Do you view marriage as a worthwhile goal?

[Owl]

To me, M is not a worthwhile goal, but as a by-product of an awesome R, it's not too shabby.

 

Coco, I don't think that you and I agree on much, but I do think we agree here.

 

I find it interesting that most of the responses I've seen that indicated that they saw marriage as a goal when they were younger have been from women (of course most of the responses on this thread have been from women...got to take that it into account).

 

I wonder how much of that development as a 'goal' was fostered by family and cultural expectations...growing up myself, it seemed that most women were expected to want to marry and have children...which makes me wonder if that was the reason that it was ORIGINALLY a goal for some women here who later changed their minds as they grew up and matured.

 

Anyway...hoping this isn't limited to APs, but personally I've never seen marriage as a goal. A great, long lasting, wonderful relationship is something I sought...and as Coco said...marriage as a by-product of that relationship is just icing on the cake. The relationship is the 'goal' if you will...marriage (to me) is just 'formalizing' that relationship if you will...making it public. The marital vows are just a formal recognition of what we both already feel/want/plan on.

 

I personally don't feel that anyone 'has to' want marriage. It's not for everyone...and that's totally fine.

[LFH]

LFH said:

LFH, nobody on this thread has said you should or would feel cheated by that.

 

Why are you arguing/advocating against a point that nobody made? Has someone been saying such things to you?

 

Yes, yes they have. Cheated, settled, screwed... all terms used recently. I don't feel anything of the sort though. I feel pretty much the exact opposite.

[MissBee]

 

I didn't tell her this but I don't value traditional M, for me, anymore. It's like a glass container made to look like steel. It should be strong and protective but in all actuality it's fragile and can cause harm if handled improperly. DMM wants to get M again and I'll do it from respect for him but I've told him it's not going to be traditional vows. We'll do what SG is doing and create our own version of what we want M to be. He's ok with that. We have a long way to go before that happens but we've spent the 3 or so weeks really struggling and we finally are letting ourselves look to the future.

 

I think this is how it should be for everyone personally!

 

I don't think marriage is some ready-made, pre-fab concept you just buy and put on, like a one-size fits all, although indeed I understand how culturally, through media etc. we get sold certain ideals in this regard. I mean our cultures sell all kinds of ideals about what a good life is in general, the kind of house, car, man/woman, relationship, education etc. you "need" to "be happy." Romance, love, marriage are definitely big sellers and money makers.

 

But yep...I think ALL marriages and vows therein should be what the couple make it and want it to be and isn't that which you simply pick off of some pre-made menu lol. I am not sure what "traditional marriage" is being defined as in your mind, are you talking about monogamy or something else? In any case, I intend for my marriage to be my own tradition.

[georgia girl]

This is not a legitimate response because I'm not an OW or a BS. I'm just an S.

 

Marriage, when I met my husband was not my goal. A relationship that was fulfilling, inspiring, comforting, empowering and just plain fun was. When we got serious, we had a moment when he wasn't ready for commitment. That broke my heart and I walked away. He came back and truly proved to me that he was the man I thought he was and that he could be the partner that I needed.

 

Marriage today is my goal. I love my marriage and my husband. I love that this thing is so intrinsically ours and so private, special and heartwarming that I am both blessed and obliged to work very hard at it.

 

We have those "unplugged" or "out-of-synch" times that every marriage has. But, it's amazing to me because for both of us the commitment never waivers. One of us may have to tap the other one on the shoulder every once in a while (and it's a pretty great while that it happens) and remind them to get back in the game. But 99% of the time, it's more than I could have asked for or imagined.

 

I can't believe I get to do this thing, with this man and for the rest of my life. Marriage for me settled all questions about love, sex and romance. When I see people post here in so much pain from whatever side of the relationship that they're on, I think how sad that they haven't yet had the chance to build this thing that we have. But I am constantly hopeful that everyone will. I didn't get married until my late 30's for the very first time (to a fellow first-timer), so I think there is always time for all of us to find the loves of our lives.

[Got it]

I think this is how it should be for everyone personally!

 

I don't think marriage is some ready-made, pre-fab concept you just buy and put on, like a one-size fits all, although indeed I understand how culturally, through media etc. we get sold certain ideals in this regard. I mean our cultures sell all kinds of ideals about what a good life is in general, the kind of house, car, man/woman, relationship, education etc. you "need" to "be happy." Romance, love, marriage are definitely big sellers and money makers.

 

But yep...I think ALL marriages and vows therein should be what the couple make it and want it to be and isn't that which you simply pick off of some pre-made menu lol. I am not sure what "traditional marriage" is being defined as in your mind, are you talking about monogamy or something else? In any case, I intend for my marriage to be my own tradition.

