I was scoped out by a demon

[2sure]

question - based on all you people's god and satan talk in this thread (sry but it was just too long to read all of it), I presume that you are in the camp that discounts science and instead believes in creationism (god created the universe a few thousand years ago, the rapture is coming, that kinda stuff)?

 

Nope. I mix it up. I lean more to science, but have faith in God.

I am in the camp that that Knows Jesus did not ride a dinosaur .

[pureinheart]

And certainly its easy enough to write the whole thing off as an intense dream. But there were people who heard what they did.

 

I couldn't sleep last night for thinking about it all again. But have not researched anything at all, because to be honest, I have serious doubts about ...really anything like this.

 

Anyway, as far as warfare . That's EXACTLY what it was. Not a confrontation, like a battle. As if I were about to engage. it had that fight or flight feeling?

And I felt as though I were protecting my family, in the dream part I was putting them behind me. Very emotional. But I didn't recognize them as anyone I knew, no specific family family members.

 

We were asked to leave in the morning. It truly was awful.

 

You know 2Sure, the only thing I can come up with is that you actually were protecting your family, recognisable or not- I've known others and myself operate in a combination of Spirit/flesh (soulish). People have given words of knowledge in both Spirit and soulish desires.

 

I wonder if this dream-like state you were actualy caught up in the Spirit.

 

Most of us are in continuous war with the flesh.

 

I'm getting a strong sense in my Spirit that you are of God and have received Jesus as your Lord and Savior at some point- the gifts are without repentantance, meaning we can operate in them even in states that God would not approve of...

 

I have to say this is of God, yet embarrassing to you. I had a friend grab me by the hand and take me out of the hanger we were working in- we were doing the last mod on Columbia before the disaster. I was speaking in tongues REALLY loud and no one heard. My friend feared that someone would hear and break out the straight jackets lol. Many unusual spiritual things happened during that mod.

[pureinheart]

question - based on all you people's god and satan talk in this thread (sry but it was just too long to read all of it), I presume that you are in the camp that discounts science and instead believes in creationism (god created the universe a few thousand years ago, the rapture is coming, that kinda stuff)?

 

I believe that most science confirms what most of us have been saying- science is a wonderful thing IMO.

[pureinheart]

I have recently begun attempts to be like Jesus and live by the Holy Spirit even when it directly conflicts with the physical flesh. The Bible says God CANNOT be pleased in the flesh. Only the spirit.

 

However, all spirit is not holy. This is the danger of just being a "spiritual person" without the discernment of spirits spoken of by Paul.

 

Amen Brotha, me too. Killing the flesh is hard both physically and mentally- it's a transition/change of which is difficult for me.

 

Taking a person that was saved at 27 years old- well a lot of the world and thinking had infiltrated my being.

 

Christians aren't perfect, just forgiven, and I have to guard against perfectionism also, as I have a tendancy to drive myself nuts trying to do everything right. Then fall back into old/comfortable patterns due to falling short.

[todreaminblue]

Amen!

 

Beautifully stated.

 

Love you Deb and am so thankful you are alive!!!

 

 

luv you too bethebutterfly ...yay ...you are posting....smilin atcha....deb

[2sure]

question - based on all you people's god and satan talk in this thread (sry but it was just too long to read all of it), I presume that you are in the camp that discounts science and instead believes in creationism (god created the universe a few thousand years ago, the rapture is coming, that kinda stuff)?[/

 

I struggled for a long time reconciling myself between some of the stories in the bible and science. I still do. But years ago I read a book that was called the Bible as History. For what it's worth, it's written from a scientific viewpoint and offers some proof that many of the occurrences written about in the Bible actually happened. The parting of the red sea. It had to do with a rare tidal thing that geologists can tell happened.

 

Just pointing out that spirituality and science do mix.

[2sure]

You know 2Sure, the only thing I can come up with is that you actually were protecting your family, recognisable or not- I've known others and myself operate in a combination of Spirit/flesh (soulish). People have given words of knowledge in both Spirit and soulish desires.

 

I wonder if this dream-like state you were actualy caught up in the Spirit.

 

Most of us are in continuous war with the flesh.

 

I'm getting a strong sense in my Spirit that you are of God and have received Jesus as your Lord and Savior at some point- the gifts are without repentantance, meaning we can operate in them even in states that God would not approve of...

 

I have to say this is of God, yet embarrassing to you. I had a friend grab me by the hand and take me out of the hanger we were working in- we were doing the last mod on Columbia before the disaster. I was speaking in tongues REALLY loud and no one heard. My friend feared that someone would hear and break out the straight jackets lol. Many unusual spiritual things happened during that mod.

 

I appreciate your giving thought to this. It's a mystery to me. I know it was important. I've not pursued it, it seems too strange. I think I might like to find out more in general. Ive been remiss in my spiritual health.

 

I'm so glad no one suggested I was possessed by demons , I had some concern there! But I know that wasn't it.

[M30USA]

question - based on all you people's god and satan talk in this thread (sry but it was just too long to read all of it), I presume that you are in the camp that discounts science and instead believes in creationism (god created the universe a few thousand years ago, the rapture is coming, that kinda stuff)?[/

 

I struggled for a long time reconciling myself between some of the stories in the bible and science. I still do. But years ago I read a book that was called the Bible as History. For what it's worth, it's written from a scientific viewpoint and offers some proof that many of the occurrences written about in the Bible actually happened. The parting of the red sea. It had to do with a rare tidal thing that geologists can tell happened.

 

Just pointing out that spirituality and science do mix.

 

2sure,

 

I can save you a lot of time and tell you that most of the miracles in the Bible were not done by humans. They were done in the presence of angels and by angels. Angels, as I've said, are not like fairy tales. They are real beings with incredible intelligence and technology. They are capable of doing things in the natural world through knowledge and technology that humans can only dream of. This is how most of the miracles in Scripture occured from the Red Sea, to Daniel in the lion's den, to the collapsing of walls of Jericho. All done by angels.

[2sure]

 

2sure,

 

I can save you a lot of time and tell you that most of the miracles in the Bible were not done by humans. They were done in the presence of angels and by angels. Angels, as I've said, are not like fairy tales. They are real beings with incredible intelligence and technology. They are capable of doing things in the natural world through knowledge and technology that humans can only dream of. This is how most of the miracles in Scripture occured from the Red Sea, to Daniel in the lion's den, to the collapsing of walls of Jericho. All done by angels.

 

I liked reading about the historical evidence that these things happened. Like a cross reference. I needed that.

[pureinheart]

I appreciate your giving thought to this. It's a mystery to me. I know it was important. I've not pursued it, it seems too strange. I think I might like to find out more in general. Ive been remiss in my spiritual health.

 

I'm so glad no one suggested I was possessed by demons , I had some concern there! But I know that wasn't it.

 

Oh my Lord, heavens no! LOL, wanted to real quick wanted to change my wording on the gifts being without repentance...meant to say He can work through us even if we're doing stuff He doesn't approve of...actually was thinking of MANY situations I've been in (which are rather embarassing) and He's still worked through me regardless.

 

I'm on antibiotics right now and my wording can sound off (more than usual:laugh:)...wasn't infering that you were out of his will:o

 

I struggle with my spiritual health continually and just when thinking I might be getting somewhere- Bammm, am reminded how far I have to go- thinking it's this way with most (?) ....thank God He judges the heart- the motive behind the motive, of which I am oblivious to most of the time. He knows why we don't do or do the things we do...His compassion is great (thank God:D).

[M30USA]

I struggle with my spiritual health continually and just when thinking I might be getting somewhere- Bammm, am reminded how far I have to go- thinking it's this way with most (?) ....thank God He judges the heart- the motive behind the motive, of which I am oblivious to most of the time. He knows why we don't do or do the things we do...His compassion is great (thank God:D).

 

Good point. Christ is the author and perfecter of our faith. That means he starts it and completes it. The only thing we do is desire to allow him to do this--and even that small role is debatable since Scripture says that repentance, itself, is a gift from God. That leaves us pretty much with zero credit for anything good that comes from us. I don't have any confidence in our nature as humans so fortunately he doesn't leave anything up to us. Even our strength to do his will comes from him.

Edited April 20, 2013 by M30USA

[ErosOcean]

Well, that depends on belief. I don't believe in evil spirits, demons or anything of the like. I think folks who do aren't giving the imagination and creativity of the human mind enough credit; if our minds are powerful enough to imagine things like demons, dragons, fairies and the like, then it's completely possible that a belief held as strongly as those some religious folks here adhere with can create these images without it being reality

 

As someone who has had episodes of sleep paralysis. I know the feeling all to well of seeing demons, ghosts, and angels (or a glowing white figure)! And also of feeling the heavy weight on your chest. Or being pulled into darkness, or feeling the temperature of the room drop to freezing.

 

For years, I've experienced that and I too believed in the supernatural... or I used to.

 

Now, I've come to believe that it's all delusional thinking. I think our mind is so powerful that it can create a false reality of things.

 

I believe that we are the source of it. That we are creating it!

 

I've read in the Buddhist Golden Precepts that the mind is the slayer of the real. Meaning, it can be easily deceived on the perception of reality. And I think it's true.

 

Quantum physicist who research about consciousness and the mind delves into it deeply and they find that our minds is incredibly powerful enough to create whatever we perceive as a reality. And that it can not tell the difference between real or fake!

 

Think about it.. how powerful is your mind when, under hypnosis, someone can believe that they can see a spoon bending to touch their hand!

 

So I think dreams are nothing but symbols for something within your life. It's just the subconscious part of you that is conveying a message.

 

I think the healthy interpretation of Katzee's dream of the Mother and child is she is the creation of the evil child. The evil child could be her own "sins", or evil within her, as she is the Mother - a symbol for creation. After cleansing her own home of evil spirits, in her sleep she began to banish or slay her creation of "evil" within herself. The child doing harm to others - her "evil" tendencies, bad behavior or bad habits that has been hurtful to those around her. So she had to conquer or slay it...

 

It could also mean that she hasn't fully faced whatever her problems are and her subconscious is trying to convey the message to her that she needs to do so or she will end up hurting people...

 

Anyway, it requires some thought of the dreamer to interpret for themselves. Because our minds creates symbols based on what it means for us...

 

Also, about prayer. It's powerful stuff! And I'm a firm believer in it.

 

However, I don't follow the norm on prayer. I've read accounts from past history that when they prayed it was to give thanks and not to ask for stuff. So when I pray I give thanks for things that I am grateful for.

 

But should I need to ask something from God, it is for a sound mind and a healthy body.

 

Everything else, I think, God gave me (as well as anyone) the power to create and have on my own.

[Eve]

As someone who has had episodes of sleep paralysis. I know the feeling all to well of seeing demons, ghosts, and angels (or a glowing white figure)! And also of feeling the heavy weight on your chest. Or being pulled into darkness, or feeling the temperature of the room drop to freezing.

 

 

What were the experiences? Please be specific.

 

Take care,

Eve x

[M30USA]

The issue with sleep paralysis, as I've said before, is that you can't say it holds zero spiritual significance merely because we can explain it scientifically. Using science to understand things does NOT explain things away or take meaning away from them. It merely just states, "This is what happens during such and such." It's merely observation. And since science only deals with physical, material observation, by definition it cannot ascribe meaning to the experience or whether or not it holds spiritual significance.

 

Unfortunately, we can never "prove" any spirual aspect of sleep paralysis. All we can do is learn what it MEANS to people and how they INTERPRET it. Granted, certain things can still be ruled out in this way. For example, if a person says they woke up and saw some purple ghosts with polka-dots, we could probably rule it out as false since it's highly inconsistent with other reports. We would say, "Hmmm...well, most people are paralyzed during these experiences. Also, most people see shadow/silhouette beings which look like ghosts. Additionally, most people seem to be afraid, etc."

 

This is the best we can do when criticaly analyzing subjective spiritual experiences like this. Science was never intended to get into this area as a full explanation. It can merely aid in the understanding. It will never prove it and it will never explain it away as being non-spiritual.

[ErosOcean]

What were the experiences? Please be specific.

 

Take care,

Eve x

 

Sure.

 

I recall one time when I was young, in my late teens, I woke up but was not able to move. Then I felt a dark presence within the room and I felt something pull at my legs as I was being dragged into darkness - a pitch black shadow. And yes I prayed like crazy in my head that God would save me...

 

I think I had this because I was getting into trouble a lot back then and coming from a religious background I felt that what I was doing was wrong. Although consciously I didn't feel remorse and I was justifying my reasons for my bad behavior. But my subconscious knew it wasn't right because of my old religious beliefs that was planted of what is right and wrong. And so I created this as a warning.

 

The angel (or white glowing orb) I recall was early in the morning. I was awakened by something and it appeared above my head. I didn't feel afraid, but I was curious about it. So I asked it (in my mind) "Who are you?" She just laughed and disappeared...

 

I wanted to believe in a spiritual guru who said she would come to us in our meditations if we meditated hard enough upon her. So I, wanting to be special and feel important, created this with my subconscious thought in my sleep. In other words, delusional thinking.

 

The ghost, I was actually able to move. When I was young (8 or 9?) I went on a trip with my class to an old historical site where soldiers died. I took a dare to walk around a grave backwards three times or something. Someone told me it was bad luck and dared me, so I did. For a few weeks, I kept seeing the same ghost of a young boy my age. When I woke up in the middle of the night, he would be standing there by my bed or at my door just looking at me. Other times I saw him walking about the room...

 

I actually forgot about this, my sister reminded me of the event not too long ago. She remembered that for months she thought I was possessed because I would tell her about it. I think I created it out of fear of superstition.

 

I have a lot of other episodes of sleep paralysis I can think of. But one episode of sleep paralysis, I awoke to find I couldn't move and I felt something heavy sitting upon my chest and I couldn't breathe. I prayed to Jesus to cast away the evil spirits. And it did go away after excessively praying. And when I came out of the sleep paralysis, my heart was beating incredibly fast and I was gasping for air...

 

This particular sleep paralysis, I think, I created because I had some stressful personal problems that I felt was weighing down on me at the time. My prayer to Jesus was able to overcome this because my belief in him over-weighed my belief that the evil spirits could take me. Of course, when we are afraid our heart beats fast and sometimes subconsciously we hold in our breathes out of fear, so naturally when I awoke from this state it was just an effect of the cause.

 

I believe when you form a belief in a superstition you can create it within your own subconscious mind.

 

So my latest sleep paralysis episode I had I just didn't pay attention to it. I didn't give it power by feeding into the fear that my mind was trying to create. Instead, I ignored it as being a supernatural event and saw it as something that was meaningless. That it was just delusional thinking. It actually went away faster!

 

Didn't Buddha who was tempted by Mara just ignore the arrows that was shot at him and they all turned into flowers?

 

In other words, don't feed the fear. Just let it go. We give meanings to our fear which creates the power of it's hold on us. So ignore it or you can try to analyze it as your subconscious mind trying to convey a message. Sometimes we can't understand the meaning of our dreams, but that's okay.

 

Science tells us that a chemical in our brain paralyzes our body in our sleep, which prevents us from acting out our dreams. Which is good because I sometimes have dreams of fighting and it wouldn't be good on my body if I was punching my wall.

 

So I think sleep paralysis happens because we don't fully complete our REM sleep cycle. And when your conscious mind awakes to find it can't move, it begins to create its own delusional thoughts out of fear.

 

Cheers!

Eros

 

PS. You know sometimes I come on here to post dumb things to confuse people and to contradict myself. Mainly because I'm bored and I want to be a little trouble maker sometimes...

 

So who knows maybe this post is just one of those... bye!

[ErosOcean]

This is the best we can do when criticaly analyzing subjective spiritual experiences like this. Science was never intended to get into this area as a full explanation. It can merely aid in the understanding. It will never prove it and it will never explain it away as being non-spiritual.

 

You're right!

 

Science can give us an understanding but it can't fully explain some of the supernatural events of the universe.

 

But it seems that you are more afraid that science will take away your spiritual experiences. That it will take away your belief in God and Jesus.

 

When in actuality it doesn't. There have been hundreds of renowned scientists who are deeply religious. In fact, I think science could make your faith even stronger. There is a physicist, Amit Goswami, who says he can explain God exists through science.

 

As for spiritual experiences. I think we should question it and not be led blindly by faith. Because we can be fooled!

 

I've read a few historical accounts of the great men and women who have spiritual experiences. Often, I see that they have spent years or ages trying to communicate with God through self-discipline and living by the strictest code of principles.

 

When they do happen to have a deep spiritual experience it doesn't happen a hundred times or all the time. Often, it comes once or twice. On rare events maybe three times... in their whole lifetime!

 

When they experience such an event they claim the same thing...

 

It's a feeling of bliss. Of clarity of thought and mind. They are in touch with the conciousness of God - they think with God. It's indescribable, but this is as close as they can relate to it.

 

No angels come down to sing praises to them. No demons, but their own self created demons or lower natures that they conquer through their disciplines.

 

So when I hear about the average person who goes about claiming to see supernatural things. Of course, I'm going to question it! Perhaps they did, and perhaps they didn't.

 

I too, have gone through these spiritual experiences myself. And I will question it.

 

There's an interesting documentary called Kumare I think you should explore.

 

 

I relate to these people in the film. And I don't think they were dumb, nor do I find any spiritual or religious person dumb. People are incredibly intelligent! But I do think that we fool ourselves, because we seek shortcuts to life.

 

We seek easy answers to our problems and we run away from them out of fear. We turn to God, Jesus, Buddha, Krishna, Allah, a spiritual guru, etc... to work out our problems. Instead of us working them out for ourselves.

 

God already gave us the tools to conquer our fears and problems. He made us complete. Our body can heal itself with the aid of our thoughts and a healthy diet. Our problems can be solved with the aid of reasoning.

 

If I discredit your spiritual experience. Don't take it as a personal attack. It doesn't in any way discredit your faith in your religious beliefs. In fact, I don't think you actually need to have "spiritual experiences" of seeing things to have faith in Jesus or God.

 

Just look at the mysteries of the world we live in. Explore the realms of the universe. Explore yourself - know thyself!

 

God created some phenomenal ****. Including yourself.

 

God bless,

Eros

[Eve]

 

PS. You know sometimes I come on here to post dumb things to confuse people and to contradict myself. Mainly because I'm bored and I want to be a little trouble maker sometimes...

 

So who knows maybe this post is just one of those... bye!

 

Well, it is not for me to work this out. I have more important things to do.

 

I can agree from your posts that any 'spiritual experiences' which occur only in the body could be self created. God - being the God of the Universe, The First and Only One always has a purpose within any communication which is not to lock a person into having bodily experiences only which have no purpose.

 

Just wondering - do you study thelema by any chance?

 

Take care,

Eve x

[pureinheart]

Good point. Christ is the author and perfecter of our faith. That means he starts it and completes it. The only thing we do is desire to allow him to do this--and even that small role is debatable since Scripture says that repentance, itself, is a gift from God. That leaves us pretty much with zero credit for anything good that comes from us. I don't have any confidence in our nature as humans so fortunately he doesn't leave anything up to us. Even our strength to do his will comes from him.

 

Not sure if this will make sense or not, although I hit a point- a marked point in my walk in which I had no choice in any matter. Yes I will sin (of my own strength/will), and yes I'll be obedient (not of my own strength), but my life was REALLY not my own and the path would not be detoured. This is difficult to describe in words, but the truth.

 

It's not an issue of salvation and want to say that several cleansings/fires had taken place.

[ErosOcean]

Just wondering - do you study thelema by any chance?

 

Take care,

Eve x

 

No I have not studied Thelema. I just study across broad subjects such as Eastern and Western philosophy, theology, psychology, quantum mechanics, mysticism. But I know nothing, really.

[Eve]

No I have not studied Thelema. I just study across broad subjects such as Eastern and Western philosophy, theology, psychology, quantum mechanics, mysticism. But I know nothing, really.

 

Ok, I was unsure if you were serious with the comment I highlighted - but you raised a good point and I wondered whether you were serious or was just adhering to darker forces which you follow or something.

 

Using the example of people who are mentally ill there is an aspect where one has to assume that due to some original experience/trauma/force the person can be seen to begin to self perpetuate particular behaviours. Personally I think this is ultimately what the demons want to happen when they appear to us and at worst this can take on a bodily root in the person; repetitions etc.

 

For many the focus remains on the physical care of a mentally ill individual due to the focus on the preservation of life - but many will tell you that there is a spiritual element to their suffering which is transposed from their sleeping life into their waking life. With some being able to see the their afflictors and others not.

 

The problem is that such a group will probably not be seen as being very reliable at stating what they are experiencing!

 

So, IDK. I do identify with the number of people who claim calling upon Christ brings relief from many experiences and have seen an enduring difference in those (ill or not) who claim this relief occurs, as often there are no further answers, even with medication to bring relief to the individual.

 

I have concluded that many things are down simply to how firm a personal belief a person holds about destiny as to whether they have any capacity to even be able to begin to see further into these matters.

 

Take care,

Eve x

[worldgonewrong]

Last night I was sleeping and I was awoken at 3:00 am on the dot. For those of you that don't know, that is the devil's hour.

 

It is?

Why? How? Sez who?

 

honestly, just curious.

[youngnlove89]

It is?

Why? How? Sez who?

 

honestly, just curious.

 

In popular folklore, when something is of the devil, it is the opposite of Christianity. For instance, a popular symbol for the devil (of folklore) is the inverted cross. Turning something upside down corrupts and perverts it. According to Christians belief, Christ died at 3pm. The inverse (or corruption) of 3pm is, naturally, 3am. I'm not certain if that's old folklore or recent (I never heard of it before seeing "The Exorcism of Emily Rose")

[Eve]

It is?

Why? How? Sez who?

 

honestly, just curious.

 

Essentially Jesus is said to have been on the cross for 6 hours, with 12pm til 3pm being the final hours, hence the term Passion Hours.

 

With Jesus dying at 3pm, demons tend to come bothering people at about 3am as an attempt at a perversion of The Passion Hours - satanists do their blood rituals at this time also.

 

Read up on it.

 

Take care,

Eve x

[2sure]

I don't believe in much . But there would have to be some really psycho reason for my experience . I certainly don't even subconsciously know how to swear in Japanese.

[M30USA]

It happened again.

 

I did not see any creature or beings this time, but I woke up paralyzed again. I heard an extremely loud crash or explosion. The noise was sudden and didn't continue. I wasn't dreaming and I could see my room perfectly. After 15 seconds I snapped out of it. The strange this is I was not afraid at all this time.

 

To be objective and fair, it's not abnormal for people during sleep paralysis to hear loud noises. But they are usually continuous static type noises or wind (which I heard last time).

 

I asked anybody in my house if they heard or were woken up by a deafening crash. Nobody heard it.

Edited April 29, 2013 by M30USA