Pastor Rick Warren's Son Committed Suicide

[TheFinalWord]

 

Please keep the Warren family in your prayers!

 

Saddleback Church Says Rick Warren?s Son Has Committed Suicide « CBS Los Angeles

Edited April 6, 2013 by TheFinalWord

[OpenBook]

I just saw this in the news. Horrible!!! And so hard to believe. Pastor Warren seems like a genuinely nice person, religion aside. Taking yourself out when you have a Dad like that?? I don't understand.

 

They said he struggled with "mental illness." What does that mean exactly? Chemical imbalance? Brain damage? Some tragic event that warped him forever?

 

I also read that suicide is the #2 cause of death between young people age 25-34.

 

Horrible!!!!!

[pureinheart]

I just saw this in the news. Horrible!!! And so hard to believe. Pastor Warren seems like a genuinely nice person, religion aside. Taking yourself out when you have a Dad like that?? I don't understand.

 

They said he struggled with "mental illness." What does that mean exactly? Chemical imbalance? Brain damage? Some tragic event that warped him forever?

 

I also read that suicide is the #2 cause of death between young people age 25-34.

 

Horrible!!!!!

 

Possibly all of the above:( ? Wow...

 

My condolences to the family and friends and many prayers:(:(:(

[pie2]

How sad. Even more sad is the cruel irony of the situation.

 

What do you think about this man's eternal salvation?

[somedude81]

How sad. Even more sad is the cruel irony of the situation.

 

What do you think about this man's eternal salvation?

Hopefully God isn't so cruel to give somebody a mental illness that they hate their life on Earth and then curse them to damnation when they finally end it themselves.

[pie2]

Hopefully God isn't so cruel to give somebody a mental illness that they hate their life on Earth and then curse them to damnation when they finally end it themselves.

 

God knows our hearts, our pains and our struggles. I think God can see though a momentary lack of faith, and knows if a person truly loves Him. I absolutely pray that this man will still find glory in heaven.

[somedude81]

God knows our hearts, our pains and our struggles. I think God can see though a momentary lack of faith, and knows if a person truly loves Him. I absolutely pray that this man will still find glory in heaven.

Momentary lack of faith?

 

It sounds like this guy struggled with depression his entire life. Kinda sucks how God wasn't able to heal him.

 

Guess it was God's plan for him to kill himself.

[TheFinalWord]

Hopefully God isn't so cruel to give somebody a mental illness that they hate their life on Earth and then curse them to damnation when they finally end it themselves.

 

I think his son is the best witness...

 

"Dad, I know I'm going to heaven. Why can't I just die and end this pain?"

 

Church: Pastor Rick Warren's son commits suicide

 

If anything good comes from this this tragedy, is that Rick Warren, whether you are Christian or not, has done a lot for charity, especially AIDS/HIV. I pray he will now focus on mental health issues. We need a focus on that issue in this country...big time.

[pie2]

It sounds like this guy struggled with depression his entire life. Kinda sucks how God wasn't able to heal him.

 

It's tragic that, for whatever reason, God wasn't able (permitted) to heal him. Only God and Pastor Warren's son know what it was like to live the life he lived. Whether it be a chemical imbalance or spiritual warfare, there's no doubt that life can be very cruel.

[M30USA]

Gosh, that is awful. None of us are above what happened to him.

[Els]

Very sad to hear. Having been part of the inner circle of my previous church back when I was more into the traditional concept of religion, though, I have to say that this isn't all that uncommon. There is a lot of pressure to maintain a happy, faithful, godly facade for prominent members of the church, and all of that often hides the pain, dysfunction, and suffering beneath. We've had cases of pastors abusing their wives and children, cases of pastors cheating on their wives with members of the congregation, cases of pastors' children feeling so estranged from their parents that they don't want anything to do with them as soon as they can get out. Parents who refuse to allow their children to seek treatment for mental illnesses because they believe that God will cure them. And yes, suicide and depression as a result of all the above. All of that is often shushed up as much as possible until either something happens that causes it to be unable to be kept secret anymore... or forever.

