Hypocrisy

[Decorative]

truly hypocritical!

 

My H, who did not even see me during the affair, became hyper-vigilant, incredibly jealous and stalked me when I had thrown him out after the affair!

 

I tell OW all the time to carefully consider this. For many a MM, it has NOTHING to with the kids and the assets....

 

he keeps the affair secret because he COULD NEVER handle his wife doing exactly what he is doing....effing another.

 

manipulation and control and hypocrisy in the extreme.

 

Same experience.

 

I set him free to be with her, and that is what happened.

 

Ironically ? She "cheated" on him with another MM, and he didn't react much. he said later in therapy " I already knew what kind of woman she was. I wasn't surprised".

 

Oy.

[Decorative]

And as for the active OW who does not support infidelity?

 

That's the best example of the OP. Like ever. LOL

[Spark1111]

I do not support infidelity. I do not practice it myself. I am doing everything in my power to support my MM in dealing with the issues which cause him to be unfaithful.

 

So then you actively support him in leading a hypocritical life?

 

how long is this relationship? How long has he been dealing with the issues that force him to be unfaithful?

[Spark1111]

You do realize that if Neo had sex with his wife he would be unfaithful to me. We have an agreement of sexual exclusivity.

 

So did my H with his fOW. It wasn't true. he lied about that also, but I guess she remained exclusive with him, so I suppose it worked.

 

And it is these same MM who go insanely, crazily jealous after DDay when the spouse throws them out and now they fear another man in their marital bed above all else.

 

Kids? Assets? Hogwash....primal male jealousy trying to keep the paws of his possessions which includes his wife.

[SmokeRat]

Agreed about the gun selling not being against the law.

 

It's not consenual to the betrayed spouse, but then again, for self centered, egomanical, selfish poor excuses for human beings, who cares about the betrayed spouse.

 

You go ahead and keep telling yourself your actions are ok. Eventually, events such as these catch up with people, and never with good results.

 

It may be consensual between you and MOM, but when the wife finds out (they all do), she'll come down on you like the Fist of an Angry God, filled with righteous fury.

[96nole]

You do realize that if Neo had sex with his wife he would be unfaithful to me. We have an agreement of sexual exclusivity.

You are trusting this man, who lies to his wife about you, won't lie to you about not having sex with his wife.

Are you with him 24 hours a day, 7 days a week to verify this?

[Owl]

This may be the crux of the disconnect here. If HE is the hypocrite, why are you calling her one?

 

 

I am not a hypocrite.

I made the choices I have based on what I personally can live with.

 

I do not believe in lying, so I personally do not lie.

I do not feel that keeping my relationship a secret from those important to me would be ok, so I don't.

I would never become involved with another while committed to someone, so, I don't cheat.

I don't steal, I don't violate other's privacy, I don't gossip or spread rumors, I give to charity and I try to actively make life better for someone each and every day.

I have never once encouraged someone to become entrenched in an affair. I think it's a foolish decision and not one I'd make again, but it's one I did make. I've always admitted that.

These are the things I've chosen to live by.

I never once was a person that would have told you I'd have avoided married men, mostly because the idea was so bizarre to me it would never have entered my head.

 

I don't think someone else making choices that we may or may not agree with makes one a hypocrite.

Hypocrisy is the state of promoting or trying to enforce standards, attitudes, lifestyles, virtues, beliefs, principles, etc., that one does not actually hold.

Hypocrisy is not simply failing to practice those virtues that one preaches.

 

YOU don't personally do these things...and yet your very actions in maintaining a relationship with someone that requires that HE participate in these actions and conduct himself in this fashion...by it's nature..."promotes" those standards in him.

 

Hence the perceived hypocrisy when it comes to being an OW/OM engaged in an affair stating that they aren't hypocritical when they condone the very affair that they're in themselves.

 

They view themselves as "better" for not having conducted those actions themselves...but the very nature of the relationship they're in promotes and condones those behaviors in someone else.

 

Q.E.D.

[nofool4u]

To me hypocrisy is BSs wondering why OW did not refrain from having the EMR out of empathy for them while clearly lacking empathy for the OW.

 

Because the BS is married to the bastard. Not quite as simple.

 

And why should a wife have empathy for someone who knowingly is boning their husband and doesn't care who she hurts?

[nofool4u]

Understanding that you can be in a position where you love a man who is married and choose to have/continue a relationship with him because you love him. That that does not make you evil or a perpetrator but a woman in love.