 

I completely agree but I think we get sold into this idea that it is supposed to be like x and not realize that once you walk down the aisle you aren't in the end zone and can coast and in fact the work is just beginning. I don't think Disney, RomComs and chick lit has helped at all with this as everything is about the pursuit up to the point of marriage and then they ride off into the sunset. How many times has some posted on LS about a knight in shining armor (and in wanting one not complaining about their cheating spouse ), their fairy tale, etc. When I was in my 20s I believed the same thing and it is such bunk sadly. Life in a relationship/partnership is more wonderful and more boring put up on the big screen.

 

I wish that we spent more time showing what a relationship requires, the constant work and energy. I think so many people really just don't know and it is the blind leading the blind.

[MissBee]

I completely agree but I think we get sold into this idea that it is supposed to be like x and not realize that once you walk down the aisle you aren't in the end zone and can coast and in fact the work is just beginning. I don't think Disney, RomComs and chick lit has helped at all with this as everything is about the pursuit up to the point of marriage and then they ride off into the sunset. How many times has some posted on LS about a knight in shining armor (and in wanting one not complaining about their cheating spouse ), their fairy tale, etc. When I was in my 20s I believed the same thing and it is such bunk sadly. Life in a relationship/partnership is more wonderful and more boring put up on the big screen.

 

I wish that we spent more time showing what a relationship requires, the constant work and energy. I think so many people really just don't know and it is the blind leading the blind.

 

I've lamented at this as well and I think American culture especially is obsessed with romance and being in love and the theatrics of it and not real relationships....which are not always romantic and spicy 24/7. I think I had a hard time with this but am slowly unlearning this. I learned a lot from 2 friends I've had who had arranged marriages. First off, they cleared up my assumption that arranged marriages were always forced on underaged girls. They likened it more to families betrothing their children to each other and over the years when they are old enough allowing a friendship to develop etc. and they do not HAVE to marry if they do not want to. But the whole system as explained, unlike in America, where it is all about the individuals and feelings, gave more of a realistic picture of marriage as team work, partnership, friendship, blending families, trust and more than just "I love you, you love me, let's sail off into the sunset."

 

I think many people get married or partner up and when the high wears off of new romance they can't function and immediately start searching to replace that feeling. My ex is like this and he can never be happy because eventually every woman/every relationship is not shiny and just out of the wrapper and filled with quickies and trips . Yes those are included, but for him, he felt all the real work was "too much" and only lived for the good feelings.

[Got it]

I know for myself each major relationship in my life, we have dated for more than 5 years prior to anything else. I know when I was 18-20 I really wanted to marry my husband. We didn't marry till 25 and by that time it was a given but less because I would die without being with him, it was more sh#t or get off the pot. Not the best way to look at it.

 

But I think many women think they want kids, its the time, etc. and push to marry Mr. Right now not Mr. Right. What is the saying, women marry a man hoping he will change, men marry a woman hoping she never changes. (or something like that).

 

What I have learned, therapy early on to help strengthen the foundation and really pin point the red flags. And I will never deepen a relationship with someone who is against and/or not not interest in therapy. Big red flag!

[Sarabi]

And I will never deepen a relationship with someone who is against and/or not not interest in therapy. Big red flag!

 

Interesting. I have my reasons for asking you this but...how come?

Just thinking about something someone said once...

[MissBee]

Interesting. I have my reasons for asking you this but...how come?

Just thinking about something someone said once...

 

I'm not her...but for me someone's unwillingness to do that can be a sign that they are unwilling to change, unwilling to address issues, and aren't willing to consciously work on themselves. I don't think it is smart to attempt to be with someone who is adamant to not work on their issues or who believes they are just perfect, if for you, you are someone who believes in this. I am. A quality I need in a man is humility and an ability to ask for help when necessary and to always be striving to be his best self.

 

Someone willing to do therapy is showing that they actively care about working on themselves, improving their relationships etc. and seems like a positive sign that should problems arise they'd be willing to put in serious effort to address them.

[Sarabi]

I'm not her...but for me someone's unwillingness to do that can be a sign that they are unwilling to change, unwilling to address issues, and aren't willing to consciously work on themselves. I don't think it is smart to attempt to be with someone who is adamant to not work on their issues or who believes they are just perfect, if for you, you are someone who believes in this. I am. A quality I need in a man is humility and an ability to ask for help when necessary and to always be striving to be his best self.

 

Someone willing to do therapy is showing that they actively care about working on themselves, improving their relationships etc. and seems like a positive sign that should problems arise they'd be willing to put in serious effort to address them.

 

Thanks for your answer I had a feeling it might be to do with not being willing to change or work on themselves.

I guess I ask because one day a very long time ago we were talking about relationships and I asked exMM if he would go to marriage counselling. He said no and that he thought it was rubbish.

Hmph

[mercy]

Marriage is treated as if it's this big prize to be desired and obtained and safeguarded.

As an AP, do you view this to be true? Do you think marriage is a big deal?

Do you think that it's the PRIZE or treasure chest or do you think.. eh... it is what it is?

 

I was very happily married. We had a fantastic marriage and one that was everything someone could want from marriage and we both worked REALLY hard at it. So yes, I think a marriage like that is a treasure.

