Looking for Solution Options

[genuinelyloverly7]

I want to have a conversation with my partner about some problems I have with our current relationship. I could drop the whole backstory, but I figured I would try a more direct question first. I will say that he is so set against taking any negative criticism that he won't even talk to me about how we are doing on a day to day. I want to bring up things casually so it's not a big blow up, or he feels attacked, but we never get around to it. He will ignore me to avoid it. At this point these issues have built up so much that I have a laundry list of problems I want to talk about. The biggest being that we do not communicate on anything any deeper than what we are doing that day. No sex in months... so many more issues too!

 

I am asking for advice regarding how to make him understand that if we do not have some of these conversations (and if he doesn't step into the work of making our relationship strong) that I will consider leaving him again.* Should I be casual and say it will help me feel better, and for my sake can't he just listen to me, if nothing else? Or should I say how I am ready to start separating if he won't get it together? I don't want to threaten him, or always hold over his head that I might kick him out. He moved from 3 states away to get back together with me (or is it my free rent?), thus is alone out here.

 

It is my instinct to start by saying what is going right, or by saying what I could do to improve our relationship. But I can never get through that part to the real issues as I see it. So I need some non-confrontational (or confrontational) discussion opening and outlines so I can say what I need.

 

 

*if anyone wants to know more details I will post them- I wrote it all out in anticipation of posting it all, but it is so long and rant-y!

[TiredFamilyGuy]

To state the obvious, it seems you both have a communication problem, and are non-confrontational avoiders. But, issues arise and resentments build nonetheless - and as you have no way to resolve them, they are poisoning your relationship.

 

So say that, to him.

 

You must be direct and willing to take the consequences. Direct does not mean confrontational beyond the point necessary to get the issue unavoidably in view. It can be something like this:

 

"We need to talk. I want you, and I want our relationship to work out. It's not working out now. One reason it's not working out is that we don't work anything out by discussion. Part of that is my fault. I want to have a "Your needs of me, My needs of you" discussion. You go first, you might want to write down a list as I will have one. It doesn't have to be today but it must be soon - how about tomorrow night: I will cook dinner first".

 

BTW OP, more detail would help. Post that backstory you mentioned. It's hard to tell you how to talk about issues, when you are indirect about what those issues are. It's a fair indication that you don't express yourself directly though!

 

Let us know how you get on.

Edited March 20, 2013 by TiredFamilyGuy

[genuinelyloverly7]

Looking for Solution Options (longer version) <I wrote this yesterday evening>

 

 

I am at the end of my rope with my partner. It's like there are too many issues in our relationship to list, from miniscule to HUGE. And I feel like every time I talk about him and/or our relationship, I feel like a nag because he is SO not into it. For anonymity I will call him Mr. Big (and no I am am not a SITC fanatic).

 

I am going to start with his virtues (and he does have them…), because I don't want represent him as only an a**h*le.

 

 

Mr. Big is 5 years older then me (33/38), super creative, very ambitious (big life dreams), sexy as the summer solstice day is long, as freaky as I am and in many of the same ways too (this is not an easy combination to find in a hetero man, so I give big points to this). He wants kids and a house (or three- houses and kids), has a code of loyalty that is both focused and narrow (positive and negative outcomes), and acts like he loves his life. He SAYS he loves me (more so now than he ever has in our past relationship- explanation below), and says I am hot and sexy and beautiful and an amazing woman. He is interested in health like me (eats healthy, mostly… doesn't smoke ciggies, doesn't drink more than an occasional glass or three of wine, doesn't do any other stuff I don't do…)

 

We both do yoga, and use natural body products. We like the same musical variety. He is super intelligent, loner-ish (me too), confident (obnoxiously and also sexily so), and likes some of the same quirky old shows I do.

 

There is more, but you get the point- he is not an ogre, by any means. However, he does have some really bad traits and habits (which I feel I have exacerbated by my non- empowered, passive, approaches to the relationship) that he doesn't seem to be to worried about. He doesn't feel ANY need to talk about our relationship- get's passively or angrily defensive at just the mention of it. He is about as emotionally sensitive as a rock on the outside- I can see emotion down under the layers of concrete shell, but it is buried SO deep! I don't even know if he releases it when angry- it may just be an ingrained negative response to everything at this point.

 

 

*Back-story- We met too shortly after I left an extremely abusive relationship and moved to a big city at 24 y/o (I know now I should have gone to a lot of counseling before I tried to get with anyone), and as I was trying to reclaim my self-confidence with men, I figured it could be sexual instead of emotional. Then of course, I wanted the emotions, and he was too busy. He told me he was in school and starting a business. I agonized over his lack of commitment interest for 6 years when I should have just listened to and believed him and enjoyed what we had.