 

All in all, pastors' families seem to be some of the most dysfunctional I've ever seen. I would not be surprised if that contributed to this tragedy, or at least to the son being unable to get help for a genuine mental disorder.

[OpenBook]

I'm wondering the same thing... if there's something about being in a pastor's family that sometimes causes this to happen? I just don't know. There are a couple of things that don't add up for me, at least what's being reported in the media right now:

 

-- One, CNN reports that in Rick Warren's letter to his congregation, he said his son killed himself Friday night after a "fund evening" with his parents. But Huffington Post is reporting it said "a fun evening" with his parents. Is it "fund" or "fun"? And what happened during that evening that pushed him over the edge?

 

-- Two, Warren's letter describes his son suffering from mental illness "since birth." I have a hard time picturing an infant with mental illness? How exactly is that diagnosed in an infant, or even a toddler? Or is that just an expression he used, "since birth"? I don't know, just strikes me as odd.

[TheFinalWord]

Here is the statement Warren released:

 

Subject: Needing your prayers

 

To my dear staff,

 

 

Over the past 33 years we’ve been together through every kind of crisis. Kay and I’ve been privileged to hold your hands as you faced a crisis or loss, stand with you at gravesides, and prayed for you when ill. Today, we need your prayer for us.

 

 

No words can express the anguished grief we feel right now. Our youngest son, Matthew, age 27, and a lifelong member of Saddleback, died today.

You who watched Matthew grow up knew he was an incredibly kind, gentle, and compassionate man. He had a brilliant intellect and a gift for sensing who was most in pain or most uncomfortable in a room. He’d then make a bee-line to that person to engage and encourage them.

 

 

But only those closest knew that he struggled from birth with mental illness, dark holes of depression, and even suicidal thoughts. In spite of America’s best doctors, meds, counselors, and prayers for healing, the torture of mental illness never subsided. Today, after a fun evening together with Kay and me, in a momentary wave of despair at his home, he took his life.

 

 

Kay and I often marveled at his courage to keep moving in spite of relentless pain. I’ll never forget how, many years ago, after another approach had failed to give relief, Matthew said “ Dad, I know I’m going to heaven. Why can’t I just die and end this pain?” but he kept going for another decade.

 

 

Thank you for your love and prayers. We love you back.

Pastor Rick

[KathyM]

He struggled from birth with mental illness. Undoubtedly had a brain chemical imbalance causing his severe depression. Very sad. Depression is often treatable with medication or psychotherapy or a combination of the two, but unfortunately for some, the biological depression is so severe that the person eventually gives up and wants to put an end to his suffering. It sounds like the man was a wonderful son who, unfortunately, was afflicted with a terrible biological illness that he has dealt with his entire life. I'm sure Rick Warren's faith will help him to deal with this. Rick Warren is one of the most inspirational Christian leaders of our time. His book The Purpose Driven Life is a wonderful treasure.

[pie2]

-- Two, Warren's letter describes his son suffering from mental illness "since birth." I have a hard time picturing an infant with mental illness? How exactly is that diagnosed in an infant, or even a toddler? Or is that just an expression he used, "since birth"? I don't know, just strikes me as odd.

 

Yeah, you definitely can't diagnose depression in an infant. But there are many developmental signs to look for that can point to a problem. In general, even in the first days, weeks and months of life, infants should display certain skills like crying appropriately, ability to be soothed by a caregiver, ability to focus on faces etc. etc. And as research grows, specialists are able to recognize more and more subtle signs that a child may have a delay/problem.

 

It's just speculation, but I would guess that the signs the Warrens saw related to their son's ability to bond with his mother (caregiver). IMO though, these situations are more complex than just the child's predisposition to depression.

