When There Has Not Been True Closure

[lilmisscantbewrong]

Okay this is a question really for men in an affair (or maybe women too?)

 

If you truly do not want the OW ever contacting you again do you say:

 

1). I am going to work on my marriage so it is over between you and I and please don't ever contact me again - stay away from me and my family.

 

 

The last words that were said to me by my xMM was "I love you" then total silence. Nothing.

 

I must also say that my husband had an affair and his ended more quietly than mine, mine was very public. I discovered his (was an employee) and I said she had to go and allowed her to bow out gracefully over two months because he has a prominent business and I didn't want him to be harmed the way I was when I was exposed.

 

So because of this, she drops by every now and then and I just discovered that she called him and then stopped by while i was on a trip. He said he picked up the phone and she was there and at first it was that he got off the phone quickly and then he said it was a 3 minute conversation - then she showed up the next day.

 

My contention is she still believes there is hope and he has never really told her its over or maybe because there was never a true d- day (her husband still doesn't know) she thinks she can get away with it and he has never told her to truly stay away.

 

Anyway - long explanation to ask a simple question, I know - but any insight would be appreciated.

[Silver_Lining]

Well for what it is worth in my opinion there are two things going on here:

 

1. You are unsure of your feelings and how to proceed with your xMM

 

and

 

2. You are more than likely looking for an excuse to leave your husband based on his actions in possible hopes of re-kindling your xMM

 

Well, I can almost assure you that if your xMM left the situation with those words only that he has got feelings for you still in a big way. Probably unsure and conflicted himself on where to go from here with his life. Yet more than likely not the end all be all of the relation you once shared and had.

 

Bigger question is what do you want? Divided emotions and heart will neither carry the full weight of either relation. Hard choices ahead! gl

[lilmisscantbewrong]

I should say the silence has lasted 3 years - but never the words "don't ever contact me again - stay away -etc". I just wondered whether the silence is the same thing or if he truly wanted me to stay away he would have said so.

[secretlady76]

I should say the silence has lasted 3 years - but never the words "don't ever contact me again - stay away -etc". I just wondered whether the silence is the same thing or if he truly wanted me to stay away he would have said so.

 

He didn't say the words because he didn't want to hurt your feelings and also, at the time he was probably trying to keep his options open.

 

There is real power in silence. I think you can safely say that he has moved on and you should too. If he wanted to get back in touch he would have done so. I mean, if a friend or family member didn't contact you for 3 years you would take the hint.

[stevie_23]

I should say the silence has lasted 3 years - but never the words "don't ever contact me again - stay away -etc". I just wondered whether the silence is the same thing or if he truly wanted me to stay away he would have said so.

 

No. It doesn't mean anything. My ex-MM told me finally, 10 days after leaving me suddenly with no explanation, that he couldn't live 2 lives anymore and that I was his only true wife and that he would love me forever...he never said don't contact me again, never said leave me alone, never said he had to commit to his wife or anything...

 

But it's been almost 4 months and it IS over.

 

You may be surprised at how many men just don't see the need for a formal goodbye so the woman knows it's really and truly OVER.

 

I heard of one woman on another forum I used to be on occasionally, and her ex-MM's last words to her were "Hang on sweetie, I'll come back for you" (after a D-day)...and 18 months later he still hadn't been heard from. So...yep.

[whichwayisup]

Maybe it's time to tell her husband? And talk to your H. Seems he may not be over her or the A but is telling you it is over.

 

Time to talk to him, find out what is going on.

[stevie_23]

There is real power in silence.

 

VERY true in my case too. If he wanted to be with you or talk to you, or felt he COULD talk to you and be with you somehow, he would. Simple as that.

[thefooloftheyear]

To answer your question..(I am a guy).

 

Unless he was divorced and ready to have a real relationship with you, what good can come out of calling you? You will be in a lot of pain over it and so would he.

 

If there is truly no hope, then the best thing you can do is try to move on. Being "friends" just doesnt do it for people who are romantically connected and still have those feelings.

 

I dont think anyone WANTS to say something to the effect of "never call me again". Its a hard message and its likely human nature to want to leave the door open, even if its just a crack.

 

TFOY

[stevie_23]

To answer your question..(I am a guy).

 

Unless he was divorced and ready to have a real relationship with you, what good can come out of calling you? You will be in a lot of pain over it and so would he.

 

If there is truly no hope, then the best thing you can do is try to move on. Being "friends" just doesnt do it for people who are romantically connected and still have those feelings.

 

I dont think anyone WANTS to say something to the effect of "never call me again". Its a hard message and its likely human nature to want to leave the door open, even if its just a crack.

 

TFOY

 

I completely agree with all of this.

 

My ex I notice still has me as a friend on his music discussion forum. It's been almost 4 months and I'm still his "friend" but we've spoken not a single word in all that time. So...that door, right now anyway, is still open a tiny crack.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

I completely agree with all of this.

 

My ex I notice still has me as a friend on his music discussion forum. It's been almost 4 months and I'm still his "friend" but we've spoken not a single word in all that time. So...that door, right now anyway, is still open a tiny crack.

