Back squat

[Emilia]

http://deansomerset.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/squat-variants.jpg

 

I mainly do front squats for some reason. I think I've just found it easier to go 'ass to grass' in that position. I've started back squats, I find the position shown in the middle (high-bar) easier than the one on the right hand side.

 

Am I on the right track? It feels a bit weird but high bar feels ok-ish. Any pros and cos high-bar vs low-bar?

[AlexDP]

http://deansomerset.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/squat-variants.jpg

 

I mainly do front squats for some reason. I think I've just found it easier to go 'ass to grass' in that position. I've started back squats, I find the position shown in the middle (high-bar) easier than the one on the right hand side.

 

Am I on the right track? It feels a bit weird but high bar feels ok-ish. Any pros and cos high-bar vs low-bar?

 

Definitely on the right track if you follow Dean Somerset's blog.. He's awesome!

 

It's easier to go down with the front squats, because your anterior core is activated. Otherwise you'd just drop the weight.

 

As for back squats.. I'm currently rebuilding my back squat form, so I've been focusing on overhead squats and bodyweight squats. Also, I do not care for low bar squats at all. I think high bar squats are a far better choice.

[Emilia]

As for back squats.. I'm currently rebuilding my back squat form, so I've been focusing on overhead squats and bodyweight squats. Also, I do not care for low bar squats at all. I think high bar squats are a far better choice.

 

Yes I'm thinking about going back to body weight squats with the correct posture, overhead ones are a good idea. I don't like leaning in as much as low-bar squats require it, prefer the high-bar posture.

[EasyHeart]

The important thing is to keep the weight over your heels. The exact position of the bar on your back is going to be a little different for everyone, and I think it has to do with the relative length of your upper and lower torsos. If the bar is too high on your back you'll find yourself leaning forward, which places stress on your lower back. Hurting your back is the biggest dangers of squats -- if your low back hurts after squats, you're doing something wrong. And that something is the bar moving too far forward.

 

Front squats are easier to do, but you can't handle as much weight in that position as a regular squat. It's basically the same reason that it's easier to carry things in a backpack than it is to carry a bag in your arms. But if holding up the weight is no problem, it's not any different than a regular squat.

 

The different positions of the bar are just to make it comfortable and convenient to hold the weight and keep it in position. It's not going to make any real difference to strength/muscle gains. The point of the squat (and the deadlift, for that matter) is simply a way to add weight to a good old-fashioned deep-knee bend.

[Star Gazer]

Back squats are where it's at! You can use more weight on the back than the front; as such, I've always found them easier to do.

 

And like EH said, weight over heels!

[Emilia]

I do squats and deadlifts bare feet so that it's weight over heels.

 

It's getting down to a deep squat that I find challenging - more so with low-bar than a high-bar. I think it's a flexibility issue though to an extent.

[Pyro]

I read the title as 'Black Squat'

 

I need to accept the fact that I am going blind.

 

Sorry, carry on.

[Emilia]

I read the title as 'Black Squat'

 

I need to accept the fact that I am going blind.

 

Sorry, carry on.

 

This is still a slightly more constructive contribution than what I expected

[Pyro]

This is still a slightly more constructive contribution than what I expected

 

Are you saying that my contributions mean squat? (Pun intended)

[Emilia]

Are you saying that my contributions mean squat? (Pun intended)

 

pretty much but they are usually uplifting (pun intended too)

[EasyHeart]

I do squats and deadlifts bare feet so that it's weight over heels.

 

It's getting down to a deep squat that I find challenging - more so with low-bar than a high-bar. I think it's a flexibility issue though to an extent.

One bit of advice that I got years ago is to build up your back muscles before trying to squat. There should be a ridge of muscle on your upper back where the bar just naturally rests. I doubt I could move the bar any higher or lower than where I always put it because it would feel really weird.

 

The easiest way to tell if you're going low enough is just how your muscles feel. As you're going down into a squat, the beginning of the motion is supported by your quads. As you go lower, the motion switches to your glutes and when you press up from the bottom of the motion, you should feel it in your butt, not your legs. As long as your butt hurts a little after you squat, you're going low enough. You don't want to go too low, because that can really mess up your spine. The squat puts a lot of stress on your spine, so protecting it should be the number one priority.

[Emilia]

As long as your butt hurts a little after you squat, you're going low enough. You don't want to go too low, because that can really mess up your spine. The squat puts a lot of stress on your spine, so protecting it should be the number one priority.