[BetheButterfly]

Very sad to hear. Having been part of the inner circle of my previous church back when I was more into the traditional concept of religion, though, I have to say that this isn't all that uncommon. There is a lot of pressure to maintain a happy, faithful, godly facade for prominent members of the church, and all of that often hides the pain, dysfunction, and suffering beneath. We've had cases of pastors abusing their wives and children, cases of pastors cheating on their wives with members of the congregation, cases of pastors' children feeling so estranged from their parents that they don't want anything to do with them as soon as they can get out. Parents who refuse to allow their children to seek treatment for mental illnesses because they believe that God will cure them. And yes, suicide and depression as a result of all the above. All of that is often shushed up as much as possible until either something happens that causes it to be unable to be kept secret anymore... or forever.

 

All in all, pastors' families seem to be some of the most dysfunctional I've ever seen. I would not be surprised if that contributed to this tragedy, or at least to the son being unable to get help for a genuine mental disorder.

 

 

It's important for people to remember that pastors and their families are just as human as everyone else. My Dad was a pastor's kid, and yes he and his brother and sister were expected to be on their best behavior at all times when growing up. However, his family was not what he calls dysfunctional. Although not perfect, they all truly loved each other and my Dad and his siblings had a peaceful and fun childhood.

 

Dysfunctional families are found in pretty much all career paths of the parents, I suppose. Pastors and their families just get more attention because they are expected to be role models.

 

It does seem like added pressure can cause young people to commit suicide. In China for example, many of the young people who kill themselves do so it seems because the pressures of life get to them? They are just as important however as the young people in the West who happen to be preacher's kids, and yet their parents possibly are not judged as harshly?

 

"By the time you get done reading this article at least one (and likely more than one) person in China will have killed themselves. Every two minutes a Chinese person takes their own life, and it is resulting in the largest suicide (自杀, zìshā) problem in the world. In fact 287,00 deaths a year are labeled suicide-related deaths, a whopping 3.6% of the annual deaths in all demographics. In China, 22.23 people out of every 100,000 commit suicide.This rate places the country among the countries with the highest suicide rates per capita on the planet (according to the AFP)."

Suicide in China is unlike anywhere else in the world. | The World of Chinese

 

Sadly, suicide is a huge issue for people around the world, no matter the career of the parents. Instead of focusing though on the careers of the parents, it's important to focus on why young people are resorting to killing themselves.

 

We need to encourage people, no matter their parents' career paths, to seek help and to not give up, instead of taking their lives. I really wish that Pastor Rick Warren's son had not given up.

 

Many people think about suicide at least once in their life, but Love many times keeps them the brink and pulls them out of despair. While many who commit suicide have people in their lives who love them, I have heard that those who actually commit suicide do not tend to focus on the love of those who love them, but rather on the pain that drives them over the edge.

 

For anyone who's thinking about suicide, please, please focus on Love and on the positive in life!!! Please get help and please don't give up!!!

[Els]

It's important for people to remember that pastors and their families are just as human as everyone else. My Dad was a pastor's kid, and yes he and his brother and sister were expected to be on their best behavior at all times when growing up. However, his family was not what he calls dysfunctional. Although not perfect, they all truly loved each other and my Dad and his siblings had a peaceful and fun childhood.

 

Dysfunctional families are found in pretty much all career paths of the parents, I suppose. Pastors and their families just get more attention because they are expected to be role models.

 

It does seem like added pressure can cause young people to commit suicide.

 

The bolded was pretty much my point, yep. I agree that the extra attention bit is true, because we do tend to hold pastors to higher standards of familial health, as they are supposed to be the ones teaching everyone else how to keep a happy and healthy home. This does lead to pressure, though, and as you said, inordinate amounts of pressure can be very harmful to youth.

 

I feel that some professions tend to be associated with a greater risk of a dysfunctional family than others. Well-known examples include politicians and celebrities. My personal observation has been that pastors fall into that category as well.

 

In China for example, many of the young people who kill themselves do so it seems because the pressures of life get to them? They are just as important however as the young people in the West who happen to be preacher's kids, and yet their parents possibly are not judged as harshly?

