50, divorced, and with kids I can see your point. But, at this time she doers not need to lower her standards, Age 30 is the best age for both men and women. Way better than 40, 50, 60, etc. That is not a put down, it is simply a fact.

 

 

 

It does not matter that the single man is superior to your MM. You will always prefer the MM because cheating men fit perfectly with women in need of external validation. It is a marriage made in heaven. Your single guy cannot compete with your cheating MM.

[Pierre]

But he really has been a perfect gentleman - it's not like he's been pursuing me. He's only ever been a good friend to me and never pushed for anything more - I guess sometimes you can just read between the lines and if I had to call it, I think if I offered it up, he would be happy to oblige (but I could be wrong).

 

He is grooming you. He will wait patiently as long as it takes and he will be a gentleman at all times and when you lower the bar even more you will be the one that jumps his bones. This guy is very good, a very typical cheating MM.

 

You may want to read this:

 

How the narcissist picks his prey

Posted on July 15, 2011

He looks for a nurturing, conscionable person. The more innocent, honest, humble and kind hearted the better. These type of people cannot recognize the narcissist‘s ulterior motive. How could they? The facade he presents is nearly perfect in every way. Charming. Successful. Well liked. Charismatic. Great sense of humor. He says all the right things at all the right times. He is able to do this adroitly because he takes an inventory of the victim. Their likes and dislikes, their behavior and the emotions they reveal. He mirrors all of this back to the victim. He becomes “just like you”. Each and every time with each new victim, conquest, mate or spouse. It is the narcissist’s modis operandi.

 

He always has an answer and it is always reasonable should you question his motives or intentions. To think otherwise would be an aberration. This is not a person that has a bad bone in his body. Kind, caring and considerate. Oozing charm and charisma. You believe him and so do many others. He keeps a collection of supporters (minions), near and dear to him. But they don’t get to see the inside of the narcissist’s world. Only a victim who is pliant enough, trusting enough and humble enough will get to see that. If he senses that anyone is on to his games, they are abruptly discarded in cold, cruel callous fashion. He never looks back. He never apologizes. He has no conscience so he feels no remorse. His motive is for complete and total adoration. He is a dictator, an oligarch, a tyrant. His motive is to find someone that makes him look good in the world’s eye. Someone he can continue his charade with. He believes he is a king that deserves complete reign over all his kingdom, including the subjects in it. But, the king wears no clothes. And he knows it. He hopes no one else will notice.

 

He repeats the same patterns as he has always done before. For a narcissist, a sociopath who knows his victim better than they can recognize the predator, the above is the perfect scenario. Con men cannot con another who can see through the mask they project or who may have the audacity to question what is or isn’t real. The narcissist will back up their lies, with more and more lies. They are very charming. Extremely convincing, and the victim believes wholeheartedly, that this tale he spins is fact, not fiction. It will be a rare day to ever find any proof of his true colors. Covering their tracks is a natural behavior. They are very predatory. But rarely violent. They kill differently.

 

They do not marry or get involved in relationships for love. They do it to appear “normal” to outsiders. They look for a cleat to tie their boat to; an anchor to make them feel safely secured in a turbulent sea. It is not properly anchored however, the boat is adrift. They don’t care whom they hurt or manipulate for their own ends. They do not feel what normal people feel. Once the victim is in place, in the drifting barge, the narcissist goes about his merry way, engaging in promiscuous sex and extra marital affairs, appearing to be every man’s man, every woman’s dream, covering their tracks well and leaving a wake of devastation behind them. They brush the dust off and move on swiftly. Other people mean nothing to them. They possess no moral code or conscience. They do not answer to a higher power like the rest of us mere mortals. They do as they please always and even brag about how they “always get what they want”. If the victim does not abide by the game the narcissist plays, they will be severely maligned, abused, and destroyed.

 

Once the victim is safely secured in the narcissist’s prison, there is no escape. The narcissist will consume the thoughts, the functions and beliefs of the victim. In their own conscience, the victim recognizes all the red flags, that something is very wrong. Something is not natural and the gut instinct that all is not true about this person, infects their thinking. There is a war going on inside the victim. A constant roller coaster of emotions. Hot and cold. Charming and cruel. The voice is tiny though. The louder voice, proclaims, he is wonderful, a prince, my soul mate because this is what she needs and wants to believe. He knows this. He knows because of their good conscience and moral compass, the victim can only believe absolute good in the narcissist.