 

If I can't go low enough I decrease the weight

[Mr Scorpio]

If I can't go low enough I decrease the weight

 

FWIW, when I worked with personal trainer(s) I was advised agaisnt going much lower than ninety-degrees at the knees. I would never go "ass to the grass". However, I seem to be much more of a "range of motion" nazi than most.

[Emilia]

FWIW, when I worked with personal trainer(s) I was advised agaisnt going much lower than ninety-degrees at the knees. I would never go "ass to the grass". However, I seem to be much more of a "range of motion" nazi than most.

 

I have heard of personal trainers advising parallel (there is one in my gym) and that's when I cut off the conversation. It seems to me they dismiss the whole sport of olympic weightlifting for starters (cleans anyone?). You activate your glute's flexibility and strength more and build stronger legs the deeper you go and your knees are designed for bending.

[AlexDP]

The important thing is to keep the weight over your heels. The exact position of the bar on your back is going to be a little different for everyone, and I think it has to do with the relative length of your upper and lower torsos. If the bar is too high on your back you'll find yourself leaning forward, which places stress on your lower back. Hurting your back is the biggest dangers of squats -- if your low back hurts after squats, you're doing something wrong. And that something is the bar moving too far forward.

 

Front squats are easier to do, but you can't handle as much weight in that position as a regular squat. It's basically the same reason that it's easier to carry things in a backpack than it is to carry a bag in your arms. But if holding up the weight is no problem, it's not any different than a regular squat.

 

The different positions of the bar are just to make it comfortable and convenient to hold the weight and keep it in position. It's not going to make any real difference to strength/muscle gains. The point of the squat (and the deadlift, for that matter) is simply a way to add weight to a good old-fashioned deep-knee bend.

 

Squatting through the heels: Why it only works for Pirates | DeanSomerset.com

 

 

I think he makes a few valid points. At least for my body structure he does.

[tman666]

My experience is that different bar placements and stances on squats will each have advantages and disadvantages.

 

For example, the vast majority of powerlifters use a low bar placement and a wide stance. Some use a more moderate stance. Most Olympic lifters focus on front squats with narrow stances or high bar back squats.

 

Typically, people are able to lift more weight with a low bar placement. Fronts squats tend to be more quad dominant than low bar back squats (which are highly posterior chain dominant). Wider stance squats tend to be more hip dominant, while narrower stances tend to be more quad dominant.

 

I don't think that there are any set in stones rules as to which variation you should use. Obviously, if you have plans to compete in powerlifting or Oly. lifting, you need to develop your low bar squat/front squats according to the requirements of the respective sport.

 

For more generalized training, I think it's wise to cycle though the variations.

 

For what it's worth, I have two squat days per week in a 4 day/week training schedule. The first day is devoted to a maximal effort squat, generally using a low-bar back squat. My second squat day is generally done with somewhat higher volume (with some heavier, low rep sets mixed in) on front squats. I sort of despise front squats from a comfort-level standpoint, but I feel they help me address some of my weaknesses that limit my back squat (upper back strength and core strength, primarily).

 

As far as whether or not your form is correct, it would be helpful to see a video. Everyone's form is going to look a little different, based on the individual anatomy of the lifter. General tips include keeping your head up, your upper back tight, your spine neutral and slightly arched in, sitting back and not coming up on your toes, keeping your chest out, pushing your knees out, etc. There is a LOT to think about with a good squat (just like with a good bench, deadlift, clean, etc.)

Edited April 12, 2013 by tman666

[Emilia]

Perfect tman, I knew you wouldn't let me down

 

My plan is to play around with footstance and bar positioning. I usually use narrow footstance for my front squat, I'm going to try wider for the back squat, partly because as you said that's not so quads focused and I think I can do with more hip strength (and perhaps flexibility). It just seems to make sense/easier.

 

Even just for boredom reasons it makes sense to play around: I'm planning to get a decent form on high-bar back squats with a wider stance and on overhead squats. I'm also planning to keep front squats going with a narrower stance.

 

Videa is a good idea, I should do that for deadlifts too.

[StandingO]

I gave up on front squats because my wrists are all messed up from injuries. Unfortunately the pain is too great because the wrist can't bend back that well anymore. Back squats I tend to lean forward to much. Goblet squats work for me.

