Dealing with the abuse aspects of infidelity

[SidLyon]

You don't have to give us all of them. Just the best ones. It's kind of silly if we all have to go and look for them when obviously you've already found them.

 

I believe it hurts terribly. The word abuse I don't think fits.

 

It pulled up a bunch of BS's claiming it was abuse on blogs and perhaps one or two 'experts', but nothing more.

 

One reason I didn't give links was to encourage people to research it for themselves. Whether you accept or reject what you find is up to you.

 

Trinity, it's up to you whether you want to feel silly by doing your own research. I am sure you wouldn't just take my word for it anyway.

 

Realist, thank you for looking.

 

I asked before do you think that the behaviours towards one's BW that go with infidelity are abusive behaviours? Do you limit the meaning of abuse in your mind to "physical abuse" or being assaulted? Do you even accept the existence of psychological and emotional abuse?

 

My own fWH has had an awful lot of trouble coming to grips with the fact that his gaslighting of me (and other stuff too) was abusive behaviour.

 

I sympathise with you both and the other WSs and OWs who don't want to acknowledge that they themselves or their MP, is a spouse abuser. I can understand why you would want to limit the definition of "abuse" to being beaten up.

Edited March 9, 2013 by SidLyon

[angie2443]

I think, once you understand what abuse is, the question of infidelity bieng abusive is very simple. Abuse is a harmful way to control someone. You control someone to make things better for you. Abuse always, always, involves screwing with a persons mind. It always involves distorting the abused person's sense of reality because if they knew what was really going on, if they understood the real motives of the person abusing them, they would have the power of knowledge and most likely take actions to get themselves out of the abusive situation. If you are a person in a commited relationship (at least one you told your partner was commited) and you want to have someone else on the side, but don't want to change things at home, you have to distort your partner's reality by lying or you're not get what you want. Abuse has to be part of infidelity or else, it wouldn't be infidelity. It's as simple as that.

[angie2443]

It's classic blame the victim mentality so the perpetrators don't feel guilty.

 

This is another tool that is always used by an abusive person.

[Decorative]

One reason I didn't give links was to encourage people to research it for themselves. Whether you accept or reject what you find is up to you.

 

Trinity, it's up to you whether you want to feel silly by doing your own research. I am sure you wouldn't just take my word for it anyway.

 

Realist, thank you for looking.

 

I asked before do you think that the behaviours towards one's BW that go with infidelity are abusive behaviours? Do you limit the meaning of abuse in your mind to "physical abuse" or being assaulted? Do you even accept the existence of psychological and emotional abuse?

 

My own fWH has had an awful lot of trouble coming to grips with the fact that his gaslighting of me (and other stuff too) was abusive behaviour.

 

I sympathise with you both and the other WSs and OWs who don't want to acknowledge that they themselves or their MP, is a spouse abuser. I can understand why you would want to limit the definition of "abuse" to being beaten up.

 

Well said.

 

The day the MC read characteristics if emotional abuse to my spouse?

 

He started to cry.

 

He recognized what he had done to me.

 

It was horrible for him to realize that, and a whole lot of protective denial had gone into walling that realization off. Until that day in the office. When he realized.

[AnotherRound]

AR.........Bringing up WS's who are abused in THIS thread is strawman logic. You know it, everyone else knows it too.

 

I'm sure it would be a good topic for a new thread.

 

 

No, not a straw man, an honest "other side of the coin". It's a chicken or egg question - is the WS having an affair bc they felt abused? Because if so - then, is the "abuse" of the BS more valid than the WSs previous abuse simply bc the WS had an affair?

 

It's spotty logic, and emotionally fueled. Like I said, if someone feels abused, then they WERE abused - regardless of what anyone else says about it. I do not think that having another relationship outside of your marriage is innately abusive - I do agree that gaslighting is abusive - as most instances of lying (and invalidating someone else's feelings and emotions ) are abusive.

 

I guess this comes back to everyone assuming that if there is an A that there is lying and gaslighting. And simply due to my experience, I know this not to be true - so, I have a different image in my head when someone says "affair" - I don't automatically assume that the BS was in the dark as I've seen and heard too many stories of them not being in the dark. So, it's hard for me to agree with such a broad generalization of saying "Having an affair is abusive to the BS" - because that isn't ALWAYS the case.

