Revenge

[RiceaRoni]

According to the bible. It is said that The Lord will seek revenge for you so it isn't necessary for you to do so.

 

We shouldn't want to seek revenge or avenge ourselfs to those who have hurt us or betrayed us.

 

However is this true? Would God seek justice for us who have been betrayed or hurt?

 

 

Does this follow under the rule of bad karma? What goes around comes around?

 

That if you forgive, ignore, and move on from those that have hurt you, you can live in peace and eventually you will be avenged?

[M30USA]

Seeking revenge isn't the same as seeking to bring justice. If you see a person kill a baby, the right thing to do is turn them in. That way nobody else will be subjected to this person. Revenge, on the other hand, is more selfish. Someone has hurt us, personally, and we want to make them "pay"--not because it will help anything, or even them, but because we take pleasure in seeing that person suffer because they made us suffer.

[RiceaRoni]

Seeking revenge isn't the same as seeking to bring justice. If you see a person kill a baby, the right thing to do is turn them in. That way nobody else will be subjected to this person. Revenge, on the other hand, is more selfish. Someone has hurt us, personally, and we want to make them "pay"--not because it will help anything, or even them, but because we take pleasure in seeing that person suffer because they made us suffer.

 

 

How would justice be brought to those who have hurt us then?

 

Do we walk away on silence? That is what I have done and question myself if Ive done the right thing. To just walk away from the person who hurt me and ignore them as if I never knew them...I don't know if that is right.

[pureinheart]

According to the bible. It is said that The Lord will seek revenge for you so it isn't necessary for you to do so.

 

We shouldn't want to seek revenge or avenge ourselfs to those who have hurt us or betrayed us.

 

However is this true? Would God seek justice for us who have been betrayed or hurt?

 

 

Does this follow under the rule of bad karma? What goes around comes around?

 

That if you forgive, ignore, and move on from those that have hurt you, you can live in peace and eventually you will be avenged?

 

Personally, I think it's a natural thing that occurs...if people go around screwing others, well...they get what they give eventually.

 

I can't tell you how many times I've kept my mouth shut (which is no easy thing) and how many horrible ways I've been either violated or messed with. The people who have done these things are not happy people and each and every person that I have seen has been dealt with in one form or another. Now my responsibility is to not delight in their misfortunes and pray for them- this is hard, but I need to work on doing this. Recently am seeing the anger I carry and need to focus on forgiveness.

 

The key to inner peace is forgiveness IMO...great thread BTW, and thank you because I need to get busy!

[TheFinalWord]

According to the bible. It is said that The Lord will seek revenge for you so it isn't necessary for you to do so.

 

We shouldn't want to seek revenge or avenge ourselfs to those who have hurt us or betrayed us.

 

However is this true? Would God seek justice for us who have been betrayed or hurt?

 

 

Does this follow under the rule of bad karma? What goes around comes around?

 

That if you forgive, ignore, and move on from those that have hurt you, you can live in peace and eventually you will be avenged?

 

Good points and questions.

 

When we leave vengeance to the Lord, we are basically telling God that we trust his wisdom more than our own.

 

We can not always understand why someone has mistreated us; however, we know that in this life, many will betray us, damage us, mistreat us, and disrespect us.

 

Yes, vengeance does belong to the Lord. But it may very well be that they will never experience any grief in this life. David noted that despite living for the Lord, he was constantly plagued; while those that were ungodly were always prospering...he started asking himself, "why am I following the straight and narrow and getting nowhere, meanwhile these other people that mock God's laws, prosper. What's the point?"...until he understood their end (Psalm 73). Then he began to feel pity for them, in the same way Christ felt pity for those that nailed him to the cross when he said "forgive them, for they know not what they do".

 

Forgiveness is for our benefit and to love our enemies is to be like our Father in Heaven, who gives his rain to the evil and the good and his sun to the just and the unjust.

 

Here is the passage from Romans 12 for you to study.

 

Playing Romans 12 by Alexander Scourby - picosong

[TheFinalWord]

How would justice be brought to those who have hurt us then?

 

Do we walk away on silence? That is what I have done and question myself if Ive done the right thing. To just walk away from the person who hurt me and ignore them as if I never knew them...I don't know if that is right.

 

Oh, I just saw this. Well forgiveness and reconciliation are two different things. It would help to know what happened exactly. But that is up to you to disclose, if you do not feel comfortable

 

This is a great blog on the topic for you:

 

How Can I Forgive?

 

If this was a guy or a friend that is hurt you, I think this video may help.