[Emilia]

]I gave up on front squats because my wrists are all messed up from injuries. Unfortunately the pain is too great because the wrist can't bend back that well anymore[/b]. Back squats I tend to lean forward to much. Goblet squats work for me.

 

That's a shame. I'm doing a lot of exercises on the side to strengthen my forearms/wrists. Boxing has also helped. I had tendonitis in my forearms last year so I got back into lifts with caution but so far have managed to keep up strength development in my forearms and wrists with the general weight increase.

 

On another note: I've watched my form in the mirror and while I'm happy with my front squats, my back squats are terrible, I don't think there is enough flexibility in my hips mainly. Also my current gym is not ideal for lifting: not enough racks, not even near close to demand, lots of cardio equipment but hard to share free weights and space is limited too.

 

So for the next 3 months or so I'm going to sign up to a proper weightlifters gym, there is one not far from where I live and I'll research a couple more too. I want to learn form properly, open up my hips more, etc. I don't know how much I care for lifting inordinate amounts but I'd really like decent back and overhead squats.

[Emilia]

Signed up to a 10-week (lesson once a week only 2-hour sessions) powerlifting course from next Monday. Might run a thread here based on experiences relating to the course.

[StandingO]

For both back and front squats I have to bend my upperbody forward to much in order to go lower. This makes the bar want to fall off on the front squat. My wrists are strong enough within a certain range. My left wrist has been injured so many times that I just live with it. I can still do bench presses but I often wrap my wrist to be sure. I am happy with increasing my strength endurance with the lunges and goblet squats.

[Emilia]

For both back and front squats I have to bend my upperbody forward to much in order to go lower.

 

This is why my instructor at the weightlifter's gym I've just joined watches form very closely, it's great.

[Emilia]

So, I was contemplating starting a new thread on my joining a weightlifting club but will update this old one instead for the time being.

 

Walked in... I knew it was in a poorer part of London and in a shed more or less but it still surprised me and made me nervous There were about 3 guys lifting, about 2 coaches helping out, it was just big, massive weights and big, massive men lifting. I thought they were going to ask me to start with 200lbs squats or something.

 

But it wasn't like that at all . It's really friendly, the coach is great, everyone talks to you and you start at whatever level you are able to confidently BUT it is expected that you lift heavy (which is why I went there).

 

I did much better than expected, I can deadlift my own body weight which I didn't know. Objectively it's not that high but relatively it is for me and going to work on it more of course. Both my squats and benches were better than I thought they would be in an environment where your form is strictly controlled. My squats are not brilliant and have to remember to keep my chest up at all times but it's getting better.

 

I can just do my normal core exercises and hill running on non-weightlifting days, don't have any home work from the coach except for keeping up with the usual because he said I knew what I was doing so I can just carry on. A lot of work ahead but it feels doable

[tman666]

So, I was contemplating starting a new thread on my joining a weightlifting club but will update this old one instead for the time being.

 

Walked in... I knew it was in a poorer part of London and in a shed more or less but it still surprised me and made me nervous There were about 3 guys lifting, about 2 coaches helping out, it was just big, massive weights and big, massive men lifting. I thought they were going to ask me to start with 200lbs squats or something.

 

But it wasn't like that at all . It's really friendly, the coach is great, everyone talks to you and you start at whatever level you are able to confidently BUT it is expected that you lift heavy (which is why I went there).

 

I did much better than expected, I can deadlift my own body weight which I didn't know. Objectively it's not that high but relatively it is for me and going to work on it more of course. Both my squats and benches were better than I thought they would be in an environment where your form is strictly controlled. My squats are not brilliant and have to remember to keep my chest up at all times but it's getting better.

 

I can just do my normal core exercises and hill running on non-weightlifting days, don't have any home work from the coach except for keeping up with the usual because he said I knew what I was doing so I can just carry on. A lot of work ahead but it feels doable

 

I'm jelly! It's so good to be able to train with people who are serious and knowledgeable about their sport.

[Emilia]

I'm jelly! It's so good to be able to train with people who are serious and knowledgeable about their sport.

 

It is and it's so cheap in this case. The coach is a lovely guy, there are also some hotties in the gym which helps as we know

 

There are about 2 bikes, one ham and glute raise bench, one cable thing with harness and the rest just racks and weights. I'll do a progress report once I've been down there a handful of times.