 

No, that makes her a woman where severing ties really isn't as simple. Some BS are thinking of their children, some are thinking of financial ruin that a divorce can bring about.

 

Don't get me wrong, I don't think those are good reasons to stay with a POS cheater, but I'm not going to judge someone who has been put in a tough situation by their spouse and their sex on the side partner.

Edited March 4, 2013 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[KathyM]

I agree. Cheaters ARE hypocrites. They have relationships outside their committed one, but don't want their spouse/SO to do the same. They would suggest an open marriage if they wanted to be fair, or leave their spouse/SO instead of going behind their back. But they want to have their cake and eat it too, and they don't want their spouse/SO to be able to, so they choose to keep their spouse/SO in the dark. Definately hypocritical. I know a couple who are now divorced where the guy was a serial cheater, and his wife stayed in the marriage, but eventually the wife had an affair as well, and all hell broke loose when her affair was discovered. Definately a double standard and hypocritical.

[Spark1111]

I agree. Cheaters ARE hypocrites. They have relationships outside their committed one, but don't want their spouse/SO to do the same. They would suggest an open marriage if they wanted to be fair, or leave their spouse/SO instead of going behind their back. But they want to have their cake and eat it too, and they don't want their spouse/SO to be able to, so they choose to keep their spouse/SO in the dark. Definately hypocritical. I know a couple who are now divorced where the guy was a serial cheater, and his wife stayed in the marriage, but eventually the wife had an affair as well, and all hell broke loose when her affair was discovered. Definately a double standard and hypocritical.

 

A few months after DDay, when my H was still begging me to reconcile, I told him HIS LYING TO ME was what I could not get past.

 

So I asked him, would you still be here begging IF I HONESTLY informed you I intended to date others during this separation?

 

His answer: Probably not.

 

How hypocritical is that? At least it was honestly so, I guess.

[Furious]

No, because that would violate the terms of the relationship parameters I have set with him. But I know he sleeps with his wife and have always been aware of that nor do I expect him to stop.

 

In essence you're saying your MM can cheat and lie to his wife but you've set parameters in your affair that he is not to cheat and lie to you.

 

it's like me telling my children they can lie and steal but they can't steal and lie to me.

[KathyM]

A few months after DDay, when my H was still begging me to reconcile, I told him HIS LYING TO ME was what I could not get past.

 

So I asked him, would you still be here begging IF I HONESTLY informed you I intended to date others during this separation?

 

His answer: Probably not.

 

How hypocritical is that? At least it was honestly so, I guess.

Yeah, it's kind of funny/pathetic/disgusting how cheaters think they can cheat, but they can't stand the thought of their spouse/SO having sex with someone else or being with someone else.

[ComingInHot]

Trinity,

I'd imagine you are feeling somewhat "picked on" right now and I am sorry for that.

It's just that you are a perfect example of what the majority (including some exOW's) are talking about within OP's thread topic.

 

I read what you wrote here, "I don't do unfaithful. I don't want my partner to do it either but that is not within my control.

 

You can call it hypocrisy all you want. You should see by now that my value system is different than yours. I am from another country, another culture. There is more than one way to look at these things. The world is a large place. So what may be hypocrisy to you, may be following my value system to me. "

 

I find it heart-wrenchingly sad. I would probably be jailed or stoned if I was forced to live in a society that lacks such humanity in and of itself. To me, it sounds like your society has literally "turned off" the souls of it's people to what is morally and ethically wrong, NOT just in one's society but in one's own heart, soul, conscience (whatever term you like).

 

What I see happening is a refusal to acknowledge what is basic in right and wrong. The whole, "I don't classify between liars/non-liars" thing to this here, "I'm Not a hypocrite because I AM against infidelity but fully support someone else's infidelity by enabling them in the hopes I get what I want".

 

Trinity I swear to you (and I don't lie as in if you look fat in that dress I will lovingly tell you that you have other things that flatter you WAY better than that dress*) I am NOT trying to be mean or disrespectful. I am TRYING to understand you.

And what I understand so far is that you come from a place that is able to justify and rationalize behaviors to a point that ANYTHING is acceptable for one's personal gain REGARDLESS of the pain it inflicts on others because its "all relative"...

To me, a person's heart and the sanctity of their marriage is not relative or justified, rationalized away for someone else's personal gain.

 

I really do believe that is Hypocrisy.