 

SOME PEOPLE/THINGS YOU CAN "NEVA" GO BACK TOO!!!! - YouTube

[TaraMaiden]

According to the bible. It is said that The Lord will seek revenge for you so it isn't necessary for you to do so.

 

We shouldn't want to seek revenge or avenge ourselfs to those who have hurt us or betrayed us.

 

However is this true? Would God seek justice for us who have been betrayed or hurt?

 

No.

if this were the case, all the Paedophile catholic Priests would be suffering a lot more, and all the crimes done in 'His' name would be avenged out of a sense of outrage.

So, I hate to rain on the Bible's parade, but - No.

 

It doesn't happen.

Have you ever seen it happen?

 

 

Does this follow under the rule of bad karma? What goes around comes around?

 

Okay, trying to be patient here.

 

You have it wrong.

Karma is not 'what goes around, comes around'.

Karma is not retribution, it's not revenge, it's not justice, it's not pay-back, it's not a kick-up the ass, it's not come-uppance and it's not just desserts.

 

Karma doesn't mean that.

Karma - quite literally, simply means 'Volitional Action'.

It's what you are purposely doing at any given moment, be it Mental Action, (thinking) Verbal Action (speaking) or Physical Action (doing).

 

It's just a process.

 

It just 'is'.

 

I'm creating Karma right now.

And so are you, with this post....

Think about that.

Karma is a universal process, nobody is exempt.

 

That if you forgive, ignore, and move on from those that have hurt you, you can live in peace and eventually you will be avenged?

 

If you have 'forgiven', isn't that being 'bigger than God' if you still expect him to wreak havoc and take revenge? You can forgive, but he can't and he still kicks ass....?

 

Why would you want revenge on someone who never actually purposely determined to deliberately hurt you?

Why would you want some kind of harm to come to someone who simply decided on a different course, and went a different way?

 

Because that's what you're asking about, really, isn't it?

 

You're still banging on about your 17-year-old ex.

 

A boy.

An immature, developing boy, who's just doing what boys of his age do.

 

Honestly.... I truly hoped you were more mature about this, but it looks as if I may be wrong.

 

Or am I wrong about your post?

Are these questions completely unrelated and general?

Edited March 24, 2013 by TaraMaiden

[pureinheart]

Good points and questions.

 

When we leave vengeance to the Lord, we are basically telling God that we trust his wisdom more than our own.

 

We can not always understand why someone has mistreated us; however, we know that in this life, many will betray us, damage us, mistreat us, and disrespect us.

 

Yes, vengeance does belong to the Lord. But it may very well be that they will never experience any grief in this life. David noted that despite living for the Lord, he was constantly plagued; while those that were ungodly were always prospering...he started asking himself, "why am I following the straight and narrow and getting nowhere, meanwhile these other people that mock God's laws, prosper. What's the point?"...until he understood their end (Psalm 73). Then he began to feel pity for them, in the same way Christ felt pity for those that nailed him to the cross when he said "forgive them, for they know not what they do".

 

Forgiveness is for our benefit and to love our enemies is to be like our Father in Heaven, who gives his rain to the evil and the good and his sun to the just and the unjust.

 

Here is the passage from Romans 12 for you to study.

 

Playing Romans 12 by Alexander Scourby - picosong

 

Awwww, thank you for Romans 12...awesome. I think this was more effective than reading it because it allows one to meditate on these things.

 

TFW, I'm not sure if you guys have ever noticed this, athough I've seen really angry people, some have known them for years, and after a few years I noticed that even facial features became distorted...also vindictive, high minded and condescending attitudes will cause a distortion. The worst I've seen though is anger and hatred. Not just being angry at an injustice, but walking in anger as a lifestyle.

 

Right now I'm watching a very good friend age quickly and having all sorts of health problems, of course some of it is other types of lifestyles...but the one thing I notice is the constant anger and stress. I used to sit for hours listening to his anger and hate and would feel completely drained afterwards, realising it was sucking the very life out of me and felt bad spirits all around me. I've recently been able to talk him out of his anger, or at the very least get him on better subjects...but wow, what a waste.

[pureinheart]

Oh, I just saw this. Well forgiveness and reconciliation are two different things. It would help to know what happened exactly. But that is up to you to disclose, if you do not feel comfortable

 

This is a great blog on the topic for you:

 

How Can I Forgive?

 

If this was a guy or a friend that is hurt you, I think this video may help.

