"Homewrecker" - lazy terminology?

[Got it]

Okay, outside of a typical affair overlapping, how does one's emotional health dictate/fall in line with the State's requirements.

 

There are many people who are done by the time they get around to divorcing, why does not having the paperwork mean they can't/shouldn't date? This, I would think, would especially be the case if NC passes their two year waiting period. That is an extremely long time to be in limbo and not moving on with your life just because the State decides you have to sit it out for that long.

 

There are many States that do not require a separation period so those individuals can be done and divorced in a few months. Because they are now officially divorced does that mean they are ready?

 

I would think it is a case by case basis on emotional readiness.

[Silly_Girl]

Please list other scenarios where a third party impacts a marriage like infidelity does.

 

I will be more than happy to apportion blame in those scenarios, too.

 

 

I'm sure you would! :laugh:

[SoleMate]

"Homewrecker", to me:

 

* smacks of Ann Landers circa 1964

* makes sense if used to designate an OW who was the primary aggressor and driver of the affair

* makes no sense whatsoever if used to designate a naive and reluctant OW who was aggressively groomed, wooed, snowed and manipulated by the MM

* makes perfect sense for any cheating MM (except the victim of an aggressive instigatory OW) but is NEVER used that way except on LS

[Decorative]

I'm sure you would! :laugh:

 

I will be waiting for the list.

 

Thanks again!

[KathyM]

Or transformed. Perhaps "hometransformer" would be a more appropriate term. The MP transitions into a new relationship and the kids now have two homes to go to instead of one. It's what's happening right now in my MM's life.

Transformed would not be an accurate term, because that implies that the marital home and family unit are still intact, when in fact, they are broken apart/dissolved into pieces. One home is broken and a new home with a new wife/partner is created with the children going back and forth between the two homes.

[Decorative]

Okay, outside of a typical affair overlapping, how does one's emotional health dictate/fall in line with the State's requirements.

 

There are many people who are done by the time they get around to divorcing, why does not having the paperwork mean they can't/shouldn't date? This, I would think, would especially be the case if NC passes their two year waiting period. That is an extremely long time to be in limbo and not moving on with your life just because the State decides you have to sit it out for that long.

 

There are many States that do not require a separation period so those individuals can be done and divorced in a few months. Because they are now officially divorced does that mean they are ready?

 

I would think it is a case by case basis on emotional readiness.

 

Probably a case by case basis makes sense.

 

Except I guess the way I see it? As I have no need to be in a relationship. I choose to be in one- but I am pretty awesome all by myself. So if the laws of my state require a long space between filing and finalization- I have no problem abiding by those rules. They make sense to me- even those with periods as long as two years.

 

I am a fan of having proper endings and healing before moving forward- especially in a situation that involves other people. I would feel horrible catching someone else in my end of marriage crap and process. Especially because I would know they would not be the recipient of my proper attention and devotion. Or at least- they should not be.

 

All things in good time.

[Decorative]

Why is jumping into another relationship the only thing that seems to be a way of moving on with your life???? I don't think anyone has ever died from not being able to be in another relationship for a whole year. Are people really that needy that if they can't get into another relationship for a year then their entire lives are in limbo???

 

The answer to this is yes. There are people out there that are that needy.

 

I kinda want to hug them and tell them they really will be okay on their own.

[Silly_Girl]

Why is jumping into another relationship the only thing that seems to be a way of moving on with your life???? I don't think anyone has ever died from not being able to be in another relationship for a whole year. Are people really that needy that if they can't get into another relationship for a year then their entire lives are in limbo???

 

My finances still aren't split from a relationship that ended early '09. If we were married it would have taken even longer. I'd have missed out on meeting my wonderful fiancé. Black and white thinking doesn't work for all of us, which is just as well as the world would be weird if we all acted the same!

[KathyM]

Any affair damages/compromises a marriage, regardless of intent to do so. Both affair partners are damaging the marriage by having the affair, therefore both are responsible for damaging/destroying the home. An affair is like a bomb being dropped on a home. It destroys trust, which is the foundation of the marriage. It's the ultimate betrayal of the spouse, to which the vast majority of marriages cannot survive. Most marriages go through rough times, but can recover with effort by the spouses, but when you engage in an affair during those rough times, you in essence pull the trigger on the marriage, thereby destroying it.

 

Most men/women don't enter into affairs with the intent of divorcing. They are looking to get some needs met (sexual, validation, attention, affection) outside of the marriage while intending to keep the marriage intact. But the presence of the affair takes away/detracts from the emotional bond between the married partners, and of course, when the affair is discovered, the trust is broken and is very difficult to restore. Most people do not want to try to restore their marriage after such a betrayal. Affairs themselves, regardless of intent, are destructive to a marriage, and usually result in its demise.