 

After a few years of this agonizing, I left him; a few months later he came back and said he was ready for more. We moved in together as he needed housing and so did I, but I wanted it so bad I didn't insist on his paying half of everything- I figured he could pay me back later because we would be together forever. He was still in school and had practically no finances that I knew of, and I had a lot, so I didn't worry about it.

 

I know now I was emasculating him, and resentment built. I tried to talk to him, he resisted. I tried to let him know there was no pressure, he pulled back more. Our sex life diminished until there was nothing left. Four years after we moved in together, I couldn't handle the non-existent relationship- we barely spoke, had meaningless random sex that catered completely to his desires, never went anywhere together (this has always been an issue- he is practically a shut-in 95% of the time regardless of his mood), and he kept his stuff in a corner of a closet the whole time, in bags packed up and locked away.

 

So I broke up with him, we lived and fought together for another two months while I planned on leaving the Big City to go back to where my family lives. I was so conflicted, loving him but feeling like there was nothing I could do or say to make the relationship better, or him more interested in making it better. I admit I am not good at communicating my issues and problems- even though I tried to be calm and thoughtful when approaching him about it all, it came out very bitter and nagging, I feel. Anyway, I left him on the street to go. (I asked him to come, he sad no, then he asked to come, I said no… he asked me to marry him, I said no. I didn't believe that he really wanted it).

 

A year and a half later, I get an email asking if he can come out to visit (a 3 state difference separated us). I said yes, and really believed that it would just be a friendly visit, albeit one full of issues coming to bear. I figured we could clear up some stuff we were both still holding on to.

 

But on the way back from the airport he mentions moving here to be with me, and remembers the break-up as me needing to leave the city, and needing to be back with my folks. So it's almost like we were never apart, in some of the way he acts. Then when he gets angry, it comes out like an accusation, like I screwed him on purpose by leaving. (His school stuff did get messed up from the move, and study-time, et cetera- he has been in school for 10+ years and started a business and all sorts of other stuff simultaneously).

 

But I figured this would be his third chance, and in a different setting we might be different together. Instead he is more remote (in a friendly way ) than ever; we haven't had sex in two months because the dog gets jealous and he won't put her in another room or train her to chill or leave us alone. He will not sleep in my bed because he had a scary medical experience in there when he first arrived- that he would not let me do anything about but feel guilty, for not noticing while I was asleep). He will not let me touch or see his penis AT ALL. (As I was typing this I said 'we should play around.' He said 'right now? I'm playing a game (video).'

 

We don't sit together on the couch (he sleeps on at night) or eat meals together, we rarely eat the same thing any more. We don't go out, because he is either busy on his homework (even when he is not in classes yet), playing the PS3 I got him for an X-mas present (just like the pup), sleeping or meditating, planning world domination or whatever… He sleeps on the couch, freaks (in a laughing to cover how serious he is kind of way) if I get near his stuff… I feel like I stepped back a year and a half (before I left), except he is a little more open and chill. He does NOT kiss or hug me more than once a month or so, and I almost always initiate it. (He has been here for 4.5 months now)

 

His attitude of selfish indifference has increased, and I am much less tolerant of this sh*t. But when he does something I am not going to put up with, I want to let him know I am not going to put up with it! It just feels like I am flipping it all up without warning after being so agreeable for so long (he has been here in the new place with me for 4.5 months now). And that feels unfair to him- the dropping the bomb that he must leave after he established himself in a new state and school to be with me. (I am a classic too-fair-for-my-own-good).

 

 

He talks about how everything is fine, and takes my hesitation or lack of irate response as such when he occasionally asks me how I am. The first month and a half he was here he talked to me about things if I brought them up, but I just didn't believe he would come all the way out here to tell me he was wanting to be with me so he could "be selfish for this coming year."

 

His control issues are so bad if something doesn't go his way he just completely let's go of whatever it is. There is no discussion or compromise or working together to create new options that we could both live with. Example- he wanted to help me with my business ( I am not business inclined and he is), and was so enthusiastic he made all of these suggestions… I had trouble keeping up as it was so much more aggressive than my previous business practices. When he saw I wasn't doing exactly what I said when he said it, he got hurt and upset. He then, after another argument over our conflicting view of business practices, declared that he would never offer me so much as a crumb of advice again unless I asked him specifically for help with whatever I needed help with. And he hasn't. I acknowledge the positive intent behind this, and my slacker response, but the outcome was this huge thing about how I didn't trust and/or respect him.