 

SOME PEOPLE/THINGS YOU CAN "NEVA" GO BACK TOO!!!! - YouTube

 

Again TFW, your over the top! Thank you so much- the video, well that blessed lady needs a pulpit...loved. it. You know it felt like like my Godmother talking to me...she used to say and I can hear it now- Baby, you don't need no (blank, haha) crazy man makin you all crazy and playin with your head and your heart- be married to Jesus- the devil is a liar.

 

She's the reason I'm where I'm at today, she trained me up...my Godmother most likely has forgotten more than most people will ever know about the Word.

[pureinheart]

How would justice be brought to those who have hurt us then?

 

Do we walk away on silence? That is what I have done and question myself if Ive done the right thing. To just walk away from the person who hurt me and ignore them as if I never knew them...I don't know if that is right.

 

I think there is a time to speak and a time not to speak. I have rebuked certain things in the past, and it was possibly God- if it was my flesh then I'm usually convicted.

 

Maybe I was wrong in this, but have yet to feel convicted because of it. My daughter is one of the nicest people you'll ever meet...it got to doormat stages though- this scared me. Nice people that don't stick up for themselves when the time is meant for them to do so can turn into angry hurt people by burying this stuff up inside.

 

This fool did my daughter wayyyyyy wrong....ohhhhh when I think of it I burn up inside: she comes home crying, she's 17 (this was 11 years ago). I don't remember how she ended up locked in the basement but this "individual" (I am thinking of other terms to call him) who was supposed to be her boyfriend had sex with another girl while she was locked in the basement....I wanted to hurt this fool BAD. BUT, told my husband at the time...you take her to his house and make sure she tells him off...and I mean tell him off. I told her, you better tell him off or you'll deal with me...I was livid to say the least.

 

They went and she told him off...I said do you feel better? She said she did and released a lot of anger.

 

I felt she needed to start a journey of sticking up for herself. Knowing she's not the type to go running around telling people off, I felt this was safe. Today she sees right through people and is still nice.

 

Then there are those things that aren't even worth dealing with...choose your battles wisely...lol

 

Looking back, I seriously doubt I'd let the stuff slide that I did then, back then I had so much going on and didn't think too much on it...but thank God now with having more time, realise how precious time is and what we do with it...some people and things just aren't worth the energy. Let God deal with it, He does a much better job:)

[TheFinalWord]

Awwww, thank you for Romans 12...awesome. I think this was more effective than reading it because it allows one to meditate on these things.

 

TFW, I'm not sure if you guys have ever noticed this, athough I've seen really angry people, some have known them for years, and after a few years I noticed that even facial features became distorted...also vindictive, high minded and condescending attitudes will cause a distortion. The worst I've seen though is anger and hatred. Not just being angry at an injustice, but walking in anger as a lifestyle.

 

Right now I'm watching a very good friend age quickly and having all sorts of health problems, of course some of it is other types of lifestyles...but the one thing I notice is the constant anger and stress. I used to sit for hours listening to his anger and hate and would feel completely drained afterwards, realising it was sucking the very life out of me and felt bad spirits all around me. I've recently been able to talk him out of his anger, or at the very least get him on better subjects...but wow, what a waste.

 

Welcome Plus you can't really beat the voice of Alexander Scourby.

 

Yes, I do know what you mean. Bitterness, anger, and hatred are poisonous. That's why it's so much more freeing to forgive and let God handle it. Our freedom from being tempted by satan is contingent upon how much we forgive others (Perry Stone).

 

This is a good message, regarding revenge amongst believers, Christians that backbite and use the Word to tear down other believers, and forgiveness in general...kind of deals with some of the topics that pop up here from time to time. I recommend when you get a spare 20 mins sometime

 

 

Bless you PIH!!

[RiceaRoni]

No.

if this were the case, all the Paedophile catholic Priests would be suffering a lot more, and all the crimes done in 'His' name would be avenged out of a sense of outrage.

So, I hate to rain on the Bible's parade, but - No.

 

It doesn't happen.

Have you ever seen it happen?

 

 

 

 

Okay, trying to be patient here.

 

You have it wrong.

Karma is not 'what goes around, comes around'.

Karma is not retribution, it's not revenge, it's not justice, it's not pay-back, it's not a kick-up the ass, it's not come-uppance and it's not just desserts.

 

Karma doesn't mean that.

Karma - quite literally, simply means 'Volitional Action'.

It's what you are purposely doing at any given moment, be it Mental Action, (thinking) Verbal Action (speaking) onor Physical Action (doing).

