analystfromhell Posted March 15, 2013 Share Posted March 15, 2013 (edited) My wife and I have been in therapy, since Aug 2011 first with one and since Feb of last year, with a second marriage councillor. I've been in IC for this time as well- primarily with the same therapist dealing with personal and relationship related issues. She was going to IC- not to the same one for long but has been treated for depression (but is not taking the medicine) and has decided to stop IC as there was a hiccup in our insurance which has, at least for me, since been resolved. As to the reason for the marriage counselling- well there's my posts on here explaining the catalyst for that.... In all this time however, things haven't changed. Well at least in our relationship which is precisely, IMHO, the same as before. At least as of the middle of last year she was still have thoughts about the object of the EA. She put up a ton (~150 lbs or so) of weight, still no sexual or interest in conversation, have never actually discussed the EA in therapy or otherwise, etc. I don't have any hard evidence she's continued or started a new EA but there's still nothing going on in our relationship- we are room mates at best. This is my second marriage and my experience this time is so different than before that I'm lost and not sure how to address my feelings on this. There's an element of, "whatever" and stickit out willingness to my attitude this time which, despite the previous complications of children and much else during the previous divorce, are new to me. Before I just wanted to ensure my relationship with my kids but had zero ability to continue in that relationship. Now, with no kids, a spouse who's far more reasonable than before so the separation or divorce this time would be far less painful and difficult than before, I find myself far more isolated and accepting of the status quo. I'm now at a point where I'm asking if my best course of action is to pre-emptively stop joint MC (I would continue IC as it's done me a world of good) and perhaps address the relationship in a more definitive way... I'm not sure there are a lot of readily apparent upsides to ending the relationship, nor other clear paths and green fields to go to. My own actions didn't "cause" the EA but I feel like there are many aspects of my upbringing and personality which make any relationship challenging for me to maintain. This should probably end with a question- instead I guess I'll just ask for your gut reaction. In an ideal world, there would be tons of people who I could sit around with over a beer and discuss but IRL, that's not the way it seems to be... Edited March 15, 2013 by analystfromhell Link to post Share on other sites
TigerCub Posted March 15, 2013 Share Posted March 15, 2013 If I understand correctly: - 2nd marriage, no kids together - She had an EA - Emotional distance - No affection, no sex, no connection Yeah...If I got that right: - Quit MC - Get a divorce - Continue IC (since at your own admission you feel that you have certain factors that make hard for you to maintain a relationship - maybe you should concentrate and work on you) I honestly don't see why you're sticking around at all. Link to post Share on other sites
ver13 Posted March 15, 2013 Share Posted March 15, 2013 My wife and I have been in therapy, since Aug 2011 first with one and since Feb of last year, with a second marriage councillor. I've been in IC for this time as well- primarily with the same therapist dealing with personal and relationship related issues. She was going to IC- not to the same one for long but has been treated for depression (but is not taking the medicine) and has decided to stop IC as there was a hiccup in our insurance which has, at least for me, since been resolved. As to the reason for the marriage counselling- well there's my posts on here explaining the catalyst for that.... In all this time however, things haven't changed. Well at least in our relationship which is precisely, IMHO, the same as before. At least as of the middle of last year she was still have thoughts about the object of the EA. She put up a ton (~150 lbs or so) of weight, still no sexual or interest in conversation, have never actually discussed the EA in therapy or otherwise, etc. I don't have any hard evidence she's continued or started a new EA but there's still nothing going on in our relationship- we are room mates at best. This is my second marriage and my experience this time is so different than before that I'm lost and not sure how to address my feelings on this. There's an element of, "whatever" and stickit out willingness to my attitude this time which, despite the previous complications of children and much else during the previous divorce, are new to me. Before I just wanted to ensure my relationship with my kids but had zero ability to continue in that relationship. Now, with no kids, a spouse who's far more reasonable than before so the separation or divorce this time would be far less painful and difficult than before, I find myself far more isolated and accepting of the status quo. I'm now at a point where I'm asking if my best course of action is to pre-emptively stop joint MC (I would continue IC as it's done me a world of good) and perhaps address the relationship in a more definitive way... I'm not sure there are a lot of readily apparent upsides to ending the relationship, nor other clear paths and green fields to go to. My own actions didn't "cause" the EA but I feel like there are many aspects of my upbringing and personality which make any relationship challenging for me to maintain. This should probably end with a question- instead I guess I'll just ask for your gut reaction. In an ideal world, there would be tons of people who I could sit around with over a beer and discuss but IRL, that's not the way it seems to be... Counseling of some sort since 2011? If things haven't changed since then it is because you don't want to get the ball rolling. Your M is just that your's and only you can decided when enough is enough. All of the stuff from your previous M is just that previous, this is the one that you live in now. So choose which way you want to go and do it or sit around for another 2yrs in counseling asking yourself what am I going to do. Your W had her reasons for the EA which really have nothing to do with you in the least. So why even give that incident any power in her decision to not interact in the relationship 2yrs later. If she really wanted to be more intimate you would be more then roommates by now. So choose what is best for you and move forward or say idle it's you choice. Link to post Share on other sites