 

I almost feel like he is waiting for me to kick him out again so he can say "I told you so! You have all this power because I live in your (parent-owned) house. So you are abusing that power! (I said it once or twice in these huge fights we have been having since he got here- we never fought in the city- and he uses it as proof)

 

 

We (and by we I mean he, but we live together) got a puppy whom he loves- 13 (now 21) weeks and a VERY active breed- but he is training her very sloppily and haphazardly. He gets mad and raises his voice or tone when she does something wrong, but doesn't put the energy into training her correctly. He believes she will learn by listening to his words. But 2.5 months later, she still pees inside sometimes and he still doesn't walk her enough. She barks at him half the day and he ignores her completely then sometimes yells at her. He has occasionally gotten physical and fake pumped towards her to try to make her quit. He will not let me do a lot of things to train her (he has never trained a dog- I have) like walking her or letting her out when she scratches on the door, like feeding her treats or talking to her in certain ways. He got mad at her tonight and chased her around and when he caught her she whimpered (they were behind the table so I didn't see what happened); I said "don't step on her," and he got really offended and said he didn't care what I thought about him- like I was erroneously saying that he is mean to her… I know he wouldn't hurt her but he reacts much more harshly than I think is right.

 

 

He and my cat's do NOT get along, though this is slowly getting less severe (mostly because my cats stay in my bedroom ALL the time, because the rambunctious puppy runs up to play every time they come out). When he first came to visit/live with me he tried to get along with them (but was very active/aggressive with them), but was not used to more reserved cats, and they quickly started hissing at him. He swore they were planning on killing any puppy he got as a show of territorial-ness. Well, after a few bad encounters between him and them, they ended up staying in my room ALL the time. Then he got the dog, and the night she came home (I wasn't there) he introduced them without me and somehow one of my cats got a broken leg (not a puppy bite- vet said). So they have barely left my room since then. That was two months ago. They still will not come out becasue the pup wants to play and she runs at them or chase them if they come out of the room. <I know she just wants to play because she has gotten into the room and either eats their food or sniffs everything and them very excitedly.>

 

He has only met my father once when he first got here, for about 45 minutes, when we ran him to get his car. (He never came out to meet them from the city after eight years together and multiple invitations) He has said ever since then, 'what? Iv'e already met him.' Or, 'I don't want them as friends, so I don't need to go be friendly with your family.' I think he blames them for some of our issues… but he says not. He didn't go to Thanksgiving, Christmas, my mom's birthday dinner, or ANYTHING! I went alone, and happy to be with my family. But chalking it up in the back of my mind.

 

He doesn't help me with heavy things or big projects if I need it; he is unashamedly focused on himself and his own stuff that way (read: selfish).

 

We do have mellow times when there is nothing to get into an argument about- if I do my thing and he does his thing, then we get along fine. It is only when I start focusing on all the things the relationship lacks that I see problems.

 

As for myself, I know that I am an enabler, probably co-dependent, and have all sorts of issues with wanting things my way. I am overweight and sometimes unhappy with my body, my life, and my financial dependance on my parents assistance. But I am also totally confident in my sexuality and would love to grow more deeply into what we both wanted, if only we could communicate it! He acts like it will come through osmosis. I would happily take on more of the responsibility if I thought that would fix it, but after trying and trying and trying, what is left? I am still open to learning new things and ways, or being wrong to be corrected. Am I wrong to want him to be less harsh when he does communicate these things to me?

 

 

I want to end this extremely convoluted rant by saying that I have been getting a lot stronger during our separation, and feel like there is a possibility to grow together if we can get into a place of good communication. Some things we might never agree on, and I am fine with that obviously, but there are things I need to be able to request from a life partner. I am also open to us not being together for the rest of our life. But I really do not want that to be the case. Why? He has so much goodness blended in with all this s**t! The age-old lover's question- How much do you put up with to get what you want?

 

 

 

--------------

So after that exhaustive text on all the problems in my relationship, how do I break into his self-imposed bubble to let him know I am on the verge of dumping him (again)? He see's the bubble and is fine with it! Or do I dump a long term friend and lover onto his a** in a strange place, with no-one around him to turn to, school plans interrupted, and financial plans tossed around … again.

 

 

 

Questions for the community:

 

How can I get to a place of clear communication with him? I try to be as well thought out as possible in my approach, and bring a sense of focus to the conversation, but he acts like I am speaking another language.

 

How do I bring my boundaries into a relationship where I haven't had them before, without alienating him in the process? (I know it may be inevitable, but I want to diminish my part in compounding the problems as much as possible)

 

----------------------------------------------------

I plan on having a conversation with him that goes something like this:

 

I know your uncomfortable having conversations about anything intimate or relationship related, but this is a matter of the health of our future together. There are issues that we need to work together on, and if this conversation doesn't happen, then I consider that our relationship is in danger, and may not last very much longer. I refuse to continue to try to build a relationship with a person who doesn't put any effort into our relationship, or my needs being fulfilled. I know it is not all about me, but it should be sometimes.

 

 

 

The larger issues that we need to discuss and resolve are:

 

Our ability to plan and work towards common life goals together- we need to talk about what they are, how we want to work on them, and if we need a backup plan

 

Our financial plans- how they affect our together-family plans

 

How can we both work on the strengthening of our sexual and intimate, spiritual and emotional connections

 

What do we have right now? Not what did we have in the past. Not what might we have together in the future. What we have now is what we have to build on, towards the future we want. What is it?