 

It's just a process.

 

It just 'is'.

 

I'm creating Karma right now.

And so are you, with this post....

Think about that.

Karma is a universal process, nobody is exempt.

 

 

 

If you have 'forgiven', isn't that being 'bigger than God' if you still expect him to wreak havoc and take revenge? You can forgive, but he can't and he still kicks ass....?

 

Why would you want revenge on someone who never actually purposely determined to deliberately hurt you?

Why would you want some kind of harm to come to someone who simply decided on a different course, and went a different way?

 

Because that's what you're asking about, really, isn't it?

 

You're still banging on about your 17-year-old ex.

 

A boy.

An immature, developing boy, who's just doing what boys of his age do.

 

Honestly.... I truly hoped you were more mature about this, but it looks as if I may be wrong.

 

Or am I wrong about your post?

Are these questions completely unrelated and general?

 

 

Oh. Thank you Tara I never really understood what karma was :0 I had always thought it was that whole notion of "what goes around comes around" stuff, but now I understand.

 

And you are wrong about my post. They truly are unrelated about my ex..otherwise I would have posted this in the breakup forum.

 

I was in church and heard about this whole revenge thing and I didn't understand it because I always thought God wanted us to forgive and to never seek any revenge. "To love your enemies" so when I read something from the bible about God seeking revenge for us, I couldn't understand because I would think God would do the same for the person or persons that have hurt us.

[RiceaRoni]

I would think God would turn the other cheek as well.

[TaraMaiden]

Glad you mention 'turning the other cheek' as well, because that is often taken to mean being passive, and not fighting back.

 

It doesn't.

It's passive defiance and resistance.

 

And here's why....

 

 

(I included two different links to illustrate that this isn't some isolated theory, but actually a quotation with historical support....)

[TaraMaiden]

Hindus prescribe to Karma as a Fatalistic concept - believing everything to be pre-ordained, but it has led, in the modern world, to problems, regarding discrimination between castes and social ranking....

 

Buddhists see karma (or Kamma, in ancient Pali texts; 'Karma' is Sanskrit) as Voluntary, pre-meditated and intentional action, be it a deliberate thought, a deliberate word or a deliberate deed.

 

So accidentally squashing a snail is not the kind of Kamma that would bring about a negative consequence.

 

The word people are really seeking to use, here, is Vipaka - THAT - is 'Effect'.

 

Kamma is the 'cause', the original Action: Vipaka is what happens as a direct result of that action.

There is mental Vipaka, Verbal Vipaka and Active Vipaka.

 

Kamma is what 'goes around'.

Vipaka, is the possible "kick up the backside" which 'comes around'.

 

But the original Kamma has to be implemented with deliberate intent.

 

Remember that.

 

Someone has to actually premeditatedly intend to do something, in order to merit Vipaka of a similar intensity....

 

And it is just as pertinent to Positive Kamma, and 'neutral' Kamma, as it is to Negative Kamma.....

[RiceaRoni]

Hindus prescribe to Karma as a Fatalistic concept - believing everything to be pre-ordained, but it has led, in the modern world, to problems, regarding discrimination between castes and social ranking....

 

Buddhists see karma (or Kamma, in ancient Pali texts; 'Karma' is Sanskrit) as Voluntary, pre-meditated and intentional action, be it a deliberate thought, a deliberate word or a deliberate deed.

 

So accidentally squashing a snail is not the kind of Kamma that would bring about a negative consequence.

 

The word people are really seeking to use, here, is Vipaka - THAT - is 'Effect'.

 

 

Oh I see. So it would have to be purposeful? For example how you said accidentally squashing a snail would not bring a negative consequence, but only if you had done it on purpose or for a purpose; only then it would bring a negative consequence?

 

And the same goes for good as well? If you purposely do something that is good you will receive good in return?

[RiceaRoni]

Glad you mention 'turning the other cheek' as well, because that is often taken to mean being passive, and not fighting back.

 

It doesn't.

It's passive defiance and resistance.

 

And here's why....

 

 

(I included two different links to illustrate that this isn't some isolated theory, but actually a quotation with historical support....)

 

 

The links are very interesting. I never thought about "turning the other cheek" in that way. I was always told it meant to be passive, to ignore the bad things that were being done instead of fighting back.

[Taramere]

TFW, I'm not sure if you guys have ever noticed this, athough I've seen really angry people, some have known them for years, and after a few years I noticed that even facial features became distorted...also vindictive, high minded and condescending attitudes will cause a distortion. The worst I've seen though is anger and hatred. Not just being angry at an injustice, but walking in anger as a lifestyle.