 

That is absolutely a crack. Here is one weird thing that happened over a year after no contact began. One of our favorite drinks was a red stripe and in one of the last conversations we had he said he didn't know when or where we would have a red stripe together again.

 

Flash forward over a year to a lake side eatery and my daughter and I walk in and he is there with his whole family (wife, parents, siblings,etc). My daughter saw them right away - I did not but then I saw him - not wanting to be driven out we took a seat about 30 feet away and ordered our food and listened to the music. His actions were that of a little boy - he was very nervous.

 

I could tell he was trying to angle himself to see me. Anyway - he was drinking corona but right before I paid the bill I notice he was drinking a red stripe. My daughter asked what that mean. I said " I think it means he still cares". So I ordered a red stripe and there we had our red stripe 30 feet apart - no talking.

 

But I have not seen him since other than to pass him in a ca and he generally doesn't wave at all.

 

I am also on a music forum I know he is on and he even created a different user name and started posting but because of he gear listed i knew it was him. But he hasn't posted now for over a year and even the new user name is really tight - like you couldn't pm him if you wanted to.

 

Anyway....

[lilmisscantbewrong]

Maybe it's time to tell her husband? And talk to your H. Seems he may not be over her or the A but is telling you it is over.

 

Time to talk to him, find out what is going on.

 

You are telling me to talk to the wife's husband? I have thought about this many times (and on other militant board they say exposé, exposé, exposé) - but I need to handle this wisely. My husband has a very prominent business, she was his employee - I think enough time has passed but I'm concerned about retaliation - like a sexual harassment lawsuit even though that was not the case at all (I saw their texts). But once her husband finds out that is possible - but it's been over a year since she left the job so I am thinking maybe statute of limitations is up.

Edited March 31, 2013 by lilmisscantbewrong

[thefooloftheyear]

That is absolutely a crack. Here is one weird thing that happened over a year after no contact began. One of our favorite drinks was a red stripe and in one of the last conversations we had he said he didn't know when or where we would have a red stripe together again.

 

Flash forward over a year to a lake side eatery and my daughter and I walk in and he is there with his whole family (wife, parents, siblings,etc). My daughter saw them right away - I did not but then I saw him - not wanting to be driven out we took a seat about 30 feet away and ordered our food and listened to the music. His actions were that of a little boy - he was very nervous.

 

I could tell he was trying to angle himself to see me. Anyway - he was drinking corona but right before I paid the bill I notice he was drinking a red stripe. My daughter asked what that mean. I said " I think it means he still cares". So I ordered a red stripe and there we had our red stripe 30 feet apart - no talking.

 

But I have not seen him since other than to pass him in a ca and he generally doesn't wave at all.

 

I am also on a music forum I know he is on and he even created a different user name and started posting but because of he gear listed i knew it was him. But he hasn't posted now for over a year and even the new user name is really tight - like you couldn't pm him if you wanted to.

 

Anyway....

 

Unfortunately though, for those who are suffering, HOPE only serves to torture those who need to move on. It allows for a constant rumination of thoughts that swirl through the head..Its horrible. frankly!

 

TFOY

[Goodbye]

My MM seems to need to leave the door open a crack, depriving me of needed closure. Two days ago I told him HE needed to choose and he needed to break up with me, as I knew he wouldn't choose me over the comfortable situation he has with his wife and son. We ended things on the phone and then he sends me a b.s. email saying "you forced me to choose, and I choose you and I will come for you when I am out of my very difficult situation." Right. His situation isn't anymore difficult than anyone else's. He isn't coming for me, he is settling back down on the homefront but wants to alleviate his own guilt, and wants to have the satisfaction of knowing that maybe I'm still out here holding out hope and thinking of him....

[lilmisscantbewrong]

My MM seems to need to leave the door open a crack, depriving me of needed closure. Two days ago I told him HE needed to choose and he needed to break up with me, as I knew he wouldn't choose me over the comfortable situation he has with his wife and son. We ended things on the phone and then he sends me a b.s. email saying "you forced me to choose, and I choose you and I will come for you when I am out of my very difficult situation." Right. His situation isn't anymore difficult than anyone else's. He isn't coming for me, he is settling back down on the homefront but wants to alleviate his own guilt, and wants to have the satisfaction of knowing that maybe I'm still out here holding out hope and thinking of him....

 

Yeah my XMM said he wanted to wait until his youngest was out of diapers - well I am assuming the child has been potty trained for six months probably and he's not here....

[lilmisscantbewrong]

I am a fool I suppose - believing in something that cannot be.

 

It was just a question - I didn't know how many others had had honesty and been told - not just gone silent.

 

I am much stronger, don't get me wrong, I just felt safer asking the question here, that's all.

[thefooloftheyear]

I am a fool I suppose - believing in something that cannot be.

 

It was just a question - I didn't know how many others had had honesty and been told - not just gone silent.

 

I am much stronger, don't get me wrong, I just felt safer asking the question here, that's all.

 

Nah...

 

Youre not a fool...Love hurts. Its easy to say to someone to "just move on" , but when you really cared then its very hard...

 

Hang in there...I wish you well.