 

 

***I would love to talk more about his good qualities, but they surface so seldom these days. Examples- He does say I am an amazing woman, and sexy, and is more verbally complimentary than he was in the city (by more I mean once or twice a week). He watches me, and vids I made for him make up a good amount of his 'stash,' so I know he thinks I'm hot. He is a teeeensy bit more open about his life/job plans in a general kind of way, but he is also more unapologetic about what he is locked up about. 'Don't worry about it' is a favorite response. He is more ready to talk about doing social things, and then occasionally actually doing them (about 15-10% of the time I guess...)*********

[genuinelyloverly7]

Thanks TiredFamilyGuy- that is exactly what I was hoping for- some direct, guided openers.

[Koekie]

I want to have a conversation with my partner about some problems I have with our current relationship. I could drop the whole backstory, but I figured I would try a more direct question first. I will say that he is so set against taking any negative criticism that he won't even talk to me about how we are doing on a day to day. I want to bring up things casually so it's not a big blow up, or he feels attacked, but we never get around to it. He will ignore me to avoid it. At this point these issues have built up so much that I have a laundry list of problems I want to talk about. The biggest being that we do not communicate on anything any deeper than what we are doing that day. No sex in months... so many more issues too!

 

I am asking for advice regarding how to make him understand that if we do not have some of these conversations (and if he doesn't step into the work of making our relationship strong) that I will consider leaving him again.* Should I be casual and say it will help me feel better, and for my sake can't he just listen to me, if nothing else? Or should I say how I am ready to start separating if he won't get it together? I don't want to threaten him, or always hold over his head that I might kick him out. He moved from 3 states away to get back together with me (or is it my free rent?), thus is alone out here.

 

It is my instinct to start by saying what is going right, or by saying what I could do to improve our relationship. But I can never get through that part to the real issues as I see it. So I need some non-confrontational (or confrontational) discussion opening and outlines so I can say what I need.

 

 

*if anyone wants to know more details I will post them- I wrote it all out in anticipation of posting it all, but it is so long and rant-y!

 

O wow. This looks so familiar.

 

Heres the thing. Your partner is emotionally unavailable (EU). They like to relate on a shallow level. My husband is EU. He comes from an abusive home and was never taught to trust, share and be emotionally close to anyone.

What you are missing is trust and a deeper emotional bond. And yes my husband lost interest in sex too, because he ran away from any attempts to connect on a deeper level and how boring does sex feel with no connection?

 

At this point in time I am on a hardcore plan of action. I have to wait till December to file for a divorce, so I thought to give this plan a try since Im waiting anyway.

 

I have for two months, not once said a word about his emotional unavailibility or his basically giving me no affection or attention. I had gone out of my way to do everything he likes and needed and remained chirpy (if you dont hell end up saying you were the cause) Then I nicely told him that I have done all he asked but I think were just on different wave lengths, that Im warm and need a deeper bond. Chances are your partner will now start promising to change etc. He wont. You need to leave first. And tell him if he seeks professional help and you see a permanent lasting change that you will consider dating him again and only if you feel you have connected on a deeper level will you consider serious commitment again.

 

Im sorry to say but otherwise the chances of him connecting on a deeper level are slim, especially if he feels theres no problem.

 

My husband and I are for now just friends. He knows that he will not be with me again unless he sees a professional and permanent change is evident.

[genuinelyloverly7]

I almost feel like I am betraying him by writing all of this and thinking this and feeling this. I feel like I should be loving all of his good parts and ignoring his less good parts. (Isn't that what he does for me? He doesn't bring my less good aspects up, except in the worst arguments.) And I should definitely not be 'telling all our business to the world,' as he would say. He would be so mad and hurt if he knew I was talking online about our relationship. But I cannot afford a therapist (for months and months), and my friends and family are so over hearing about him already...

 

Also, I really do believe in the Law of Attraction, and I feel like by focusing on all these bad things (i.e., trying to solve these problems), I am inviting more of the same into our future relationship. So if anyone knows Law of Attraction and has any comment on that, I'd love it.

 

Maybe I feel this way right now because he has not being angry and confrontational for the last day or two. He has been generally agreeable, though just as uninvolved in the day to day or me. But that is because he has just found a video game that he likes, and has been playing it for three days non-stop. And I mean that literally. I have never lived with a video game before, or someone who played it like this, so it is very new for me.

Sometimes I feel like he is baiting me to do my worst (not now but in recent past words and actions), pushing me to see how far I will go, or more likely not go. Other times I think he is really being just who he is, with no malicious intent in his actions.

 

I feel like crying about it, somewhere inside myself. But I cannot summon the emotional energy to get sad or hurt or anything. My grandmother passed a few months ago, and I didn't have the emotional energy to cry as much as I feel like I wanted to for her either. So I am in this very weird place right now.