[eleanorrigby]

It's like that saying, "the best way to get over the old guy is to get under a new one"

 

I always thought it was funny when I heard it, but never really agreed with it.

[ComingInHot]

LFH, " While I actually agree with you that people shouldn't go from one relationship to another, legally separated is as good as divorced for dating purposes in most people's minds."

 

But, they are Married?! I've read even here that married couples reconcile at the eleventh/twelfth hour.

 

To me separated is Not single. It's Married.

[eleanorrigby]

I don't understand how knowing this......would lead one to believe this...I mean, if people can go through all the formalities and trouble of a divorce, then later on remarry, why is it so far fetched for a couple to call off the divorce at the last minute? I highly doubt the remarried couple got married so they could get "their stuff" back.

 

I really dislike the implication that most are married just for "stuff".

What about those that don't have much stuff? What are they staying for, reconciling and/or actually remarrying for? Crap from the Fingerhut catalog? 15 year old pots and pans? Five year old computers?

[Henni]

Please list other scenarios where a third party impacts a marriage like infidelity does.

 

I will be more than happy to apportion blame in those scenarios, too.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

If a marriage is being wrecked by alcohol, rather than a new relationship, then the person providing the alcohol or opportunity to drink is the 'homewrecker' by your logic. Likewise, if the marriage is being wrecked by gambling, it's the bookie who's the homewrecker, if it's being wrecked by work addiction, it's the work that's the homewrecker, etc.

 

That's the same logic that's being applied to OW / OM as homewreckers.

[Henni]

Yes it is how I view it, which is all that matters in my life. I also don't believe that most people think it is okay to start a new relationship before ending a current one.

 

I also wouldn't consider that I must be in another relationship to prove that I have moved on. I think that is the mindset of people who have affairs. That they must have another relationship to immediately be in before they even begin to end the one they are currently in.

 

This is really odd to me. So, for all those who consider the relationship isn't over until the divorce is through, does that mean that if your husband / wife has left you, says its over, doesn't want the marriage, lives somewhere else, has a life you are not involved in, you would still insist that you are in a relationship with them? As in, if someone asked, are you single? You would say, no i'm in a relationship? I would feel really pathetic saying that in such circumstances.

[Henni]

No, you said most. "legally separated is as good as divorced for dating purposes in most people's minds." I also don't think most people cheat.

 

I disagree that having someone in your life is in any way proof of moving on. I'm sure for some people moving on may be something they wish for someday. I don't think people who decide they wish to not be in another relationship or who just never meet anyone again, that doesn't mean they have not moved on.

 

I think once again that is an affair mindset. That OMG I have to be in a relationship with someone, even if that someone isn't really available. The people who use affairs as an exit or a back up plan if they decide at some point to leave their marriage. They have the mindset that they can't possibly leave a relationship without having another one waiting.

 

There is a lot of naivity and stereotyping of OW / OM going on here. I was single for a few years before my current A. I have no need whatsoever to be with a man, I am have been very happy on my own. I simply fell for a friend who was in a horrible, dead and aggressive marriage, and the emotional bond and possibilities for a happier relationship probably sped up the divorce proceedings, but they have not slept in the same place for years and both parties want to divorce. Their home has been 'wrecked' for years. I don't feel or believe that I have done anything to make it any more wrecked.

[Henni]

The answer to this is yes. There are people out there that are that needy.

 

I kinda want to hug them and tell them they really will be okay on their own.

 

I feel that way about people who stay in bad marriages because they are afraid to be on their own too. There's lots of them.

[Mme. Chaucer]

Or transformed. Perhaps "hometransformer" would be a more appropriate term. The MP transitions into a new relationship and the kids now have two homes to go to instead of one. It's what's happening right now in my MM's life.

 

What about the wife? What's she transitioning into? Since it was her home, in which she was in full partnership with her husband, that was about to undergo a big transformation, wouldn't it have been appropriate for her to play a seminal role in an transformations her home was to undergo?

 

Your using the circumstances of the children to help you paint a rosy picture is alarming and a huge example of real grasping at straws for rationalization.

 

Children of divorce don't think "oh goody I have 2 homes." I'm sure the parent, to assuage their own guilt, tries to present it that way to the kids, but NO. You MUST believe in your heart that kids do NOT see it as a benefit when their parents break up and they need to be shuttled between homes so the parents can do what they want or need to do. The kids are told they have 2 homes, but really, they have no home. They have mom's house, and dad's house.