 

The narcissist is a professional at appearing to be a soul mate to everyone he encounters. When caught in a lie or anything that negatively may impact the narcissist’s facade he projects, he cries. He pleads. The tears and pleas for forgiveness are merely a ruse. Another disguise. The narcissist only cries for himself. The mask is slowly falling away and he knows this and he cannot bear being exposed. In time, he ultimately will discard and abandon the victim. At first through a devaluation phase. He begins to see the faults in that person and clings tightly to them. A sublte shift in emotional attachment. Then the snide comments and insults. There are more waiting in the wings that the narcissist already is priming and will quickly move on to, to obtain the only thing he seeks. Narcissistic supply.

 

 

 

With regards to the replies about being picky and valuing myself and now just wanting to give it away - yes, I can see how I'm contradicting myself.

 

That is an understatement. BTW, most OWs that come here in shambles once claimed they had it all together before they got destroyed by the affair.

 

Now that I've passed the big 3-0 and my situation is what it is, a level of panic and desperation has set in. Suddenly those standards that I thought were awesome over the last 10 years and would set the foundation for me making good choices and having good outcomes in life, seem to be the very reason I'm now where I'm at.

 

Typical! You are now lowering the bar. And you are doing this at age 30! As I said above if you were much older i would understand.

 

As Catplates suggested - yes, I really do feel like I missed the boat Where's my damn boat - I want a boat RIGHT NOW! I seem to have lost my ability to be happily single and my faith that Mr Right is on his way, so I guess I just decided that my standards were making me miserable so I should throw them out the window and that MM could be MR Right Now. I can see this is really not an appropriate reaction....

 

But I still feel sh*tty about my situation. I can read through all the replies here and suddenly say, oh my god, what was I thinking?! Everyone's right - I'm out of my freaking mind! And then I worry by next week I'll be right back in the same spot consumed with being alone and looking for an immediate solution.

 

You did not miss any boat. You are about to throw away the prime of your youth on an old fart. And this will consume you for the next 10-15 years. And by then it will be quite late to turn around.

 

 

Why do you think a man that cheats on his wife is attractive?

 

A woman with healthy self esteem would not give this guy a look for more than 2 seconds.

[Pierre]

Talking about external validation, your method does not make sense. Single man whom is very interested in that particular woman, would also say any kind of sweet words, attentive, gift, dining wining....etc, however it can not trigger the woman the same connection with the MM somehow. But I don't think there is any difference between external validation between single gentleman and the MM.

 

Single non cheating men are not as smooth as cheating men. Read the forum, most cheaters are charismatic, charming, and smooth. Where have you been?

[Eggplant]

Single non cheating men are not as smooth as cheating men. Read the forum, most cheaters are charismatic, charming, and smooth. Where have you been?

 

I want to ask a question about the charming MM.

 

 

I dated a lying man, who I didn't know was married. I have always read that men, when it comes to emotional intimacy, come in waves. Sometimes they give themselves, other times they need to retreat and have space. This man, contrary to what I was prepared for, did not come in stressful waves. He was there 150% emotionally from the beginning almost. Having only had 1 previous relationship, I didn't know how typical this behavior was. Now I wonder if this degree of emotional intimacy from a man should be considered a red flag. The next guy I date had better have reservations... that means he is genuinely considering giving. People what do you think?

[stevie_23]

In terms of what Mount said about not being able to help who you're attracted to, this is correct. HOWEVER...I've often thought...if I was developing a crush on someone who was a complication (married, way way older, whatever else that may pose a significant issue at some stage later down the track), in hindsight, I would just NOT pursue it. GOD NO!

 

Just WAIT and find someone else who you can love JUST as much, who will give you those butterfly feelings and that spark JUST as intensely, but who will NOT come with all those added complications (and once it's too late and you're in love? Complications like that = PAIN.)

 

YES, if you back off from this potential affair, you will most likely be missing out on something pretty good FOR A WHILE. But it is WORTH missing out on that because of the HORRIBLE amount of pain and stress and LOSS of yourself that will follow.