[Koekie]

I almost feel like I am betraying him by writing all of this and thinking this and feeling this. I feel like I should be loving all of his good parts and ignoring his less good parts. (Isn't that what he does for me? He doesn't bring my less good aspects up, except in the worst arguments.) And I should definitely not be 'telling all our business to the world,' as he would say. He would be so mad and hurt if he knew I was talking online about our relationship. But I cannot afford a therapist (for months and months), and my friends and family are so over hearing about him already...

 

Also, I really do believe in the Law of Attraction, and I feel like by focusing on all these bad things (i.e., trying to solve these problems), I am inviting more of the same into our future relationship. So if anyone knows Law of Attraction and has any comment on that, I'd love it.

 

Maybe I feel this way right now because he has not being angry and confrontational for the last day or two. He has been generally agreeable, though just as uninvolved in the day to day or me. But that is because he has just found a video game that he likes, and has been playing it for three days non-stop. And I mean that literally. I have never lived with a video game before, or someone who played it like this, so it is very new for me.

Sometimes I feel like he is baiting me to do my worst (not now but in recent past words and actions), pushing me to see how far I will go, or more likely not go. Other times I think he is really being just who he is, with no malicious intent in his actions.

 

I feel like crying about it, somewhere inside myself. But I cannot summon the emotional energy to get sad or hurt or anything. My grandmother passed a few months ago, and I didn't have the emotional energy to cry as much as I feel like I wanted to for her either. So I am in this very weird place right now.

 

After some time of trying to get through to him I just became numb, which could be where you are now? I think it comes down to what you need. I think mostly women to need to feel desired, cherished and connected spriritually to those around us.

 

You have every right in the world to have your needs met if they are not unreasonable. Wanting to be with someone who shows he loves you and desires you is in no way unreasonable. If you give up what you need in the end you will resent him and stop loving him anyway. So I think if you sit him down and tell him straight out what you need (keep it short, direct, and unemotional) and your simply not interested in a relationship without it. Then stick to your guns and walk out if he doesnt budge.

 

I personally feel that being EU is a deep issue and need professional help to sort through

[diipii]

You don't love each other. You are only together when it suits you for other reasons. No wonder you have problems. Learn about yourself and move on.

[genuinelyloverly7]

I am really ready to be over him, but I still hold some idea in my mind that if only we could forgive and let go of the things we have said and done, we could move forward and work it out.

 

But he has said multiple times now that is glad when I tell him "if he doesn't care about me then I don't want to be with him." He then replies by giving me a big hug and a smile, and saying he is so glad I finally told him the truth, that I didn't want to be with him, that he will be out in a few months as soon as he finds a place.I said, what about the other part of my statement, that I wanted you to care for me more than you leaving? He said of course he cares about me; he hasn't thrown out all my physical things (in retaliation for how he thinks I 'let his storage stuff get auctioned off') and that my cats would be hurt/dead/missing if he didn't care.

 

This conversation has happened multiple times, usually after I ask to talk to him about the thing I perceive as issues (I don't always make it about problems, sometimes things we could do together that we never end up doing). He says "I don't care." I ask about what. He says, "all of it, I don't care what you think of me, or what you want. I am doing what I want and need to be where I need to be in life. I'm focusing on me, and being selfish inasmuch as I'm focusing on my needs, because I lost everything [in the storage auction]."

 

He goes from saying that to acting like everything is fine, doing exactly what he wants, and wondering why I make a big deal about it. He also says that he is willing to take the consequences of his actions- basically if I kick him out for it. It's almost like he expects it, and is glad when I say it so I validate his belief...

 

He came to visit me from another state, and stayed. He enrolled in a college out here to finish his degree. I wasn't speaking up enough though I thought I was trying to speak up, but it just got so hard to talk about everything so I ended up letting a lot go, because I was so busy/drained from it all. Began to question if I was just making too much of things because I was seeing problems.

 

 

SO (was tipsy last night- I'm assuming from the 2 beers he drank), walked up to me in a conversation/tiff about why I was cleaning up his dog's pee in the house, and he walked up and said my name until I stopped what I was doing an looked up at him. He then grabbed my hair and wrapped it up to be kind of tight on my head and said in this tight low but not too angry voice that I was needed to stop doing whatever I was doing to cause the pup to pee in the hall. (in fact, I think it is because he doesn't walk her enough).

He has only put his hands on me once before a month or so ago) in some weird attempt to get me to call my dad so he could fight him (blames my folks too for me leaving him the first time we lived together, and his stuff). That time he put his hands around my throat and put pressure and held me by the throat on the edge of the couch. He said, "Call your dad, I want to fight him too." Both of these times, he has blown it off the next day like he was just a little mad, and what was I making it a big deal for?

The next time this happens, he will be gone, if he is not before it happens.

