My therapist doesn't think there's anything else to talk about?!?

[Pierre]

Well I chose her specifically based on her experience with infidelity.

 

I am not looking for someone to comfort me. In fact, I started a thread at the beginning of my IC because I was concerned she wasn't pressing me enough about my A.

 

Maybe there's nothing left to discuss. Maybe it's just not the right fit.

 

Some therapists are afraid to press the issue because they can lose the client. So most tend to provide comfort even when comfort is not the right thing to do.

[BrokenPrincess]

Thank you for all the above thoughtful replies. For 4 months since DDay, I never felt there was any decision to be made. It's been 2 weeks since xMM broke NC, then told me how he felt. I know he is willing to restart the A, but I don't know much beyond that. We're going to talk next week when we both have more time. I need think about what I really want for my life. What if I never feel like that with my H?

[LFH]

What if I never feel like that with my H?

 

Then you're wasting your life and his as well.

 

Life is unbearably short. Why would you settle when you know you don't feel everything you should?

[Pierre]

Thank you for all the above thoughtful replies. For 4 months since DDay, I never felt there was any decision to be made. It's been 2 weeks since xMM broke NC, then told me how he felt. I know he is willing to restart the A, but I don't know much beyond that. We're going to talk next week when we both have more time. I need think about what I really want for my life. What if I never feel like that with my H?

 

It is obvious your therapist knows nothing about infidelity.

 

As long as you have any contact (of any kind) with MM you will remain in love with MM. As long as you are in love with MM you cannot feel anything for your H.

 

 

If you were 200% over the MM you could love you H again, but this is not your situation. Your MM needs to feel like an old relationship that died a long time ago before you could fall for your H again.

 

As long as you have contact with MM you will not get over MM and you will feel nothing for your H. Your therapists is a bit of an idiot for suggesting you needed a meeting with MM. At this rate you will never get over MM and you will never fall in love again with your H.

Furthermore, the MM knows how to meet your "Emotional Needs" and your H does not know your ENs. Your H cannot compete with your MM.

[RainDown]

Thank you for all the above thoughtful replies. For 4 months since DDay, I never felt there was any decision to be made. It's been 2 weeks since xMM broke NC, then told me how he felt. I know he is willing to restart the A, but I don't know much beyond that. We're going to talk next week when we both have more time. I need think about what I really want for my life. What if I never feel like that with my H?

 

You probably won't. When relationships are new and we are "falling in love" it creates an excitement and a high and an infatuation that can preoccupy one 24/7 with thoughts of the other. That initial high does not last forever. The relationship morphs into something more stable, calm, secure and quiet. We love our partner, but do not obsess about them 24/7 like we did in the beginning. We still have our "highs", but the whole relationship mellows into a quieter state.

 

Your relationship with your husband has morphed past the endorphin laden infatuation that is the first stage of love. I suspect your relationship with MM never made it out of the infatuated/obsessed stage and comparing the feelings you have in your affair to your feelings for your husband are like comparing apples and oranges. If you were to be married to your MM for a few years, guess what? He turns into your husband, because that high will mellow just like your current marriage did.

 

It's one of those circle of life things, I guess.

[Pierre]

You probably won't. When relationships are new and we are "falling in love" it creates an excitement and a high and an infatuation that can preoccupy one 24/7 with thoughts of the other. That initial high does not last forever. The relationship morphs into something more stable, calm, secure and quiet. We love our partner, but do not obsess about them 24/7 like we did in the beginning. We still have our "highs", but the whole relationship mellows into a quieter state.

 

Your relationship with your husband has morphed past the endorphin laden infatuation that is the first stage of love. I suspect your relationship with MM never made it out of the infatuated/obsessed stage and comparing the feelings you have in your affair to your feelings for your husband are like comparing apples and oranges. If you were to be married to your MM for a few years, guess what? He turns into your husband, because that high will mellow just like your current marriage did.

 

It's one of those circle of life things, I guess.

 

 

Great post!

 

many OWs don't understand these issues and compare "butterflies" with "long term calm stable" relationships.