 

I am not vilifying divorce, though I think it's sad and awful that it happens so much. I agree that if a marriage has to end it has to end, and the kids, unfortunately, have to lose their world to a great extent.

 

But when there's an affair at the root of it and the "other woman" is proudly boasting about how the kids of the divorce are benefitting by receiving 2 homes … rationalizing and justifying to a huge extent.

 

I notice that the handful of you who seem to be actually, actively pro-affair - by that I mean that you think that affairs are positive and good in general, not just in your case, are the ONLY ones who "like" each others posts. Don't you think that's kind of odd? Your tiny group "likes" that the kids get 2 homes in the divorce, and I'd put money on almost nobody else in the world, affair having or not, feeling that way.

 

There are many many people involved in affairs who don't have a mission to elevate the whole concept of affairs. How did this little cadre develop? Is it yet another strange outcome of the Internets?

[Henni]

I would feel really pathetic having an urgent need to jump right into another R because I can't be happy unless I can focus on someone else.

 

So would I....relevance?

[Henni]

What about the wife? What's she transitioning into? Since it was her home, in which she was in full partnership with her husband, that was about to undergo a big transformation, wouldn't it have been appropriate for her to play a seminal role in an transformations her home was to undergo?

 

Your using the circumstances of the children to help you paint a rosy picture is alarming and a huge example of real grasping at straws for rationalization.

 

Children of divorce don't think "oh goody I have 2 homes." I'm sure the parent, to assuage their own guilt, tries to present it that way to the kids, but NO. You MUST believe in your heart that kids do NOT see it as a benefit when their parents break up and they need to be shuttled between homes so the parents can do what they want or need to do. The kids are told they have 2 homes, but really, they have no home. They have mom's house, and dad's house.

 

I am not vilifying divorce, though I think it's sad and awful that it happens so much. I agree that if a marriage has to end it has to end, and the kids, unfortunately, have to lose their world to a great extent.

 

But when there's an affair at the root of it and the "other woman" is proudly boasting about how the kids of the divorce are benefitting by receiving 2 homes … rationalizing and justifying to a huge extent.

 

I notice that the handful of you who seem to be actually, actively pro-affair - by that I mean that you think that affairs are positive and good in general, not just in your case, are the ONLY ones who "like" each others posts. Don't you think that's kind of odd? Your tiny group "likes" that the kids get 2 homes in the divorce, and I'd put money on almost nobody else in the world, affair having or not, feeling that way.

 

There are many many people involved in affairs who don't have a mission to elevate the whole concept of affairs. How did this little cadre develop? Is it yet another strange outcome of the Internets?

 

I have liked people's posts and I am not unilaterally pro-affair, at all. I think it's better if there isn't an affair, but I am first and foremost pro happiness and pro personal development, and I am pro moving on from failed or unhealthy relationships in a respectful way, and I am pro divorce rather than staying in a sad marriage.

[Mme. Chaucer]

your husband / wife has left you, says its over, doesn't want the marriage, lives somewhere else, has a life you are not involved in,

 

If I were a woman who was involved in a relationship with such a man, if I really believe him (lots of guys say that's their situation when they want extramarital flings, you know - it is legend) I really doubt I would seek support on the Internet from a group of women who love to identify themselves as OTHER WOMEN, who brag about being in affairs to an amazing extent, and who devote a whole lot of energy to the state of their affair partner's marriage.

 

I would just think I was in a relationship that had some potentially concerning elements and I'd be on guard. But I would not be thinking "I'm in an affair! I'm the OTHER WOMAN! Go, me" That stuff would not even be on my radar.

 

you would still insist that you are in a relationship with them? As in, if someone asked, are you single? You would say, no i'm in a relationship? I would feel really pathetic saying that in such circumstances.

 

To get to your actual question, no, under those circumstances I would not. I would be trying to move on. And if he were in a relationship, I might be very sad, but I would not blame that woman as a "homewrecker."

 

UNLESS HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH HER PRECEDED HIS ABANDONMENT OF ME AND OUR HOME LIFE. Then, back to my original stance. She's a nasty homewrecker, and he's even worse because he betrayed what we'd created together.

[Henni]

I would call those examples...........enablers.

 

So.......I would think that a ow/om by that logic would be an enabler to the mm/mw who is the main homewrecker.

 

As a fow, I acknowledge that I was an enabler. Do you acknowledge that?