 

 

My hang-ups (which I personally go back and forth on being valid) about breaking it off are this: it seems like he is such a great person when everything is going okay- I just keep feeling like our miscommunication is the problem. He is all alone out here (his fault since he never leaves the house since he got here five months ago) and has no-where to turn if I kick him out, has school planned out here and needs a place for multiple reasons for that to work (this all crashed when I left him before and he had to move when I left).

 

He was so happy to be back with me when he first got out here, being more emotionally open than he ever has, and talking more openly than before. But only in his own time. If I tried to ask him about having a conversation about anything, he cuts me off. I know I may try to go over and over the same thing, but that is because he never lets me get out everything I need to without interruptions or incredulity at my sensitivity on certain issues. He has been antagonistic about certain things, and completely ignoring others since he got here.

 

So my question is, should I kick him out with 30 days to find a place, and screw him? He only pays for his own food (mostly- and sometimes he asks me to do it then pays me back later…). I know he has a lot of pride, but him staying in my apartment (that is actually my parents) without paying them any rent or utility bills or for most of the other stuff. I kew it would take a while for him to get his school money… I gave him space to do it his way- school money- my family thinks he is a sponge, and came back to me for the free ride.

 

He is so sincere and nice when I talk to him about things, but such an uncaring ******* other times. I have done some mean things since he got here- (I acknowledge that I forgot his birthday and was asking him to do chores until like 6pm; he thinks I was not that sympathetic when he was sick- he wouldn't let me give him too much attention, but then he thought I didn't give him enough)

 

I could go on… I am trying to be honest about my own contribution to the problems and solutions, as well as seeing his actions honestly- is he acting in the defensive, and just needs to feel safe, or is he really manipulating me and the situation for his comfort?

[pcplod]

Unfortunately, if he will not face up to the challenges that you both face, and it sounds from what you say, he simply, flat-out won't then there is absolutely nothing that you can do about it because it is HIS issue.

 

To put it crudely, from his perspective, if you wrap up a turd and hand it to him, it doesn't matter how carefully and caringly you have wrapped it up, it is still a turd, when he unwraps it. The subject itself is his objection, not the manner in which it is broached. To double the jeopardy for you he simply can't cope with your forward, assertive personality. Before divorce parity for women, they, women, just had to suck it up becuase they simply had no other options. Not any more. Now some men whine about how this is the thin tip of the undermining of their role as men {rolls-eyes}.

 

You want him to step up to the mark and play in the big-boys' league when he isn't even equipped to fend for himself in the little league. Before you could even BEGIN to have a sensible discussion with him, someone, somehow would need to help him sort out his self-esteem, confidence conflict avoidance and communication inabilities first. That sounds like an improbably difficult challenge to me. Maybe I'm wrong.

 

Just read your subsequent post. I was wrong. He is way beyond appeal of any sort. Bridges burnt and all that. He has already discounted your relationship from any future outcome. What can anyone say? I think there is a universal opinion that once someone lays hands on you during any dispute that an undeniable Rubicon has been crossed simply because he/she has practically demonstrated inadequate self-control. He may well be nice sometimes but is far from it too often. Want to spend decades wondering whether when you wake up in the morning which it is going to be?

 

Arse, door, boot.

Edited April 9, 2013 by pcplod

[Harlequin_Dog]

I think you really need to evaluate the fact that this person is ok physically harming you.

 

He is demonstrating classical abusive/controlling behavior. If you get rid of him, I guarantee he will continue to try to crawl back. Don't let him come back. This has gone beyond any acceptable bounds, and you must get this person out of your life.

 

Yes- he probably is a wonderful person under all his flaws, but it takes two people actively working to improve a relationship. He has clearly checked out, refuses to want any involvement with your family, takes offense when you clean the house of animal fecal/urinary matter and even just tries talking/sleeping/cuddling with him.

 

This is someone who, while at one time may have cared and been a good partner, is no longer that person. Furthermore, do not listen to anything he may try to say about you living in your parents' house or having unequal power or hurting his life by making his leave. He is an adult, and as such the only person responsible for his actions and troubles is him.

 

Leave this abusive man behind, there are many men would would jump to have someone as kind, flexible and warm as you. You can do much better.

[genuinelyloverly7]

Well, the pup has ended up causing more and more problems between us than even I ever imagined. I think he is too angry to keep he (for her safety), but I know he loves her too, and is going to make things problematic for me to keep her from him when he leaves. We fight over how he thinks I am doing something to make her evacuate in the house, how I shouldn't talk to her in certain ways (most ways), how the gate I have up for my wounded cat gets on his nerves, it being in the hallway.