[BrokenPrincess]

I don't recall ever feeling like this with my H. Our love almost feels like its always been stable. I understand what you're saying, and I have been trying hard to remember if it felt like this with my H at the beginning, because I feel like that would make it easier to confirm that eventually xMM would settle into exactly where I am now.

 

Although if he has no intention of leaving his W, then really I just need to decide if I am willing to go down the A path again, especially knowing how I feel about xMM.

 

And, guilt has been hitting harder at home. When the A first started, it gradually developed over time. Everything felt separate. Now that I've had time away and am contemplating what resuming would mean, it doesn't feel separate at all.

 

In fact (and sorry if this triggers some) for the first time, I really felt bad for his W too. I dreamt about her all night, and during a nap the following day. I think this is stemming from this potentially being a very deliberate situation. There's no "I didn't mean for this to happen."

[Pierre]

I don't recall ever feeling like this with my H. Our love almost feels like its always been stable. I understand what you're saying, and I have been trying hard to remember if it felt like this with my H at the beginning, because I feel like that would make it easier to confirm that eventually xMM would settle into exactly where I am now.

 

Although if he has no intention of leaving his W, then really I just need to decide if I am willing to go down the A path again, especially knowing how I feel about xMM.

 

And, guilt has been hitting harder at home. When the A first started, it gradually developed over time. Everything felt separate. Now that I've had time away and am contemplating what resuming would mean, it doesn't feel separate at all.

 

In fact (and sorry if this triggers some) for the first time, I really felt bad for his W too. I dreamt about her all night, and during a nap the following day. I think this is stemming from this potentially being a very deliberate situation. There's no "I didn't mean for this to happen."

 

Why don't you tell your H how you feel?

[twosadthings]

It's because for over six months you've been in love with the soap opera drama. If you really crave some drama in your life tell your husband. Your therapist has heard enough and I can see so have most of the posters even on this forum.

 

Twosadthings

[Pierre]

And, guilt has been hitting harder at home. When the A first started, it gradually developed over time. Everything felt separate. Now that I've had time away and am contemplating what resuming would mean, it doesn't feel separate at all.

 

In fact (and sorry if this triggers some) for the first time, I really felt bad for his W too. I dreamt about her all night, and during a nap the following day. I think this is stemming from this potentially being a very deliberate situation. There's no "I didn't mean for this to happen."

 

This is good news. It probably means you are developing some empathy.

 

Tell your H and your troubles will end.

[BrokenPrincess]

It's because for over six months you've been in love with the soap opera drama. If you really crave some drama in your life tell your husband. Your therapist has heard enough and I can see so have most of the posters even on this forum.

 

Twosadthings

 

 

I see you decided not not to ban yourself from posting here after all. You must be in love with the OM/OW Board soap opera drama.

[twosadthings]

maybe it's because I've been in love with the same woman for the past forty years and have empathy for people who get what they don't deserve or no sympathy for people who complain about no spark in a marriage that can't have any when it keeps getting peed on.

 

Just sayin'

 

Twosadthings

[BrokenPrincess]

maybe it's because I've been in love with the same woman for the past forty years and have empathy for people who get what they don't deserve or no sympathy for people who complain about no spark in a marriage that can't have any when it keeps getting peed on.

 

Just sayin'

 

Twosadthings

 

Ok so then why are you visiting and posting on an OM/OW board? Just to declare that you have no sympathy for me and to state that all other LS posters are tired of reading my posts? Doesn't seem like relevant to support OR discussion about my experience with my therapist.

 

Or maybe you meant to post this one on the thread about why no one acknowledges the OWs pain?

[RainDown]

I'm going to ask a question, and I really want you to understand I am NOT saying this in any kind of derogatory manner or to be insulting. This is something that I and many other BSs really would love to understand:

 

You yourself state you are fully aware of the pain this would cause his wife (and your H I'm sure, but let's leave it at his wife). He is clearly willing to put her through that for his own pleasure.

 

What is attractive about this kind of man? What is attrative about someone so willing to flaunt that kind of unimaginable selfishness?

 

Again, no disrespect, but how do you overlook a character flaw that is this large?