 

"By the time you get done reading this article at least one (and likely more than one) person in China will have killed themselves. Every two minutes a Chinese person takes their own life, and it is resulting in the largest suicide (自杀, zìshā) problem in the world. In fact 287,00 deaths a year are labeled suicide-related deaths, a whopping 3.6% of the annual deaths in all demographics. In China, 22.23 people out of every 100,000 commit suicide.This rate places the country among the countries with the highest suicide rates per capita on the planet (according to the AFP)."

Suicide in China is unlike anywhere else in the world. | The World of Chinese

 

Sadly, suicide is a huge issue for people around the world, no matter the career of the parents. Instead of focusing though on the careers of the parents, it's important to focus on why young people are resorting to killing themselves.

 

Yes, this is very true. I definitely don't think the sole reason for anyone committing suicide is their parents' profession. However, the title of this thread prompted a specific discussion about the son of a pastor committing suicide.

 

We need to encourage people, no matter their parents' career paths, to seek help and to not give up, instead of taking their lives. I really wish that Pastor Rick Warren's son had not given up.

 

Many people think about suicide at least once in their life, but Love many times keeps them the brink and pulls them out of despair. While many who commit suicide have people in their lives who love them, I have heard that those who actually commit suicide do not tend to focus on the love of those who love them, but rather on the pain that drives them over the edge.

 

What I really want to know is, has his family actually sought medical help for his diagnosis or were they withholding out of 'faith'?

 

I could well be wrong and they might very well have helped him acquire medical help for all I know. I am skeptical, however, because many churches seem to preach focusing on God to cure medical illness and encouraging the sufferers not to seek medical help because they shall be saved by faith.

 

There was a young lady in my old church who suffered from delusions - seeing things, losing focus from the real world, hearing things. For over a decade her parents brought her to various pastors and healing sessions. They refused to have her see a psychiatrist because they believed that they should rely on God to heal her from demonic possession. They believed that this demonic possession came about as a 'curse' due to her previous pornography usage.

 

Frankly, I'm pretty sure that she was just suffering from schizophrenia and would have been treated by medicine, if they had only chosen to seek it.

 

For anyone who's thinking about suicide, please, please focus on Love and on the positive in life!!! Please get help and please don't give up!!!

 

Second this, 100%.

[BetheButterfly]

The bolded was pretty much my point, yep. I agree that the extra attention bit is true, because we do tend to hold pastors to higher standards of familial health, as they are supposed to be the ones teaching everyone else how to keep a happy and healthy home. This does lead to pressure, though, and as you said, inordinate amounts of pressure can be very harmful to youth.

 

True.

I feel that some professions tend to be associated with a greater risk of a dysfunctional family than others. Well-known examples include politicians and celebrities. My personal observation has been that pastors fall into that category as well.

Ah ok! I understand now. Good point.

 

 

 

Yes, this is very true. I definitely don't think the sole reason for anyone committing suicide is their parents' profession. However, the title of this thread prompted a specific discussion about the son of a pastor committing suicide.

Understood now; thanks for explaining.

 

 

What I really want to know is, has his family actually sought medical help for his diagnosis or were they withholding out of 'faith'?

Very good question. One of the hardest times in my family was when my sister went to a church where they had this "healing service" and she thought she was miraculously healed of bipolar. While I definitely believe God has the power to heal and does heal many people, she wasn't healed. She still isn't. We continue to pray for her healing, but we also understand that God gave people brains. It's important for people to use their minds to figure out how to medically help those who suffer from a sickness or disorder or tragedy; the medical field is awesome!!! Both my sis and my Dad are on meds to help them, and that's so important for their well-being, as well as for the well-being of their loved ones.

 

In Rick Warren's letter, it does sound like they sought medical help, but I don't know how much. I don't know what mental disorder his son suffered, but thinking about committing suicide is "normal" for people with bipolar who are suffering lows/depression. From what I have learned, daily personal attention greatly helps my sister. She does much better while on her meds and while receiving constant encouragement from her loved ones! My sister has a more severe case than my Dad does.