 

But when...here goes... she broke a bowl reaching for food after he refused to tell her to get down for days now- then I was holding her out from the broken shards while picking it up- he went to grab her from me/the broken dish, and she got excited and nipped at or on him- he went all aggressive and picking her up, saying loudly to her in her face ''what are you doing? Are you crazy?"I asked what he was doing to her, he said to shut up, that I was ignorant of the breed (she is a bull terrier). We both said more angry things. He said 'You, my full name here, are ignorant.' And 'you are ignorant,' like 20 times in a row. So I said, fine, he should go find someone to live with who is not ignorant, who suits him better. I told him after he asked if I was going to try and take the dog. I said, maybe, if he keeps doing those kinds of things. He has kept her with him in his space since then, not yelling or getting angry, but she has just been laying in there with him in the dark all day. He NEVER gives her enough exercise- just one of many problems he has being responsible for her.

 

And he says again, 'tell me to leave. After you invited me out here, where I know no-one, you tell me to leave.' He asked me if he could come out here! He wanted to go to school as soon as he got here. He rushed it all, not trying to talk through any of it with me. Just, 'things are fine; aren't things fine for you? I don't have time to talk about it, because I lost everything in the storage auction you allowed to happen to my things... so I have to focus twice as hard to get back where I want to be.' It's so ironic- I want him to do all these things, if he would be more considerate of our growth together.

 

<I am so proud of him, keeping after his diploma and goals after so many years of doing that and other things- but I always just wanted him to make time for me, without my having to nag him about it (which I never intended to do, but probably did- thinking he would come around to giving me what I needed). To have him act as excited about spending time with me as he was to do school work, or watch Bloomberg. He says (and genuinely believes, I think) that he is excited to see me, to be with me. But I just want more expression of it. And when, after a few months of him being more and more resentful towards me for wanting things he cannot or will not give, manifesting in his ignoring me, I am over it, and tell him so.>

 

He broke some of the hall gate yesterday after an argument about her chewing on it, and when I said 'what did you do that for?' he said he wanted, no, needed, for me to go tell my Dad that I didn't feel safe around him, and for my Dad to come down and make him leave.

I know he means 'because it is all my family's fault anyway.' Our annual reunion and my Dad's Birthday is next weekend, and he said to me (he told me weeks ago he could not come due to project deadlines) that he wanted me to go tell my whole family that he was an a**hole, and that he abuses me. He said that since I would tell them that anyway, I should do it when he knew abut it. Instead of talking stuff behind his back.

 

We end up agreeing that he is moving as soon as he finds a place (me very passively- I didn't want his friendly acceptance of my so-called treating him badly as the final outcome)...see above for that... and yet here we are, friends, and not together anymore.

 

So we both go to our separate rooms last night, and this morning, we are both back to cautious niceness... but when I (he said) looked upset today, he asked what was wrong! I said after yesterday, I was just sad, and upset. He asked why? I said don't you remember what happened? He said yes; you said you wanted me to leave, and so I am. And he said if I wanted him to stay, then I could tell him, and he would stay. And that because I had led him to believe he could stay, he was going to stay until after he finished his school project. I said how long is that? He said he didn't know, and if it was taking too long to let him know. I said okay, but that timeline may be sooner than either of us originally thought, if we fight one more time.

 

So now his timeline for finding a place is on me, and our staying together or not is ALL on me. But we are friends; he and I have both said so, and we are acting like it- again, nothing too intimate, just a lack of animosity.

 

My biggest problem now other than when he will leave is that I am facing taking his dog from him when he leaves or sooner (my dog on paper and financially- I 'adopted' her, with us both agreeing that she was for him, so he has those papers- but he has never paid me back for her) because he has such a bad temper when he is upset. When he is happy/not angry he is nice to her, more stern and yet non-training than I agree with, but not exactly neglectful or abusive. UNTIL he gets angry! Then he is WAY TOO aggressive and psychologically abusive to her. If he gets that way one more time with her, I am going to take her away, and hold her in my room with my cats, and tell him to find a place within 48 hours. I will just keep her with me 24/7, and stay with my cats or lock the door to my bedroom if I have to leave. I am obviously not a confrontational person, but I cannot see him do one more thing to her in the name of too-stern punishment. Of course, now that he is just hiding out with her, it may take a while before such an incident occurs. Should I do it now, before the next time he gets angry? I want it to happen in the heat of things, so he knows EXACTLY why I am doing something I said I wouldn't.

 

I think I will call the college he is enrolled in and ask (anon of course) about housing. Then he cannot lie to me about timing.

 

It is SO lame that this happened, and that it needed to happen! I love who he is, until he gets angry or negative. I still love him, and it hurts me to see him in the pain of negative emotions. But I cannot heal him. He must heal that, or be willing to be healed by the things he does. And he is not (as far as I can tell), because he doesn't want to deal/confront/face those issues.At least not with me. He would rather argue and push me till I ask him to leave. I hope to the Mother that he does sometime, somewhere, with someone. He said he faced death, and that from that incident he knows his value. But he says that and then refuses to communicate with me (because, as he says, I just treat him so badly all the time).