 

I don't regret my A with my ex-MM. I really don't. It took me a while to get to this point though. It HAS messed me up big time though, and I will NEVER be the same again. And he wasn't my first. (well, actually he sort of was in a way. He was the first man I was ever with, but we were online / long distance only so...meh)

 

In any case, if you are not in love with this guy yet? DON'T LET YOURSELF FALL IN LOVE WITH HIM! PLEASE! For your own happiness. Seriously. I KNOW what it's like. There's maybe 1% of long term affair couples who are actually mostly HAPPY. The rest? Crash and burn after however long of a roller coaster of emotional highs and crushing lows.

 

Are you perhaps drawn to him because he's a protective older figure? Or maybe because he's somewhat "safe" because he's married and thus, less pressure on you to make this HUGE decision and commitment to giving yourself wholly to someone?

Edited February 24, 2013 by stevie_23

[2sunny]

What I think and how I feel is much different than what I DO.

 

A person's ACTIONS is what defines their character - or lack of.

 

When it comes to bad behavior - it doesn't matter how I FEEL - it only matters what I DO.

 

I have a boundary. I don't get involved with men who are taken/married.

[wisernow]

In terms of what Mount said about not being able to help who you're attracted to, this is correct. HOWEVER...I've often thought...if I was developing a crush on someone who was a complication (married, way way older, whatever else that may pose a significant issue at some stage later down the track), in hindsight, I would just NOT pursue it. GOD NO!

 

Just WAIT and find someone else who you can love JUST as much, who will give you those butterfly feelings and that spark JUST as intensely, but who will NOT come with all those added complications (and once it's too late and you're in love? Complications like that = PAIN.)

 

YES, if you back off from this potential affair, you will most likely be missing out on something pretty good FOR A WHILE. But it is WORTH missing out on that because of the HORRIBLE amount of pain and stress and LOSS of yourself that will follow.

 

I don't regret my A with my ex-MM. I really don't. It took me a while to get to this point though. It HAS messed me up big time though, and I will NEVER be the same again. And he wasn't my first. (well, actually he sort of was in a way. He was the first man I was ever with, but we were online / long distance only so...meh)

 

In any case, if you are not in love with this guy yet? DON'T LET YOURSELF FALL IN LOVE WITH HIM! PLEASE! For your own happiness. Seriously. I KNOW what it's like. There's maybe 1% of long term affair couples who are actually mostly HAPPY. The rest? Crash and burn after however long of a roller coaster of emotional highs and crushing lows.

 

Are you perhaps drawn to him because he's a protective older figure? Or maybe because he's somewhat "safe" because he's married and thus, less pressure on you to make this HUGE decision and commitment to giving yourself wholly to someone?

 

^^This^^

 

OP, Could this be why you are contemplating this arrangement with this MM? Wise words, Stevie!

[lafleur]

Because of the huge age difference, there have been quite a few questions about daddy issues and/or me looking for a "safe" relationship (eg: someone I don't actually have to commit to because they're not available).

 

I've thought about this... a lot. I'm definitely not actively seeking out older guys. I can see all the problems that causes. I'm one of those people who cringe when I see people together that have massive age gaps. I totally agree it's not right!! And if I got together with MM, I would never want to be openly seen in a social setting where it was obvious we were together. It would make me feel really uncomfortable. And if he said he was leaving his wife for me, I would freak out!

 

But, I do find a lot of guys my own age immature, which is a huge turn off for me.

 

I'm a type A personality. I'm overly ambitious, slightly competitive, work a lot, have an opinion etc. I'm not domineering, but I'm certainly not a shrinking violet either. In terms of a guy, I want someone who is slightly more of all these things than me. It's not that I want to be dominated in a relationship (that definitely would not work) but I do want the man to be the man. Unfortunately, I'm not sure guys my own age have developed the ability to match me at my own game yet.

 

And it's not that I want to be "looked after" in a relationship either, but there is something ever so slightly appealing about finding someone that could occasionally just "fix" the odd problem when it pops up. I run my own business and have been single forever, which means I'm always the one in control and always the one finding solutions to both business and everyday life situations that can sometimes be really stressful. Don't get me wrong, for the most part I like being in control! But it gets exhausting sometimes. On some level I think I would occasionally like someone to take over and let me fall into a somewhat gender submissive role. Does this make sense? I feel uncomfortable even writing that...