 

 

 

I could well be wrong and they might very well have helped him acquire medical help for all I know. I am skeptical, however, because many churches seem to preach focusing on God to cure medical illness and encouraging the sufferers not to seek medical help because they shall be saved by faith.

Yeah Again, I believe God can and does heal people, but many times He says no. I personally believe that medical advancements are a great blessing which need to be used and can be a part of the healing process, and healing is an everyday thing for people with some mental disorders.

 

There was a young lady in my old church who suffered from delusions - seeing things, losing focus from the real world, hearing things. For over a decade her parents brought her to various pastors and healing sessions. They refused to have her see a psychiatrist because they believed that they should rely on God to heal her from demonic possession. They believed that this demonic possession came about as a 'curse' due to her previous pornography usage.

 

Frankly, I'm pretty sure that she was just suffering from schizophrenia and would have been treated by medicine, if they had only chosen to seek it.

Oh no. Yeah, agreed.

 

Yeah, medicine and daily emotional support are vital. Saying someone who suffers from a mental disorder has "demonic possession" is not emotional support though. It rather confuses/scares/discourages them.

[OpenBook]

In Pastor Warren's statement about his son: "He had a brilliant intellect and a gift for sensing who was most in pain or most uncomfortable in a room. He’d then make a bee-line to that person to engage and encourage them."

 

This makes me wonder if Matthew was empathic. From my (very limited) understanding of empaths, they not only empathize/sympathize/identify with those around them more than normally, they actually "absorb" the emotional states of others, especially pain. It can be totally overwhelming unless the empath learns to manage the hypersensitivity (control it, block it, rechannel it, etc.). I wonder if the Warren's ever explored this possibility. Maybe it would have helped to team him up with an (older) empath to teach him how to handle this gift?

[TaraMaiden]

Yeah, you definitely can't diagnose depression in an infant.

 

Wrong.

[pureinheart]

In Pastor Warren's statement about his son: "He had a brilliant intellect and a gift for sensing who was most in pain or most uncomfortable in a room. He’d then make a bee-line to that person to engage and encourage them."

 

This makes me wonder if Matthew was empathic. From my (very limited) understanding of empaths, they not only empathize/sympathize/identify with those around them more than normally, they actually "absorb" the emotional states of others, especially pain. It can be totally overwhelming unless the empath learns to manage the hypersensitivity (control it, block it, rechannel it, etc.). I wonder if the Warren's ever explored this possibility. Maybe it would have helped to team him up with an (older) empath to teach him how to handle this gift?

 

OB, I think you nailed it here....:(:(

[pie2]

Wrong.

 

The link you posted seemed to be a blog (not sure?), but I couldn't see any scientific studies that say depression is diagnosed in infants .

 

Just to clarify, infants are 0-1, and toddlers are 1.5-3. The website's author focused on a study of children ages 3-6, which is much different than looking at infants.

 

Even if they can see depressive-like symptoms in 3 year-olds, I don't think the mental health field is anywhere near giving a diagnosis that young. And thank goodness . I'm all for treating symptoms at any age, but a 3 year-old has no need to be labeled with 'depression' (which will follow him/her for years to come), when there are really so many other factors that effect a child that young, and the research is not yet extensive enough for psychologists to make that determination.

Edited April 9, 2013 by pie2

[TheFinalWord]

Some tweets from Rick Warren...wow, one chocked me up a bit...

 

Someone on the internet sold Matthew an unregistered gun.I pray he seeks God's forgiveness. I forgive him. #MATTHEW 6:15

 

Grieving is hard.Grieving as public figures,harder.Grieving while haters celebrate your pain,hardest.Your notes sustained us

 

In dark days, doctrine in your head isn't enough;You need Jesus by your side. My sustaining #BestFriend for 50 years.