Hey, guys! Want to see a REAL woman???

[USMCHokie]

That chick is not fat. Having preferences is one thing, but imo you have a screwed up perception if you truly consider her fat. She looks healthy and athletic. Could she lose a few pounds and still be healthy? Sure. Does she need to in order to improve her health? From a medical perspective, I don't think so. There is a range of what is healthy and she easily falls within that range, based on every indicator commonly used including waist-hip ratio, lifestyle, defined muscle mass, and perfectly healthy bmi. I don't have an issue with personal preference for a different aesthetic but to judge this girl for failing to conform to your (yes, shallow) ideals is outrageous.

 

I'm going to have fun with this one...

 

The sheer amount of hypocrisy in the post above is overwhelming. I'm like this:

 

Let's start here:

 

Having preferences is one thing, but imo you have a screwed up perception if you truly consider her fat.

I take it here that you are asserting (i.e., judging) my perception to be "screwed up." Fine.

 

Does she need to in order to improve her health? From a medical perspective, I don't think so.

So this is merely your perception. Nay, your medical perception. Fair enough; shall I also assume that your perception is absolute truth? Or even medical fact?

 

There is a range of what is healthy and she easily falls within that range...

Healthy and attractive are two different things. One can be healthy and attractive; one can be healthy and unattractive; one can be unhealthy and attractive; and finally, one can be unhealthy and unattractive.

 

I don't have an issue with personal preference for a different aesthetic but to judge this girl for failing to conform to your (yes, shallow) ideals is outrageous.

Yet you are judging me for failing to conform to your ideals and your perception? Does that make you outrageous as well...? Say it ain't so!!

[Mr Scorpio]

I'm going to have fun with this one...

 

I think she was responding to Imported, not to you. Still, nice socratic.

[USMCHokie]

I think she was responding to Imported, not to you. Still, nice socratic.

 

Hahah, thanks. I couldn't resist...

[man_in_the_box]

I'm glad it started a dialogue (that I haven't bothered reading) about the stereotypes of women's bodies and how they are viewed, even if I didn't present it in the proper manner. :rolleyes:

 

THAT is properly presented in the OP. The problem is that a hole bunch of posters give their own twist to what the thread is about. And subsequently complain that others disagree with their interpretation.

[lucy_in_disguise]

I'm going to have fun with this one...

 

The sheer amount of hypocrisy in the post above is overwhelming. I'm like this:

 

Let's start here:

 

I take it here that you are asserting (i.e., judging) my perception to be "screwed up." Fine.

 

So this is merely your perception. Nay, your medical perception. Fair enough; shall I also assume that your perception is absolute truth? Or even medical fact?

 

Healthy and attractive are two different things. One can be healthy and attractive; one can be healthy and unattractive; one can be unhealthy and attractive; and finally, one can be unhealthy and unattractive.

 

Yet you are judging me for failing to conform to your ideals and your perception? Does that make you outrageous as well...? Say it ain't so!!

 

My point was that I believe with a great degree of confidence that most medical professionals wouls not find this woman unhealthy based on her weight.

 

Think of it this way. Assume for this exercise that healthy = not fat.

 

She is either fat or not fat (her status is a medical fact).

 

As I am not a doctor or a medical professional (and neither are you) I cant confirm her fat status for certain. But I have yet to see any evidence from a health standpoint that would indicate a woman with her dimensions would be give the medical recommendation to lose weight for her health.

 

There is healthy and there is attractive. One is more objective (healthy) than the other.

 

I am judging you for having presented no argument for your opinion that she is fat. And having an implicit definition apparently not grounded in science.

[USMCHokie]

There is healthy and there is attractive. One is more objective (healthy) than the other.

 

And one tends to matter more for initial impressions of whether you are attracted to someone.

 

I am judging you for having presented no argument for your opinion that she is fat. And having an implicit definition apparently not grounded in science.

 

Indeed. My definition is grounded in the English language, i.e., the plain language usage of the term.

 

From dictionary(dot)com:

 

fat - adjective

 

1. having too much flabby tissue; corpulent; obese: a fat person.

2. plump; well-fed: a good, fat chicken.

[mesmerized]

And one tends to matter more for initial impressions of whether you are attracted to someone.

 

 

 

Indeed. My definition is grounded in the English language, i.e., the plain language usage of the term.

 

From dictionary(dot)com:

 

fat - adjective

 

1. having too much flabby tissue; corpulent; obese: a fat person.

2. plump; well-fed: a good, fat chicken.

 

And you are the one defining this "too much" so its all subjective anyway, when it comes to attraction alone that is.

 

The bottom line is, men are stupid. Anyone, even supermodels can take unappealing pics of themselves and then we'd have somedude here saying he wouldn't date them. Some bad pictures don't mean someone is unattractive just like a few good pics from good angles don't mean someone is attractive. I mean look how sexy your mila kunis looks in these:

 

http://i.imgur.com/y6y6D.jpg

http://cutepix.me/assets/images/gallery/502.jpg

http://www.everyjoe.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/mila-kunis-ugly-without-makeup.jpg

[fortyninethousand322]

And you are the one defining this "too much" so its all subjective anyway, when it comes to attraction alone that is.

 

The bottom line is, men are stupid. Anyone, even supermodels can take unappealing pics of themselves and then we'd have somedude here saying he wouldn't date them. Some bad pictures don't mean someone is unattractive just like a few good pics from good angles don't mean someone is attractive. I mean look how sexy your mila kunis looks in these:

 

http://i.imgur.com/y6y6D.jpg

http://cutepix.me/assets/images/gallery/502.jpg

http://www.everyjoe.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/mila-kunis-ugly-without-makeup.jpg

 

Well, except for the last one (in which she looks tired and might need a nap or something) I don't think she looked bad in those photos.

 

I'm weird. I know...

[mesmerized]

Actually...This is a great article proving my point.

 

Mila Kunis Without Any Makeup! The Sexiest AND Most Casual Woman Of The Year? | Grazia Fashion

 

Honestly, I'm annoyed that I even have to point this out...This is way too obvious. The idiocy/superficiality that we have to deal with in this world...

[mesmerized]

Well, except for the last one (in which she looks tired and might need a nap or something) I don't think she looked bad in those photos.

 

I'm weird. I know...

 

I don't think she looks bad either. But is she the goddess we were promised? NO.

 

The reality is, the fake made up look has become the standard...specially when it comes to pictures. Men being extremely visual has made them forget that hey, this is all makeup, results of an hour or two in a salon. The real girl is usually far from what you see in all these pics.

 

The girl in that article was brave enough to put this all out. I guarantee you that she could take some hot pics of herself and leaves it at that and men here would drool. We women get it, the smart men get it, too bad there is just not many of them around.

[Taramere]

Edit: And it really irks me that it seems to be impossible to talk about female body image issues on LS without it turning into the exact opposite of what the thread was intended to achieve.

 

I think often men believe they're being motivational (encouraging women to "be their best" - aka at the lower end of their healthy weight range, and with a level of toning that requires a lot of time in the gym) with those comments.

 

It tends to be counterproductive because most women probably react with the thought "but I don't want a man like you. I want to be with somebody who makes me happy." That's the message from the woman whose site Carrie linked to. It doesn't really matter what a million or even ten million single bachelors think of her. Ultimately, the guy she's with is happy with her and she's happy with him.

 

Dieting and exercising down to the bottom end of your healthy range isn't going to bring any more health rewards than you would get by just doing things in moderation and staying at a higher point in your medically healthy range. In terms of getting any "being happier" reward - even less likely. Certainly not if it results in the woman being with an overly critical man who experiences disgust at the sight of anything less than lads' mag female perfection.

 

The critical male responses to a woman like the one this thread is about may get that message across better than the woman herself does.

[fortyninethousand322]

I don't think she looks bad either. But is she the goddess we were promised? NO.

 

The reality is, the fake made up look has become the standard...specially when it comes to pictures. Men being extremely visual has made them forget that hey, this is all makeup, results of an hour or two in a salon. The real girl is usually far from what you see in all these pics.

 

The girl in that article was brave enough to put this all out. I guarantee you that she could take some hot pics of herself and leaves it at that and men here would drool. We women get it, the smart men get it, too bad there is just not many of them around.

 

And thank God for that. I'd hate to be with a goddess. Either they're out to kill you like Medusa or they just ignore you half the time.

 

Seriously, I kind of hate pictures myself. I have never met a woman who looked better in pictures than she did in person. Whether on online dating, facebook, whatever there's a certain sexiness that reality has that cannot be understated or replicated through touched up pictures. It's hard to describe but there's a certain sexiness to how someone conducts themselves, speaks, etc. that can't be conveyed through photos or even videos.

 

Hell, for me half the attraction is smell anyway (and they don't have smelling pictures...yet). A woman who smells good could probably get me to agree to anything.

 

I'm not sure if I'm one of those smart men who get it. I hope so, but my track record in the romance department certainly says something...

[sweetjasmine]

Dieting and exercising down to the bottom end of your healthy range isn't going to bring any more health rewards than you would get by just doing things in moderation and staying at a higher point in your medically healthy range. In terms of getting any "being happier" reward - even less likely.

 

Precisely. And it takes a lot of strength for some of us to say "F YOU!" to all the people out there who are intent on making anyone who's not at the very bottom of their healthy weight range like they're a disgusting, flabby, lazy hunk of gross meat who would be lucky to have one poor sap settle for her and take her out on a single date.

 

Certainly not if it results in the woman being with an overly critical man who experiences disgust at the sight of anything less than lads' mag female perfection.

 

Yup. Anyone who's less than perfect should be running far, far away from some of the critical men who think that lady is fat.

 

The critical male responses to a woman like the one this thread is about may get that message across better than the woman herself does.

 

Unfortunately, the critical messages tend to reinforce fears and make vulnerable people feel like every other man on the planet is going to say the same things about her slight belly pudge and thick thighs.

[fortyninethousand322]

It tends to be counterproductive because most women probably react with the thought "but I don't want a man like you. I want to be with somebody who makes me happy." That's the message from the woman whose site Carrie linked to. It doesn't really matter what a million or even ten million single bachelors think of her. Ultimately, the guy she's with is happy with her and she's happy with him.

 

This is a good point. I feel like a lot of people care what others think of their looks, but they only listen to those who are critical.

 

I've stopped going to threads on here in which a girl says something to the effect of "I'm ugly" because when I say I think they're actually attractive it's dismissed because my opinion doesn't matter.

 

I don't know, maybe it's a Groucho Marx situation or something. But it's kind of annoying and reeks of fishing for compliments.

[Taramere]

Unfortunately, the critical messages tend to reinforce fears and make vulnerable people feel like every other man on the planet is going to say the same things about her slight belly pudge and thick thighs.

 

I've stopped going to threads on here in which a girl says something to the effect of "I'm ugly" because when I say I think they're actually attractive it's dismissed because my opinion doesn't matter.

 

Both these posts make me think of a friend of mine who's in and out of hospital like a yo-yo. She has to go in to hospital twice each week to be weighed (if she falls below a certain BMI she'll be admitted again). Her life revolves around anorexia/bulimia. As a friend to somebody like that, you start losing your tolerance eventually - no matter how much effort you've put into trying to understand.

 

The only opinions that matter to her are those of the most critical, destructive people...of which she herself is, unfortunately, one. She's been a dancer and a model in the past. Now, although she enjoys going to watch ballet and likes the Next Top Model shows, her enjoyment of these things is marred by her perception that all the dancers/models are "too fat". She wouldn't ever tell any of her friends "you're too fat" but she'll happily share her opinion about beautiful, slender women in the public eye being not good enough (read not thin enough).

 

I have to limit my time with her - not because I care if she thinks I (at slightly above the middle of my healthy weight range) am not thin enough, but because it's boring. All the endless talk of exercise, starvation, fruit gums being an anorexic's best friend, flooding herself with water before weigh ins in order to fool the medical staff and so on is depressing, so although I want to be a supportive friend I have to limit the time I spend with her listening to that stuff. Especially as she's been that way forever, and nothing I say or do can possibly change it.

[xxoo]

The woman in the blog is married, and married to a man who loves the real her (not a glamour version). It might be interesting to know how they met, and how much make up she was wearing when they were courting.

 

Also, it might be informative to know if the women on here consider her husband to be attractive (or attractive enough).

 

JMO, but a good way to avoid the shallow men who expect full make up is to not wear full make up. Probably that will result in a huge decrease in attention--but that attention was worthless outside of an ego feed. And the attention you get will be of greater value.

[somedude81]

This thread shows how much the media has affected male brains. They are obviously clueless to the effects of lighting and hours spent with hair and makeup artists and strategic styling. Not surprising considered how everyone is bombarded with media images and the brain is very malleable. Overexposure to anything affects it really.

So men only see women on TV, the internet and magazines?

[somedude81]

The woman in the blog is married, and married to a man who loves the real her (not a glamour version). It might be interesting to know how they met, and how much make up she was wearing when they were courting.

This is taken from the About page

I have an amazing husband (yes, he loved me even before my weight loss), we met through friends 7+ years ago

Back then she was 240 lbs. That does seem pretty amazing.

Also, it might be informative to know if the women on here consider her husband to be attractive (or attractive enough).

 

JMO, but a good way to avoid the shallow men who expect full make up is to not wear full make up. Probably that will result in a huge decrease in attention--but that attention was worthless outside of an ego feed. And the attention you get will be of greater value.

I never understood why women wear full make up in the first place. It's nothing more than false advertising. Edited April 28, 2013 by somedude81

[sweetjasmine]

I never understood why women wear full make up in the first place. It's nothing more than false advertising.

 

After reading this thread and the countless others on here that have gone the same way, you still don't understand why some women wear full makeup?

[tbf]

After reading this thread and the countless others on here that have gone the same way, you still don't understand why some women wear full makeup?

The world revolves around somedude's preferences.

[Taramere]

I never understood why women wear full make up in the first place. It's nothing more than false advertising.

 

So you, somedude, who has spent many hours on here trying to figure out how you can become more successful with/attractive to the opposite sex, fail to understand why a woman with beautiful bone structure but drab colouring could possibly want to use make up transform herself from a plain Jane into a show-stopper? In a society where it's so much the norm for women to wear make up that women without it tend to look ungroomed?

 

Really?

[ltjg45]

After reading this thread and the countless others on here that have gone the same way, you still don't understand why some women wear full makeup?

 

Why bother when all it does is attract the males you don't want in the end?

[somedude81]

Why bother when all it does is attract the males you don't want in the end?

Guessing from the responses I got to my post, women do want shallow men.

[tbf]

Guessing from the responses I got to my post, women do want shallow men.

From a guy that considers women who wear make up as false advertisement, that's a laugh.

[somedude81]

From a guy that considers women who wear make up as false advertisement, that's a laugh.

Please tell me why it's shallow for me to prefer women to not wear a lot of make up that can change their natural appearance. Frankly it seems pretty much the opposite of shallow.

 

Make up is essentially a fake face. The same general thing as a man sticking a sock in his pants.