[cocorico]

 

i find it even more hypocritical ( to the point that it's almost nauseating) when one is is/was married sees zero problem with being involved with a married person...how would they have felt if their spouse had been cheating? I owuld asusme they would have felt pretty bad...yet they have little problem, although they may pay lip service to the idea that they are conflicted, with enabling such as relationship to take place...as long as it's not happening to them, they are fine with it...

 

I was M, previously, yet had no problem having a R with a MM. And no, that does not make me a hypocrite. You *assume* I would have felt bad had my then-H shagged another. Actually, you could not be further from the truth! I would not have felt a thing, either way. Sexual infidelity is only a big deal to those people whose identity is vested in their M. Mine wasn't, and isn't. My self-esteem does not rise or fall by how many compliments my H pays me each day, nor whether or not he notices other women. I am quite secure in myself and my self-worth does not depend on anyone else.

[Owl]

I was M, previously, yet had no problem having a R with a MM. And no, that does not make me a hypocrite. You *assume* I would have felt bad had my then-H shagged another. Actually, you could not be further from the truth! I would not have felt a thing, either way. Sexual infidelity is only a big deal to those people whose identity is vested in their M. Mine wasn't, and isn't. My self-esteem does not rise or fall by how many compliments my H pays me each day, nor whether or not he notices other women. I am quite secure in myself and my self-worth does not depend on anyone else.

 

What that sounds like from the outside is a lack of emotional investment into your relationship with your H.

 

If you don't care if he seeks someone else...that tends to be more indicative of a lack of committment on your part as well as his.

 

If you're invested in something, you don't want to lose it. You value it.

 

I don't see this same viewpoint in your description of your marriage.

 

Perhaps the difference here is more cultural, as Trinity suggests? Perhaps the difference is in the value placed on the marriage, the relationship, and how much you invest into that?

 

I could see Trinity's viewpoints from that stance. Marriage/marital/personal relationships doesn't mean nearly as much in her culture as it does in ours...so the violation of it means far less as well.

 

There could be a lot less emotional investment in marriages in those other cultures as compared to our western expectations...it's more of a business transaction, and less of a love relationship as it is here.

 

I could see that, and it could explain a lot about the differences in how we react to infidelity as well.

[KathyM]

I was M, previously, yet had no problem having a R with a MM. And no, that does not make me a hypocrite. You *assume* I would have felt bad had my then-H shagged another. Actually, you could not be further from the truth! I would not have felt a thing, either way. Sexual infidelity is only a big deal to those people whose identity is vested in their M. Mine wasn't, and isn't. My self-esteem does not rise or fall by how many compliments my H pays me each day, nor whether or not he notices other women. I am quite secure in myself and my self-worth does not depend on anyone else.

So you're saying that you have no respect for marriage, don't think it should involve monogamy, would not have cared if your husband lied to you and had sex with others while married to you, and you currently do not care if your current husband (former MM) lies to you and has sex with other women while married to you. Somehow I find that hard to believe.

[cocorico]

What that sounds like from the outside is a lack of emotional investment into your relationship with your H.

 

If you don't care if he seeks someone else...that tends to be more indicative of a lack of committment on your part as well as his.

 

If you're invested in something, you don't want to lose it. You value it.

 

I don't see this same viewpoint in your description of your marriage.

 

Perhaps the difference here is more cultural, as Trinity suggests? Perhaps the difference is in the value placed on the marriage, the relationship, and how much you invest into that?

 

I could see Trinity's viewpoints from that stance. Marriage/marital/personal relationships doesn't mean nearly as much in her culture as it does in ours...so the violation of it means far less as well.

 

I could see that, and it could explain a lot about the differences in how we react to infidelity as well.

 

Of course I value my R - not that it is a M, I couldn't care less what name it was given, or what piece of paper was attached. I value the connection I have to my Beloved, I value our live together, our shared goals, our shared interests, the life we build together. And yes, I am deeply committed to it and choose each day to renew that commitment.

 

That does not mean I would be shattered if he shagged someone else. My mind is boggled that you equate the two. You honestly measure someone's commitment to their M by how gutted they would be if their SO shagged another? So, poly couples are really just playing house? Open Ms are just a sham? Traditional African Ms, Ms by Muslim rites, Mormon Ms or other polygamous Ms are all as serious as Britney Spears's 10 minute Vegas M?? Seriously, you believe that?