 

 

Aaaaaaarrrrrgggghhhhhhh... I am over it, through the first part, and is is easier inasmuch as I am not going to change my mind (out loud anyway- I am still crying all over my pillow and into my bubble bath)... but now I have to go at him about these last few things. I guess I could bring my dad/family into it, but they would pull in the cops WAY sooner than I would, and it doesn't need to come to that as far as I will ever have a say in it. He is going to hate me after this is over, if it all comes to me forcing him to release her to me. And I don't want that. But the pup's (and my, and my kitties, and even his) safety comes first. Not our feelings. I verified on a dog forum that his actions are indeed, abusive, even if it not physical. (I didn't want to be projecting)... So how should I orchestrate the pup's safe-napping? Without causing too much more fights, for all our sakes.

[genuinelyloverly7]

I acknowledge that I am just using this for a venting/ranting post right now, and I am so glad to have a place to say it all. My parents would do more than I am ready for- my whole family, really. So I am not ready to do that yet. My friend in my hometown is probably tired of hearing me rant on and in about this guy.

 

 

I have known this guy for so long; he has never been this physically responsive to his feelings before-especially the negative ones. He says he is not subverting himself to anyone anymore. He is not hiding or being soft or just agreeing to anything to please people any more. This makes me feel like he is saying I want him to do that with me. Maybe he is just not used to me being so assertive myself- I rarely if ever made ultimatums or 'rules' before when we were together.

 

I just wish I could be with the person I knew before he got so bitter about me and my family and life; I wish we both weren't so defensive and ready to be mad at the other. It came down to him and I deciding that his leaving would be the solution. By that i mean this time when i said he should go, i actually meant it. and agreed, in his usual defensive way. We both agreed we would still be friends. I don't know how that made it through today's confrontations, though. The upstairs neighbor finally came by today and complained about the pup's barking- I apologized and said we were working on it and how she is a puppy. But because he doesn't train her in any way, nor want me to, she barks at him, just him, at all hours. Or does when I'm around for the most part. I think she is either trying to communicate my stress or her own at our anger towards each other.

 

He is now more determined than ever to leave, thinking I take sides with the neighbor over him; he said 'he would never want me on his team'. And goes to take the dog into his room to quiet her. He told me if anyone went in that room without him, that the pup was trained to mess them up. I don't believe it, and I want to prevent this from happening to her- she shouldn't be so angry like him. But she is getting harder to handle. He thinks he is taking the dog- I say he not emotionally fit- but it would get so ugly; and I'd have to do it sooner than later, and that would make it harder for him to find a place.

 

For all of his problems (that sadden me when a person I care for is going through), I wish we could have worked out our differences and strengthened each other instead of tearing us down. Now I just wish the dog situation would be less problematic. He will make it into me having to dog-nap her into my room and face him head-on her or pull her out of his hands.. Either way I'm going to need muscle behind me.y dad? I don't want someone SO will try to fight. And he has as much said he would fight my dad. A 70 year old man to his 38. I'm by turns grieving the loss of what was, and happy he's leaving- cant wait. maybe we will be better friends if we don't live together. But I doubt it.

 

This being pushed to extremes is what makes this SO bad for me- it makes me into the bad guy every time. Now I get to be the bad guy that takes away his last scrap of living companionship. Out here where he knows no one. I hate that!!! I wouldn't do it a all except he gets too aggressive when he is angry, and doesn't give her enough care. So she has to come first. But he was hurt when I made the point that he might be hurting her. 'Now I see how you think of me.' It makes me doubt my judgement- am I being too quick to jump to conclusions about his intent, if not the outcome? I wish that we could just talk it all out, make a list of things/actions to do to make improvements, and then devote ourselves to ourselves and each other!?!!!

Edited April 15, 2013 by genuinelyloverly7
Typos...

[KraftDinner]

I think my head just exploded.

 

Get the police to escort this guy out of your apartment.

[Realist3]

He needs to go, the sooner the better. He is a 38 year old baby. And yes, as you already stated you are enabling this behavior. There is no changing him. He will be the same or worse. Given everything you have described I don't think anyone with a clear head would choose that for their future.

[genuinelyloverly7]

Well, we always end up fighting late at night. So we just finished one and it was 95%, him going on and on about the situation, saying all sorts of things I could only sit and listen too. I didn't absorb most of it.

 

I know this sounds, victim-y, but I just wish these talks came about without all the hateful statements. I just wish he would always act as he does when he is excited about something. But to me- I'm the excitement!

[genuinelyloverly7]

He is being nice and congenial in his distant sort of way. Wants to stay till he finds a place- like July or August! No way! It is blizzardimg outside right now, I am trying not to make him leave in the midst of that, but no way will it be even another month if I can help it! It sucks having a person who has been your friend for so long be the person you end up having to be the meanest to. I HATE that!!!!!!!!!

 

Ill keep you posted on it all...