 

I acknowledge that in that case where there is a marriage, there is a relationship, sex, talking, stuff like that, and one partner cheats with another who knows there is a relationship and not some skeletal wreck or marriage in name only, then yes, they are an enabler. But since my situation is one of marriage in name only, no sex, no sharing the same place, no talking, and only nasty wrangling for money, then no, I don't feel like i'm enabling home wrecking. I think the wrecking was done over the past 10 years since they stopped the sex and talking and planning. Her reaction to 'ok, you've wanted this for years, i've been trying to find a way for the kids but now i see it's not happening and i want a divorce' was 'good - i don't want to grow old with you'. So, I don't acknowledge that I am an enabler of homewrecking, no. I do acknowledge that that might sometimes be the case, though.

[Mme. Chaucer]

your husband / wife has left you, says its over, doesn't want the marriage, lives somewhere else, has a life you are not involved in,

 

If I were a woman who was involved in a relationship with such a man, if I really believe him (lots of guys say that's their situation when they want extramarital flings, you know - it is legend) I really doubt I would seek support on the Internet from a group of women who love to identify themselves as OTHER WOMEN, who brag about being in affairs to an amazing extent, and who devote a whole lot of energy to the state of their affair partner's marriage.

 

I would just think I was in a relationship that had some potentially concerning elements and I'd be on guard. But I would not be thinking "I'm in an affair! I'm the OTHER WOMAN! Go, me" That stuff would not even be on my radar.

 

 

 

To get to your actual question, no, under those circumstances I would not. I would be trying to move on. And if he were in a relationship, I might be very sad, but I would not blame that woman as a "homewrecker." …..

 

UNLESS HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH HER PRECEDED HIS ABANDONMENT OF ME AND OUR HOME LIFE. Then, back to my original stance. She's a nasty homewrecker, and he's even worse because he betrayed what we'd created together.

[Henni]

your husband / wife has left you, says its over, doesn't want the marriage, lives somewhere else, has a life you are not involved in,

 

If I were a woman who was involved in a relationship with such a man, if I really believe him (lots of guys say that's their situation when they want extramarital flings, you know - it is legend) I really doubt I would seek support on the Internet from a group of women who love to identify themselves as OTHER WOMEN, who brag about being in affairs to an amazing extent, and who devote a whole lot of energy to the state of their affair partner's marriage.

 

I would just think I was in a relationship that had some potentially concerning elements and I'd be on guard. But I would not be thinking "I'm in an affair! I'm the OTHER WOMAN! Go, me" That stuff would not even be on my radar.

 

 

 

To get to your actual question, no, under those circumstances I would not. I would be trying to move on. And if he were in a relationship, I might be very sad, but I would not blame that woman as a "homewrecker."

 

UNLESS HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH HER PRECEDED HIS ABANDONMENT OF ME AND OUR HOME LIFE. Then, back to my original stance. She's a nasty homewrecker, and he's even worse because he betrayed what we'd created together.

 

You really seem to have a screwed up perception of what OM / OW here come for. Who is saying 'I'm in an affair! Yaye me!' That's ridiculous - just look at the many stories. It's more often 'I'm in an affair - oh **** - how did this happen - I can't think straight - I need to talk to someone anonymously about this to get my head around it.'

[Mme. Chaucer]

and I am pro moving on from failed or unhealthy relationships in a respectful way, and I am pro divorce rather than staying in a sad marriage.

 

Me too.

 

But … serious question: How can "moving on in a respectful way" ever include lying, cheating, sharing personal details of the marriage or even misrepresenting the marriage to an outsider? Cutting oneself off from their spouse? That all is so, so profoundly disrespectful, especially in the environment of a monogamous relationship where vows were made.

 

How can you manage to spin it into "respectful"?

[Henni]

Me too.

 

But … serious question: How can "moving on in a respectful way" ever include lying, cheating, sharing personal details of the marriage or even misrepresenting the marriage to an outsider? Cutting oneself off from their spouse? That all is so, so profoundly disrespectful, especially in the environment of a monogamous relationship where vows were made.

 

How can you manage to spin it into "respectful"?

 

Well, the personal details of the marriage, the heartache, the overwhelming sense of failure, the tears recounting the damage witnessed by his children, and the sense of hopelessness, were all shared before any affair in the context of talking to a friend. A friend is an outsider, it's true, but I doubt many people would be so harsh as to consider it necessary for a person experiencing total marriage breakdown not to talk to a friend.

 

There is not much lying, since there is very little communication with the spouse, and brief conversations about finanaces, the house, the kids school holidays, have been the sum total of their communication for many years.

 

There is cheating though, since the information hasn't been volunteered. I feel bad about that. He doesn't feel any guilt. He doesn't feel any 'marriage', hence the divorce. Respectful means not putting it in people's faces, she is concerned that her public image will be intact.