dichotomy Posted March 16, 2013 Share Posted March 16, 2013 I actually "get" much of what your saying here - experienced some of it myself. The no kids things makes this so much easier for you this time. Can you do a simple plus and minus list to..... staying or leaving. Link to post Share on other sites
Nyla Posted March 16, 2013 Share Posted March 16, 2013 Two years of counseling should have brought forth positive changes by now. Why has the EA not been discussed in therapy? No sense in holding back from the therapist. I think it may be time to think about leaving. Link to post Share on other sites
Author analystfromhell Posted March 18, 2013 Author Share Posted March 18, 2013 (edited) I really appreciate the responses so far- here's an update based on your thoughts and suggestions. Feedback much appreciated for reasons the pros and cons will help make more clear. You read right- the EA hasn't ever been discussed so I'm not sure of her rationale for doing it, she still hasn't "owned" it (IMHO) and it ended (IMHO) primarily as a result of sending the correspondence to the other guy's wife. So I presumed that ended it but of course who knows... I've brought it up many times and the fact that it has yet to be discussed is a significant part of why I'm where I am in my pondering. Other than a few frank discussions, the therapy has not changed her behavior or personality. I think my personality and behavior have changed as a result of IC, but that's just me and my perception of me; there haven't been a lot of others who commented on it other than to observe my general state of being "serious"- which I am.... So the pros and cons to ending it are: Cons: - personal self- esteem: this is my second marriage and I'm pushing 50 so I feel as though this sort of means I'm unable to maintain a stable relationship over the long term. First marriage was 17, this one 10 so far which is not short but as a result of my growing up situation and my career I've not developed or been able to maintain long-term relationships outside of marriage. This self-esteem issue is both part of the problem (marriage wise) and an inhibitor so far as ending it goes. - uncertainty: I've never lived alone- not even for a minute- always had roommates, etc. I've also always had a girlfriend or wife, etc. Having a partner, even in the current situation, helps, I imagine, to encourage you to keep your ducks in a row and I'd worry what my mind would do if it were left unchallenged by other people over an extended period. There would be work and school, of course, but personal interaction is very limited honestly due to us all being busy, living in different areas, and there being a high level of competition. - divorce sucks: Between finances, courts, lawyers, etc. it just was terrible. I don't think a divorce from this marriage would be anywhere near the high stakes stress-inducer it was before but who knows- I'm sure I don't need to elaborate on how the process can take on a life of it's own. - depression: IC is dealing with this, but seemingly everyone in my family bar my own kids) suffers from it, and I am to date the only member of my extended family who has had a somewhat normal and successful life. I came from relatively ****ty circumstances (family, culture, and environment) and the life situation of most of my childhood friends and the rest of my family nags at me. I'm not sure how much of my ability to buck the odds was "me" and how much was my environment so I worry there are support mechanisms the current marriage provides which I won't recognize or appreciate appreciate until it's over. - Is it really "bad" or just "not great": she's rather more tolerant of me than I suspect other women might be. My first marriage ended up a disaster and this one has been much less full of drama, spite and anger. That's a huge plus in my book but not, I recognize, indicative of a "good" relationship but rather just an improvement in relative terms. Still, tolerance of other people and their differences tends to decrease with time and I suspect this would be "it" as far as relationships go. Unless something dropped into my lap I can't see myself pushed to move on to anything new for quite a while. Pro: - Timing: if there is "something better" out there, in the current situation we won't discover it. It's not that the current situation is terrible, abusive or anything but rather it's not stimulating for either of us nor is it improving. We get on each others nerves to some extent and don't seem to be improving one another's situation. I worry we'll gradually come to resent one another making an eventual separation more difficult than it would be today. As an aside, this would be the very first time I wouldn't have either and not be in a position to for quite a while. I work a lot, am in grad school and have a ton of things I need to clean up. I would want to streamline my life before starting any new relationships. - I'm unhappy. It's affecting my work productivity, my mood, my physical shape. It seems as though there's no relief or support mechanism. My strongest and best relationship is with my (college age) kids who are soon graduating and of course moving on to be adults. My attempts to make myself happier have involved tackling some questionable mid term goals (finishing my Phd) which have, in the short term, just made my life more stressful. Current non-players - finances: I make enough to support myself and partially subsidize her through home expenses, etc. Otherwise we have 100% separate financially. So not a con per se but 2 incomes go further than 1. I also ride with her to work and hate driving so I'd end up driving myself (so trivial but still)... I do worry about post-work- if that ever happens either voluntarily or non-voluntarily. I'm probably better than average setup but I worry a lot about this aspect of things (always the planner) and I feel the situation could change at any moment given the ups and downs of the economy. professional: we work for the same company so there would be a number of non-family members involved. Happens all the time I'm sure but we're both relatively well known so it would, at least for a while, be slightly awkward. We'd have to work very hard to remain friends during and after the process. Edited March 18, 2013 by analystfromhell Link to post Share on other sites
TiredFamilyGuy Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Doesn't sound like much of a marriage, not even by "local optimum" standards. Sounds like there are no drivers for improvement for either of you, just a few conveniences to keep it together. Look ahead ten years. What do you see? I think that means - divorce and have done. Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts