Back squat

[StandingO]

My woman is very knowledgeable with squats and been doing them for nearly two decades. I never trained legs much until I met her so my muscular structure is a tad disproportionate as she says. My poor uneducated training habits have contribute to by poor flexibility too. She trains probably 60/40 percent legs for the last few years. She has tried to get me on track and has helped me but I tend too hate squats due to the fore mentioned reasons and a history of knee and hip injuries to boot. She on the other hand loves squats so she gets a better work out with her female gym partner. I stick to my dumbbell goblet squats and lunges while she is in the rack doing ass to grass reps with 225 lol. My knees and hips have improved a ton though.

[Emilia]

Brief update: I've had 5 powerlifting sessions so far and they have been amazing. I go Mondays and Thursdays.

 

We start with warming up on a bike or rowing machine, a few good mornings then off doing squats with just the bar first then start loading weight. My personal best is surprisingly high and coach has been happy too. Deadlifts are coming along too, they are next on the list after squats, then bench, rows, abs and stretch. (I do abs 'properly' as well as hill running in my normal gym on other days, don't need a coach for these). I train roughly 4 times a week altogether plus yoga which is not weekly.

 

What was bizarre though is that I had Monday off (bank holiday in the UK and I was off to my home country) and when I went to the weightlifters' gym yesterday - I hadn't done any exercise for a week, no other gym, nothing - I struggled.

 

I thought having plenty of rest would have a good effect but in fact everything just felt 'heavy' and it didn't feel as flowing as before. I lifted less because we focused on form and didn't do that pyramid style (where you steadily increase weight and decrease reps).

 

Is that normal? Usually after a few days rest I feel energised. Is it normal to just feel less strong after just a week's rest? Or is that fatigue building up as my body is getting used to increased stress?

[tman666]

Brief update: I've had 5 powerlifting sessions so far and they have been amazing. I go Mondays and Thursdays.

 

We start with warming up on a bike or rowing machine, a few good mornings then off doing squats with just the bar first then start loading weight. My personal best is surprisingly high and coach has been happy too. Deadlifts are coming along too, they are next on the list after squats, then bench, rows, abs and stretch. (I do abs 'properly' as well as hill running in my normal gym on other days, don't need a coach for these). I train roughly 4 times a week altogether plus yoga which is not weekly.

 

What was bizarre though is that I had Monday off (bank holiday in the UK and I was off to my home country) and when I went to the weightlifters' gym yesterday - I hadn't done any exercise for a week, no other gym, nothing - I struggled.

 

I thought having plenty of rest would have a good effect but in fact everything just felt 'heavy' and it didn't feel as flowing as before. I lifted less because we focused on form and didn't do that pyramid style (where you steadily increase weight and decrease reps).

 

Is that normal? Usually after a few days rest I feel energised. Is it normal to just feel less strong after just a week's rest? Or is that fatigue building up as my body is getting used to increased stress?

 

I got excited reading this post... You're experiencing the real deal, haha.

 

There's a good reason why you experienced this, and it wasn't because you were fatigued. It was more likely because peak strength is largely a function of your CNS and "learned" motor patterns. Basically, while your muscles and joints were likely 100%, your CNS was likely not as primed to operate with the same efficiency as it was when being trained in the same motor pattern on a bi-weekly basis. Basically, your CNS got a little rusty.

 

While this theory is most often applied to high frequency training of Olympic lifts, more and more people are finding that the power lifts benefit from frequent training as well.

 

On a personal note, I've been experimenting with squatting and pressing 3 times per week, deadlifting once per week, and doing some sort of speed pulling once per week, via the "Texas Method". The trick is cycling intensities and volumes. So far, it has been working marvelously.

 

But yeah, what you experienced is completely normal. This is a good example of how powerlifting is not just about brute strength and the ability to recruit muscle fibers, but also highly dependent on skill and learned motor patterns.