 

And, just wondering if any of the BSs who were commenting that it is innately abuse - no matter the circumstances (if there was lying or not, etc.) would agree with the many WSs who claim that they felt abused and that is why they chose to have an affair? Because they didn't feel like it was "fair" that they should have to give up half their lives and time with their children bc their BS was neglectful (aka abusive)? I would like BSs to answer honestly and without saying "it's negated because he/she had an affair" bc that is exactly the point - many WSs feel abused prior to seeking another relationship. Is everyone in agreement that is bs but that the other way (BSs being abused by the affair) is universally true?

[AnotherRound]

It's classic blame the victim mentality so the perpetrators don't feel guilty.

 

Nope, that wasn't my point at all. My point was - what if both people - the WS and the BS feel abused? Is one more valid than the other? And if so, why?

 

I will say it one more time - if someone feels abused, then they were abused, period. When we feel invalidated, it's abusive - and I would never say to someone, "what you feel is wrong, you weren't abused!". If it feels bad, then it's abusive to some extent.

 

My question is - why is one way (having an affair) viewed as abusive automatically, but the other way (neglecting a spouse and refusing to participate in a marriage on any intimate level - if that is what the BS did) not considered abusive automatically?

 

If someone feels a victim as a BS, I understand that - but being able to look at the other side of the coin and see that the WS probably felt abused too might help one understand why the breakdown occurred in the first place. Ignoring that other side of the coin and only seeing one side only gives you half the picture - and I'm fearful that will lead you to erroneous conclusions, and it won't be helpful at all.

 

It's not about denying any abuse YOU suffered - but about acknowledging that some things that are abusive are just more subtle - passive/aggressive even. ???

[Decorative]

I just asked my spouse if he ever felt abused by me.

 

He's adorable when he raises one eyebrow in utter confusion.

 

LOL

 

AR- feel free to start a thread for waywards to discuss the ways they were abused by their betrayed spouses and then felt led to cheat in return.

 

Because in this thread? It is absolutely a strawman.

[ComingInHot]

trin, "Y ou lost the second part of my post which clearly states that I was thinking of the healing of the BSs:"

 

Ah no. I didn't. It just didn't make sense to me after I read all your "non classifications".

 

It's okay though. This is absolutely something you & I will never agree on*

[sweet_pea]

It may not be as severe as physical violence, but yes, I can see how BS' considering infidelity abuse. Just from a general standpoint, I know that for many, while the WS was off frolicking with the OW, he was neglecting his BS/family, spending money on the OW, this, that and the other. And I know that in my case, xWS got pretty verbally abusive at one point, his entire personality changed. It was awful.

 

As a side note, Trinity, what book did you get that quote from? I would love to research more on this "expert's" opinion on being the 'victim.' Thank you!

[Decorative]

You know what?

 

I understand some people's need to blame the betrayed spouse at all costs. No matter how illogical. No matter how untrue. I get it.

 

Because it has to be absolutely horrible to sit quietly with the knowledge that a person was hurt for no good reason on such a deep level.

 

And that you helped perpetrate that harm. Or initiated it.

 

It takes a lot to be able to handle that. Not everyone is up to the task.

[sweet_pea]

I always state the source of a quote, see the parenthesis at the end of the quote.

 

Yes, I saw that you wrote her name down. I tried to look it up in google (pasting the quote you gave, searching for her/keywords) and nothing came up therefore I am asking you, again, what book/article did it come from?Thank you!

Edited March 9, 2013 by sweet_pea

[Furious]

Yes, I saw that you wrote her name down. I tried to look it up in google (pasting the quote you gave, searching for her/keywords) and nothing came up therefore I am asking you, again, what book/article did it come from?Thank you!

 

 

I can't find it either, all I find on Emily Brown is her theory on split-selves, which think is hogwash.

[sweet_pea]

The book AFFAIRS by Emily Brown. A copy of it is laying right next to my computer.

 

Underneath the title it says: "A Guide to Working Through the Repercussions of Infidelity", so a good book to read for BSs who want to heal.

 

Thank you, I'll have to check it out.

[Decorative]

Thank you, I'll have to check it out.

 

I've read it.

 

As a BS- it painted, in my opinion, a very unflattering picture of the OW ( which is why I am confused as to why Trinity would endorse it) and did not resonate with me in recovery.

 

But give it a whirl and report back.