 

TFOY

[ThatJustHappened]

I don't understand what the brand of beer he's drinking has to do with you..

[lilmisscantbewrong]

I don't understand what the brand of beer he's drinking has to do with you..

 

Red Stripe was one of our "drinks". It was signature for us when we would go out. One of the last conversations we had he said "we will drink a red stripe together again - I don't know when or where - but we will"

 

That day I sawhim he was drinking corona - he switched to red stripe.

 

I took it as a sign and ordered red stripe too.

 

In my mind we had that red stripe together 30 feet away and I don't think his wife had a clue.

 

Maybe I'm stupid, but it appeared like that to me.

[ThatJustHappened]

His poor wife.

[Owl]

Absolute silence and NC for three years is the most powerful closure there is.

 

 

I think people misinterpret closure. For them closure is hope and more contact. Closure becomes more external validation.

 

 

Absolute NC and silence is closure.

 

I agree with this.

 

His three years of silence are all the answer you need. Unmistakable.

 

Looking for signs or clues in those last words he used are just wasted actions and ways to keep yourself from healing and moving on...as we always hear here...his actions speak louder than his words. Three years of silence says a lot.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

This is all good and helpful - thank you for your responses.

 

As far as the red strip event, that was close to two years ago now and oddly enough it was a little bit comforting. But there are days now that I wish I hadn't ordered one.

 

We are trying to recover and it has not been an easy road. His "revenge" affair, or whatever you want to call it has not helped anything at all. In fact, it set us way back, but the last year has been pretty good.

 

It was the revelation of the fact that there has been contact in the past 9 months at least and that she called him recently that has now raised all kinds of questions. That is actually what drove me to find this forum and I'm grateful - wish I had found it 3 years ago.

 

I am planning to address it this weekend as we will have some time then to talk.

 

It's been a journey, that's for sure.

Edited April 1, 2013 by lilmisscantbewrong

[georgia girl]

I am so sorry that you are still hurting, but I hope you can begin to let go so you can be happy again. Genuinely honestly, I think you're reading way too much into that Red Stripe story. He had a particular beer and you chose to copy him. It wasn't that he acknowledged you in any way and he also didn't follow your lead - you followed his.

 

Further, after three years of no contact, you must realize that he has moved on. He may still have very fond memories of your time and of you as someone he once loved, but if he isn't motivated to reach out to you, that love has now faded.

 

My honest opinion is that thing are going well with your husband but when you realized that this woman was hanging around again, you consciously or unconsciously looked around for another source for your affection to land and focused in on him. I don't think what you think you feel for him is really real any longer. He was a source of comfort in a potentially rocky situation for you.

 

Focus on your life. Forget him. That ship sailed three years ago.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

I am so sorry that you are still hurting, but I hope you can begin to let go so you can be happy again. Genuinely honestly, I think you're reading way too much into that Red Stripe story. He had a particular beer and you chose to copy him. It wasn't that he acknowledged you in any way and he also didn't follow your lead - you followed his.

 

Further, after three years of no contact, you must realize that he has moved on. He may still have very fond memories of your time and of you as someone he once loved, but if he isn't motivated to reach out to you, that love has now faded.

 

My honest opinion is that thing are going well with your husband but when you realized that this woman was hanging around again, you consciously or unconsciously looked around for another source for your affection to land and focused in on him. I don't think what you think you feel for him is really real any longer. He was a source of comfort in a potentially rocky situation for you.

 

Focus on your life. Forget him. That ship sailed three years ago.

 

You may be right, but generally if I start drinking one brand of beer, I don't switch midstream and if this had not been a conversation we had had previously, I wouldn't have thought much about it.

 

The situation with my husband and his xOW is much more recent. His affair came AFTER mine, so it's more fresh and no contact was demanded in my case and because of my husband's business and his fear of reputation being damaged, etc., he has not gone 100% no contact. So this woman just shows up whenever she wants.

 

This will be addressed this weekend, however.

[White Flower]

He didn't say the words because he was either a coward or he wanted to leave the door open or both. Yet, three years is a very long time. You must have loved him to still be thinking of him all this time later.

 

If you ask your H to say similar words to his xOW he would only be saying them for you and not necessarily because he meant any of it. My xMM's BW used to routinely have him call me and I would just laugh because firstly, I knew she put a gun to his head, and secondly, I knew he'd be back in a week. What an immature game! And when I prodded him to ask his IC what he thought of the scenario he too thought it was very immature to call me and try to bully me when her H really wasn't on her side anyway. The last few times there was a Dday BW just took it, except for the time she texted me from her WH's cell. She didn't like my response very much as I suppose it was too dignified for her.

[underwater2010]

I should say the silence has lasted 3 years - but never the words "don't ever contact me again - stay away -etc". I just wondered whether the silence is the same thing or if he truly wanted me to stay away he would have said so.

It is the same thing. If he wanted contact with you...he would have called/emailed/texted to let you know what was going on. Do yourself a huge favor and let it go. I mean that from the bottom of my heart. Questioning whether or not you have closer because there has been no contact for 3 yrs will drive you crazy.