[Emilia]

I got excited reading this post... You're experiencing the real deal, haha.

haha thanks, same when I saw your name on the thread, I knew I'd get a good explanation

There's a good reason why you experienced this, and it wasn't because you were fatigued. It was more likely because peak strength is largely a function of your CNS and "learned" motor patterns. Basically, while your muscles and joints were likely 100%, your CNS was likely not as primed to operate with the same efficiency as it was when being trained in the same motor pattern on a bi-weekly basis. Basically, your CNS got a little rusty.

 

While this theory is most often applied to high frequency training of Olympic lifts, more and more people are finding that the power lifts benefit from frequent training as well.

 

On a personal note, I've been experimenting with squatting and pressing 3 times per week, deadlifting once per week, and doing some sort of speed pulling once per week, via the "Texas Method". The trick is cycling intensities and volumes. So far, it has been working marvelously.

 

But yeah, what you experienced is completely normal. This is a good example of how powerlifting is not just about brute strength and the ability to recruit muscle fibers, but also highly dependent on skill and learned motor patterns.

Makes perfect sense, thank you! I experienced something similar when I started increasing the amount of boxing I did, adrenaline rushes became more frequent and it was so exhausting I cried once when I left the office for another session. My CNS adjusted though it became fine.

 

The other two sessions I do are less intense but hill running is still demanding and the way I do core and pushups raise my heartbeat pretty well. It makes sense that going from 4x to zero times would have some kind of effect, especially when 2x of those is powerlifting.

 

Thanks!

[Emilia]

Yesterday main focus was on 1RM to put a personal training plan together as it is my 4th week at the weightlifters' gym and worked hard on form and conditioning.

 

I benched 40kgs (88lbs) which is 2/3rd of my body weight and

I squated 60kgs (132lbs) which is about 4 lbs below my body weight

not too bad for the first month, used a belt but still.... Coach just said 'you've done well today' when I was leaving the gym .

 

On Thursday we will focus on deadlifts and presses. I'm hoping my 1RM on deadlift will be at least 80kgs (176lbs) with decent form.

 

Today I'll be doing supporting exercises in the gym: hill running, rows, push ups and core.

 

Been doing lots of stretches and had a Swedish massage on Saturday for an hour. It hurt at times but was well worth it. Probably yoga class on Sunday.

[tman666]

Those are some diesel lifts, Emilia!

 

Not a single pink barbie weight was lifted that day.

[Star Gazer]

I love talking about squats and deadlifts and I love reading tman's contributions... Don't mind my crush, t.

 

Yesterday main focus was on 1RM to put a personal training plan together as it is my 4th week at the weightlifters' gym and worked hard on form and conditioning.

 

I benched 40kgs (88lbs) which is 2/3rd of my body weight and

I squated 60kgs (132lbs) which is about 4 lbs below my body weight

not too bad for the first month, used a belt but still.... Coach just said 'you've done well today' when I was leaving the gym .

 

On Thursday we will focus on deadlifts and presses. I'm hoping my 1RM on deadlift will be at least 80kgs (176lbs) with decent form.

 

Today I'll be doing supporting exercises in the gym: hill running, rows, push ups and core.

 

Been doing lots of stretches and had a Swedish massage on Saturday for an hour. It hurt at times but was well worth it. Probably yoga class on Sunday.

 

We're almost the same weight. After a month, my 1RM deadlift was 190. Then 220. Then 235. Then I got t-boned by an oil tanker and hurt my shoulder.

 

Good on ya!! Keep it up!!

[tman666]

I love talking about squats and deadlifts and I love reading tman's contributions... Don't mind my crush, t.

 

D'awwww oh garsh gee whiz...

[StandingO]

Great bench. Wow! that is pretty darn strong so early. Fantastic.

[Emilia]

Thanks guys! Great lifts there Star. I'm hoping my deadlift technique gets perfect quickly, I didn't use my legs enough in the beginning, it's getting better.

 

Thanks StandingO I have some outlanding targets , will see. I'll update the thread again soon

[Star Gazer]

Thanks guys! Great lifts there Star. I'm hoping my deadlift technique gets perfect quickly, I didn't use my legs enough in the beginning, it's getting better.