 

I see this kind of thing all over the place. I see couples and wonder, "how on earth can she be attracted to that?" or "how can he possibly be attracted to that?" I don't understand how half the people I know can be with the person they are with because I see glaring faults and unattractive traits that I wouldn't go anywhere near, much less sleep with or marry.

 

The heart does what it does, I suppose, unattractive faults and all. My ex-husband has wildly unattractive qualities, yet women fall all over him. They obviously see something I don't, or don't see something I do see.

 

In any case, I don't personally see infidelity as a "character flaw". Others may not either.

[Pierre]

I see this kind of thing all over the place. I see couples and wonder, "how on earth can she be attracted to that?" or "how can he possibly be attracted to that?" I don't understand how half the people I know can be with the person they are with because I see glaring faults and unattractive traits that I wouldn't go anywhere near, much less sleep with or marry.

 

The heart does what it does, I suppose, unattractive faults and all. My ex-husband has wildly unattractive qualities, yet women fall all over him. They obviously see something I don't, or don't see something I do see.

 

In any case, I don't personally see infidelity as a "character flaw". Others may not either.

 

It is easy. Some people fall in love with the person that meets their emotional needs.

[BrokenPrincess]

I'd say this is beyond just infidelity. This man is already aware of the pain DDay caused his wife. He knows what a second DDay would do to his wife, and he doesn't care.

 

He is disgustingly selfish. THAT I suppose is the character flaw I'm asking about. One might say that all cheaters are selfish, and I'd agree to a point, but to destroy someone again, after promising them that 'it was just a mistake' and that they really love the BS, well it's past selfish and is now cruel.

 

I think this might warrant a new thread. I honestly never thought we'd talk again, and when I'd read here of xAPs having 2nd, 3rd, 4th DDays, I didn't understand it either, but from the BS side. In my situation, I don't fully know what happened at his house after DDay, but generally it sounds like it only lasted a few weeks, they never talk about it, and they've only (jointly) told 1 person. It didnt sound like what I've read or was imagining, but who knows.

 

His for contacting me again could be selfishness, naïveté, arrogance, denial, or maybe even cowardice to end his M. I don't know, but I do know that I still care for him. It's just like you could ask the BS, how could still love someone so selfish to cheat on you?

[Cali408]

You are addicted to him and he to you. You are co-dependents.

 

This guy is extremely selfish. He wants his cake and to eat it too. You escape for 4 months and he calls you again, taking you back into the abyss of the affair. Now you're mentally tortured on whether you want to be with him or your husband.

 

Lose him, don't even speak with him. He's an emotional basket case who has no respect for his family.

[RainDown]

I think this might warrant a new thread. I honestly never thought we'd talk again, and when I'd read here of xAPs having 2nd, 3rd, 4th DDays, I didn't understand it either, but from the BS side. In my situation, I don't fully know what happened at his house after DDay, but generally it sounds like it only lasted a few weeks, they never talk about it, and they've only (jointly) told 1 person. It didnt sound like what I've read or was imagining, but who knows.

 

His for contacting me again could be selfishness, naïveté, arrogance, denial, or maybe even cowardice to end his M. I don't know, but I do know that I still care for him. It's just like you could ask the BS, how could still love someone so selfish to cheat on you?

 

Oy vey. This situation sounds like a train wreck waiting to happen, BP. This man's wife already knows about you and you are considering resuming the affair? That is not a great idea and will just make an ugly situation even uglier for you. From a practical standpoint, I really think you should reconsider this idea before your life turns into a complete disaster. I think you'd be wise to just let it go.

[AnotherRound]

You are addicted to him and he to you. You are co-dependents.

 

This guy is extremely selfish. He wants his cake and to eat it too. You escape for 4 months and he calls you again, taking you back into the abyss of the affair. Now you're mentally tortured on whether you want to be with him or your husband.

 

Lose him, don't even speak with him. He's an emotional basket case who has no respect for his family.

 

I don't think that attraction and/or wanting to be with someone = codependence, especially in a case where the OP is not being mistreated by the AP. Maybe he and his wife have a codependent relationship and that's why they can't divorce, but I'm not sure how you got codependence from his affair with the OP? Curious...