[cocorico]

I see. So all people who have forged a bond with their spouse and there is a promise between the two to keep themselves only for each other are somehow inferior. Gotcha.

 

 

Since that is patently not what I said, I have no idea why you quoted my post. If you wish to respond to your own projection rather than what was written, please do so without dragging an innocent post onto the fray.

[Furious]

Of course I value my R - not that it is a M, I couldn't care less what name it was given, or what piece of paper was attached. I value the connection I have to my Beloved, I value our live together, our shared goals, our shared interests, the life we build together. And yes, I am deeply committed to it and choose each day to renew that commitment.

 

That does not mean I would be shattered if he shagged someone else. My mind is boggled that you equate the two. You honestly measure someone's commitment to their M by how gutted they would be if their SO shagged another? So, poly couples are really just playing house? Open Ms are just a sham? Traditional African Ms, Ms by Muslim rites, Mormon Ms or other polygamous Ms are all as serious as Britney Spears's 10 minute Vegas M?? Seriously, you believe that?

 

 

 

If someone chooses open marriage, or living together, swinging, or Mormon marriage, that's all good if they so chose it.

 

But when it's a traditional marriage and you've made vows to be faithful to each other but then go behind your spouses back and cheat that's where the problem is.

 

It's hypocritical to lie and cheat on your spouse but pretend to be faithful to that spouse.

[cocorico]

If someone chooses open marriage, or living together, swinging, or Mormon marriage, that's all good if they so chose it.

 

Please read that in context. I was responding to this:

 

If you don't care if he seeks someone else...that tends to be more indicative of a lack of committment on your part as well as his.

 

The implication was that a SO in a poly / open arrangement had a "lack of commitment" since they did not herniated at the thought of their SO seeking another.

[cocorico]

You inferred people who have an emotional investment in their spouse finding them attractive are weak minded. THAT is why your post was quoted.

 

I inferred no such thing. I stated that my self-worth was independent of that, and so the assumption that I would fall apart if my SO "sought another" was false. If you wish to project, feel free to do,so, but please take ownership of your projections and do not attempt to attribute them to me.

[Owl]

Of course I value my R - not that it is a M, I couldn't care less what name it was given, or what piece of paper was attached. I value the connection I have to my Beloved, I value our live together, our shared goals, our shared interests, the life we build together. And yes, I am deeply committed to it and choose each day to renew that commitment.

 

That does not mean I would be shattered if he shagged someone else. My mind is boggled that you equate the two. You honestly measure someone's commitment to their M by how gutted they would be if their SO shagged another? So, poly couples are really just playing house? Open Ms are just a sham? Traditional African Ms, Ms by Muslim rites, Mormon Ms or other polygamous Ms are all as serious as Britney Spears's 10 minute Vegas M?? Seriously, you believe that?

 

I hadn't realized we were talking about open marriages, or any relationship where it was previously discussed and agreed upon that physical relationships outside of the marriage were already agreed upon and approved.

 

That is a completely different kind of thing from the "standard" marriage where the expectation is that both participants intend to remain monogamous.

 

There is a huge difference in the "expectations" of those marriages/relationsihps. Whether or not they are as committed, I couldn't personally say as I've never been in one, nor would I agree to participate in one.

 

But again...you can clearly see that the EXPECTATIONS of the relationship are completely different in that regard. Open relationships aren't as widely accepted in western cultures as they are in others...so again, the expectations of the marriage are different...which could be why we have differing opinions on what constitutes a violation of the marital expectations.

[Owl]

Actually it was the day I handed my SO the bottle of alcohol he asked for from the refrigerator and he himself had to make the choice whether to take it or not that his sobriety became solid. He's been sober now for 27 years.

 

This raises the question of when are you going to do the same with him in reference to your relationship with him, and whether or not he chooses to remain with you, or with her.

 

Sometimes, that IS the way to have someone make a choice AND DEMONSTRATE their true intentions by showing it in their actions.

 

That same "ultimatum" is often given to WS's on d-day. The choice they make at that point is that defining moment in their future relationships...as was that day for your SO.

 

So when do you plan on "handing him the bottle" of your relationship?

[Robert]

Time for a post from a moderator.

 

I have been spending too much time editing and deleting posts on this thread because of the slights, pokes and even the passive aggressive alerting that has been happening.

 

If you all cannot leave the pokes, slights and insults.. hidden or otherwise at the door and post to the topic and not to a person then expect an infraction from this point forward.

 

Thanks