 

This is true. People can cause themselves a lot of health problems with anger, It's not unlike a drug. Anger can be very stimulating, so the angry person seeks out more things that will anger them to keep getting that exciting feeling. The newspaper the Daily Mail was actually created with that very specific remit of "giving people their daily dose of anger" (founder Lord Northcliffe).

 

It's not all bad. I think channelled correctly anger can inspire creativity. A lot of great music, literature, comedy and art comes from a pretty angry place. If people don't have that knack of channeling it in positive ways that will enrich rather than impoverish their lives, though, then I think it transforms them into purposeless balls of rage who repel other people.

 

As for revenge, I personally don't have the stomach for taking it in real life but I do certainly fantasise about it at times, and I think revenge themes make for great fiction/soap operas (the tv series "Revenge" is one of my big weaknesses - I refuse to miss an episode). It's an understandable desire. When you feel deprived of justice, it feeds wrath - but wrath is a destructive force. Sometimes it's better to just accept that life isn't always fair and focus on the things that you can fix. I've seen times when somebody treated me in a way that was manifestly unfair, and I shrugged it off - and then at a later day they compensated by doing me some sort of favour. Times I've been unable to shrug it off, I've found myself caught in a vicious circle of negative feelings. When people are overly fuelled by anger and wrath, they can miss the small ways in which justice gets done or people attempt to compensate for earlier wrongdoings. It's an approach to life that, in the end, only hurts them.

 

I don't take biblical teachings literally, but I think there's often wisdom in them. The seven deadly sins related to very human flawed behaviour and thinking that everybody is capable of. The hell they can take a person to is the hell associated with the negative aspects of rage, victimhood, an endless sense of being on the receiving end of injustice - that other people have it easier, etc. These are toxic feelings most people probably get from time to time. Some people embrace them as "right", others do battle against them - and I think people in the latter category are generally the spiritual or psychological winners in life.

Edited March 24, 2013 by Taramere

[TaraMaiden]

(Have asked Mod's to delete 2nd post - it's a duplicate-in-part of the first...

 

My computer was taking for ever to 'submit Reply' so I quickly highlighted it and "Ctrl+C"-d it... then the whole damn system crashed.

I reopened the site after recovery, came back to this thread, and my post was nowhere to be seen, so opened up a new reply box, and I pasted it - and obviously I only managed to copy half of it by the looks of it - but I now see the original post DID in fact appear....

 

I'll never fully understand computer technology, not if I live to be 100!)

[TaraMaiden]

Oh I see. So it would have to be purposeful? For example how you said accidentally squashing a snail would not bring a negative consequence, but only if you had done it on purpose or for a purpose; only then it would bring a negative consequence?

 

And the same goes for good as well? If you purposely do something that is good you will receive good in return?

 

I'm not going to get into heavy discussion on Kamma-Vipaka here - first of all, it's very long-winded and actually a lot more complex than simply citing "Cause and Effect". There are different 'levels' of kamma, depending on the action involved; to cite an example, if you murder someone, that's one heck of a Vipaka-come-back... if you defend your family from an intruder, who is set on killing you and raping your wife, and kill him as a consequence - that too, is Vipaka - but it's a subtle and different quality of Vipaka....

 

There again, if you think of giving £100 to a good cause, but don't do so, that's a different form of Vipaka again... and you think of giving £100, but only give £50, because you want that glorious pair of shoes.... that's another type of Vipaka.... but if you want to give £100, but only give £50, because you have to use the remainder to pay your rent, or you'd be evicted.... see?

 

All manner of different forms of consequences.

it's complex.

 

To be honest, I doubt there's any Buddhist who could actually explain "The Law of Kamma" to any completely satisfactory degree, and in line with any other Buddhist's thinking, too.... in fact, I can't think of many Lay Buddhists who completely understand it themselves.

 

The Buddha instructed that the workings of Kamma were an unconjecturable, and an imponderable enigma; one we should not waste time trying to figure out....

 

Really, our concentration should simply focus on what we think, say and do, right now, and evaluate our own actions. That's hard enough to do in itself, without trying to figure out the precise workings of Kamma.

 

"Be a light unto yourselves", he recommended. In other words, just focus on what you're doing, day to day, hour to hour, minute to minute....

 

I challenge anyone to do this for just one hour - to think completely and to evaluate every mental/verbal/active step....

Hard, isn't it.....?