 

I have a freakishly strong lower back and hamstrings (my lower posterior chain is my favorite "body part"), so it came easier for me. I miss doing them with heavy weight, but having the weight kinda pull down on my shoulder hurts too much now. I'm jealous! I can only do like 120-130 now before I'm whimpering.

 

Did you take before pictures? Just for your own progress?

[Emilia]

I have a freakishly strong lower back and hamstrings (my lower posterior chain is my favorite "body part"), so it came easier for me. I miss doing them with heavy weight, but having the weight kinda pull down on my shoulder hurts too much now. I'm jealous! I can only do like 120-130 now before I'm whimpering.

That's a shame. What does 't-boned by an oil tanker' mean?

Did you take before pictures? Just for your own progress?

No, I'm hoping my physique won't change that much (except for my glutes of course ), I don't even know how long I'll keep it going. The main idea was really just to get stronger and to keep it going.

[Star Gazer]

That's a shame. What does 't-boned by an oil tanker' mean?

 

I was driving, and I was hit directly/perpendicular (like a T) on the driver's side by an oil-tanker truck.

 

No, I'm hoping my physique won't change that much (except for my glutes of course ), I don't even know how long I'll keep it going. The main idea was really just to get stronger and to keep it going.

 

Gotcha.

[Emilia]

I was driving, and I was hit directly/perpendicular (like a T) on the driver's side by an oil-tanker truck.

Bloody hell.

[Emilia]

My deadlift 1RM turned out to be 90kgs in the end (roughly 198lbs) and my overhead press was 32.5 kgs (72 lbs) so coach has put a plan together that we have been using for the past two weeks.

 

- Squat, bench, deadlift and press: 1 set of 5x75% of 1RM, 1 set of 5x80% of 1RM and 1 set of 'do as many as you can but at least 5 reps otherwise you are in trouble' x85% of 1RM

 

- Supporting exercises: good mornings, barbell rows, whatever the 'ordinary' rows are called, ham and glute raises, abs work, step ups, lat pull downs, etc.

 

It's surprisingly tiring for the rest of the week. My other 2 sessions in the week feel like harder work but then again spend shorter time in the gym focusing on support exercises plus more legs including hill running.

[tman666]

My deadlift 1RM turned out to be 90kgs in the end (roughly 198lbs) and my overhead press was 32.5 kgs (72 lbs) so coach has put a plan together that we have been using for the past two weeks.

- Squat, bench, deadlift and press: 1 set of 5x75% of 1RM, 1 set of 5x80% of 1RM and 1 set of 'do as many as you can but at least 5 reps otherwise you are in trouble' x85% of 1RM

 

- Supporting exercises: good mornings, barbell rows, whatever the 'ordinary' rows are called, ham and glute raises, abs work, step ups, lat pull downs, etc.

 

It's surprisingly tiring for the rest of the week. My other 2 sessions in the week feel like harder work but then again spend shorter time in the gym focusing on support exercises plus more legs including hill running.

 

Sounds like the start of a 5/3/1 cycle. Keep us updated!

 

My advice regarding good mornings is to stay light. Form is critical with good mornings. I just think that going too heavy on them tends to force most people to take over the lift with their lower backs (rather than their hamstrings/glutes) when they get fatigued, which also opens them up to more injury potential.

 

If good mornings aren't working out for you, think about (or possibly ask your coach about) substituting dumbbell or barbell RDLs instead.

[Emilia]

Sounds like the start of a 5/3/1 cycle. Keep us updated!

It's what coach said but he also says he doesn't like 5/3/1 that much because it 'isn't intensive enough towards the end' whatever the hell that means.

My advice regarding good mornings is to stay light. Form is critical with good mornings. I just think that going too heavy on them tends to force most people to take over the lift with their lower backs (rather than their hamstrings/glutes) when they get fatigued, which also opens them up to more injury potential.

Thanks, I'll bear it in mind! I have been thinking about this. The boys definitely go heavier as they tend to with everything (partly to compete with us girls ) but I see how bad form gets when the weight is too heavy

If good mornings aren't working out for you, think about (or possibly ask your coach about) substituting dumbbell or barbell RDLs instead.

Good call, just had a look on youtube.