[twosadthings]

BrokenP,

 

I know that I don't fit the profile of those who post here but I can assure you it's not for the drama. As a faithful husband and father of two grown children I assessed my next familial non-material responsibility to the happiness of my children as that of being ready and available to provide suggestions and conciling to deal with or avoid an episode of faithlessness in either of their marriages. Last year, the tenets, learned on this site, of full disclosure, transparancy, honest and palpable remorse, and effective communication helped me do just that in an incident of not quite infidelity for one of my children.

 

I know that my words have not been well received by you but can you honestly tell me they are wrong? You are no further along in the resolution of your situation than you were six months ago. You describe you husband with kind words and often denegrate your lover. You express your fear of discovery and cry in secret. You have recently shown concern for the other betrayed spouse. You say that you don't have passion in your marriage but you continue to dissipate that passion by directing it to the other man. You keep starting new threads that cover the same ground and get the same responses. Even your therapist has said that she can't help you, you'll have to help yourself.

 

I have seen threads posted here by unfaithful spouses that say that their affairs have provided the 10% or so they need that is missing from their marriages. I'm not a betting man but it doesn't seem smart to risk 100% of a good husband's love, 50% of your children's lives, not to mention 100% of your self-respect for 10% that may or may not be real. It would be easier and surer attained within your marriage without the catastrophic consequenses. Actually I don't think that anything that involves human beings can or should really be measured beyond good or bad, right or wrong, and smart or stupid.

 

My posts as an anonymous stranger have been met and maybe rightfully so with your derision. Perhaps fatherly-like concern from a stranger who would not want to hear of family's train wreck will be better received.

 

Good luck,

 

Twosadthings

[AnotherRound]

Oy vey. This situation sounds like a train wreck waiting to happen, BP. This man's wife already knows about you and you are considering resuming the affair? That is not a great idea and will just make an ugly situation even uglier for you. From a practical standpoint, I really think you should reconsider this idea before your life turns into a complete disaster. I think you'd be wise to just let it go.

 

Agreed, sounds complicated. I'm wondering if he and his wife have decided that the only way to make their marriage work (for the sake of their children maybe?) is to change the way it operates - as in, letting it be more of an open marriage situation? Maybe that's what he wants to talk about with OP?

 

If it was me (and I am aware this may not be the right response for you), but I wouldn't resume unless it was going to be an open situation for ALL involved. Otherwise, I would remove myself from the equation for my own mental health and well being (as I would be very stressed out in your situation!).

[AnotherRound]

Absolutely. I think the difference is that a BS is agreeing in the light of day and there is (now) no hidden agendas or other people. This is, as many commented, taking a really bad situation and making it worse.

 

If I might add, I assume you're getting this information from him (what happened in his home). If so, be careful. It would be harder if he had said "She was devastated. She is in counseling and it's a daily topic. But hey, screw her, let's start seeing each other again". That would be extremely cold. He may be making it seem like she didn't care much, just as many MM make it seem like the marriage is all but dead when in reality that isn't the case.

 

Again, please just be careful. That 'spark' was taken from both of you. It's obvious why having it back could be exciting, but is it really in your best interest?

 

I agree that I would tread carefully. But, it may be the truth that his wife "doesn't care" or isn't wanting to actually participate in a marriage on any deep level but wants to keep the marriage for other reasons. There are usually sources for this type of information if one finds it necessary and those sources don't necessarily include the wife, as she may be blind to the signals she is sending to her H, despite her intentions. As in, he may honestly believe that is the case with his wife, that she doesn't care or mind, and if she is unwilling to tell him otherwise, he can't be expected to read her mind or to continue on the same unhappy path without all the information he needs to make an informed decision.

 

I have no idea if that is what is happening here, I am very interested to see how your talk with him goes OP and to see what is revealed. I wish it weren't so stressful for you - but all in due time it will sort, things always do.

[AnotherRound]

BrokenP,

 

I know that I don't fit the profile of those who post here but I can assure you it's not for the drama. As a faithful husband and father of two grown children I assessed my next familial non-material responsibility to the happiness of my children as that of being ready and available to provide suggestions and conciling to deal with or avoid an episode of faithlessness in either of their marriages. Last year, the tenets, learned on this site, of full disclosure, transparancy, honest and palpable remorse, and effective communication helped me do just that in an incident of not quite infidelity for one of my children.