 

As a really ridiculous example (everyone try not to laugh), when MM took me for coffee, we went in his car and he drove. I can't remember the last time anyone drove me anywhere (unless I was in a taxi). I distinctly remember thinking how nice it was to just sit back and let him do the driving and figure where we were going. I know, that sounds stupid, right?

[beyond]

Because of the huge age difference, there have been quite a few questions about daddy issues and/or me looking for a "safe" relationship (eg: someone I don't actually have to commit to because they're not available).

 

I've thought about this... a lot. I'm definitely not actively seeking out older guys. I can see all the problems that causes. I'm one of those people who cringe when I see people together that have massive age gaps. I totally agree it's not right!! And if I got together with MM, I would never want to be openly seen in a social setting where it was obvious we were together. It would make me feel really uncomfortable. And if he said he was leaving his wife for me, I would freak out!

 

But, I do find a lot of guys my own age immature, which is a huge turn off for me.

 

I'm a type A personality. I'm overly ambitious, slightly competitive, work a lot, have an opinion etc. I'm not domineering, but I'm certainly not a shrinking violet either. In terms of a guy, I want someone who is slightly more of all these things than me. It's not that I want to be dominated in a relationship (that definitely would not work) but I do want the man to be the man. Unfortunately, I'm not sure guys my own age have developed the ability to match me at my own game yet.

 

And it's not that I want to be "looked after" in a relationship either, but there is something ever so slightly appealing about finding someone that could occasionally just "fix" the odd problem when it pops up. I run my own business and have been single forever, which means I'm always the one in control and always the one finding solutions to both business and everyday life situations that can sometimes be really stressful. Don't get me wrong, for the most part I like being in control! But it gets exhausting sometimes. On some level I think I would occasionally like someone to take over and let me fall into a somewhat gender submissive role. Does this make sense? I feel uncomfortable even writing that...

 

As a really ridiculous example (everyone try not to laugh), when MM took me for coffee, we went in his car and he drove. I can't remember the last time anyone drove me anywhere (unless I was in a taxi). I distinctly remember thinking how nice it was to just sit back and let him do the driving and figure where we were going. I know, that sounds stupid, right?

 

No, it doesn't sound stupid at all.....in fact it sounds like......me! lol.

 

What you have described there is that you would like a 'man' as opposed to a 'boy'. But this isn't an age thing. There are plenty of 'boys' who are far older than you and men who are your age who take charge when required....and are single.

 

You seem to be thinking this through really well La Fleur - keep going.

[Pierre]

Because of the huge age difference, there have been quite a few questions about daddy issues and/or me looking for a "safe" relationship (eg: someone I don't actually have to commit to because they're not available).

 

I've thought about this... a lot. I'm definitely not actively seeking out older guys. I can see all the problems that causes. I'm one of those people who cringe when I see people together that have massive age gaps. I totally agree it's not right!! And if I got together with MM, I would never want to be openly seen in a social setting where it was obvious we were together. It would make me feel really uncomfortable. And if he said he was leaving his wife for me, I would freak out!

 

But, I do find a lot of guys my own age immature, which is a huge turn off for me.

 

I'm a type A personality. I'm overly ambitious, slightly competitive, work a lot, have an opinion etc. I'm not domineering, but I'm certainly not a shrinking violet either. In terms of a guy, I want someone who is slightly more of all these things than me. It's not that I want to be dominated in a relationship (that definitely would not work) but I do want the man to be the man. Unfortunately, I'm not sure guys my own age have developed the ability to match me at my own game yet.

 

And it's not that I want to be "looked after" in a relationship either, but there is something ever so slightly appealing about finding someone that could occasionally just "fix" the odd problem when it pops up. I run my own business and have been single forever, which means I'm always the one in control and always the one finding solutions to both business and everyday life situations that can sometimes be really stressful. Don't get me wrong, for the most part I like being in control! But it gets exhausting sometimes. On some level I think I would occasionally like someone to take over and let me fall into a somewhat gender submissive role. Does this make sense? I feel uncomfortable even writing that...