[anne1707]

As I said, I do my best to understand from all perspectives and aspects. E Brown's only weak part is her description of "the third party". That doesn't negate her good parts.

 

Do you only ever read Emily Brown's work? If so, that would suggest to me that you only consider things from one perspective. One that could, after all, be wrong. Or self-serving.

[anne1707]

No, I have a whole lot of books on infidelity here on my book shelf, but hers are by far the best. Some are good, some are excellent, some are so-so, some are outright bad.

 

How sad to have so many books on infidelity. I have books on a much wider range of subjects.

[anne1707]

That is my personality. I read up on everything I encounter in life. Factual books interest me.

 

As do I, and more. But if your bookshelves are full of books on infidelity then that means all you encounter is infidelity. That is sad.

[Decorative]

One can easily choose whatever book says what they need to hear to feel okay about something. Doesn't mean it's right.

 

Yes. And Emily's writing provides a basis/excuse for an OW/OM to hang on and wait while the married partner does not act.

 

It's unusual, in my opinion.

[anne1707]

Well, that I did not say, that was something you inferred from nowhere. Unless my English was bad again?

 

Your English is absolutely fine and you know it.

 

Funnily enough, I remember another poster from your part of the world who would make such comments. Though she has since been banned from LS.

[anne1707]

I'm sure she wasn't crazy.

[anne1707]

In that case my English and perhaps also my knowledge of the culture was not good enough.

 

Well your culture does seem to be very unusual from what you have told us

[Realist3]

Just say that to betrayed spouses who ends up with a life long STD, and tell them it's not abuse or even criminal.

 

That is unfortunate, but it does not constitute abuse.

[Decorative]

That is unfortunate, but it does not constitute abuse.

 

Assault, then?

 

Which is better? You pick the word.

[MissBee]

It's not 'just' an affair

 

And I'll post this again (since you either missed it or ignored) Just to be helpful...

 

Thanks for this! Just quoted some points that really stuck out and explain how cheating can be a form of emotional abuse.

 

Sustaining an affair involves the emotional manipulation and psychological control of another person. A person who trusts and relies on you. At the beginning, it’s constructing and controlling an alternate reality, where you aren’t where you say you are and you’re not with who you say you’re with. Then it progresses to smoke-screening: “we’re just friends”, “there’s nothing going on” or “I wouldn’t do that to you”. And then, at the risk of discovery, desperation creeps in and it becomes mind games: “no, you must be imagining things”, “don’t be silly”, “you don’t know what you’re talking about” or “you must be crazy”. At this point you might also pick fights or find fault with your partner to create conflict or emotional distance so you can justify to yourself the feelings you are developing for someone else.

 

Cultivating an alternate reality so an affair can continue undiscovered destroys, amongst many other things, the cheated party’s perceptiveness, intuition, confidence and, more than their trust in you, their trust in their own senses. Trust is the foundation of relationships. It is also the foundation for mental health and emotional wellbeing. In sustained affairs, sex is not the hardest thing to get over; it’s the deeper and more long-term affect of having to put the pieces of your intellect and your shattered self-esteem back together and learn to trust yourself again.

 

Both mind games and emotional manipulation are forms of domestic abuse. Sustained affairs are covert, insidious abuse that has dire consequences for families and yet it’s also the sort of abuse that can be minimized, condoned or even glorified in the media. It’s the sort of abuse that is commonly ‘blamed on the victim’: it happens because of a woman’s “declining interest in sex”. Psychological and emotional abuse are forms of domestic violence and include humiliation, contempt and controlling behaviours. Affairs involve all of these. Acts of omission are also included in one definition. In Hurting Without Hitting: Non-physical Contact Forms of Abuse, Laurie Mackinnon lists: withholding necessary information, refusing to communicate for extended periods, ignoring the other person’s attempts to interact, failure to confirm the other person’s feelings or needs and failure to show appropriate affection or love.

 

 

If the “third party” is knowingly involved in the affair, then they are collaborating in the mental, emotional and sexual abuse of another. If they do not know that the person they are involved with is leading a double life, if they have been informed the person is “separated” before the partner they are supposedly “separated from”, then they are being abused also.

[sweet_pea]

Merriam-Webster's definition of abuse.

Take note of #3....

 

Just so we're clear, abuse is not just physical. It can also be verbal and psychological and I am pretty dang sure that at least a few BS' have undergone some form of verbal/psychological abuse resulting from/during an affair.