 

But marriage as many people see it and treat it is not something that I would ever want nor do I see it as the only successful outcome of a long term relationship.

 

I was wondering what your thoughts as an OW/OM/WS were on this. If you're in love with your AP, do you see yourself with them married eventually? Is that your goal?

 

Do you HAVE a goal?

 

Or is marriage just kind of like.. eh... like it is to me now.

 

But didn't you divorce your husband?

[Silly_Girl]

But didn't you divorce your husband?

 

No, she didn't. What makes you say that?

[Dreamworld]

I was in an arranged marriage, married at 22 and had my first child a year after. Marriage at the time seemed like roses and sunshine because my parents were and still have a wonderful trusting marriage. I was naive and thought it would be just like that for me too but it was the most miserable emotionally abusive( i guess neglect is more the word) one. I stayed for as long as I did because I thought it would be best for our child but also to maintain the outward happy well off couple appearance and I was scared to think of alternatives. I was also the BS who turned the other way on my husband's cheating but couldn't take it anymore when I found out he was cheating with my best friend. The shock of it led me to miscarry our second child. The double betrayal and the loss of my child was too much for me and I left the marriage with full custody of our daughter. Adultery is a crime here but I didn't press criminal charges.

But before all that, yes, marriage seemed like the way to go. I wanted the kids, the white picket fence etc.

 

When I became the OW marriage was NOT my goal in the slightest. I was actually glad MM was married because I actually liked the alone time I had when he was busy with his family. But could enjoy just the perks and fun of the affair minus the work that came with being a wife and feel desired and sexy and all that. I know I know really bad right? Most of you other OW here are much nicer than me! I did not want him to leave his wife for me at all and I was very good at minimizing her existence. She was a vague intangible non entity until d day came and I had to confront her very pregnant form face to face. Talk about Karma.

 

Is marriage a goal now? No. Am I still open to it? Yes. But with a different approach to it.

[LFH]

But didn't you divorce your husband?

 

No. No I did not. Why on earth would I have divorced my husband? Why would you assume that? I have been pretty clear about that.

[Got it]

Interesting. I have my reasons for asking you this but...how come?

Just thinking about something someone said once...

 

Because I need someone willing to do whatever is necessary to strength the health of the relationship. I am not saying therapy is the be all and end all but it is a great tool to have in one's toolbox and so someone not willing to add a new tool is someone not interested in investing energies into the relationship. There are things that (taking therapy at its most basic level) stated outloud to a neutral third party can give you a lightbulb moment. We are all made up of patterns on top of patterns of behaviors, thought processes, etc. and we can't always know where it started and why we do it. So I have found therapy to be helpful in these two areas especially.

 

In my marriage, we struggles in many areas and my ex refused to do therapy. He dealt with depression, communicating issues, etc. and would not go to therapy with me or alone. He finally did one session with me and then refused to do any more. That was a major deal for me because nothing ever improved and we couldn't address things properly. I even asked as my last birthday gift from him (in the last year) that I didn't want anything other than him going to therapy. Nothing happened. So finally when we separated THEN he was willing but it was too late. I was completely burnt out and had no energy to spare to try and revive our relationship. It showed me what I meant to him and what are relationship meant that it wasn't worth investing in the time and energy until the very end.

 

So since then I am hypersensitive on this area and have it as a major priority. I understand that others feel differently, I completely understand, and do know that going to therapy doesn't always mean that someone is going to effect change.

[mercy]

No. No I did not. Why on earth would I have divorced my husband? Why would you assume that? I have been pretty clear about that.

 

I'm sorry for what you have been through, I really am.

 

It's what I was pm'ed, concerning your divorce.

 

No mean intent intended, honestly it was just a question. I like you, really I do.

 

I crave the truth, from all situations, it's what my heart desires. No mean intent desired. Please believe that. A lot of what I have posted has been misinterpreted concerning some of the OW here, for that I'm sorry. I seek peace, nothing else. Period.

[cocorico]

I'm sorry for what you have been through, I really am.

 

It's what I was pm'ed, concerning your divorce.

 

.

 

Take it whence it came. Not everyone here knows everything, and some have malintent in what gossip they choose to spread out of sight of the mods.

[LFH]

I'm sorry for what you have been through, I really am.

 

It's what I was pm'ed, concerning your divorce.

 

No mean intent intended, honestly it was just a question. I like you, really I do.

 

I crave the truth, from all situations, it's what my heart desires. No mean intent desired. Please believe that. A lot of what I have posted has been misinterpreted concerning some of the OW here, for that I'm sorry. I seek peace, nothing else. Period.

 

It's ok. There are a lot of PMs going around about me. Obviously I'm unaware of the full content but from what I can tell about 95% of it is assumptions and misrepresentations.

I've always said if anyone wants the story all they have to do is ask. I may not answer straight out on the board for privacy purposes but I have no secrets.

All I'm not going to tell people are full names and locations.