 

As a really ridiculous example (everyone try not to laugh), when MM took me for coffee, we went in his car and he drove. I can't remember the last time anyone drove me anywhere (unless I was in a taxi). I distinctly remember thinking how nice it was to just sit back and let him do the driving and figure where we were going. I know, that sounds stupid, right?

 

Stop it!

 

Your post shows too much low self esteem. That you were impressed because he gave you a ride in his car shows how incredibly thirsty you are for external validation.

 

Like many OWs you post a long list of accomplishments, but that does not negate your highly vulnerable state. The cheating MM senses your weakness and he wants to get you in the sac. What an opportunity! I am sure he loves the game and the two of you are a match made in heaven.

 

A cheating MM can pick a woman like you a mile away.

 

A healthy women with good self esteem would not pay any attention to this old guy. But, you are so thirsty that you cannot stay away. MM knows this and he will be ready to deflower you.

 

You need IC to see why you are not offended by this.

[ThatJustHappened]

Yes it is ok. Sorry, I don't quite understand your question...what were you trying to say behind your questoin?

 

Yes, I don't ever think I said I break up, it was "we" break up, but in reality sometimes we choose to stay where we are, or not. Everything is a conscious behavior.

 

I never am intending to whine as victim. Let me say it again - everything/consequence is from conscious mindset/decision - even though I would feel uncomfortable/painful sometime.

 

Back to lafleur, she has to be involved with the MM then she could have unhappiness due to the situation. It is her call anyway.

 

So everyone who's attracted to each other should just go ahead and have sex? That seems smart.

[ThatJustHappened]

OP you sound like a very intelligent woman. I'm the same age as you (turning 30 in April) and I understand your frustration, I really do. But think about this logically.

 

- Where do you see this affair going?

 

- Is he going to leave his wife for you?

 

- Do you really want to get involved with this man and waste the next couple of years on a dead end affair only to wake up on your 35th birthday and realize that you're STILL alone, but now you're tainted by your lascivious first (and only) relationship? I'm not saying we're old, or that 35 is old..I'm just saying think about how you'll feel 5 years down the line when you're embroiled in this nonsense. IF you don't get caught and humiliated that is, which is a strong possibility.

 

- Do you want to lose your virginity, something you've held onto for 30 years, to some creep who also has sex with another woman, a woman to whom he has legal and emotional obligations?

 

- This guy is SO clearly grooming you to be his OW. He is a class A jerk and you deserve better.

[stevie_23]

^^This^^

 

OP, Could this be why you are contemplating this arrangement with this MM? Wise words, Stevie!

 

Ah yes, quite wise perhaps, but I think easily picked up because it’s most likely the reasons for my OWN affair with my ex-MM, who was 27 years older than me, taken and I was also taken and so not able to fully commit, and also never having had any experience intimately with a man before.

[lafleur]

Stop it!

 

Your post shows too much low self esteem. That you were impressed because he gave you a ride in his car shows how incredibly thirsty you are for external validation.

 

At this point this thread is pretty much finished, as I can clearly see that getting involved with MM is a terrible idea. It was really useful to talk about it here, and there's a good possibility I would have made a different choice today if I hadn't had the opportunity to talk it through here first. It really helped me realize it was a bad idea, so thanks so much to everyone

 

Pierre - I appreciated your input, so this is not a criticism in any way, but you're wrong about linking everything back to external validation. I wasn't "impressed" MM gave me a ride in his car - my point was that it's nice to have someone look out for you sometimes and take the pressure off. That's a fairly normal part of any friendship or relationship. I would have felt the same way if it had been a female friend that had done that, but the point is that taking over in times of crisis or just generally being on the lookout for someone most often happens in romantic relationships. It's a nice thing, no? Doesn't everyone want that?

 

I just don't see how my last post shows low self esteem or weakness? The post was about what most people would consider normal/healthy gender roles and taking comfort in letting a guy take the lead now and again. What's the point of a relationship if I don't actually need the man for anything? 99% of men want to feel needed in a relationship. They *want* to be the protector and the provider. It wasn't talking about older married men, I was talking about men in general. I'm fairly sure most guys don't want to be emasculated in their relationships. I've seen strong female friends do this and it never works. They guy leaves to go elsewhere were he feels he's needed and can be the "man". Anyway, I like your input Pierre, you've just gotta get a new line