 

I know that my words have not been well received by you but can you honestly tell me they are wrong? You are no further along in the resolution of your situation than you were six months ago. You describe you husband with kind words and often denegrate your lover. You express your fear of discovery and cry in secret. You have recently shown concern for the other betrayed spouse. You say that you don't have passion in your marriage but you continue to dissipate that passion by directing it to the other man. You keep starting new threads that cover the same ground and get the same responses. Even your therapist has said that she can't help you, you'll have to help yourself.

 

I have seen threads posted here by unfaithful spouses that say that their affairs have provided the 10% or so they need that is missing from their marriages. I'm not a betting man but it doesn't seem smart to risk 100% of a good husband's love, 50% of your children's lives, not to mention 100% of your self-respect for 10% that may or may not be real. It would be easier and surer attained within your marriage without the catastrophic consequenses. Actually I don't think that anything that involves human beings can or should really be measured beyond good or bad, right or wrong, and smart or stupid.

 

My posts as an anonymous stranger have been met and maybe rightfully so with your derision. Perhaps fatherly-like concern from a stranger who would not want to hear of family's train wreck will be better received.

 

Good luck,

 

Twosadthings

 

 

Interesting, that 10% thing that another poster stated (I think that's what you meant?). My exMM and his exW both agreed that they had stayed in the marriage for a long time at 80% for the kids, and another 20% for the financial losses they would both experience - and that neither of them were staying out of love for the other. And that was early in my relationship with exMM - which lasted 7 years - and helped that marriage go another 7 years.

 

I would love to see some statistics on how many people have an affair to meet 10% of their needs - bc as you said, I'm not sure how many people would risk losing their children, their homes, etc. for that amount. It seems like the possible gain would have to be MUCH higher, and the unhappiness in the marriage much higher than 10% to instigate that kind of risk.

[AnotherRound]

Edited to add - Let me clarify - the exMM and his exW both had loyalty to the other as they share children, but in that way only, according to them. They didn't hate each other, they just couldn't get along and balance their relationship as it had never really been balanced in the first place. Then, they added all the other stuff - the kids, the house, the families, etc. and it just got to the point where neither of them wanted to tackle trying to untangle it all and it was just easier to stay. They are both MUCH happier now and from what I hear, regret that they waited so long to do what ended up being the right thing for them and their children. I didn't mean to imply that they didn't love each other on some level, as I'm sure they did, and at least had in the beginning - even if it didn't last for the long haul, it was enough to bring children into the world and then sharing children creates a love also in that they are the other parent of your children. Just wanted to clear that up...

[skylarblue]

Sorry, I don't know your story outside of this thread, so please keep in mind that I post as such.

 

First, if you are not comfortable with your therapist, please find another one. However, please be sure that you aren't just looking for someone to tell you what you want to hear.

 

Second, what are you looking to accomplish in therapy? A therapist is very different from a friend. They're not there as a shoulder to cry on or simply a sympathetic ear or cheerleader (no accusation intended).What goals have you and your therapist discussed for yourself? Are you looking to solve a specific problem (MM) or are you looking for further self-exploration and a better development of self-concept and behaviors, and coping skills?

 

What was wrong with your therapist's recommendation regarding the issue with MM? A therapist's job is to HELP you improve your life by HELPING you to overcome personal barriers and obstacles by HELPING you to identify strengths and weaknesses, goals, and solutions to individual problems. It seems she advised you in a reasonable and adult way regarding your problem with MM, and in offering immediate assistance if you find yourself in distress (one thing a therapist must do is assess the client's need for therapy). Perhaps, her delivery style is not one that's suitable for you (again, it is very important for the client to feel comfortable).

 

Where and how does your H fit into all of this? My impression is that you have far more problems to deal with than just the MM issue in regards to your happiness. I just don't see you becoming satisfied with life without your H's involvement even if you end things for good with MM.

 

I reiterate my lack of knowledge towards your situation and apologize if I am off base.