[tman666]

It's what coach said but he also says he doesn't like 5/3/1 that much because it 'isn't intensive enough towards the end' whatever the hell that means.

 

I'd like to know what that means too.

[Emilia]

I'd like to know what that means too.

I'll find out shortly

[Emilia]

tman, can you post a good deadlift clip please? I still lift with my back. thank you

[tman666]

tman, can you post a good deadlift clip please? I still lift with my back. thank you

 

Good deadlift, complete with 80's montage music and a homely fireside chat:

 

Notice that Ed lifts with a slight rounding in his upper back. Some lifters do this. Rounding in the upper back is OK. What you DON'T want is rounding in the lower back. Rounding in the lower back is what leads to weakness and injury.

 

I think that Elliot Hulse has good info as well. He tends to come from more of a strongman background, however, which tends to emphasize some different things. Here's a video of him deadlifting:

 

He's got a lot of other videos on deadlifts (and a wide variety of topics), so it might be worth your time.

 

Another great resource is Jordan Syatt. He's a wee little man, but he's strong as hell for his size, and his deadlift tips have helped me immensely (such as the advice to "pull your scapulae down").

 

My opinion is that the deadlift does involve your back (as do squats, bench, and just about every other lift). Yes, you should be engaging your glutes/hamstrings, but your back definitely still comes into play in a large way. Where problems arise is if you're not engaging your hams/glutes well, and relying on lower back strength alone to pick up the weight.

 

If you're having trouble getting your glutes/hamstrings to fire on the deadlift (as indicated by your butt popping up right at the start of the lift), there are several things you can do:

 

1) you can practice the form very intensively (starting very light) and working up slowly in weight, ONLY allowing more weight on the bar if your form is perfect. This can be tough to do alone because it's hard to get feedback during the lift, which makes it more difficult to form the correct mind/muscle connection.

 

2) you can strengthen/build your glutes and hamstrings. If you're having trouble recruiting your glutes/hams, having more muscle fibers to recruit will help.

 

3) you can isolate your glutes/hamstrings to train them to fire properly. Hyperextensions, glute/ham raises, barbell hip thrusts, and RDLs are all great for this.

 

4) You can perform warm ups that "wake up" the glutes/hamstrings prior to lifting. Check out Bret Contreras' stuff for this kind of thing.

 

Keep in mind that just about everyone's deadlift is going to look slightly different. There are objectively more "wrong"/dangerous/less mechanically advantageous ways to perform a lift, but don't get too wrapped up if your deadlift doesn't look EXACTLY like the next lifter.

[Emilia]

4) You can perform warm ups that "wake up" the glutes/hamstrings prior to lifting. Check out Bret Contreras' stuff for this kind of thing.

 

Keep in mind that just about everyone's deadlift is going to look slightly different. There are objectively more "wrong"/dangerous/less mechanically advantageous ways to perform a lift, but don't get too wrapped up if your deadlift doesn't look EXACTLY like the next lifter.

Thank you very much!

 

Might be 4)... but will look at them all as options. I think I don't sit into them enough. I think I haven't found my position where I naturally sit into it low enough but have the bar at a distance I like too...

 

When I start doing my warm up today in about 90 minutes time, I'll focus from minute 1 when it's still light rather than when it starts getting heavier.

 

EDIT: yeah, I don't sit into it enough. I'll set myself up differently this evening.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Emilia

[Emilia]

You were right tman, we started the 5/3/1 cycle. It was hard yesterday. I squatted 95% of my 1RM twice and without a belt (I reached 1RM with a belt). Being so close to 1RM and driving it up twice is HARD , it wasn't a pretty sight

 

Deadlifts on Thursday. My form definitely got better after looking at the clips you posted because I've set up myself differently. Not looking forward to that 5/3/1 thing though

[StandingO]

My GF and her buddy want to try to go for one rep max this week. I promised a nice night out if they make their goals.

[Emilia]

My GF and her buddy want to try to go for one rep max this week. I promised a nice night out if they make their goals.

It's de-loading week this week (which is great! ) and the cycle is starting again next week with a higher 1RM for most lifts I think