 

(Sorry about the elaboration. Not shoving it down anyone's throat, just clarifying..... )

[M30USA]

No.

if this were the case, all the Paedophile catholic Priests would be suffering a lot more, and all the crimes done in 'His' name would be avenged out of a sense of outrage.

So, I hate to rain on the Bible's parade, but - No.

 

It doesn't happen.

Have you ever seen it happen?

 

 

 

 

Okay, trying to be patient here.

 

You have it wrong.

Karma is not 'what goes around, comes around'.

Karma is not retribution, it's not revenge, it's not justice, it's not pay-back, it's not a kick-up the ass, it's not come-uppance and it's not just desserts.

 

Karma doesn't mean that.

Karma - quite literally, simply means 'Volitional Action'.

It's what you are purposely doing at any given moment, be it Mental Action, (thinking) Verbal Action (speaking) or Physical Action (doing).

 

It's just a process.

 

It just 'is'.

 

I'm creating Karma right now.

And so are you, with this post....

Think about that.

Karma is a universal process, nobody is exempt.

 

 

 

If you have 'forgiven', isn't that being 'bigger than God' if you still expect him to wreak havoc and take revenge? You can forgive, but he can't and he still kicks ass....?

 

Why would you want revenge on someone who never actually purposely determined to deliberately hurt you?

Why would you want some kind of harm to come to someone who simply decided on a different course, and went a different way?

 

Because that's what you're asking about, really, isn't it?

 

You're still banging on about your 17-year-old ex.

 

A boy.

An immature, developing boy, who's just doing what boys of his age do.

 

Honestly.... I truly hoped you were more mature about this, but it looks as if I may be wrong.

 

Or am I wrong about your post?

Are these questions completely unrelated and general?

 

Read the Book of Psalms. Nearly the entire book questions God about why he seems to remain "silent" and "hide his face". David was being persecuted, falsely accused, and plotted against. It seemed as if God didn't care and just the let wicked have a field day.

 

So, on that account, the Bible would agree with you. However, if you have a complete understanding of the Bible, you realize that the wicked prosper (yes prosper) but it's only for a season. These seasons can be a day, a month, a year, a decade, perhaps even a lifetime. It may go on a LONG time. But make no mistake that it DOES come to an end. God is just. A man reaps what he sows. The wicked are judged eventually. Unfortunately God thinks differently than us and lets it go on longer than we'd like. But let me ask you this: what if God had cut you down INSTANTLY the moment you committed one of the bigger sins in your life? Hmm? You see where this leads?

 

The best parable, in my opinion, on this matter was told by Jesus. I strongly suggest you read it if you haven't already:

 

The Parable of the Weeds (Matthew 13)

 

24 Jesus told them another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. 25 But while everyone was sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away. 26 When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared.

 

27 “The owner’s servants came to him and said, ‘Sir, didn’t you sow good seed in your field? Where then did the weeds come from?’

 

28 “‘An enemy did this,’ he replied.

“The servants asked him, ‘Do you want us to go and pull them up?’

 

29 “‘No,’ he answered, ‘because while you are pulling the weeds, you may uproot the wheat with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’”

[TaraMaiden]

Oh, so you have might well have to wait until you die to see God make his judgements?

 

That's useful....

 

Perhaps you should write to Obama and Bush, and tell them they shouldn't have slammed Bin Laden and Saddam Hussein, but left them to God to deal with....

 

That applies to us all then... Those who wrong us, we should not judge, criticise or condemn, because we should just be patient. God will deal with them.

in the meantime we'll just carry on regardless....

 

I suspect I'm not the only one to NOT buy this.....

 

(Oh, and, of course I've read it - I was spoon-fed this stuff from when I was born. Suffice to say this kind of dogma was one of the many things that caused me to move away from Catholicism/Christianity, so easily.

Because it doesn't. Make. any. sense.)

Edited March 24, 2013 by TaraMaiden

[M30USA]

Oh, so you have might well have to wait until you die to see God make his judgements?

 

That's useful....

 

Maybe.

 

You have every right to think the way you want. And so does God. If there's one clear message from the Bible it's that God does not think like us.

 

Are you born again by the Holy Spirit? If not, and if you eventually choose to, you will thank god endlessly for his patience.

Edited March 24, 2013 by M30USA

[TaraMaiden]

I'm not about to screw this thread completely off-topic by having a theological argument with you about how 'God thinks'.

 

If you'd like to start another thread, I'd be happy to engage.

I've said my piece, and that's that.